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Randy Savage one of wrestlings biggest wasted talents?

Wall_of_Jericho

Break Me Down.
Just thought I would write a piece about one of my all time favourite wrestlers, Macho Man Randy Savage and his last couple of years in WWE (1992 – 1994). Something which I had never witnessed and still have yet to see again. He went through a steady decline, which saw him, go from WWE Champion, to midcard, to, one off matches, to announcer before finally leaving the company for WCW. Makes you realise was he one of the biggest wasted talents WWE ever had? Could they have gotten more from him?

A former WWE Champion, Intercontinental Champion and King of the Ring. Savage was one of the best and most popular stars in the 1980s. Randy also main evented Wrestlemania V and was involved in one of the greatest Wrestlemania matches of all time when he lost the Intercontinental Championship to The Dragon at Wrestlemania III.

1992 began well for Macho Man Randy Savage as he was deadlocked in a feud with Jake Roberts, which had been going since Jake crashed Randys wedding at Summerslam 1991. Along the way we saw Jake viciously attack Macho Man and go as far as to use his pet Snake on him. As a kid I will never forget the image of Jake Roberts Snake chomping on the arm of the Macho Man. Randy finally saw off Jake Roberts once and for all on an episode of Saturday Nights Main Event in early 1992 and pretty soon after he found himself in a tussle with Ric Flair (the then WWE Champion) over his wife Elizabeth. Savage had become so popular with a lot of fans after his reuniting with Elizabeth and his marriage to her, so the storyline between Ric and Randy really did seem so much more real and personal.

Randy Savage defeated Ric Flair by (suspicious) pinfall at Wrestlemania VIII and became the WWE Champion for the second time in undoubtedly the best match of 1992. This could not have come at a better time for Macho Man, he was the #1 guy in the company at a time when Hulk Hogan was taking a year off to do movies. It was also time when Rowdy Roddy Piper was moving away from the business, The Undertaker was just beginning his babyface run, Bret Hart was still in the midcard as well as the British Bulldog. Macho Man was the top babyface in the company and looked like the man that Vince would place all his chips on as the top guy. That was until an hour later, in the same event (Wrestlemania VIII) when the Ultimate Warrior returned from nowhere to help Hulk Hogan from an attack by Sid Justice and Papa Shango. Warrior almost instantly stole Randys spot and basically made everyone forget the awesome match earlier in the night. It is debatable but if you listen, the noise in the Hoosier Dome for Warriors return eclipses the noise the crowd made when Randy Savage won the Championship.

Randy held the Championship for six months before losing the belt back to Ric Flair in September 1992. Along the way Randy defended the belt against the Ultimate Warrior at Summerslam 1992 infront of a packed Wembley Stadium. It was a special night and I still remember watching it live on TV however Randy and Warrior (despite having a good match) didn’t main event the Pay Per View. Instead Vince played to the home crowd and put Bret Hart vs British Bulldog as the main event. A match which made Bret Hart as he had to carry Bulldog to a five star match. The match is great but if you watch closely there are a lot of botched moves. As Bret Hart says in his DVD, this match is the match, which signalled to Vince that Bret could do it in the main event. A fact that would be true as only a month after Ric Flair regained the belt from Macho Man, Bret Hart won the title from Ric Flair and became the WWE Champion.

The months that followed saw Macho Man make a steady decline from the main event. He finished his feud with Ric Flair at Survivor Series 1992 before eventually fading out of the main event scene to move down to an announcer. Now it’s not unheard of for a wrestler to become an announcer but this usually comes at the end of a career and as Macho Man proved. He still had it even as much as five years later. Macho Man was not injured either, so it wasn’t like he was placed at the announce table to disguise he was injured. Randy became a bit part player in the company only wrestling occasionally within the next eighteen months. Did you know Macho Man only wrestled four times on Raw for the whole calendar year of 1993 and only twice in 1994? Savage also took part in the 1993 and 1994 Royal Rumbles as well as being a substitute for Mr Perfect in Razor Ramon’s team at the 1993 Survivor Series and of course he faced Crush at Wrestlemania X. It’s not much when you consider that not so long before that he was one of the top performers in the business. Why couldn’t they found some high profile midcard feud for him to participate in rather than being a colour commentator? He could have been used to help put a young up and coming heel (Owen Hart, Shawn Michaels etc) over. Summerslam 1994 was the last time I saw Macho on WWE television and all he did that night was come out to the ring as the show started with a microphone and get the crowd a bit rowdy for the show starting. How low he had fallen.

Now people will argue that Vince was trying to bleed out the old timers to make way for a “new generation”, namely Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels, Razor Ramon, Diesel and Owen Hart etc. Now this is a reasonable explanation, I will be the first to admit that Randy was getting on a bit. However when you consider Savage went to WCW in 1994 and continued to still put on good matches for the next five years and showed he still had some “juice” in the tank. It makes you think was Macho a wasted talent? Could WWE have treated him better and got more out of him?

I also heard whispers a while ago that the reasons behind his de-push was Macho Man apparently tried to get oral pleasure from a very young Stephanie McMahon. Now if these rumours were actually true, don’t you think Vince would have fired him rather than just kill his push? Either way now adays Vince and Randy are not on talking terms for whatever reasons (probably because Savage is nuts) and any dreams people have of him going into the Hall of Fame are going to remain just that, dreams.
 
great piece of writing.
i to am a huge Macho Man Randy Savage fan.
and i totally agree him being wasted in WWF in the latter stages.
 
i read in flairs book that after elizabeth left him his heart was not in it and the fans were sort of bored with him.

when hogan took him to wcw it seemed to rejuvenate him. like in all forms of life a change is as good as a rest
 
it pisses me off that rumour about a young stephanie mcmahon still does a turn, because if that was the daughter of anyone of us on here the perp would be in prison or a hospital or a prison hospital
 
Good question. Savage will go down in history as one of the most polarizing figures in Wrestling history, hands down.

I cannot in good conscience sit here and say he was a waste. Savage held the WWE Championship 3 years apart, winning it at Wrestlemania 4, losing it at 5, and regaining it at 8. That means he held the major title for 18 out of 60 months from Wrestlemania 4 to until he lost the belt to Flair. For you math wizards out there, that is 30% of the time from April 1988 - October 1992. During the 70% of the time he wasn't the champ during those years, he feuded with the Ultimate Warrior, retired, married Ms. Elizabeth, got attacked by Jake Roberts and bitten by his snake, and almost won the Royal Rumble. Arguably, he was as significant during those 60 months as anyone - even Hogan.

I give more creedence to the idea that Savage's accusations and personal strain with Hulk Hogan caused his decline more than any rumors about Stephanie. Hogan was hands down the #1 guy, so if Vince felt Savage may air personal issues and harm Hogan's credibility as the squeaky-clean face, I understand it. Don't forget, Savage also did some work building that bridge with Jim Cornette and Smokey Mountain Wrestling.

I can't call Savage a waste of talent. I think he used his more than some from start to finish. But the two biggest enemies to any wrestler - injury and personal problems, creeped into his life more than most. I'd say it's a wonder he was as successful as he was.
 
it pisses me off that rumour about a young stephanie mcmahon still does a turn, because if that was the daughter of anyone of us on here the perp would be in prison or a hospital or a prison hospital

That rumor is fucking BULLSHIT. At the time he was in the WWF, Stephanie would have been what.....? 14? 15? If he was trying to get a little somethin from her, first off....Vice McMahon would have fucking killed him. And second, he just wouldn't have gotten a de-push....he'd be in prison, That is, if McMahon did kill him first.

C'mon people. If Macho Man was trying to get a blowjob from a 14 year old daughter of Vince McMahon, do you honestly think the end result is that he just gets bumped out of the Main Event picture? :blink:
 
A very well-written piece, thanks for posting it. I couldn't agree more. I think they really dropped the ball with Savage. In the glory days he was one of the most popular people in the business, and I think if Hulk Hogan never existed, Savage could have been the one to make wrestling as popular as it was. He definitely helped as he was the top guy behind Hogan.. for a while, anyway.

You know somebody is a great entertainer when they're not only loved by wrestling fans, but non-wrestling fans as well. Now, everybody knows and loves the Macho Man. He's one of the most unique and charismatic performers I've ever seen, well known in and outside of the wrestling business. There's not a lot of performers we can say that for. Hulk Hogan, The Rock, and in Canada, Bret Hart.

As for the Stephanie McMahon / oral sex thing, somehow I really doubt the validity of this rumor. If it were true, there would have at least been some legit fighting and Savage would have been charged with a crime. The OP is right, he would have at least been fired, and not depushed to be an announcer.

But as for the current issues between WWE and Randy Savage, we all know it takes two to tango, and maybe Savage isn't the one willing to dance? For all we know, WWE already called Savage about an HOF induction or an appearance and got a two word response. It's impossible to know for certain because neither side has publicly addressed what the issues are.
 
It sucks what has happened to Savage. It is a great shame to see that he really isn't treated with the respect he deserves.

Look at his history at WM.
WM 3: He stole the show against Steamboat, which was headlined by the biggest main event in Wrestlemania History.

WM4: Savage stole the show by wrestling multiple matches during the evening. Even with Hogan's help, Savage was the star of the night, despite hogan Interfering.

WM5: Hogan and Savage have an excellent matchup with one another. The crowd was into every step of the way. This was a very well done feud, if not one of the WWE's best, and Savage delivered in the big match.

WM 6: Not his fault he was wrestling an overweight Dusty Rhodes and Sapphire.

WM7: One of the best matchups in the history of Wrestlemania. Savage carries the warrior to possible the best match of his career. The retirement match was the best match at wrestlemania.

WM8: Best match of the night belongs to, drum roll please, Flair and Savage. What a fucking match, and Savage regains the title again.

WM 10: In one of the better matches of the night against Crush, yup, that's right, crush. I thought the match was the second, if not third best match of the night.

So right there, Savage owned the first decade of Wrestlemania's as far as actual quality matches are concerned in my opinion.

I just never under stood why the WWE forced him onto the announcers table instead of actually using his in ring ability to work with the younger stars. Why the WWE didn't try to keep him when Hogan jumped to WCW, I'll never know.

Savage was never really the same in WCW. Like stated before, I really think his relationship with Elizabeth weighed on him more then most will realize, plus his hatred for all things Hogan hurt him. I think the WWE fucked up savage in the 90's in my opinion, and it's a damn shame.
 
while i enjoyed the Savage/Flair match,saying it was "undoubtedly" the best match of 1992 is a stretch... it was not a better match than Hart/Bulldog at Wembley...that is not only the best match of 1992, but arguably one of the best IC matches ever....
 
i never understood why Savage was pushed to the sidelines in 1994....WWF World Champion Bret Hart defeated Randy Savage with the Sharpshooter at 17:48; Savage played the heel for the match in June of 1994 at a show in Japan....according to Hart,the match went great and he pushed for a program with savage after he was done feuding with Owen hart....McMahon shot it down and we were stuck with Backlund/Hart for Survivor series and then with Diesel as champ for the next year...this proves that Vince is not the genius that people make him out to be....Savage/Hart feuding for the WWF belt would have by far drawn more money than the Backlund match at survivor series and a lenghty feud between the two would have done better business than Diesel ended up doing as champ....it also would have have been a great match for the fans at the time as it would have bridged the gap between the new and old generations and having Savage pass the torch to Bret would have heralded the arrival of the 'new' generation...something that Hogan refused to do in 1993....i also think the steph rumours are total bullshit....if Vince didn't press charges for some reason, you better believe Linda McMahon would have....
 
Think about this for a second..........hasn't anybody realized that any wrestler with the god given talent that Savage had didn't or haven't gotten a chance to shine. Savage (Mr. Wrestlemania), Steamboat (Never had a WWF Title Shot), Benjamin and Carlito (Should be competing for the WWE Title)..................Think about it!!!!!!
 
Ok, this is a good thread, and I plan on posting more later, but it's time to clear some rumors up.

First of all, people need to do a little math. Randy Savage's last match in the WWF was in 1994, at Survivor Series. Stephanie McMahon was born in 1976. What does this tell us?

It tells us that even if Savage had Stephanie snap into his Slim Jim, there would be nothing illegal about it, assuming it was voluntary. That would make Stephanie 18 years old, 17 at the youngest, which is the age of consent in many, if not most, states.

So, this rumor that Savage tried/did have some kind of sex with a 14 year old Stephanie has no chance of being true, and anyone who continues to spout such nonsense probably should not continue posting, as anyone who cannot bother to do simple math probably isn't credible enough for an opinion. At least, that's how I take it.

In conclusion, Savage did not have illegal relations with an underage Steph.


Now, more on my thoughts with regard to the actual thread later, when I have time and internet.
 
Randy Savage was a very big waste of talent.

The man had great talent and high charisma and he put on amazing matches and always had the crowd really with him or really despising him.

His storylines were great and he was convincing. ANd other than Shawn mciahels or Undertaker ths man was great when it came to Wrestlemania. The man carried Ultimate Warrior to an amazing match at Wrestlemania 7. That must say something.

Now Sly brought up a great point with Stephanie already being 18 years of age. And it doesn't make sense to just get rid of his push if it was true. They should have been 100% clear before they did away with him. Well all I can say is he was very wasted.
 
Randy Savage at one time was my favorite wrestler. Damn I miss the old Savage. That elbow drop was a beautiful move to watch live on television or in person. He was a big waste of talent though. WCW wasn't giving him the chance that he should of had. He was like the Robin while Hogan was the Batman. He should have stop trying to kiss Hogan's ass and did his own thing. Savage would be the biggest thing in wrestling if it wasn't for Hulk Hogan.
 
At one time, Macho Man Randy Savage was my favorite wrestler of all-time. That elbow drop was amazing to watch. I remember when him and Ultimate Warrior became a tag team although they hated each other. I think that started the era where rivals would become tag team champs and both are faces who hate each other. Look at Stone Cold and The Rock. Macho Man would have been the greatest and influential guy if it wasn't for Hogan hogging all the spotlight and Savage always trying to be Robin as Hogan was Batman.
 
I'm not a fan of Savage, nor do I hate the man, but he is not wrestlings biggest wasted talent. Sure he's not Bret Hart, but he can't be sonsidered that bad, he put on some classic matches. Not only that, but he's very charismatic. About the Steph rumor like many said he would not have been pushed if he was fucking Vince's 14 year old daughter. So it can't be true!
 
The Savage thing with Steph could've happened before '94, but then why would Vinny Mac keep him round till '94 and not just fire him? I think the whole thing is a load of bullshit to be honest, and the more I think about it then the more disturbing "Oh Yeah!" images I get of Savage...

Also, on a side note, I'd say that the best match of '92 would be Bret vs Piper at WM8 for the IC Title. The perfect face vs face match. I loved Savage vs Flair and Bret vs Bulldog, but for me the Piper match just edges out the other 2. 3 classic matches though.
 
Ok, this is a good thread, and I plan on posting more later, but it's time to clear some rumors up.

First of all, people need to do a little math. Randy Savage's last match in the WWF was in 1994, at Survivor Series. Stephanie McMahon was born in 1976. What does this tell us?

It tells us that even if Savage had Stephanie snap into his Slim Jim, there would be nothing illegal about it, assuming it was voluntary. That would make Stephanie 18 years old, 17 at the youngest, which is the age of consent in many, if not most, states.

So, this rumor that Savage tried/did have some kind of sex with a 14 year old Stephanie has no chance of being true, and anyone who continues to spout such nonsense probably should not continue posting, as anyone who cannot bother to do simple math probably isn't credible enough for an opinion. At least, that's how I take it.

In conclusion, Savage did not have illegal relations with an underage Steph.

Allow me to take a second to render this entire post useless in one sentence. Ready? Consider the possibility that Vince found out about a relationship between Savage and Stephanie a couple years after it happened.

Bet you're feeling pretty stupid right about now, huh? Spouting off like that all up on your high horse all the while overlooking something so obvious...makes one wonder if you're credible enough for an opinion. By your logic, I would say no and expect you to voluntarily not continue posting.

By the way, that was rumored to be the reason his de-bush began not the reason he stopped wrestling, and his de-bush began in 1992...so do your math and that makes Stephanie 16 not 18.

Now I personally highly doubt this rumor is true, but to dismiss it as having "no chance" and act like your opinion of it not being true is a fact based on such falty reasoning, and then go on to attack the credibility of people who disagree whilea actually destroying your own credibliity with your inability to recognize such an obvious reasonable scenario is crap. That's how I take it.
 
Class is in session with Professor Slyfox.

Allow me to take a second to render this entire post useless in one sentence. Ready? Consider the possibility that Vince found out about a relationship between Savage and Stephanie a couple years after it happened.
Wait.

You're offering a hypothetical and unlikely possibility on something you don't believe and wish to use that to render my entire post useless?

Sorry, you'll have to try harder than that. Let's see what you have next.

Bet you're feeling pretty stupid right about now, huh?
You mean before I read your post or after? Because it seems as if my intelligence level is inversely proportional to the amount of words in this post.

Spouting off like that all up on your high horse
I don't ride horses.
shrugbetter.gif


all the while overlooking something so obvious...makes one wonder if you're credible enough for an opinion. By your logic, I would say no and expect you to voluntarily not continue posting.
No need to point out why this holds no water.

Now I personally highly doubt this rumor is true, but to dismiss it as having "no chance" and act like your opinion of it not being true is a fact based on such falty reasoning, and then go on to attack the credibility of people who disagree whilea actually destroying your own credibliity with your inability to recognize such an obvious reasonable scenario is crap.
Holy run-on sentence Batman!

As far as faulty reasoning...well....

That's how I take it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plagiarism

By the way, that was rumored to be the reason his de-bush began not the reason he stopped wrestling, and his de-bush began in 1992...so do your math and that makes Stephanie 16 not 18.
I saved this for the last because this is the best part of your post.

Connecticut

The age of consent is 16 for sexual encounter (and 15 for sexual contact).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_of_consent_in_North_America#Connecticut

USA by State:
Female/Male Male/Male Female/Female

Alabama
16 Law invalidated Law invalidated
Alaska 16 16 16
Arizona 18 Law repealed law repealed
Arkansas 16 Law invalidated Law invalidated
California 18 18 18
Colorado 17 17 17
Connecticut 16 16 16
http://www.coolnurse.com/consent.htm


So, even if Stephanie was 16, like you said, then it was still not illegal for Savage to do what he was rumored to do, and it still doesn't make Stephanie 14 like people were talking about earlier.



Class dismissed. Now onto more important matters like the actual thread discussion.
 
Randy Savage should be the prototype for which all wrestlers are molded. The guy was fast, athletic, had great charisma, could work the mic, understood had to pace a match, tell a story in the ring, and work a crowd.

With that being said, he was still never on Hulk Hogan's level.



That's basically what this comes down to. People talk about how Savage was misused, but that really wasn't the WWF's fault. That was the fans fault. Because, even during Savage's run as WWF champion, people still wanted Hulk Hogan more. Savage came along at the wrong time, and was always in Hogan's shadow, which is nothing to be ashamed of.

The WWF didn't waste Savage, they just had a better alternative.

Think about this for a second..........hasn't anybody realized that any wrestler with the god given talent that Savage had didn't or haven't gotten a chance to shine. Savage (Mr. Wrestlemania),
He was multiple time IC champion, tag champion, and World champion. What else could the WWF do?

Steamboat (Never had a WWF Title Shot)
That was his fault, for right or wrong.

Benjamin and Carlito (Should be competing for the WWE Title)..................Think about it!!!!!!
Hahahaha...

You're putting Benjamin and Carlito in the same breath as Savage and Steamboat? A spotmonkey and a guy who got over because he can run up a ladder and do flashy moves that disregards realism?

For those keeping score at home, Carlito is the spotmonkey and Benjamin is the other guy.


I like Shelton as much as anyone, but neither he nor Carlito even come close to working a match like a Cena or Rey Mysterio.
 
he was never on hulks level in terms of selling merchanise but its unfortunate that hulk didnt have half his talent and that didnt matter cuz inring ability doesnt always sell tickets. i kno growin up i always liked macho man the best when everyone i knew was either a hogan or warrior fan. but thats just me. sly made the point perfectly. he just came along at the wrong time.

honestly its hard for me to feel as though he was wasted? i thought he did pretty well while he was in the wwf in terms of winning matches/titles and im sure most of us here consider him a legend so how did he get wasted? hes one of my favorite wrestlers ever but ive never thought they wasted him. he was in great fueds, put on great matches, won titles and lost them just like everyone else. they even gave him time as a commentator to show off his talents micwise.

savage shared the spotlight with a ton of incredible talents in an incredible era of wrestling and i think he did pretty damn good. its true that he wasnt as big as hogan but then again, besides austin, who was?

randy savage was the maaaaaaaan. ooooooh yeaaaaaaaaaaaaaa. i wish theyd bring him back and induct him into the HOF. long live the legend of the macho man randy savage.

i know it doesnt have anything to do with this particular post, but ive always thought the wwf wasted the talents of another legend far more then they wasted the macho mans and that man is ric flair. i mean savage had his wm match with hogan and it was awesome. warrior had his. where was flairs???? i think that could be one of the biggest wastes of all time in the history of wrestling. how did they waste the opportunity to showcase flair and hogan in the main event at a wm??? its crazy. sry to get off topic.
 
Ok good to see I have started a good little discussion here.

honestly its hard for me to feel as though he was wasted? i thought he did pretty well while he was in the wwf in terms of winning matches/titles and im sure most of us here consider him a legend so how did he get wasted? hes one of my favorite wrestlers ever but ive never thought they wasted him. he was in great fueds, put on great matches, won titles and lost them just like everyone else. they even gave him time as a commentator to show off his talents micwise.

First thing I better clear up is I think I have probably titled the thread wrong. Wrong choice of words. I know Savage achieved a lot in his WWE career but I am focusing more on the later years (1992 - 1994) when Savage went from top spot to an announcer when he could have been actively wrestling. It was a bit odd to watch because I don't remember seeing such a decline happen since. He proved he could still go in the ring by going to WCW from 1994 - 1999 and still managed to put on good matches but ultimately just ended up being Hogans bitch there. So if my title is a little confusing to others, I apologise lol.

i read in flairs book that after elizabeth left him his heart was not in it and the fans were sort of bored with him.

when hogan took him to wcw it seemed to rejuvenate him. like in all forms of life a change is as good as a rest

This would actually explain a lot. I knew about the divorce but I didn't know he took it so badly.

while i enjoyed the Savage/Flair match,saying it was "undoubtedly" the best match of 1992 is a stretch... it was not a better match than Hart/Bulldog at Wembley...that is not only the best match of 1992, but arguably one of the best IC matches ever....

Although I do not disagree with you that the Hart/Bulldog match is great I still regard Savage/Flair better because of the story told in the build up to the match and during the match. Savage was legitimately married to Liz of course and Flair was such a good heel. Both men are amazing story tellers in the ring. As a kid you could really believe that was all real and personal. I still remember as a child watching the match on WM VIII and seeing Savage and Flair being battered and bruised, blood everywhere and thinking this was the coolest thing ever. The match still stands the test of time for me. Now yes, Hart and Bulldog is a classic match, as I said in my original post I still regard it as a classic however after watching Bret Harts DVD and listening to The Hitman describe the match I realised he is right. Hart had to do a Hell of a lot of carrying in that match to prevent Bulldog from injuring himself. Just watch the spot where Hart leapfrogs over the top rope of Smith and he doesn't see it coming. Instead of Davey Boy Smith catching him, Hart does a sort of reverse bulldog move which looked damn painful. The match is still a classic, yes, but after Hart pointed those out it took a little bit of the shine off of it for me. As for a personal scale, the match definitely has the vibe of being very personal as it's Brother-in-law vs Brother-in-law however when you consider Bret went up against his own BROTHER (Owen) two years later. It kind of blows that storyline away.

Also, on a side note, I'd say that the best match of '92 would be Bret vs Piper at WM8 for the IC Title. The perfect face vs face match. I loved Savage vs Flair and Bret vs Bulldog, but for me the Piper match just edges out the other 2. 3 classic matches though.

It's a good shout. Damn, I totally forgot about the Piper/Bret match at WM VIII while writing all that.

i never understood why Savage was pushed to the sidelines in 1994....WWF World Champion Bret Hart defeated Randy Savage with the Sharpshooter at 17:48; Savage played the heel for the match in June of 1994 at a show in Japan....according to Hart,the match went great and he pushed for a program with savage after he was done feuding with Owen hart....McMahon shot it down and we were stuck with Backlund/Hart for Survivor series and then with Diesel as champ for the next year...

I was COMPLETELY unaware of this dude. Thanks for pointing it out man. Again, this brings me back to the question. Could WWE have gotten more out of Savage in the later years rather than de-pushing him and letting him go to WCW?
 
first, i want to point out that savage was not a multiple IC title holder...he had it once, winning it on Feb.8th 1986 and dropping it at WM3 in 1987...ok now that's out of the way, i gotta tell ya i love this thread....on a sidenote, as far as matches from 1992, how about HBK vs. Hart at Survivor Series that year, title for title....despite there being very little build up for it as it was shortly after they won their respective belts, i think that was probably the best 'wrestled' match of that year...of course it was Savage/Warrior and Flair/Razor that basically were the draw for that PPV....one thing i'd like to mention with regards to Savage being in Hogans shadow and being his 'bitch' in WCW is that from everything i've ever read about Randy, it seems to me that he really just cared about making money...that's not to say he didn't want to perform at a high level....it's just that i don't think he cared about having a title that much...i mean, he dropped the WCW title to Hogan on two occasions the night after he won it on PPV.....anyone i've ever heard speak about him said he was all business...i actually had the pleasure of meeting King Kong Bundy some years ago and we talked about some of the 80's guys and he said Savage was all about making the dough and he was happy to have the belt and be top guy but knew a year in advance that he was only holding it until Hogan returned and had no problem stepping aside when he came back, because he still was making huge money....i don't think Savage was really misused later on, i think he just didn't give a shit and was not a guy to play politics....having said this, i still believe that if McMahon had used his head in 1994 and offered up a Hart/Savage program, Randy would have been all over it and we would have had some great stuff to talk about instead of Diesel's groundbreaking run with the title(that's sarcasm).....
 
First of all I'd like to say Wall of Jericho's post was extremelly well written and I think it was obvious that it was meant he felt Savage was only wasted in the latter years of his tenure with the WWF. (not often I compliment a weegie!).

Second, this rumour about Stephanie? Lot of arguing going on in this forum about age and doing maths etc. Does it really matter what age she was? The rumour ( according to the posts on here, I'd never actually heard it before) seems to be that Macho Man forced her into it, so her age of consent would be irrelevant, if in fact she didn't give any consent anyway! It's clearly rubbish either way or he would not have been with the company.

Back to the topic in hand though. Loved the guy, everything from his entrance, to his promos, to his matches was brilliant. However, from what I have read in various autobiographies his matches may have been too brilliant.

What I mean by that is that there are stories that he was an absoulute perfectionist that prefered each match he did to be completly choreographed from start to finish, a style in contrast to that of hart, flair, michaels etc who like to work a lot of it out as it is going on. Could it be with the advent of raw and the demend for more top matches not on ppv, and the promotion of guys like the aforementioned into the top spots, that his style no longer fitted in with what the others wanted? I know he put on some great matches in WCW but most of them were in the same location, giving him plenty of rehersal time. Just a theory, which is probably no where near the truth!
 
First of all I'd like to say Wall of Jericho's post was extremelly well written and I think it was obvious that it was meant he felt Savage was only wasted in the latter years of his tenure with the WWF. (not often I compliment a weegie!).

Second, this rumour about Stephanie? Lot of arguing going on in this forum about age and doing maths etc. Does it really matter what age she was? The rumour ( according to the posts on here, I'd never actually heard it before) seems to be that Macho Man forced her into it, so her age of consent would be irrelevant, if in fact she didn't give any consent anyway! It's clearly rubbish either way or he would not have been with the company.

Back to the topic in hand though. Loved the guy, everything from his entrance, to his promos, to his matches was brilliant. However, from what I have read in various autobiographies his matches may have been too brilliant.

What I mean by that is that there are stories that he was an absoulute perfectionist that prefered each match he did to be completly choreographed from start to finish, a style in contrast to that of hart, flair, michaels etc who like to work a lot of it out as it is going on. Could it be with the advent of raw and the demend for more top matches not on ppv, and the promotion of guys like the aforementioned into the top spots, that his style no longer fitted in with what the others wanted? I know he put on some great matches in WCW but most of them were in the same location, giving him plenty of rehersal time. Just a theory, which is probably no where near the truth!

i agree with ya...he was too brilliant....i really think that Savage was about 10 years ahead of his time....he was doing things in the WWF that no one else was during the 1980's...yeah sure Steamboat was as good an athlete but he was about as charismatic as a pineapple....Savage had everything Hogan and Piper had and could give you a 30 minute match...i have several matches between him and Ted DiBiase from the summer of 1988 and it is brilliant stuff....what a character, and it is a fucking shame that losers like Zuess, Tank Abott, and Giant Gonzalez get classic superstars figures, and Savage goes unmentioned...i can only hope that Vince is saving up until WM 25 and will mark the anniversary by rightfully inducting the Macho Man...
 

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