Should Dolph Ziggler be stripped of the WWE WHC?

[It's...Baylariat!]

I think the best angle to work with here instead of stripping Ziggler of the belt is to have Ziggler designate Big E Langston to take his place. Have the Board of Directors approve it or something.

I also seen in one of the posts that AJ could end up costing Langston a match for the title, so he can drop it to someone like Jericho or Del Rio or Orton or something. It would work out well as Ziggler can still use the 'you didn't beat me' shtick that KB mentioned, and Ziggler doesn't get buried in the process.

But to answer the question - no. The reasoning is because it's an injury Ziggler couldn't avoid (concussion). If we strip titles from wrestlers because they have to miss time due to a concussion, it'll make the fans think the WWE punishes legit injuries and with all the stuff going with concussions, it could send a bad message.

 

[THE Great GAMMA]

The only thing I don't understand is, why can't they use him in non physical ways? I mean they have langston which could be perfect for this situation, have him cut some promos, piss some people off they go at him and langston keeps shutting it down.

I totally agree with this.

I also agree with a previous poster when they said strip him of the title and make it a storyline.

Strip him have him complain about it. Then set up a tournament for the WHC at the next PPV (i think its no way out). Have them have the Quarter finals semi finals and finals at the same pay per view (good way to bring back something like King of the Ring) and have Dolph go through all that to win it again...

That's how you make a new star as WHC and elevate the importance of the title.

 

[The Butcher]

The only thing I don't understand is, why can't they use him in non physical ways? I mean they have langston which could be perfect for this situation, have him cut some promos, piss some people off they go at him and langston keeps shutting it down.

I totally agree with this.

It's not recommended to fly with a concussion. That's the main reason why they haven't been able to use him in non-physical ways up to this point. He can't be there. Along with that, the lights, crowd noise, etc. would be very, very uncomfortable for him.

 

[THE Great GAMMA]

It's not recommended to fly with a concussion. That's the main reason why they haven't been able to use him in non-physical ways up to this point. He can't be there. Along with that, the lights, crowd noise, etc. would be very, very uncomfortable for him.

That is true. What i am glad about is that they taking concussions a lot more seriously now than before

 

[The Butcher]

That is true. What i am glad about is that they taking concussions a lot more seriously now than before

Agreed. It's another justification, at least to me, for him to be able to hold the title for at least a little while longer before being stripped. We're in a new age of understanding as it relates to the immediate impact and long-term effects of head injuries. In the not-too-distant past, it may have been permissible for Dolph to work through the injury, and I'm sure a guy in his position probably would have. Now, with WWE's emphasis on the health of their Superstars/Divas, they probably don't want to do anything to Dolph that would make another guy in the future lie about or try to hide the fact that he has a concussion.

 

[THE Great GAMMA]

Agreed. It's another justification, at least to me, for him to be able to hold the title for at least a little while longer before being stripped. We're in a new age of understanding as it relates to the immediate impact and long-term effects of head injuries. In the not-too-distant past, it may have been permissible for Dolph to work through the injury, and I'm sure a guy in his position probably would have. Now, with WWE's emphasis on the health of their Superstars/Divas, they probably don't want to do anything to Dolph that would make another guy in the future lie about or try to hide the fact that he has a concussion.

That is one of the reasons they should strip him of it. To show that his health and well being are more important than titles. That is also another reason why the Tournament would work so well. You strip him. take a week to set the tournament up give him a bye through the first round. and with the number of people on the roster round 1 could take a week or two. this gives him an extra 3 weeks to get better as well as keeping him and the title relavent

 

[shalliin]

Having not even read any other posts for this thread, I Have to say that YES he should ABSOLUTELY be stripped of the title. Even in the made up rules, if a champ can't defend in 30days he is to be stripped of his title. And I don't remember the date but he's either past or approaching that 30 day window now. That alone should see him stripped of the title.
Another potential reason is to think of the possibilites this opens up. You could run a long tournament to crown a new champ, make it long enough that he could take part and win it back perhaps with a bye to the final or semi final round, or make it short and try a new champ.

Have a 3,4,6 man mantch of the last champs or new challengers and can have Langston represent Ziggles. Or a throw back to the original concept for King of Ring style with a twist:
1 night (ppv) tournament Start with 4 singles matches, then 2 gimmick(say 1 ladder and 1 street fight) and last a lumberjack with the lumberjacks being those that lost the matches earlier.

So much to be done with Ziggles giving up the title which translates to a lot of creative options , of course being the wwe, they'll mess it up no matter what they do, but the only thing that would keep the entire situation from decending into a complete mess is to strip Ziggy of his title. Letting him retain while he's on the shelf is the worst thing they can do, as it not only breaks their rules it breaks precendent as any time in the past when the champ suffered a major injury, he had to be stripped or was conived to loose his belt.

 

[The Butcher]

That is one of the reasons they should strip him of it. To show that his health and well being are more important than titles. That is also another reason why the Tournament would work so well. You strip him. take a week to set the tournament up give him a bye through the first round. and with the number of people on the roster round 1 could take a week or two. this gives him an extra 3 weeks to get better as well as keeping him and the title relavent

Let me rephrase what I said, because it is certainly no reason to strip him of the title. Before I do that, though, I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but WWE isn't doing any tournaments or the like anytime soon. If you'll recall, they briefly promoted an "Intercontinental Cup Tournament" back in January, and nixed it pretty quickly. I wouldn't hold my breath if that's what you're looking for. It seems like things such as tourneys and best of # series have been shelved until further notice.

Back to my point about stripping Ziggler of his title: If they take it from him, it could send the wrong message to the rest of the locker room. Some could take it as a sign that if they come forward about having a concussion, then they'll be unwillingly sidelined and lose things like titles and pushes. Should that happen, and a Superstar in the future wrestles with a concussion that he hid and suffers further injury, WWE will open themselves up to a whole new round of criticisms about their treatment of talent and adherence to the Wellness Policy. The wiser move is to be patient, stick with the established plan for Ziggler's run, and reinforce the idea that reporting head injuries will not cause a Superstar/Diva to lose their title or push. The World Heavyweight Championship is neither draw enough nor forgettable enough to be rash and start booking on the fly. The title isn't going to fall into obscurity just because it isn't on a couple throwaway pay-per-views.

I would personally strip Dolph Ziggler if required.... of the WHC. If Vince needs my duties, I will get in there with my soft hands and strip him.... of the WHC.

I'm setting the over/under of you being sent to the prison at 4 days.

 

[shalliin]

Having not even read any other posts for this thread, I Have to say that YES he should ABSOLUTELY be stripped of the title. Even in the made up rules, if a champ can't defend in 30days he is to be stripped of his title. And I don't remember the date but he's either past or approaching that 30 day window now. That alone should see him stripped of the title.
Another potential reason is to think of the possibilites this opens up. You could run a long tournament to crown a new champ, make it long enough that he could take part and win it back perhaps with a bye to the final or semi final round, or make it short and try a new champ.

Have a 3,4,6 man mantch of the last champs or new challengers and can have Langston represent Ziggles. Or a throw back to the original concept for King of Ring style with a twist:
1 night (ppv) tournament Start with 4 singles matches, then 2 gimmick(say 1 ladder and 1 street fight) and last a lumberjack with the lumberjacks being those that lost the matches earlier.

So much to be done with Ziggles giving up the title which translates to a lot of creative options , of course being the wwe, they'll mess it up no matter what they do, but the only thing that would keep the entire situation from decending into a complete mess is to strip Ziggy of his title. Letting him retain while he's on the shelf is the worst thing they can do, as it not only breaks their rules it breaks precendent as any time in the past when the champ suffered a major injury, he had to be stripped or was conived to loose his belt.

 

[shalliin]

No way! Why would they take the belt off him if he just got it? all that time waiting for Ziggy to cash in and then WWE strip him not a chance!
Plus The Rock was WWE champion for 3 months and he only defended the WWE title on 3 PPV's and CM Punk was number 1 contender for 2 months, and then he faced John Cena!

Yes, 3 months and 3 ppv title defenses. That's lets see . . . .1 defense every 28-31 days? which is within their 'rules'. The 'rule' states it has to be defended at least 1x each 30 days, not that it has to be defended at every event. So the Rock having only the 3 defenses makes sense with what they were doing for him and kept him as an attraction instead of a roster spot.

 

[shalliin]

No, I don't believe they should just yet. Granted, Dolph Ziggler is not a name like Hulk Hogan by any stretch of the imagination. But back during Hulk Hogan's first WCW title run and even his second, he did not defend his title at certain events and the title was never stripped from him. Considering that there's the WWE title on top of it all, I say keep the strap on Ziggler. Until there comes a point where his return to in ring action gets further delayed, I say keep things the way they are.

Ziggler, despite my not being a fan of his has a following and is over with the crowd, I think a heel is very well suited to the Big Gold Belt, and I would like to see them keep some consistency with the title and not be so quick to have it change hands. Again, unless Ziggler can't come back as planned, keep the strap on him.

They would count Hogan's defense against Jobbers at house shows and non televised events. Back then it was a very different experience prior to the 2weekly shows and monthly PPvs so the situations are far from a good comparison.

 

[THE Great GAMMA]

Let me rephrase what I said, because it is certainly no reason to strip him of the title. Before I do that, though, I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but WWE isn't doing any tournaments or the like anytime soon. If you'll recall, they briefly promoted an "Intercontinental Cup Tournament" back in January, and nixed it pretty quickly. I wouldn't hold my breath if that's what you're looking for. It seems like things such as tourneys and best of # series have been shelved until further notice.

Back to my point about stripping Ziggler of his title: If they take it from him, it could send the wrong message to the rest of the locker room. Some could take it as a sign that if they come forward about having a concussion, then they'll be unwillingly sidelined and lose things like titles and pushes. Should that happen, and a Superstar in the future wrestles with a concussion that he hid and suffers further injury, WWE will open themselves up to a whole new round of criticisms about their treatment of talent and adherence to the Wellness Policy. The wiser move is to be patient, stick with the established plan for Ziggler's run, and reinforce the idea that reporting head injuries will not cause a Superstar/Diva to lose their title or push. The World Heavyweight Championship is neither draw enough nor forgettable enough to be rash and start booking on the fly. The title isn't going to fall into obscurity just because it isn't on a couple throwaway pay-per-views.

I agree with you about the dangers of sending the wrong message. I truly feel the WWE should of jacked up their Concussion Policy years ago way before Benoit. in boxing if you get K.O'd your boxing licence is revoked till you get the all clear from a Dr. Same should apply for Wrestling if you have a concussion you should (as Ziggler is doing now) sit on the shelf till he gets the all clear. The thing is as you said, the way they handle this will be setting a president.

I know that the tournament idea is wishful thinking i'm just saying what i would do if i was part of creative

 

[Sweettre15]

It sucks for him but he is a risk taking and often reckless worker, while this wasn't his fault - others have been hurt by him and missed opportunity as a result... Barrett lost his shot at that same briefcase cos of Dolph so these things happen, I hesitate to call it karma as a head injury is not something I wish on people, having one myself but as Gorilla used to say "he went to the well one to many times..."

1. what part of Big Show THREW Ziggler at Barrett is hard to understand?

2. How is getting kicked in the head and caused a concussion in any way "karma" for being THROWN at Wade Barrett by the Big Show?

I really don't get why people CHOOSE to pin that on him. He can't redirect himself in mid-air since he's not Goku.

 

[The Butcher]

I agree with you about the dangers of sending the wrong message. I truly feel the WWE should of jacked up their Concussion Policy years ago way before Benoit. in boxing if you get K.O'd your boxing licence is revoked till you get the all clear from a Dr. Same should apply for Wrestling if you have a concussion you should (as Ziggler is doing now) sit on the shelf till he gets the all clear. The thing is as you said, the way they handle this will be setting a president.

I know that the tournament idea is wishful thinking i'm just saying what i would do if i was part of creative

If I were with creative, I'd use this as an opportunity to get a new WHC contender in the mix. Del Rio and Swagger, after each enjoy a brief renaissance, are boring again. Big E Langston, IMO, has a long way to go before anybody should be considering him, but his name has been brought up and that's an option. I'm not in the mood to go through the roster to find out who fits the bill, but that would be my pitch- use the champion's time away to establish a new contender.

If I were Dolph's new manager my name would be Handjob Hannigan.

Clearly I set the over/under way too high.

 

[Dagger Dias]

No. Dolph Ziggler should NOT be stripped of the World Heavyweight Championship. It really sucked that he could not defend his title at Extreme Rules but if they make him relinquish the title then it makes his Money In the Bank win have been for absolutely nothing. Months and months of build, for a title run that barely even has a chance to take off into being memorable? No! They need to do everything in their power to ensure that Dolph has a memorable run with the World Heavyweight Championship. Not only does he deserve it, but we as fans need payoff for long it took him to finally cash in as well as how long it took for him to win the belt again when his first run didn't even last one night and WWE still expects us to pretend it never happened.

The worst part of it is, if they took the title away from him then he would lose a ton of momentum. Sure he could use the "you never defeated me" argument, but his credibility would take some damage. His only other world title reign was so short that WWE act like it never happened. This one should be the one that matters, that gets him permanently into the main event scene. He's earned it. Stripping him of the title ultimately undoes a lot of the build he has received and I do not support it. Have him work any obligatory (kayfabe) title matches in shorter matches with a DQ finish or something until he is able to work a full match that steals the show again when he comes back at 100%.

 

[Little Jerry Lawler]

No. Dolph Ziggler should NOT be stripped of the World Heavyweight Championship. It really sucked that he could not defend his title at Extreme Rules but if they make him relinquish the title then it makes his Money In the Bank win have been for absolutely nothing. Months and months of build, for a title run that barely even has a chance to take off into being memorable? No! They need to do everything in their power to ensure that Dolph has a memorable run with the World Heavyweight Championship. Not only does he deserve it, but we as fans need payoff for long it took him to finally cash in as well as how long it took for him to win the belt again when his first run didn't even last one night and WWE still expects us to pretend it never happened.

The worst part of it is, if they took the title away from him then he would lose a ton of momentum. Sure he could use the "you never defeated me" argument, but his credibility would take some damage. His only other world title reign was so short that WWE act like it never happened. This one should be the one that matters, that gets him permanently into the main event scene. He's earned it. Stripping him of the title ultimately undoes a lot of the build he has received and I do not support it. Have him work any obligatory (kayfabe) title matches in shorter matches with a DQ finish or something until he is able to work a full match that steals the show again when he comes back at 100%.

Remind me of this build he received before winning the title because all I remember is him losing match after match except that ladder match against Cena.

It would be better for him to lose the title now and actually build up momentum by winning matches which seems foreign nowadays. I see an Orton title reign looming on the horizon. Let Orton run with the title and have Ziggler beat him for it over the summer or fall. Would do a lot more for Ziggler than it has now. Besides, how many title runs can you say have actually been memorable after winning Money In The Bank?

 

[It's...Baylariat!]

No. Dolph Ziggler should NOT be stripped of the World Heavyweight Championship. It really sucked that he could not defend his title at Extreme Rules but if they make him relinquish the title then it makes his Money In the Bank win have been for absolutely nothing. Months and months of build, for a title run that barely even has a chance to take off into being memorable? No! They need to do everything in their power to ensure that Dolph has a memorable run with the World Heavyweight Championship. Not only does he deserve it, but we as fans need payoff for long it took him to finally cash in as well as how long it took for him to win the belt again when his first run didn't even last one night and WWE still expects us to pretend it never happened.

The worst part of it is, if they took the title away from him then he would lose a ton of momentum. Sure he could use the "you never defeated me" argument, but his credibility would take some damage. His only other world title reign was so short that WWE act like it never happened. This one should be the one that matters, that gets him permanently into the main event scene. He's earned it. Stripping him of the title ultimately undoes a lot of the build he has received and I do not support it. Have him work any obligatory (kayfabe) title matches in shorter matches with a DQ finish or something until he is able to work a full match that steals the show again when he comes back at 100%.

Ziggler is one of those athletes that doesn't need a belt to get over. He's so polarizing and entertaining that even if he's not the champion, he can still wrestle and put on a great show.

That being said, I agree with not stripping him of the title. It's a legit injury and punishing someone because they're concussed shows bad taste. But he wouldn't lose momentum if he were to be stripped. Ziggler's good enough to get the fans to boo or hate him and no one will miss a beat and be aware of him being stripped of the title.

 

[Brahma_Bull9]

It's not recommended to fly with a concussion. That's the main reason why they haven't been able to use him in non-physical ways up to this point. He can't be there. Along with that, the lights, crowd noise, etc. would be very, very uncomfortable for him.

Buddy, that's the first week maybe two... It's been a lot longer than that, football players stand on the sidelines at arenas that get much louder than that. And a lot of times they will even fly with the team, hockey players do the same thing.

It really is no excuse at this point, I understand at first. I know someone would come in here and try that bs excuse, now what, we can't compare them to real athletes at all? Then I don't want to hear a wrestler, announcer or and wwe personality refer to the talent as athletes.

They also could keep him away from the crowd in the back and cut promos... use your head a little. This isn't that hard to make adjustments for. If I said this the first week you would be correct. But at this point, it has been far to long to try those tired excuses.

 

[shalliin]

I don't understand the reasoning behind some posters claiming that stripping him of the title while he is injured would invalidate or belittle his work and cashing in of MitB.

He would not be stripped for being a useless waste as a champ(which he is anyway) but it would keep some type of relevance to the title he holds and he would always have the chance to get it back once he returns. I never saw his appeal as a legit top tier kind of guy anyway. He's nothing more then a sell factory. The only talent he has is selling others moves, he has an incredibly weak looking finisher, has no compelling mic skills and just doesn't have that 'it' factor. He's a bland modern version of Flair.

But all that aside, he does seem to work hard for what little he has, and it is bad that he got hurt, but if he is out for a lengthy time and you let him keep the belt, it renders his championship meaningless. It's not like ratings have plummeted since he's off tv, and if he stays off and they remain in the same range, it shows that his being champion is not having the impact you want your champ to have which is to pull in ratings and asses to seats along with the PPV buys.

 

[The Butcher]

Buddy, that's the first week maybe two... It's been a lot longer than that, football players stand on the sidelines at arenas that get much louder than that. And a lot of times they will even fly with the team, hockey players do the same thing.

It really is no excuse at this point, I understand at first. I know someone would come in here and try that bs excuse, now what, we can't compare them to real athletes at all? Then I don't want to hear a wrestler, announcer or and wwe personality refer to the talent as athletes.

They also could keep him away from the crowd in the back and cut promos... use your head a little. This isn't that hard to make adjustments for. If I said this the first week you would be correct. But at this point, it has been far to long to try those tired excuses.

Don't pull a time frame out of your ass like you have a clue as to what you're talking about. Cite something. Concussions vary in severity, symptoms and exasperating factors; not to mention the fact that a doctor can take whatever precautions he or she sees fit. Shut up.

 

[Sweettre15]

It's not like ratings have plummeted since he's off tv, and if he stays off and they remain in the same range, it shows that his being champion is not having the impact you want your champ to have which is to pull in ratings and asses to seats along with the PPV buys.

Now that's ridiculous, the Ratings didn't plummet when The Rock wouldn't appear during his recent championship reign and the ratings were actually better last week when Cena didn't appear on Raw. Yes a champion is supposed to draw but the ratings not plummeting doesn't mean that the person holding the belt doesn't matter to the people....At least not these days. Plus Ziggler's appearance would play more of a part with Smackdown's ratings due to the WHC Champ having to headline that show most of the time.

 

[Brahma_Bull9]

Don't pull a time frame out of your ass like you have a clue as to what you're talking about. Cite something. Concussions vary in severity, symptoms and exasperating factors; not to mention the fact that a doctor can take whatever precautions he or she sees fit. Shut up.

Good job ignoring the substanstive points, I didn't pull a time frame out of your ass. You're a moron who ignores what actual athletes do in concussions... I never said anything about Dr's. If you show me they still haven't cleared him to travel I'd drop it. However, that's not the case. Wasn't he at shows this weekend? Oh he must not have had to travel for those... you also ignore that they don't necessarily have to fly. But I guess working with and thinking of the details apparently is some kind of lies I'm making up to support my point. You don't know anything about me. I'm not a doctor, but I watch a lot of sports.

What about that Kobe Bryant guy who got a concussion in the all star game last year. Pretty sure he didn't miss a game and hopped right on the flight. I'm not saying it was as strong of a blow he took, but still. I don't see why you can't cede somebody else looking at it a different way.

 

[The Crock]

Not right now, but it might be a possibility if he isn't ready for the next PPV. The WWE has re-written their rules countless times and have ignored the 30-day rule before, so it's not something they have to worry about just yet. Still, the lack of a real world title feud is putting a damper on things, and I know the they're trying work around it with Langston/Del Rio and the like, but that's a temporary bandaid. Regardless, Ziggler's health comes first and it wouldn't be the end of the world if they had to strip him -- he could always come back and demand a rematch and win the title back. Heck, the WWE could even go the interim champion route -- like we've seen in the UFC -- and have Del Rio become interim World Heavyweight Champion, only to have a champion vs champion match at the next PPV, to determine who the "true champion" is.

 

[TempestH]

1. what part of Big Show THREW Ziggler at Barrett is hard to understand?

2. How is getting kicked in the head and caused a concussion in any way "karma" for being THROWN at Wade Barrett by the Big Show?

I really don't get why people CHOOSE to pin that on him. He can't redirect himself in mid-air since he's not Goku.

Yes, Big Show DID throw Ziggler at Barrett. But I think the reason people may pin the blame on Dolph for Barrett's injury is because everyone knows that the primary reason that Ziggler is over with the fans is his over the top selling and willingness to take the most outrageous bumps. I think Ziggler is the one who came up with that spot. Barrett got hurt because Dolph wanted to add another awesome, but unnecessary bump to his highlight reel.

 

[Sweettre15]

Yes, Big Show DID throw Ziggler at Barrett. But I think the reason people may pin the blame on Dolph for Barrett's injury is because everyone knows that the primary reason that Ziggler is over with the fans is his over the top selling and willingness to take the most outrageous bumps. I think Ziggler is the one who came up with that spot. Barrett got hurt because Dolph wanted to add another awesome, but unnecessary bump to his highlight reel.

Wouldn't that all be speculation at this point though?

I mean being willing to do them doesn't mean he came up with them OR had any idea it would turn out like that after Big Show threw him.