The Art of the Promo

[Sexcellence of Sexecution]

Dolph Ziggler is an interesting superstar. He's over with the crowd, clearly, and now that he has the Money in the Bank briefcase he's in line for a World Title. However, for most of his career he either got no mic time or had his manager Vickie Guerrero do most of his talking for him, as managers tend to do. He's cut a few promos on his own here and there, the latest of which was his promo on Chris Jericho last Monday, which people seemed to think was good for the most part.

I think this kind of shows how the art of the promo has been lost, and people seem to forget the basics when it comes to cutting an effective promo. With promos in wrestling, the general rule is to build your opponent up AS WELL as build yourself up. If you promote your opponent and they promote you, it promotes the match and feud.

Dolph Ziggler didn't do that with Chris Jericho. He said that since Jericho has returned he's sucked and won no matches. Even if that's true, you don't want to say that in a promo against the guy because now if you "beat him" all you've done is beat a guy who sucks and can't beat anybody anyways. However, if you lose, you've buried yourself because you made your opponent out to be weak, therefore a loss to him makes you look even weaker. It's a lose-lose situation.

I didn't make this thread just to pick on that one promo by Dolph Ziggler, he's not the only one to be guilty of doing this. CM Punk cut a promo on Del Rio building up to their match at Survivor Series last year in which he said Del Rio was "uninteresting". This does nothing to help build the match or the feud, all it does it make CM Punk seem "edgy" and put over that aspect of his character. I understand CM Punk is a guy who is supposed to cross lines and say outrageous things and that's fine, but you can do that in such as way as to still help put over your opponent and feud.

So what's your take on the examples I've pointed out here? Beyond that, do you think the art of cutting a good promo has been lost in the modern era? Or do you think the old rules regarding promos are somewhat passe in a time when the cat is so far out of the bag, so to speak, in terms of professional wrestling?

 

[The mind]

Yes and no. Part of it could be that someone could say that another wrestler sucks, and hasn't ebeaten anyone, etc. However, should the other wrestler win, they get bragging rights, and it allows the other wrestler to keep the fued going by trying to beat the one wrestler he said sucks.

A good promo is what to say, and what not to say.

 

[2Sweet_4Life]

A good promo is something that can grab people's attention not neccesarily like Punk's 'pipe bomb' promo, But an example would be leading up to WM28 when HBK came back & him and HHH had 1 of the best promo's i've EVER seen. (If you haven't seen it look it up, It was HBK's first week back in the HHH vs Taker fued). But for example if ADR or Sheamus grab a mic i just go to the toilet because they never say anything important. All sheamus says is IM GONNA KICK UR ARSE FELLA! Which is lame and all the little kids piss their pyjamas. And all ADR says is Perro. Compare that to when Y2J,Savage, The Rock pick up a mic your are instantly drawn in to what they will say. For example if i recorded RAW i just fast forward through the Promo's unless Y2J picks up the Mic. They all say the same thing- Cena-I never give up...., Punk- I'm the best in the world..., Sheamus-Im gonna kick ur arse fella! It gets predictable compared to last year when Punk was insulting people left,right and centre.

 

[DethMetal]

I remember reading Jericho's first book and said that this was one of the first pointers he was given in pro wrestling. He was facing a veteran, and started calling him old, etc. The guy (who's name I can't quite remember) pulled him aside and told him that he dug a grave. If he wins, he just beat up an old man. If he loses, then he just got beaten by an old man. I see elements of that in the Ziggler promo. You can't bury your opponent too much in a promo, especially if that opponent is someone who isn't doing so hot at the moment, because if you win, you lose. If you lose, you lose.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

I think that the poster above me put it pretty simply. To me, a good promo is one that involves someone that's able to talk and is able to draw you in for the purpose of making you care about listening to him talk and wrestle inside the ring. To me, Dolph Ziggler did that. Jericho didn't have to say anything, Jericho didn't have to be built up or put over by Ziggler. Ziggler stood in the ring, carried himself like a star and put himself over as he controlled the promo.

Because of Ziggler's improvements to himself as an on-screen character, coupled with Jericho's promo skills and the fact that both are superb inside the ring, I care about this feud. At the end of the day, that's all that matters. I was entertained, I was interested in the interaction from these two and I'm interested to see what hapens next. To me, that's a good promo. I don't really give a shit about what you're "supposed" to do based on what some did back in the old days. That's like saying someone isn't a "real wrestler" if they don't do this move or if they don't do that move. To me, it's nonsense.

 

[LigerBomb]

Yeah, this is straight out of Jericho's book. However, just like any rule, it can be bent or broken –the trick is to know when to do which. And that comes with experience. More to the point, who knows what WWE's plans are. For all I know it's exactly what had to happen to put something in motion. It's difficult (not to mention short sighted)to accurately judge something individually and not as a part of a whole. Until I see what this is leading to I'll keep an open mind.

 

[DirtyD79]

The problem is there's just way too much emphasis these days on catchphrases and trending on Twitter. You look at a guy like Jake The Snake, his promos weren't about seeing what he can get put on a shirt. They laid out the stakes of the match and explained why he did what he did.

They were also consistent with his character. Like when him and Undertaker crashed Liz and Macho Man's wedding party, being a sociopath he somehow couldn't understand just why they would be upset. He felt he was in the right because he didn't get invited. Even more he was beaming with sadistic glee about hitting Liz. It wouldn't make sense for him to pull out a guitar and then bust into song about Cleveland and lady parts or to call Liz a Hoski.

 

[Fansince1992]

Firstly it's nice to see Ziggler controlling the Stick and Vikkie standing in the background for once. Ziggler did a good job, He nailed the Promo pretty well as he mashed away at Jericho's rather lacklusture return. Jericho said nothing, but the look on his face showed emotion that right there was putting over Ziggler and keeping Dolph in charge of the promo.

John Cena did something simular when he faced Brock Lesnar at Extreme Rules. Remember the contract signing where Cena didn't say a single word, and looked scared of the beast who was ready to rip his head off? Cena was right there putting across his own promo without saying anything and making Brock look like a Brick Wall that you would never get past. Cena and Jericho are great talkers but they know when it's the right time to give thier opponent the rub to build up the Fued.

The Miz is amazing at this aswell. I think a good promo is not just about how well a Wrestler rolls off his words on the Mic but thier Facial Expression also plays a Massive part aswell. The Miz has been involved with promos with the likes of The Rock and Stone Cold for this very reason, he is making these old legendary wrestlers look amazing to the viewers.

I like The OP's idea here of a good Promo Wrestler not just owning his opponent on the Mic but putting his rival over at the same time. There are tonnes of examples you could use here.. remember The Rock's Face when Cena left the ring when he told The Rock "Are you Dwayne Johnson or The Rock" and "I also don't need to put my promo notes on my Wrist" When Cena left the ring The Rock looked like he was about to cry (great acting), he is putting Cena over right there and building up a heated rivalry.

Big Show in tears after being Fired by Johhny L. Big Show was gold in that promo, it dragged on but Johnny L got incredible Heat after that in my opinion.

For Dolph Ziggler he hasn't had very much Mic time but i think he did well with his first Promo with Jericho. He owned Jericho with his words but then Bam he took the Codebreaker to even up the Fued.

Good Thread

 

[Teddy Irving]

I know what the poster means by not making your opponent look terrible when you talk about them as it is a lose lose situation, but I think you missed out the subtle difference in the way Ziggler did this.
Ziggler didn't just say Jericho is a nobody who is incapable of performing at his level, he couldn't given Jericho's accolades. What he did say was that since Jericho has been back he has lost it and in saying that it implies that Jericho must then, at some stage, have had IT.
Ziggler was saying that Jericho was over the hill and that he, Dolph Ziggler, was the present and the future and that Jericho should retire. He admits to Jericho's in ring ability just that Jericho no longer seems to be able to 'finish his dinner'

Also if you want to look for someone who buried his opponents on the mic look to someone everyone says is arguably the best ever on the mic, The Rock. I loved listening to this guy and was always captivated by him when he spoke but the fact was he buried people a lot on that mic.

 

[thebowtiekiller]

yep the art of cutting a promo has been lost like it or not its because of the pg thing wrestlers are very restricted in what there alowd to say i think its also a lot more scripted then it used to be thats why that cm punk promo seemed so badass when it really wasnt to be honest i think they need to cut down on the scripting and overcontrolling and let the talen try and shine on there own a bit

 

[IT Factor]

I kind of tie this topic into the previous "why aren't debuts impactful anymore" topic. Promos are a lost art because quite simply, there are no real stars. No one in which people can get behind and clearly want to hear from. To some degree, the PG thing does kind of place restrictions on what can and cannot be done with promos. It doesn't change the fact that people can either deliver or they fail trying.

Look at Dolph Ziggler. He's great in the ring and pretty much has great matches with anyone he's placed with. As a character, he falls flat in every imagineable way possible. He has shown in the past that he may be capable of delivering, but it remains to be seen if he can hold his own on a regular basis. While having a manager works for those who are beyond help on the mic, Ziggler really needs to attempt standing on his own. No one buys a superstar who cannot get their self over enough to carry their storylines to believeability. I dunno. Maybe WWE needs to round up their best promo workers[legends] and have them help the new generation and give them pointers on how to deliver. That may help these struggling talents establish connections with audiences and in turn make them real stars. At this point, WWE need to try anything to break the vicious cycle they seem to be stuck in of lacking stars. This affects everything including the lost art of promos.