The Issue with Cena as US Champion....

[justinept]

Make no mistake, the early stage of Cena's US Title run was fantastic. The open challenges and the Rusev feud made the belt relevant again. But the reason it felt relevant wasn't necessarily because John Cena held it - while that that helped, the relevance came from the fact that it was consistently being defended on television.

The psychology behind a championship belt is that it's meaningful because everyone wants it - not because of who has it or how long they've held it. For instance, Dean Ambrose was over like rover when he held the belt a few years back. He was always on TV, worked in the biggest programs, wrestled in the main events, and he held the belt for just under a year. Still, the belt had no relevance because he never defended it. Worse, because the top stars who were working with Ambrose never even requested a title match, it further hurt the credibility of the belt. Think about it - if you're feuding with a champion, and you have no interest in taking his championship from him, then you're saying the championship has no value to you...

And that's what is happening right now with the US belt during the Cena/Owens program - a program that will see a second-straight non-title match at MITB. If Owens has a gripe with Cena but doesn't care to take the guy's belt from him - then he's making the statement that the belt doesn't matter to him. And if the belt doesn't matter to the guy feuding with the champ, then the belt doesn't matter at all.

This runs counterproductive to the reason the WWE put the belt on Cena in the first place. If you're going to put the belt on him to rebuild its prestige, then his opponents need to WANT to take the belt from him. This means that Owens needs to demand a title match. Yes, their program can still be centered around Owens gripe of being overlooked for the last 15 years - but he needs to want to prove his point by taking the belt from Cena instead of by merely beating him in a non-title match.

On the flip side, the WWE wants to use Cena to get Owens over - and it'd be difficult for Owens to go over Cena in a title match without winning the title in the process.

So the WWE needs to make a decision with Cena because he can't put over Owens and the US Title at the same time unless he drops the title to Owens and chases it...

 

[K Web V3]

i expect the US title to be defended in their 3rd match(likely summerslam) and cena will then drop it to owens. id like owens to win two straight from cena, for cena to come back and tell owens that beating cena when the belt is on the line is a whole different animal.

However i doubt wwe would really let cena lose 3 straight matches, even if it would solidfy owens as champ.

Plus, on nxt owens calls himself a "prize fighter" well right now he has a prize. Once that nxt strap is gone though, i think owens decides he wants another prize and that could lead him to demand a title match

 

[Max Headroom]

Cena's title run is still probably the best, and most intriguing part of RAW going on right now. Now, having the belt constantly defended, and having people gun for it, does add lots of relevancy to the championship. This is what is currently happening with the IC championship (it would be in more full-swing if it wasn't for unfortunate circumstances), however the fact that Cena is the one holding the challenges makes a HUGE difference. Would the Neville & Zayn appearances have been such a big deal if it weren't Cena hosting the challenge? Hardly. Sure, people would have been excited to see them, but having them have a strong showing against Cena is a much bigger deal than having them put up a strong showing against someone like Ziggler. Also, it makes it more unpredictable on when the title will finally change hands, and whoever wins it will be instantly seen as a viable champion, thus making the US championship (& its holder) still relevant.

In reference to the Owens/Cena thing, it's hardly devaluing the championship, and it's not making it take a back-seat. Owens stomped on it during his debut on RAW, whilst holding up *his* NXT championship. That's what this is, champion versus champion. Owens isn't after the US championship for the same reasons Cena isn't going after the NXT championship, they both feel they don't need the others title. They are out to show that they are the superior champion. They don't need to have titles on the line, and one champion beating another doesn't devalue said championship, as you're losing to another champion. If handled properly, this could be good for both people & both championships involved.

 

[K Web V3]

Cena having the US title has been great for everyone involved.

People that were tired of seeing cena always in the main event scene(such as myself) are happy cuz hes now down lower on the card so to speak. I went from cant standing cena, to actually looking forward to his segments, and trying to predict with my son whos gonna come out.

The US title looks meaningful now because its constantly being defended. True, just defending the title can make it important, but nobody can deny the fact that a guy of cenas caliber holding it, makes it that much more relevant as ppl wanna see whos gonna take the title off of him.

So the fact that Owens/Cena hasnt involved the US title being on the line(yet) isnt devaluing it, because as the previous poster said, neither guy wants the others belt. Owens considers his nxt belt as the only prize he needs, where cena has no need for the nxt title.

I see this changing once Owens drops the nxt title(Balor or Joe) and then deciding that NOW he wants Cenas belt.

 

[justinept]

In reference to the Owens/Cena thing, it's hardly devaluing the championship, and it's not making it take a back-seat. Owens stomped on it during his debut on RAW, whilst holding up *his* NXT championship. That's what this is, champion versus champion. Owens isn't after the US championship for the same reasons Cena isn't going after the NXT championship, they both feel they don't need the others title. They are out to show that they are the superior champion. They don't need to have titles on the line, and one champion beating another doesn't devalue said championship, as you're losing to another champion. If handled properly, this could be good for both people & both championships involved.

We're probably going to just end up agreeing to disagree, but follow this analogy:


The cheapest Stanley Cup Final ticket in Tampa is $50.

The cheapest Stanley Cup Final ticket in Chicago is $350

Why does the ticket in Chicago cost more? It's because more people want it in Chicago - so the ticket has more value there. That's the same concept of a championship belt. The more people that want it, the more value it appears to have... When people don't want it, it drops in value.

I get the program with Cena and Owens... and I've honestly enjoyed watching it. But it IS hurting the value of the title because the main contender doesn't want the belt. For a championship to remain relevant, it needs to be at the forefront of the champion's feuds.

Hell, look at Rollins and Ambrose right now. They have a long history together that would make it easy for them to have a program that wasn't centered around the WWE Championship. But guess what - it's still centered around the WWE Championship. Why? Because the belt has perceived value from the audience, and it would be bizarre if a guy feuded with the champion and didn't demand a title shot.

When we get to the point where it comes off as weird for a guy to feud with a mid-card champion and not demand a title shot - that's when the belt will have returned to its previous level of prestige.

 

[Mustang Sally]

But the reason it felt relevant wasn't necessarily because John Cena held it - while that that helped, the relevance came from the fact that it was consistently being defended on television.

I think both factors combine to make the US title an attractive proposition. Yes, that it's being defended often.....but also that it's been held by a main event-level performer who normally wouldn't be bothered with a lesser belt. It was the same concept with Daniel Bryan holding the IC title, and only injury messed that up. As to Cena, it also helped he's been a fighting champion, as one might expect him to be. In other words, if he's going to own a midcard title, he won't do it half-assed.

Still, if the plan is to have Cena put Kevin Owens over, I can't think of a reason the US title not be up for grabs in their next PPV match. KO has already beaten Cena cleanly.....why not raise the stakes?

At the same time, there's no assurance Cena won't win the match; the game plan within the company has definitely changed for him, but he's still John Cena.

Further, I doubt Cena was given the belt for the sole purpose of having Owens win it. Cena's reign has been really good; look at the eclectic list of challengers.....it's not as if they've been trotting guys like Fandango and Xavier Woods out there.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

I've got nothing negative to say about Cena's run a champion and personally, I don't really see anything to legitimately complain about.

A lot of fans have long since gotten bored with John Cena in the main event picture, as WWE Champion or chasing the WWE Championship; he's no longer in that scene and it's been a while since he felt this fresh. A lot of fans have also complained about the relevance of the mid-card title scene as a whole for quite a while and it's hard to find anyone more relevant in all of wrestling to carry a championship than John Cena. You want relevancy restored to a championship, one nearly guaranteed way to get the job done is by giving the title to someone that is in no way, shape or form going to be booked to look like a chump and that someone is John Cena. Vince McMahon's near obsessive fetish of wanting to keep John Cena looking as strong as possible makes the United States Championship the safest best on the entire roster at this point.

The US Open Challenge has been something different, though I think it's also something that's probably about to come to an end because defending a title on television every single week is something that loses its novelty; even with a television championship, the novelty of weekly defenses would start to get old before too long. Over the course of this angle, however, we've been given some extremely entertaining matches in which Cena's star power has been used to elevate the stock of several wrestlers, primarily some of the top wrestlers of the NXT roster.

As far as his feud with Owens regarding the United States Championship, it's obvious that the entire angle is not only being used to elevate Kevin Owens, but also the overall value of the NXT Championship and the NXT brand itself with the help of John Cena's star power. Owens putting over the NXT Championship while "disrespecting" the United States Championship tells a story itself when you consider how proud Cena is of being US champ and how heavily he's hyped what the title means to him; after all, Cena's this ultra patriotic sorta guy, so Owens stomping on the US title is Owens symbolically stomping on and disrespecting Cena.

IF Owens is part of the main roster, reports suggest he's gonna be around at least through SummerSlam, he may well be dropping the NXT Championship in the near future and if his feud with Cena continues, it could potentially become about the US title. WWE's broadcasting a show on the WWE Network on July 4th from Japan and one of the bouts scheduled to be featured is Owens vs. Finn Balor for the NXT Championship; given that Balor was a huge star in New Japan Pro Wrestling for the past several years before coming to NXT, he may capture the strap there.

So yeah, Cena's time as champ has seen the title elevated considerably, we've seen some great matches for the title, we've got Cena in fresh situations where he's not in the main event scene and his star power is being used to elevate a title and those who challenge him for it. As I alluded to, not a lot to complain about from my perspective.

 

[three count bout]

We're probably going to just end up agreeing to disagree, but follow this analogy:


The cheapest Stanley Cup Final ticket in Tampa is $50.

The cheapest Stanley Cup Final ticket in Chicago is $350

Why does the ticket in Chicago cost more? It's because more people want it in Chicago - so the ticket has more value there. That's the same concept of a championship belt. The more people that want it, the more value it appears to have... When people don't want it, it drops in value.

I get the program with Cena and Owens... and I've honestly enjoyed watching it. But it IS hurting the value of the title because the main contender doesn't want the belt. For a championship to remain relevant, it needs to be at the forefront of the champion's feuds.

Hell, look at Rollins and Ambrose right now. They have a long history together that would make it easy for them to have a program that wasn't centered around the WWE Championship. But guess what - it's still centered around the WWE Championship. Why? Because the belt has perceived value from the audience, and it would be bizarre if a guy feuded with the champion and didn't demand a title shot.

When we get to the point where it comes off as weird for a guy to feud with a mid-card champion and not demand a title shot - that's when the belt will have returned to its previous level of prestige.

Not much for me to add here, as usual I think you're pretty much spot on. I think it does make the US title seem as an after thought because Owens doesn't seem to really give a shit about it and in a way I think that elevates the NXT title. I'd sell it as the NXT title is the title the best wrestlers in the world are fighting for hence why Owens has little interest in the US belt. The company needs Network subscribers and showcasing not only the Champion of NXT but the prestige of it's championship can only help spread NXT awareness.

I'm assuming the reality is they don't want Owens to lose, and they don't want to give him the title because he has unfinished business in NXT and they may not be 100% sure if this current call up is a permanent one, a test run, or one that may need to be cut short due to injuries in NXT.

 

[George Steele's Barber]

I don't know. It has only been three weeks since this started. It's not like anyone in the audience has forgotten the belt still exists. Cena wears a shirt that has the belt on it. Do we even know if HHH (or whoever is making the kayfabe decisions) is OK with the NXT champ competing for a WWE title. I guess Paige did it way back when.

But I think I get what your saying. Dudes coming out to fight for the US Title could easily be misconstrued as guys just coming out for a shot at Cena (and honestly you are kidding yourself if you think winning the US Title is bigger than beating Cena). In Owens' case that is clearly what he has done. Him stepping on it was pretty disrespectful but then again the guy is a heel. Heeling it up over one's opinion (I.e. negative opinion) of a belt is actually another way of trying to help it get over. I remember fondly enjoying heel Booker T helping to get fans more invested in Smackdown while he acted like he was too good for the show.

Anyway, my main point is that the belt has been secondary for a short period of time and we don't know where it is going. I'm not going to blame Cena's ownership of the title for any loss of prestige. If anything it is Owens' character that has taken the focus off the importance of being US Champ.

Not that I've ever really felt there was much prestige with being US Champ.

 

[OYDK]

It's kind of funny. Years ago, people would say that the Intercontinental Championship was losing it's prestige because it was being defended every single week on television. They said the title should only be defended on PPV and the fact that the (WWF) was giving it away "for free" was devaluing the entire division. It seems we've come to the point where the tables have turned and the titles need to be constantly defended to be seen as prestigious... interesting.

Anyway, I think WWE has already dealt with this issue, no? Didn't Owens say something along the lines of, "I don't need that championship around your waist, because I have a better one" or something? Maybe I'm mis-remembering but if that's the case I don't see an issue. Owens is a heel and it's a very heel move to treat the US Championship like a piece of garbage, especially if you're the "lower tier" champion. I probably would have agreed with you had they not mentioned the title at all, but they seemed to have covered the bases pretty well.

 

[justinept]

I think both factors combine to make the US title an attractive proposition. Yes, that it's being defended often.....but also that it's been held by a main event-level performer who normally wouldn't be bothered with a lesser belt. It was the same concept with Daniel Bryan holding the IC title, and only injury messed that up. As to Cena, it also helped he's been a fighting champion, as one might expect him to be. In other words, if he's going to own a midcard title, he won't do it half-assed.

True. Both play a factor in the added prestige to the title. I mention this early in my initial post. That Cena has the title definitely ups the ante, but his consistent title defenses played a bigger role, imo. I've always maintained that a title is only as valuable as the list of people who want the belt - Cena wanting the belt is a huge plus in that regard, but people literally need to be lining up for a crack at the title for it to really mean something. I'm trying to think of the last time a UFC fighter fought a champion and didn't have his eyes on the belt - but I bet if it ever happened, people would throw a shit storm about that guy was disrespecting the belt. To me, it's no different here. If a contender doesn't want the championship, then it's disrespecting to the prestige of the title.

Still, if the plan is to have Cena put Kevin Owens over, I can't think of a reason the US title not be up for grabs in their next PPV match. KO has already beaten Cena cleanly.....why not raise the stakes?

Exactly - the problem is that the match has been announced, and the title is still not on the line. That could change, but it hasn't yet.

At the same time, there's no assurance Cena won't win the match; the game plan within the company has definitely changed for him, but he's still John Cena.

Further, I doubt Cena was given the belt for the sole purpose of having Owens win it. Cena's reign has been really good; look at the eclectic list of challengers.....it's not as if they've been trotting guys like Fandango and Xavier Woods out there.

True, Cena could win the re-match at MiTB. There are no assurances that Owens would win, and despite what reports are saying about writers lobbying for Owens to go over, it's still more likely than not that these two will trade victories --- because, after all, that's the WWE's way of doing things.

As for the last part - you're right. I'm sure Cena didn't win the belt with the intentions of dropping it to Owens. In fact, I can say with 99.9999% certainty that the logic behind Cena winning the title was to rebuild the belt's prestige. His name value combined with his defenses against Rusev and the US Open Challenge were steps toward accomplishing this... But again, being in a program that's not related to the title does not achieve this.

 

[justinept]

I've got nothing negative to say about Cena's run a champion and personally, I don't really see anything to legitimately complain about.

A lot of fans have long since gotten bored with John Cena in the main event picture, as WWE Champion or chasing the WWE Championship; he's no longer in that scene and it's been a while since he felt this fresh. A lot of fans have also complained about the relevance of the mid-card title scene as a whole for quite a while and it's hard to find anyone more relevant in all of wrestling to carry a championship than John Cena. You want relevancy restored to a championship, one nearly guaranteed way to get the job done is by giving the title to someone that is in no way, shape or form going to be booked to look like a chump and that someone is John Cena. Vince McMahon's near obsessive fetish of wanting to keep John Cena looking as strong as possible makes the United States Championship the safest best on the entire roster at this point.

The US Open Challenge has been something different, though I think it's also something that's probably about to come to an end because defending a title on television every single week is something that loses its novelty; even with a television championship, the novelty of weekly defenses would start to get old before too long. Over the course of this angle, however, we've been given some extremely entertaining matches in which Cena's star power has been used to elevate the stock of several wrestlers, primarily some of the top wrestlers of the NXT roster.

As far as his feud with Owens regarding the United States Championship, it's obvious that the entire angle is not only being used to elevate Kevin Owens, but also the overall value of the NXT Championship and the NXT brand itself with the help of John Cena's star power. Owens putting over the NXT Championship while "disrespecting" the United States Championship tells a story itself when you consider how proud Cena is of being US champ and how heavily he's hyped what the title means to him; after all, Cena's this ultra patriotic sorta guy, so Owens stomping on the US title is Owens symbolically stomping on and disrespecting Cena.

IF Owens is part of the main roster, reports suggest he's gonna be around at least through SummerSlam, he may well be dropping the NXT Championship in the near future and if his feud with Cena continues, it could potentially become about the US title. WWE's broadcasting a show on the WWE Network on July 4th from Japan and one of the bouts scheduled to be featured is Owens vs. Finn Balor for the NXT Championship; given that Balor was a huge star in New Japan Pro Wrestling for the past several years before coming to NXT, he may capture the strap there.

So yeah, Cena's time as champ has seen the title elevated considerably, we've seen some great matches for the title, we've got Cena in fresh situations where he's not in the main event scene and his star power is being used to elevate a title and those who challenge him for it. As I alluded to, not a lot to complain about from my perspective.

I'm not a Cena basher... seriously. Go through my thread history if you dont believe me! The guy is a cash cow who does everything asked of him. Additionally, after somewhat going through the motions of a few years, Cena's matches have been consistently great since 2012.

My complaints with his title reign has nothing to do with him individually, but simply with the fact that I don't think ANY champion should EVER be booked in a non-title program. Hell, imo, the only time a champion should ever work a non-title match is 1) He's a heel forcing a contender to beat him before getting a title shot or 2) He's working a tag-team match on Raw to further a singles program. But that's it...

I do agree that the feud with Owens is designed to elevate Owens, the NXT Title, AND NXT in general. But there are ways of doing that while also elevating the US Title, which, after all, is the main reason Cena is holding the belt... and I'll tell you this, when in a 15-minute period, a guy turns down a title opportunity and then books a non-title match with the champion - that's not exactly making the belt seem worthwhile.

So here's the thing - if you you want to use Cena to prop up KO and NXT, then great. But then he shouldn't be holding the US Championship. A championship belt should NEVER take a backseat during a feud. Hell, even Hulk Hogan demanded that the Ultimate Warrior put up his IC Title at WrestleMania VI.

 

[NegativeFeedback]

This is a minority opinion, but I actually want to see John Cena beat Kevin Owens for the NXT title in one of KO's open challenges. KO then beats Cena for the US title and Cena ends up working a couple of NXT's before putting over Samoa Joe.

 

[Navi]

The sad thing is Cena has done more for the US title since Mania, than Rollins has done for the WWE title in the same period of time. That makes me wonder what the hell is going on here.

Rollins has kept his title by using his little army of small men to keep it, and Cena has thrown out an open challenge every week, and had some damm good matches out of it. Now he's against Owens, who I believe will be the number two heel behind Rollins. This will be a great feud as they had the match of the night at EC.

 

[Aquaman6686]

John Cena has made the United States Championship the #1 title in the company, it's that simple. It's not Seth Rollins' fault, but he's been booked as a stereotypical WWE chicken$h!t heel, a weak coward who can't win a match clean if his life depended on it, and it devalues the title. Before that we had a champion who defended the title so rarely, he made Dean Ambrose's US title run look like the most fighting champion in history by comparison. Lesnar and Rollins' runs have seriously damaged the WWE World Heavyweight Championship in a lot of fans' eyes, which ironically is the exact thing they were trying to stop by unifying the championships. That's why unifying the titles was a huge mistake, if Lesnar had been WWE Champion and done the reign exactly the same, it wouldn't have bothered people so much if there was still a World Heavyweight Champion in the company.

Anyway, back to Cena. The constant title defenses and great matches John Cena has been putting on have raised the stock of the United States Championship higher than it's been in...well frankly I can't ever remember a time when the title seemed this important, even going back to it's WCW lineage. I'm hoping he keeps the title for at least a few more months.

 

[Rayne]

Anyway, back to Cena. The constant title defenses and great matches John Cena has been putting on have raised the stock of the United States Championship higher than it's been in...well frankly I can't ever remember a time when the title seemed this important, even going back to it's WCW lineage. I'm hoping he keeps the title for at least a few more months.

And four days ago:

Last night permanently and irrevocably damaged John Cena's drawing power, and that of the entire WWE roster, because they just straight up said that any random guy can come up from NXT and instantly be completely superior to any top WWE star.

How could he possibly promote the US Title if losing to Kevin Owens has permanently and irrevocably damaged the credibility that the WWE has built for him?

 

[Aquaman6686]

And four days ago:


How could he possibly promote the US Title if losing to Kevin Owens has permanently and irrevocably damaged the credibility that the WWE has built for him?

I said the US title's stock has never been higher, not John Cena's. Cena's was permanently damaged in my eyes. He'll never again be the level of talent he was one day before Elimination Chamber. The title wasn't on the line, so no damage was done to the title. But the John Cena holding the United States Championship this week is not half the star he was last week. That's still a noticeably bigger star than the last several guys who have held the championship (excluding Sheamus) like Rusev and Dean Ambrose, but until last week, the US title was on the biggest star it could have possibly been on short of Undertaker. His star value has dropped massively since last week.

 

[Navi]

I said the US title's stock has never been higher, not John Cena's. Cena's was permanently damaged in my eyes. He'll never again be the level of talent he was one day before Elimination Chamber. The title wasn't on the line, so no damage was done to the title. But the John Cena holding the United States Championship this week is not half the star he was last week. That's still a noticeably bigger star than the last several guys who have held the championship (excluding Sheamus) like Rusev and Dean Ambrose, but until last week, the US title was on the biggest star it could have possibly been on short of Undertaker. His star value has dropped massively since last week.

Are you still banging on about this? I find it hard to believe that in one post you say Cena has elevated the US title to an importance that it's never seen before, yet he's damaged goods.

Also find it hard to fathom that after 12 years a 15 time World Champion can be so damaged after one loss. One loss not to a noob, but Kevin Owens, who is a former ROH World Champion, and presently holds the NXT championship belt.

Cena hasn't been damaged at all. Wrestlers do win and lose matches, and if you're going to use that theory that you have, Dean Ambrose should be the number one jobber in the WWE today. The guy has barely won one match in the last year, but look where he is now.

John Cena is the WWE's cash cow, and if Vince McMahon thought for one minute the gravy train would go off the tracks, do you honestly think he would let that happen? The WWE is trying to build new stars, and it's the present stars that will help to make future ones. That's exactly what John Cena is doing now. It's part of his job to ensure that before he bows out the show will go on.

It's fans like you that don't welcome change and want everything to remain the same. Cena will wrestle until he has to be helped out to the ring, and Ziggler will be the one right behind him second in line to the throne. By that time the rest of us will have moved on as we're bored stiff with the same old shit weekly.

 

[Rayne]

I said the US title's stock has never been higher, not John Cena's. Cena's was permanently damaged in my eyes. He'll never again be the level of talent he was one day before Elimination Chamber. The title wasn't on the line, so no damage was done to the title. But the John Cena holding the United States Championship this week is not half the star he was last week. That's still a noticeably bigger star than the last several guys who have held the championship (excluding Sheamus) like Rusev and Dean Ambrose, but until last week, the US title was on the biggest star it could have possibly been on short of Undertaker. His star value has dropped massively since last week.

Yeah, I had a hunch it would be "CENA was damaged, not the value of the championship he holds, because that's a thing that makes sense to me." No one's ever going to believe it the next time John Cena Rises Against Hate, Defeats Adversity, Hustle Loyalty Respects, or Never Gives Up his way to a victory in a rematch after getting destroyed in the first encounter. I'll bet half the arena even boos John Cena. If things get crazy, maybe they'll start a chant about him.

 

[FlairFan2003]

The sad thing is Cena has done more for the US title since Mania, than Rollins has done for the WWE title in the same period of time. That makes me wonder what the hell is going on here.

Rollins has kept his title by using his little army of small men to keep it, and Cena has thrown out an open challenge every week, and had some damm good matches out of it. Now he's against Owens, who I believe will be the number two heel behind Rollins. This will be a great feud as they had the match of the night at EC.

Uhhh....Rollins is a cowardly heel, he is supposed to use "his army of small men" to keep the title, in fact, it would be lame if he didn't, the biggest reason you hate Rollins and pay to see him lose is because he needs his "army" to keep the belt....He is a bit more cowardly than some of the classic heel champs of the past (Race, Flair, HHH, maybe Edge although Edge was a pretty big coward, Orton) but like all of them he displays just enough skill & resiliency that you know beating him wont be easy but never enough that you think he absolutely can get by without his "army"....that makes you want to see him lose even more, and makes his eventual loss that much sweeter.

Cena is the opposite, so of course he does "open challenges", faces a wider array of competition, etc.

As for the current run vs Owens, this a huge chance to actually get casual fans to know that NXT even exists because quite honestly unless you are in the tiny minority of die hard IWC fans you have no clue what NXT even is. Owens is a clear jerk so of course he belittles Cena & the title. I would expect Cena to get the upper hand shortly and for Owens to decide he needs that title, or at least to get the belt off Cena, to prove himself and put Cena away, which will set up a finale at SummerSlam, with the title in play and a big part of the storyline for the characters going in.

 

[whoopin' ass]

Even with the open challenges though, who does it help? Think of it a different way - he didn't do that with the World title. He is so confident that no one can beat him, or he thinks so little of the US title, that he is willing to defend it every week. And that is what happens - every week someone challenges him and in the end, he wins. How is that helping anyone but Cena? But then Owens beats him yet it isn't a title match. This is the same thing that happened when he was WWE Champ - yeah someone might beat him when the title isn't on the line but when it is supposed to count, they lost. How many times did we see that when he was champ - someone else clearly should have won but instead it was Cena? So yeah, he defends it against nobodies but when it comes to someone who counts, Cena is safe. I am not blaming Cena, it is wwe creative. People were shocked when Owens beat Cena - imagine if it had been for the US title. You can't have it both ways - you can be a fighting champ and defend the title at every match except for when someone is booked to beat you. That's a cheat. Which would you rather see - Owens chasing Cena for the title for months, beating him in matches but not getting a title shot when everyone and anyone else does, or Owens taking it in his first match and Cena chasing him to bet it back but not being able to? Which is going to get Owens over better?

 

[Mustang Sally]

He is so confident that no one can beat him, or he thinks so little of the US title, that he is willing to defend it every week. And that is what happens - every week someone challenges him and in the end, he wins. How is that helping anyone but Cena?

I suppose it depends how you look at it. What you're talking about helps the prestige of the US belt.....because it's being defended all the time as opposed to how, say, Dean Ambrose wore the belt but rarely defended it. Yes, he was the US champion, but how could it be considered good if the guy who holds the belt never puts it on the line? I can't see the logic of saying Cena defending the belt every week means he thinks less of the title; I see it exactly opposite. He's made the title relevant again, which was surely what Creative wanted in the first place.

You can't have it both ways - you can be a fighting champ and defend the title at every match except for when someone is booked to beat you. That's a cheat.

That statement makes me think of Bad News Barrett. There was an IC champion who lost cleanly every week, yet continued to hold the belt because it wasn't at stake in any of his matches. Sooner than criticizing Cena for putting his title up for grabs all the time, I would sooner come down on Barrett (or WWE Creative) for all his non-title matches.

As for Owens-Cena not being for the US title, I think it was proper. It was a rookie's first match in WWE.....why would he merit a title shot? On the other hand, I think the belt should be on the line for their next encounter.

 

[justinept]

As for Owens-Cena not being for the US title, I think it was proper. It was a rookie's first match in WWE.....why would he merit a title shot? On the other hand, I think the belt should be on the line for their next encounter.

Well - what merited a match with Cena, period? The logic behind their entire feud was that Owens showed up for a US Open Challenge... so when Owens sets the match for later, I'm supposed to believe 1 of 2 things:

1) The time limit for Kevin Owens to accept the open title challenge expired, and John Cena didn't care to extend it ...

2) Kevin Owens didn't want a title shot, believing instead that beating Cena meant more than taking his title.

Given Cena's character - that he'd accept any challenge any time - I have to go with the second option. If Owens wanted the title shot, he'd have gotten one. And again, this is the problem with the booking...

If you want to make the US Title seem prestigious, you can't have guys showing up on Raw and proclaiming they don't want the title!

That's my issue with the situation. It has nothing to do with Cena as a performer - and everything to do with creative. They're trying to do two conflicting things with Cena right now... 1) They want him to put over the prestige of the title and 2) They want him to put over Kevin Owens by letting Owens pin his shoulders to the mat.

Look - Cena has done a lot to help the title these past couple of months, but all that hard work is going to go right down the drain if he's booked in a long-term program where his title serves as nothing more than a prop for him to carry to the ring.

 

[Mustang Sally]

Well - what merited a match with Cena, period?

I figured the logic was that Cena demanded a match with Owens after KO attacked him in the ring as Cena waited for someone to accept his US title challenge. If Owens didn't care about the title.....fine, Cena would fight him with the belt not on the line. But I saw this as Cena's vendetta against this 'rookie' who showed him up on TV. That the rookie won was a nice slap in the face to those good folks who claim that WWE has become totally predictable.

Cena has done a lot to help the title these past couple of months, but all that hard work is going to go right down the drain if he's booked in a long-term program where his title serves as nothing more than a prop for him to carry to the ring.

True enough; I think he has to continue his open challenge program and keep the feud going with Kevin Owens. A war on two fronts could work if Creative restricts Cena-Owens matches to PPV while keeping the US Title Open Challenge series on Raw.

Really, the title challenge is too good a program to abandon this quickly. Yet, the Cena-Owens feud won't wait.

So.....do both.

 

[justinept]

I figured the logic was that Cena demanded a match with Owens after KO attacked him in the ring as Cena waited for someone to accept his US title challenge. If Owens didn't care about the title.....fine, Cena would fight him with the belt not on the line. But I saw this as Cena's vendetta against this 'rookie' who showed him up on TV. That the rookie won was a nice slap in the face to those good folks who claim that WWE has become totally predictable.

A few things, though - What does it say about the US Title if the main challenger doesn't want it? Think about it like this -

Dean Ambrose has plenty of reasons to want to fight Seth Rollins. Their program does NOT need to be centered around the WWE Title - but it is because the psychology around the WWE Title is that people are supposed to want it! If Ambrose was offered a WWE Title match and turned it down for a non-title match, the announcers would rip into him and fans wouldn't buy it. That's the bar when you're talking about 'prestige.' I don't buy that the US Title is prestigious when people are going out of their way not to fight for it.

True enough; I think he has to continue his open challenge program and keep the feud going with Kevin Owens. A war on two fronts could work if Creative restricts Cena-Owens matches to PPV while keeping the US Title Open Challenge series on Raw.

Really, the title challenge is too good a program to abandon this quickly. Yet, the Cena-Owens feud won't wait.

So.....do both.

The US Title Open does nothing if the main competitor to the title refuses to participate in it. In fact, it discredits the entire concept because it further illustrates how little the main competitor actually cares about the belt.

As for the quality of the program - I've said many times that I've enjoyed it. I love when Cena helps new WWE talent get on the map (which he does a lot more than he gets credit for.) My issue is that this program should have waited. The writers are trying to do two conflicting things with Cena right now, and they can't do both successfully. While defending the title is a basic tenant of building a title's prestige, the more important half really is with the contenders showing how bad they want to take the title. And so you can't have Cena build the US Title while working a program against a guy who admittedly doesn't want anything to do with the belt.