Y2JChrisJericho
Pre-Show Stalwart
Oh yeah because Miz' first title reign should be over in a week to a 60 year old man (who I'm a mark for btw), and he should win it next week, giving him two title reigns in two weeks? No.
Miz vs. Lawler - All in here.
- Thread starter ChrisNutter
- Start date
Marky-Marc
Pre-Show Stalwart
I have no problem with this match.
All the solid Mid-card guys were tied up in KOTR and they needed to play up Orton's knee injury. Lawler was standing up for the legends that Miz was dissing.
This IN NO WAY made Miz look weak. I'm not a Miz fan, but this match was perfectly fine for his credibility. They made it a TLC match so Lawler had a shot to win, A One on one match and Miz woyld crush him, but with weapons involved anything could happen.
And the Michael Cole arguemeny don't work because that was just used to further the storline of how much he loves the Miz. Very nice main event, it worked.
All the solid Mid-card guys were tied up in KOTR and they needed to play up Orton's knee injury. Lawler was standing up for the legends that Miz was dissing.
This IN NO WAY made Miz look weak. I'm not a Miz fan, but this match was perfectly fine for his credibility. They made it a TLC match so Lawler had a shot to win, A One on one match and Miz woyld crush him, but with weapons involved anything could happen.
And the Michael Cole arguemeny don't work because that was just used to further the storline of how much he loves the Miz. Very nice main event, it worked.
Thephanboy
Dark Match Jobber
Even though it would be nice to see the King with a title win in the WWE......glad they didnt make Miz lose the belt. It would have made Miz look like a weak transitional champion....and as a Miz fan....i hopin for at least a extended title run with the belt.
Marky-Marc
Pre-Show Stalwart
No chance.
Nice little match to get heat on the Miz for dissing than beating a legend plus it furthered the Michael Cole love fest lol but in no way did I ever think Lawler would win. Mid card guys were tied up in KOTR and Orton was selling the knee injurt from last week. I'm glad they gave Miz a defense so quick but no, the ending was good we didn't need Lawler winning.
Nice little match to get heat on the Miz for dissing than beating a legend plus it furthered the Michael Cole love fest lol but in no way did I ever think Lawler would win. Mid card guys were tied up in KOTR and Orton was selling the knee injurt from last week. I'm glad they gave Miz a defense so quick but no, the ending was good we didn't need Lawler winning.
[YOUTUBE]lITBGjNEp08[/YOUTUBE]
Look, Lawler deserving the win? I'm not buying it. Ok, we're making the argument based on his past accomplishments, and all he's done for the business? Fantastic. Let's consider something here.
Lawler's claim to fame, frankly, was booking himself to win a shit load of championships in Memphis. What good does putting the title on him do? You can make sense of it for a Hogan, maybe Flair and Austin. But Lawler isn't even close to that star level. Not even close. He's a middling star, who booked himself to win enough championships to call it a career. He's had his time, and frankly, he doesn't deserve what I would call a World Title too big for him to carry, even in his prime. Jerry was, and always will be, at least as a wrestler, a local guy who got hot off of Andy Kaufman's comedy, and that's all he is. So, for the one value you're looking for here, to thank Jerry, it's really out of his league
Look, Lawler deserving the win? I'm not buying it. Ok, we're making the argument based on his past accomplishments, and all he's done for the business? Fantastic. Let's consider something here.
Lawler's claim to fame, frankly, was booking himself to win a shit load of championships in Memphis. What good does putting the title on him do? You can make sense of it for a Hogan, maybe Flair and Austin. But Lawler isn't even close to that star level. Not even close. He's a middling star, who booked himself to win enough championships to call it a career. He's had his time, and frankly, he doesn't deserve what I would call a World Title too big for him to carry, even in his prime. Jerry was, and always will be, at least as a wrestler, a local guy who got hot off of Andy Kaufman's comedy, and that's all he is. So, for the one value you're looking for here, to thank Jerry, it's really out of his league
nightshifty
Dark Match Winner
All this match was was a title defense for The Miz so when he does loses it at TLC or RR he'll look stronger because he can say he defended the title successfully once. This so deja vu from 4 years ago when Edge won his first WWE title ,edge vs. flair in a TLC match, and the results are going to be the same. The Miz is going to drop the title to Orton in the next month and he'll have a midcard match at 'mania then we will definatly start seeing him more the title race next year. The Miz is the next Edge. He just has Alex Riley instead of Lita
The Miz match was AWESOME! hahaha
I loved how Cole came in, Lawler's great fight, the usage of tables, ladders and chairs, and Riley's involvement! I have to say it - the WWE Creative team is spot on with Riley and The Miz together! Thank you Jesus
!!! Woohooo!
WWE is getting great to watch again! RAW is getting better and better! Very exciting through and through - let's keep the title on The Miz for a while folks!
Also, just as a side note - I love the Cena involvement! hahaha - Kick Nexus' behinds!!! hahaa
I loved how Cole came in, Lawler's great fight, the usage of tables, ladders and chairs, and Riley's involvement! I have to say it - the WWE Creative team is spot on with Riley and The Miz together! Thank you Jesus
!!! Woohooo!WWE is getting great to watch again! RAW is getting better and better! Very exciting through and through - let's keep the title on The Miz for a while folks!
Also, just as a side note - I love the Cena involvement! hahaha - Kick Nexus' behinds!!! hahaa
I was honestly expecting Juan Cena to interfere and help the King. However I agree that the Miz needed this win. My only problem with it was they made it such a close and almost predictable finish. What they COULD HAVE done was have King climb the ladder, grab the title but drop it "accidentally" and have Cole give it to the Miz. I mean essentially that's what this match accomplished. Miz won, Coleslaw turned even more idiotic heel. And I can see where this is going now. Michael Cole... WWE Superstar of the Decade as voted by: THE GM OF RAW. Then we hear some non sense speech from Cole how he is the new face of Raw (like he said with Edge).
But back to the subject at hand... Just because it was King's everything (birthday, king of the ring, etc) that should in no way give him a title win... That would've made the Miz look SO bad. If King could beat him, Santino should have no problem whooping him with the Cobra haha. The Miz did an outstanding job, much to my surprise, of carrying Lawler through this match. Aside from the predictable finish, the match itself was a breath of fresh air. Talent of the past, working with talent of the present to achieve a main event that didn't completely stink the joint up..
But back to the subject at hand... Just because it was King's everything (birthday, king of the ring, etc) that should in no way give him a title win... That would've made the Miz look SO bad. If King could beat him, Santino should have no problem whooping him with the Cobra haha. The Miz did an outstanding job, much to my surprise, of carrying Lawler through this match. Aside from the predictable finish, the match itself was a breath of fresh air. Talent of the past, working with talent of the present to achieve a main event that didn't completely stink the joint up..
Klown_Karnage
Slapstick Heavyweight Champion
Thing is, I don't think that this match had much to do with The Miz. Yeah, he's champ. Yeah, he's not a dominant champ unless he has the ability to cheat, so this whole match really went pretty well as far as these two characters are concerned. But really, I don't think it was about The Miz so much as it was about sparking off a direct feud between Cole and Lawler that could well hit the ring.
Michael Cole has been working very hard on being hated, and many people think he's the mystery GM. Supposing the one who finds out and outs him is The King. That would certainly be a good point in a feud between them and I could also see The King forcing a match of sorts in the ring with him and Cole. The Miz was merely a convenient way to make this happen. If anybody is going to beat the crap out of Michael Cole, why shouldn't it be his announcing partner?
Michael Cole has been working very hard on being hated, and many people think he's the mystery GM. Supposing the one who finds out and outs him is The King. That would certainly be a good point in a feud between them and I could also see The King forcing a match of sorts in the ring with him and Cole. The Miz was merely a convenient way to make this happen. If anybody is going to beat the crap out of Michael Cole, why shouldn't it be his announcing partner?
In my opinion, Losing it to Lawler tonight wouldnt have hurt him.
The Match hurt him enough, Our world champion needed help to beat a 60 year old who hasnt beat a midcard wrestler for 7 years. Yet he almost beats our world champ.
Miz looked like shite tonight. Didnt look to me like a world champion. I dont actually believe he's going to be a champ for long. More of a transitional champ. I know its still early to tell, but after tonights showing, he looked very poor in my eyes.
And it wasn't like it was a fluke by the king to almost of won...
The Match hurt him enough, Our world champion needed help to beat a 60 year old who hasnt beat a midcard wrestler for 7 years. Yet he almost beats our world champ.
Miz looked like shite tonight. Didnt look to me like a world champion. I dont actually believe he's going to be a champ for long. More of a transitional champ. I know its still early to tell, but after tonights showing, he looked very poor in my eyes.
And it wasn't like it was a fluke by the king to almost of won...
Are you serious? You want Jerry "The King" Lawler to beat The Miz for the WWE Championship? Not only would that destroy any and all credibility that Miz has as champ, but it would kill his push. I'm pretty sure I'd laugh every time I saw him, that's not something a champ should bring to mind. Does Mae Young win the Divas Belt on her birthday? No. Same damn thing. No way in hell should have Lawler won, how well he did in the match already puts a dent in Miz's credibility, you'd actually want to damage it further? To me, this is a stupid idea.
Honkey_Kong
Championship Contender
Come on, Lawler is 61 years old. He doesn't need the WWE title. I mean he IS a former world champ. They even mentioned his AWA World title reign. But the way this match played out, they might as well have given him the title. The Miz couldn't beat some old man cleanly, let alone convincingly. Took A-Ri and a heel Michael Cole to beat a 61 year old. Add that to the fact that The Miz didn't beat a 100% Orton for the title and how a few months ago, he tapped out to the US champ, Danielson, he does not look like a real champion and we know he's not going to be a champ very long (at least in this reign). The only way I can see him holding on to the title is via screw-job and that can only last for so long before it gets old. Miz's days are over.
TheOneBigWill
[This Space for Rent]
I'll agree with the OP. Why not?
Look at it from this point of view, through a kayfabe stand-point; Jerry Lawler had the match won if it was not for his Co-Announcer, Michael Cole. Miz had no way of stopping Lawler until Cole put himself in this contest.
Jerry Lawler, at however old he is, defeated The Miz & A-Rod in what should be considered a 2-on-1 TLC match; until his announcing partner came rushing in for no other reason than to further make Miz look like an out-of-place Heavyweight Champion.
This match was no worse than the TLC match Edge had against Ric Flair, in which Flair at who knows how old came within inches in what should've been a no contest. And just like back then, when people claimed Edge was a transitional Champion - thats exactly what the WWE is building Miz up to be like with this style of victory.
Now, here's the real difference. Miz is meant to look like an underdog Champion. He doesn't have a big build. He hasn't really beaten any top named Heavyweights. He's feuded with some (Cena), but never truly beaten them in any matches that went straight up and weren't by forfeit.
Giving Jerry Lawler the Championship from now until a rematch at TLC may not of been as awful as having Lawler lose tonight, only because of Michael Cole - instead of Miz actually defeating an "announcer" on his own, or even with the help of Alex. The only thing they didn't manage to do, by giving Lawler the title, was ruin the credibility of the Championship. (In other words, hot-shotting the title around would only hurt it and those winning/losing it.)
In closing, Miz is doing what he needs to do, to be what they want him to be. He scored incredible heat - but it's as a fluke Champion. Anyone who wants to see Miz as a credible Champion will have to wait, because this run won't be it. At least not if tonight is any indication of how his future title defenses will go.
Look at it from this point of view, through a kayfabe stand-point; Jerry Lawler had the match won if it was not for his Co-Announcer, Michael Cole. Miz had no way of stopping Lawler until Cole put himself in this contest.
Jerry Lawler, at however old he is, defeated The Miz & A-Rod in what should be considered a 2-on-1 TLC match; until his announcing partner came rushing in for no other reason than to further make Miz look like an out-of-place Heavyweight Champion.
This match was no worse than the TLC match Edge had against Ric Flair, in which Flair at who knows how old came within inches in what should've been a no contest. And just like back then, when people claimed Edge was a transitional Champion - thats exactly what the WWE is building Miz up to be like with this style of victory.
Now, here's the real difference. Miz is meant to look like an underdog Champion. He doesn't have a big build. He hasn't really beaten any top named Heavyweights. He's feuded with some (Cena), but never truly beaten them in any matches that went straight up and weren't by forfeit.
Giving Jerry Lawler the Championship from now until a rematch at TLC may not of been as awful as having Lawler lose tonight, only because of Michael Cole - instead of Miz actually defeating an "announcer" on his own, or even with the help of Alex. The only thing they didn't manage to do, by giving Lawler the title, was ruin the credibility of the Championship. (In other words, hot-shotting the title around would only hurt it and those winning/losing it.)
In closing, Miz is doing what he needs to do, to be what they want him to be. He scored incredible heat - but it's as a fluke Champion. Anyone who wants to see Miz as a credible Champion will have to wait, because this run won't be it. At least not if tonight is any indication of how his future title defenses will go.
I think if they book him better and well after this defense he won't be a fluke champion, this was all about gaining alot of heat which he did, and giving the fans a surprise, i don't think Miz will be transitional, because of the WWE book him better he will have a good length reign.
TheOneBigWill
[This Space for Rent]
I personally don't think Miz's reign is meant to last beyond the Rumble, or at most the Elimination Chamber. I'd be certainly shocked and flatout surprised to see the guy carrying the Championship into the biggest show of the year. (Mania)
I'm not saying he's a "fluke Champion" to indicate he shouldn't be a Champion. I'm saying he's being built up in the same light as guys like Swagger, Punk & Edge. He's being put into situations where he looks like a loser, and comes out a winner in fluke (heel) fashion.
As for any type of surprise - there was none. I was not surprised Lawler lost, and I barely gasp at Cole interfering. I suppose if anything was "surprising" or "shocking" it'd be Cole interfering, but it shouldn't be. Cole has been the #1 Miz supporter since his reign began last week. Furthermore, Cole tried on multiple times to stop Lawler from competing in this match.
The only "surprise" I see coming is how they work this Cole-Lawler thing out, come next Monday when the two have to reunite and do commentary together again. Will it just all blow over? Will they have random hatred words back and forth, but nothing more? Will Punk be the guy in the middle to take light off the situation? That'd be my best bet.
I'm not saying he's a "fluke Champion" to indicate he shouldn't be a Champion. I'm saying he's being built up in the same light as guys like Swagger, Punk & Edge. He's being put into situations where he looks like a loser, and comes out a winner in fluke (heel) fashion.
As for any type of surprise - there was none. I was not surprised Lawler lost, and I barely gasp at Cole interfering. I suppose if anything was "surprising" or "shocking" it'd be Cole interfering, but it shouldn't be. Cole has been the #1 Miz supporter since his reign began last week. Furthermore, Cole tried on multiple times to stop Lawler from competing in this match.
The only "surprise" I see coming is how they work this Cole-Lawler thing out, come next Monday when the two have to reunite and do commentary together again. Will it just all blow over? Will they have random hatred words back and forth, but nothing more? Will Punk be the guy in the middle to take light off the situation? That'd be my best bet.
I think before Mania he'd lose the title, but if WWE is confident and Miz has jumped leaps and bounds as top dog they could have him go into WM as WWE Champion, but that would be unlikely. But he's going to be a good champion, he's gonna have feuds that will hopefully last a good amount of time, and first time as WWE champion is never easy though. But from a in ring standpoint he put on a good match against Lawler.
The big difference with those guys you mentioned is that every one of them could (and did) win on their own, they were believable threats. Miz can't even legit be believed to beat a midcarder. He's smallish, isn't fast, isn't athletic, doesn't have a specialty in the ring, and generally just does a couple of "I just left wrestling school" moves. While those guys you mentioned had a style in the ring, were athletic, some large, or had a specialty to make them worthy competitors.
DiscipleofWrestling
Getting Noticed By Management
First off I HATE whenever Lawler picks up a microphone behind the desk. It always means two things for me. 1) He's going to get physically involved, and 2) It's going to suck. I'm not a big fan of Jerry Lawler's in ring work. I've seen a few matches from his heyday, and I just quite frankly don't get the blind worship he gets. But that's irrelevant in this case. I hate it whenever the announce team gets involved in a wrestling match. Yes, it's entertainment, but I don't like seeing Jerry Lawler get involved in the product. I hate it when WWE does it, and I hate it when TNA did it a few weeks ago. The announcers are supposed to be there for storytelling, not to air out their character differences in a main event level match. I didn't mind Michael Cole's involvement because they've already sunk low enough to bring Lawler, an announcer, into the ring. How much lower do you really have to go to bring in someone who's been kissing Miz's ass at the announce booth for almost a full year now?
No, I don't think it was wise to have The Miz wrestle Jerry Lawler in a TLC match tonight. I don't like this idea that Lawler wrestling is a good thing. It wasn't ten years ago when Tazz was feuding with him and J.R. It isn't much better now when Lawler is up there in age and wrestling fans and smarks are already crapping on Miz's title run in its infancy. Some people in the Internet are making this seem like this was a classic "one night only" storyline for Lawler. The problem is HE DOES IT ALMOST EVERY SIX MONTHS. While not for the championship in those circumstances, he does get involved in the product quite a lot for an announcer. The match should not have taken place, and WWE should have done something different on this occasion.
I wonder if this situation was bred out of Randy Orton not being at Raw tonight. The logical situation for tonight would have probably been a Randy Orton/random tag partner vs. The Miz and Alex Riley to start building towards TLC. This was an instance of WWE selling injuries the night or week after a major show, which you can't blame them for. That however leads me to the second question which sort of muddies my reaction to Lawler being booked in that manner. I guess there were a few options they could have taken to help put Miz over. They might have been able to pull off a Wade Barrett vs. Miz main event where Barrett could have told Miz he owed Nexus his world championship. Plus, Cena could have done something outrageous to cost Barrett the championship match yet again, including an appearance by Juan Cena. Then again, it is taboo to have a heel vs. heel scenario in WWE anyway. Another idea would have been to have Daniel Bryan wrestle a second match that evening against The Miz in the main event. The A-Ri confrontation in the hallway almost had me believing that Bryan would do something to interrupt Miz's celebration. Another man that probably have pulled off a match with The Miz would be Rey Mysterio, who was already in attendance tonight. Rey's been a world champion two times, and it would have been interesting to see Miz face off against a former world champion to prove his position as WWE Champion. Plus, Del Rio could have again swindled Mysterio out of an important achievement like he did on Smackdown, giving more fire to that feud.
Steve-o-mac
New Member
i think the match was very good. it was believable, it had the fans going at the end. think of it this way. miz had to carry the brunt of the match. not that the king is bad but the man is 60 years old. miz made it look good. it didnt exactly make him look strong but i dont think it hurt him either. all in all. the match was well done. miz has gotten so much better even in the past year let alone few years. i just hope to see this push last and hopefully he can prove to be what he says he is. awesome.
What will be interesting to see in this dynamic now is how Lawler will Co-Exist with Cole. Im starting to see CM Punk in a situation a the announce desk that you rarely see most anchors, He is in the Neutral position, neither really face or Heel, He may dislike John Cena in the building but he also Recognizes that Cole screwed Lawler out of the title.
People complain about Miz's persona being to weak with Lawler that he had to have Outside interferance, but that is the Miz persona, he is the new Opportunistic superstar. e picks and chooses his spots, leaves nothing to chance, even against Jerry Lawler his chacter would win no matter what, He doesn't let a little think like Pride get muddled in with his endeavors.
People complain about Miz's persona being to weak with Lawler that he had to have Outside interferance, but that is the Miz persona, he is the new Opportunistic superstar. e picks and chooses his spots, leaves nothing to chance, even against Jerry Lawler his chacter would win no matter what, He doesn't let a little think like Pride get muddled in with his endeavors.
I think the match itself was pretty average, only exciting parts being when Miz & Riley both went through tables. When Miz got back dropped on the ladder, and my favourite, Cole interfering!
When Cole got out his seat to try and help the Miz up i started laughing my ass off. When do you ever see a commentator get up and do that! Let alone go and stop someone from winning a match haha. And i laughed even harder when The King beat his ass.
Cole is doing his job so well and i absolutley enjoy seeing the funny stuff he does. What about when he was jumping up and down when Miz came out earlier for his celebration. Pure gold haha.
Anyway, match was pretty average. I understand why they did it and how it fit into the storyline and all, but I would rather the Sheamus/Morrison match have been the Main Event.
When Cole got out his seat to try and help the Miz up i started laughing my ass off. When do you ever see a commentator get up and do that! Let alone go and stop someone from winning a match haha. And i laughed even harder when The King beat his ass.
Cole is doing his job so well and i absolutley enjoy seeing the funny stuff he does. What about when he was jumping up and down when Miz came out earlier for his celebration. Pure gold haha.
Anyway, match was pretty average. I understand why they did it and how it fit into the storyline and all, but I would rather the Sheamus/Morrison match have been the Main Event.
So we have apparently so many people still supporting Miz as champion? All you need to do is watch the match from last night against Lawler.. One of the worst RAW Main Events of 2010. When Miz learns how to actually wrestle without botching more than 60% of his offense, then maybe he should be given a chance to win the Title, until then, there's no reason he should be near this belt.
Hollywood Naitch
The current reigning and defending
There was never a chance of Lawler winning this match, and anyone who knows the business would never think otherwise.
It was simply a one-off match on Lawlers birthday, and I dont think it really damages the Miz's credibility at all. Yeah he needed assistance to defend his title against a 61 year old, but he only won the belt by cashing in the MITB briefcase on already weakened opponent so it simply makes his cheating heel character who just survives with the belt even stronger.
Also, Cole stopping Lawler from winning the title was great, and again gets even more heel heat on him. So I see nothing wrong with this. The Miz will win cleanly at some point, and even if he is just a transititional champion- which I could see happening, it didnt harm Edge and as long as they dont bury the Miz as champ I cannot see him harming his career either.
I loved the match, and thought Lawler pulled off his role excellently. I still don't think Miz is worthy of a title run just yet (I would have kept him as a cocky IC/US champ for a long term reign), but I do enjoy his work. I think he also did very well in this match.
It was simply a one-off match on Lawlers birthday, and I dont think it really damages the Miz's credibility at all. Yeah he needed assistance to defend his title against a 61 year old, but he only won the belt by cashing in the MITB briefcase on already weakened opponent so it simply makes his cheating heel character who just survives with the belt even stronger.
Also, Cole stopping Lawler from winning the title was great, and again gets even more heel heat on him. So I see nothing wrong with this. The Miz will win cleanly at some point, and even if he is just a transititional champion- which I could see happening, it didnt harm Edge and as long as they dont bury the Miz as champ I cannot see him harming his career either.
I loved the match, and thought Lawler pulled off his role excellently. I still don't think Miz is worthy of a title run just yet (I would have kept him as a cocky IC/US champ for a long term reign), but I do enjoy his work. I think he also did very well in this match.
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