The Hogan Thing

[klunderbunker]

Ok so the other night I was watching Impact and under D-Von's name it says 23 time world tag team champion. That's such a ridiculous number when you think about it. Edge and Christian for instance are 7 time champions. The Dudleys have three times as many reigns as Edge and Christian, arguably their biggest or at worst second biggest tag team rivals.

I started thinking about how Cole and Matthews are always going on and on about how Edge is an 11 time champion or Cena is a 9 time champion etc. The more I thought about it, the more I thought it sounded silly. What I wanted to know is how many people knew how many world titles Hogan had, as he has more than Orton, Cena and Edge but fewer than HHH. The other two questions were designed to see if knowing the number of title reigns a person had would make people think that they had the title too often.

Obviously there are major flaws in this and a ton of outside factors such as preference or point of view and eras etc, but the main answer I got seemed to be that people didn't think Hogan had the title too often but the others, or at least some of them, did. What this makes me think is that constantly saying how many times a person has held the title as is done now makes fans think that person is champion too often.

Again, by no means am I saying this is accurate or universal etc so don't complain about me saying it is.

 

[Hawkeye]

I think once the number get too a certain point it seems redundant for the guy in question to keep winning the championship. Austin was the face of the company for nearly a decade and only held the world title 6 times, but Edge who has stayed at the top for a long time,but only came to singles dominance in the last 5 maybe 6 years has 11 reigns.

Rocky's a nine time champ and was second only to Stone Cold in his heyday, but HHH is a 13 time champ as opposed to 'Taker, a man who's been around for 20 years and has become the standard of the WWE but only has 7 title reigns to his name. But with Taker, his presence alone got him over, he never really needed a title reign to appear as a dominant force.

Also, isn't it funny how Cena and Rock have the same number of title reigns? How about Orton and Stone Cold?

EDIT: Orton has 7, Austin has 6. My bad.

 

[klunderbunker]

Austin wasn't around for nearly a decade. His first major thing was in June of 96, he wasn't a main event guy until April of 97, he was champion in April of 98, he was gone more or less all of 2000, he was gone a lot of 2002 and his last competitive match was 03. If you stretch as far as possible you could say it was less than 7 years and that's at best.

 

[shattered dreams]

Not quite sure what it means but the reaction to Orton is interesting. Initial reaction seems to be yes based on his prominence in the main event scene yet once they look at the number the opinion changes. So it seems like the presentation of the numbers can alter opinion. At the same time it is telling that the kneejerk reaction has little to do with the facts. Probably some interesting implications about length of the reign seeming to be irrelevant for most people as well. Edge got the most yes votes yet he has only cumulatively had a title about two months more than Orton, although I guess there is some factor of "deserving" involved as well.

 

[Hawkeye]

Austin wasn't around for nearly a decade. His first major thing was in June of 96, he wasn't a main event guy until April of 97, he was champion in April of 98, he was gone more or less all of 2000, he was gone a lot of 2002 and his last competitive match was 03. If you stretch as far as possible you could say it was less than 7 years and that's at best.

Even with that being said, it still seems a bit lopsided when compared to Edge. But I guess it comes back to Edge's former M.O in regards to title wins. So with that in place, the method in which they acquire title reigns would also be a factor. If you think ahead to the day Sheamus makes it onto this list, we'll all come back to his first victory which saw Cena fall through a table.

 

[The Brain]

I think the reason people think guys like Cena and Orton have held the title too many times is because they probably have many more reigns ahead of them. Nine title reigns seems like a good number for a legend whose career is over, but these guys have many years left. Where will they rank three years from now? They'll probably be nearly 20 time champions. Hogan's number is likely final. Also WWE having two champions factors in to the perception. Edge is an 11 time champion but has never really been the top guy. If there was only one champion Edge would have probably held the title twice. Edge won his first title five years ago. His longest reign lasted about three months and was never the true top guy. He has one less reign than Hogan who was the undisputed top guy for 15 years. That just doesn't seem right. It's obviously a different time but the length Edge's 11 title reigns don't add up to even half of Hogan's first.

 

[Барбоса]

What, no presentation complete with flow charts, Venn diagrams and pie charts?

 

[klunderbunker]

Psh. What do you think I am, obsessed or something?

 

[Slyfox696]

It's only natural there are so many World Champions now. With wrestling on TV every single week, and with the WWE having a World title on both Raw and Smackdown, it's not all together surprising there are so many World Champions. As fans, we have to adjust our thinking in terms of quantity, where number of reigns has replaced length of reigns.

 

[Lee]

I've said it plenty of times that length of reigns shouldn't be based on days held but the amount of times it was defended. I'm sure that would make Cena the longest reigning champ of all time.

 

[Big Nick Dudley]

On a smaller note, what was the final figure on Hogan? I have 15.

 

[Mighty NorCal]

Ok so the other night I was watching Impact and under D-Von's name it says 23 time world tag team champion. That's such a ridiculous number when you think about it. Edge and Christian for instance are 7 time champions. The Dudleys have three times as many reigns as Edge and Christian, arguably their biggest or at worst second biggest tag team rivals.

I started thinking about how Cole and Matthews are always going on and on about how Edge is an 11 time champion or Cena is a 9 time champion etc. The more I thought about it, the more I thought it sounded silly. What I wanted to know is how many people knew how many world titles Hogan had, as he has more than Orton, Cena and Edge but fewer than HHH. The other two questions were designed to see if knowing the number of title reigns a person had would make people think that they had the title too often.

Obviously there are major flaws in this and a ton of outside factors such as preference or point of view and eras etc, but the main answer I got seemed to be that people didn't think Hogan had the title too often but the others, or at least some of them, did. What this makes me think is that constantly saying how many times a person has held the title as is done now makes fans think that person is champion too often.

Again, by no means am I saying this is accurate or universal etc so don't complain about me saying it is.

I am so fucking confused right now

 

[klunderbunker]

I am so fucking confused right now

In short, saying Edge is an 11 time champion or Cena is a 9 time champion over and over and over makes them seem like weaker champions than Hogan who had more title reigns but the number wasn't mentioned over and over.

 

[klunderbunker]

Oh and Hogan had 12 recognized title reigns: 6 WWF and 6 WCW.

 

[Mighty NorCal]

Im gonna go ahead and say I dont think anyone looks into it that deeply.

Besides, uh, you.

 

[klunderbunker]

Im gonna go ahead and say I dont think anyone looks into it that deeply.

Besides, uh, you.

Well who else is going to take a study with follow up questions? THE WORLD HAS TO KNOW!

 

[Big Nick Dudley]

The Southeastern titles do not count? And who makes this determination?

 

[Coco]

You're not wrong to think into it that much. But my thinking is rather "Who's had unnecessary title runs?" My answer to that is all of them. Of course not everybody is looking at it my way.

 

[kronikfish666]

Oh and Hogan had 12 recognized title reigns: 6 WWF and 6 WCW.

He actually had 7 in WCW and 1 in Japan as well

 

[klunderbunker]

The Southeastern titles do not count? And who makes this determination?

The fact that they're Southeastern Championships perhaps? If that's the case Nick Dinsmore is a 9 time world champion for his OVW work

You're not wrong to think into it that much. But my thinking is rather "Who's had unnecessary title runs?" My answer to that is all of them. Of course not everybody is looking at it my way.

A lot of them are, especially the quick title changes.

He actually had 7 in WCW and 1 in Japan as well

Name the 7. And the Japanese ones don't count.

 

[kronikfish666]

Russo came out after he won it and said it was the "Hogan Memorial Title". In my eyes it counts if it doesn't in yours well too bad for you

 

[MrHashasheen]

The fact that they're Southeastern Championships perhaps? If that's the case Nick Dinsmore is a 9 time world champion for his OVW work

No, he's a 9 time OVW champion. It's a regional championship, like the Memphis Southern Heavyweight Championship, or the NWA North American Championship or whatever. I personally don't have a problem with recognizing regional titles when they're relevant.

 

[klunderbunker]

Russo came out after he won it and said it was the "Hogan Memorial Title". In my eyes it counts if it doesn't in yours well too bad for you

Yep...you're wrong.

 

[klunderbunker]

No, he's a 9 time OVW champion. It's a regional championship, like the Memphis Southern Heavyweight Championship, or the NWA North American Championship or whatever. I personally don't have a problem with recognizing regional titles when they're relevant.

Translation, not world titles. Thanks for trying.

 

[Big Nick Dudley]

The fact that they're Southeastern Championships perhaps? If that's the case Nick Dinsmore is a 9 time world champion for his OVW work.

Technically speaking, they count, no?