Round 5: Dave -vs- The Sign Guy

Discussion in 'Debater's League 2010' started by D-Man, Aug 29, 2010.

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  1. D-Man

    D-Man Gone but never forgotten.

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    Who is the better on-screen authority figure in TNA, Jim Cornette or Eric Bischoff?

    This is a fourth round match in the Debater's League. Dave is the home debater and gets to choose which side of the debate they will be on and who debates first, but they have 24 hours to make their choice.

    This thread is for DEBATERS ONLY and will end on Friday at 2pm EST.

    Anyone that posts in this thread besides the debaters, league admins, and judges will be infracted!

    Good luck.​
     
  2. Dave

    Dave Administrator
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    I'm going to go with Jim Cornette.

    TSG can go first.
     
  3. TSG

    TSG Too Sweet To Be Sour

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    Eric Bischoff is the better on-screen authority figure in TNA.

    My arguement is that Bischoff is a better on-screen authroity figure than Jim Cornette. The way I see it, Bischoff is better for one major reason: name value.

    Eric Bischoff, like him or not, is a big name. Bischoff is known throughout the wrestling business, particularly for almost putting Vince McMahon out of business. He is a much bigger name than Cornette, which draws in more viewers, raises the ratings, and gives fans a connection to the program, as they can turn it on an see an old face they know. To me, this makes Eric Bischoff a better on-screen authority figure for TNA.

    For clarity, I am arguing which one is better based on which one that can do more for the company.
     
  4. Dave

    Dave Administrator
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    So, a little belatedly, we get on with this cracker of a debate. Now, I do not know much about TNA but I do know that Jim Cornette is far superior to Eric Bischoff an authoritative role. Now, over the course of this debate, I will set out to prove that point and hopefully get you to subscribe to that view also.

    So, let’s get on with this thing!

    Authority does not mean name value!

    Have you ever met your icon? I once met my icon at an ATM at a petrol station and boy was I excited. He signed a piece of paper for me and we got a picture together. It was very nice. In Scotland, Henrik Larsson is a god amongst men. He was the all-time top goal scorer for my favourite football team and an absolute legend in his own right. This may seem like a digression but it is actually a very pertinent point.

    You see, Henrik Larsson is a huge name all over the world. Be it in Scotland or his native Sweden, Larsson is regarded by many as being a fine footballing talent. The point I a trying to get at here, is that just because he was and is a big name, it doesn’t make me respect him any more. Rather, it how he composes himself and displays that talent to others that really gain respect. Name value means absolutely nothing when it comes to authority.

    Let me pose this hypothetical situation to you. Your mother tells you to jump off of a cliff. She tells you that nothing will happen to you if you do. Your sporting hero also tells you to jump off a cliff and tells you the exact opposite of what your mother told you. If you jump, you will surely die. Now, if you had no idea how big the cliff face was who would you believe?

    Would you believe a man or woman who doesn’t know you and has no impact on your life? Or would you believe your mother, someone who has known you for as long as you can remember and have a basis of trust with? I, personally, would believe my mother and that is the most telling sign of all.

    Being a position of authority does not mean that you are a big name. It is the trust and capability of the figure that matters most.

    Business 101.

    A couple of months ago, I was lucky enough to get a promotion after all of my hard work in my job. I worked closely with people for my full tenure and built up a basis of colleagues and associates that I knew I could trust. We helped each other out and when I was promoted, they were the first people to congratulate me.

    However, at the beginning of my new role, people saw me more as a friend than a superior. They would try and take advantage of my kind nature but I realised that my job is not make friends. My job is to ensure that the company is running well from my point of view. Mutual respect went a long way in making that happen. Without being a respectful employee, I would never have gained that position in the first place and without the team-work ethic that I had built from my original role, I would not have been able to make the new role my own.

    When you are in a position of power, you really must be the best person for the job. You have to lend an ear to your subordinates and be aware that the company is in your hands. Jim Cornette was more than aware of that. Jim Cornette is a man who eat, sleeps and breathes wrestling. His time in TNA was incredible and he ate that place up. With TNA’s acquisition of Ed Ferrara and Vince Russo, Cornette was basically forced out of the door. He could not do his job of being an authority figure any more and Eric Bischoff was brought in a very similar role.

    Now, if Jim Cornette was not happy with his role as an authority figure in TNA, that would tell me that he didn’t have the tools to do that job any more. Nothing has changed and Eric Bischoff now occupies that role. One could say, that Eric Bischoff is happy being the watered down authority figure that Jim Cornette refused to be.

    Eric Bischoff is a polarising figure!

    WCW… Need I say more?

    As an authority figure in WCW, Eric Bischoff let the inmates run the asylum. He may be a very good booker but his promotion went down the tubes and his attitude towards people make him a polarising figure to this day. I would suspect that some of the people who now work for TNA still resent him for the way that WCW was run.

    I guess it all comes back to my Business 101 class that I listed above. Without the respect of your co-workers and subordinates, how can you expect to run a promotion as an authority figure? The answer to that is that you simply can’t. There will always be people unhappy with the way you do things and sniping will always be prevalent in your promotion. You will not be able to rule the people who have no respect for your decisions and that is Erc Bischoff all over.
     
  5. TSG

    TSG Too Sweet To Be Sour

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    To me, it doesn't matter if a bigger name doesn't mean better authority figure. To me, a bigger name is the better person to play the authority figure, on the screen. If they are a bigger name, then they'll draw in more fans and ratings. To me, that makes them a better person to play that position on-screen.

    And sorry about my lateness, Dave. Been busy lately, buddy.
     
  6. Dave

    Dave Administrator
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    See, all of this would be fine and dandy if the fans actually added anything to the show and were at all relevant in this debate. However, they are not.

    What we are talking about is who is the better authority figure in an on-screen role in TNA. Now, whether the authority figure likes it or not, they will never have authority over the TNA fans. Who they have authority over, is the TNA workers and that is where the debate lies. Your whole debate thus far has been completely irrelevant and I urge to go rethink what you are posting.

    That being said, it doesn’t prove that Jim Cornette or Eric Bischoff was the better on screen authority figure in TNA. However, you only need to look at they way Cornette did business in TNA to realise that he was, in fact, the better authority figure and it is not even close.

    Firstly, he was accompanied most of the time by Matt Morgan. Morgan is such an imposing figure and the fact that he needed a bodyguard in the first place, tells you a little bit about the things that he was saying in his authoritative role. TNA’s reluctance to create another Mr. McMahon character meant that Cornette took up very little time on the show but he was so authoritative that he didn’t actually need any more time than that. We have always known Jim Cornette to go right at something and never beat around the bush. Bischoff, in his role in TNA, is all smoke and mirrors.

    Then, of course, you have his company meetings with the TNA superstars. That is the way that Cornette conducted his business and it worked. His authority on these matters meant that the fans were getting what they wanted. Through these meeting, Cornette was able to rule with an iron fist and imposed some pretty big measures during them. Eirc Bischoff has not showed me anything that comes close to that amount of authority in his role.

    No worries.
     
  7. Cena's Little Helper

    Cena's Little Helper Mid-Card Championship Winner

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    The Sign Guy gets a point for punctuality, but he's still up to his old tricks: presenting stylish arguments with no substance to them.

    Final Score
    Dave - 4
    The Sign Guy - 1
     
  8. Miko

    Miko WATCHA GONNA DO, BROTHER!?

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    Clarity: I think I understood the point that Sign Guy was getting at better than Dave, so I guess he gets the clarity point

    Point - The Sign Guy

    Punctuality: digglet gave Sign Guy a point for this, but he admitted he was late, unless I am corrected then this is Dave's point surely

    Point - Dave

    Informative: Dave bought a lot more information and facts to this debate, so this is his point by rights

    Point - Dave

    Persuasion: I said I understood Sign Guys stance a little better than Dave's, but he didnt convince me it was the right one, Dave got his point across clear enough and out of the 2 arguments presented his came off as the most believable

    Point - The wee bastard

    My scores;

    The Sign Guy - 1
    Dave - 4
     
  9. Phoenix

    Phoenix WZCW's First Triple Crown Champion

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    Clarity of debate: Dave
    Better presentation and approach to the debate, interesting aspect to take to in order to relate to personal experience with this one.

    Punctuality: Dave
    Sign Guy actually took over 24 hours to post his opening debate after Dave chose him to go first, so awarding the point here.

    Informative: Dave
    More thorough posts and backed up with evidence.

    Persuasion: Dave
    Sign Guy didn't provide anything solid for Dave to oppose, the moment Dave made his opening post, he had this debate and Sign Guy didn't try to sway me on it.

    Final Score
    Dave: 5
    Sign Guy: 0
     
  10. D-Man

    D-Man Gone but never forgotten.

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    I've got this as a clean sweep for Dave. The Sign Guy's arguments were very weak and didn't contain a lot of convincing arguments.

    Dave gets 5 points.
     
  11. D-Man

    D-Man Gone but never forgotten.

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    After a complete judge's tally, Dave is the victor with 18 points to Sign Guy's 2.

    Congratulations and great debating from the both of you!
     
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