Kevin Owens drawing good numbers

[jmt225]

The Cena vs. Owens main events were the strongest main house show main event numbers for any match over a full month period in some time. What that says it the idea that Owens can’t draw on top based on his look is bullshit because even though he is with Cena, other guys in the same position with Cena haven’t done as well.

The John Cena vs. Kevin Owens matches drew an average of 6,583 paid. To put things in perspective, the Randy Orton vs. Sheamus main events drew an average of 2,250 paid. Last year, Cena vs. Bray Wyatt averaged 6,000.

So....

Can anyone justifiably be a Kevin Owens detractor with these numbers coming out?

 

[Slyfox696]

The John Cena vs. Kevin Owens matches drew an average of 6,583 paid. To put things in perspective, the Randy Orton vs. Sheamus main events drew an average of 2,250 paid. Last year, Cena vs. Bray Wyatt averaged 6,000.

So....

Can anyone justifiably be a Kevin Owens detractor with these numbers coming out?

The Cena/Owens feud was better than the Cena/Wyatt feud. I'd be more comfortable with your position if there were multiple pieces of evidence to support it. Of course that can't happen yet, as Owens is still so new on the main roster.

 

[George Steele's Barber]

The two make for a nice pair with each guy bringing in their own demographic. Of course there are also multiple other factors that go in to getting people to the gate but this is a good sign for Owens regardless.

A better sign was seeing a twenty something year old male walking through Union Station in Chicago with a KO shirt yesterday.

 

[Navdeep]

Owen is a draw and best thing I like about him is that he is a genuine heel and always try to act like a prick unlike Wyatt and Rollins.
Not bashing Wyatt and Rollins but they always try to be a cool wrestlers, Bray by giving cool promos and Rollins by doing flasy face move sets.

 

[klunderbunker]

BUT

HE'S

FAT!!!!

 

[rbv13]

BUT

HE'S

FAT!!!!

On top of this don't you people know that being a draw doesn't mean squat. Just b/c a majority of individuals pay hard earned money to see him on a house show, television event or buy his worthless KO t shirt in no indication of how entertaining the guy is. These number are complete crap.

 

[Uncle Sam]

Owen is a draw and best thing I like about him is that he is a genuine heel and always try to act like a prick unlike Wyatt and Rollins.
Not bashing Wyatt and Rollins but they always try to be a cool wrestlers, Bray by giving cool promos and Rollins by doing flasy face move sets.

As much as I like Owens (i.e. appreciate him as a wrestler because he's a massive piece of shit) he does love a good moonsault, and actually made the rear chinlock into something that made the crowd cheer.

 

[BaconBits]

I heard he only draws stick figures. So that makes him a shitty draw-er.

 

[Cena Is A Punk Rocker]

There needs to be more fat guys in wrestling. We need something to offset the vanilla midgets and the jacked up roid freaks.

 

[Slash-LN]

There's not enough information there.

Are they doing the Cena/Owens main events in bigger venues than the others? Are the ticket prices comparable?

Given that there's often two house shows going on on the same day there has to be more information factored in.

Example. Recent house show numbers.

* 8/29 live event in San Juan, Puerto Rico: 13,000 fans.

* 8/29 live event in Orlando, Florida: 6,500 fans.

* 8/30 live event in Daytona Beach, Florida: 4,000 fans.

* 8/30 live event in Tallahassee, Florida: 7,000 fans.

If the Cena/Owens main event took the 13,000 and the 4,000 dates you're looking at about 8,500 split between the two dates and roughly 6,700 for the other two dates.

A local example for me would be the venue I see shows at seats more than double the next closest venue that runs WWE shows. The venue I go to actually has done a RAW and at least two Smackdowns and also did a couple Thunders back in the WCW days.

So to compensate for less seating the other venue charges roughly three times as much for tickets. They have a hard time selling the tickets because of the prices they charge. So more people are going to drive the 45 minutes to go to the venue I see shows at since they usually do shows a couple months apart from each other.

This isn't anything to do with Owens. Just that you can't base anything on house show numbers alone.

Cena being your bigger star is probably going to work the bigger venues.
Orton/Sheamus being smaller stars than Sheamus are probably going to work your smaller venues.

The validation for me for Owens, not that I needed any, was when he first debuted on the main roster and one of my nephews hated him. But once he started talking and my nephew was paying better attention to it, and once he started backing up his words, my nephew started liking him.

It was the same thing with Daniel Bryan back when he was feuding with the Miz. I was at a friend's house watching and two other people were there talking about how they didn't like Daniel Bryan because he was boring. Then during the match, especially when he was throwing kicks, they kept going "oooh" and started rooting for him.

Validation for Daniel Bryan.

 

[ABMorales787]

Lulz. No one wants to see Orton and Sheamus. Shocker.

 

[Papa Pillman]

I think some people are missing the point here.

What's ultimately being represented here has nothing to do with how these A-show house tour events performed versus the B tour shows. The point is that Cena who is a constant atop the A-show tours drew 6000 fans on average when paired against Wyatt, which was the highest average over the course of one touring cycle in the last handful of years, and pairing him with Owens, the WWE was able to top that number by several hundred more fans. That makes Owens the highest drawing heel foil that's been paired with Cena in a very long stretch of time. No one questions Cena as the top draw, but these numbers also illustrate Owens as a guy who draws at a top level as well. In fact the data may indicate he's already the number one heel draw on the entire full time roster, despite reports that he still has high profile doubters in the decision making roles backstage.

 

[Slash-LN]

I think some people are missing the point here.

What's ultimately being represented here has nothing to do with how these A-show house tour events performed versus the B tour shows. The point is that Cena who is a constant atop the A-show tours drew 6000 fans on average when paired against Wyatt, which was the highest average over the course of one touring cycle in the last handful of years, and pairing him with Owens, the WWE was able to top that number by several hundred more fans. That makes Owens the highest drawing heel foil that's been paired with Cena in a very long stretch of time. No one questions Cena as the top draw, but these numbers also illustrate Owens as a guy who draws at a top level as well. In fact the data may indicate he's already the number one heel draw on the entire full time roster, despite reports that he still has high profile doubters in the decision making roles backstage.

A shows vs. B shows here is a valid point when Randy Orton vs. Sheamus is being used as one of the examples to make the point. That's why I raised that point and wanted to know if they're working the same cities/venues.

I don't think anyone is arguing Owens' ability to be a draw. I think everyone in this particular thread knows he is.

But if you present this as the standalone evidence to a detractor and use the Sheamus vs. Orton figure as an example but they aren't working the same size venues and cities then that part doesn't hold water.

The Bray example one is the key one. Especially since Bray's popularity rivals that of Owens, so comparing those two proves a point.

What were say Cena vs. Rollins numbers like? That would be a big one to know given that Rollins is the champ and a main event guy.

 

[Papa Pillman]

A shows vs. B shows here is a valid point when Randy Orton vs. Sheamus is being used as one of the examples to make the point. That's why I raised that point and wanted to know if they're working the same cities/venues.

But if you present this as the standalone evidence to a detractor and use the Sheamus vs. Orton figure as an example but they aren't working the same size venues and cities then that part doesn't hold water.

I wasn't doubting the point you made about the skewed comparisons of A versus B level House show cards. I was merely pointing out that JMT likely only included the B-show attendance average to illustrate that not all house show tours are created equal, and not all WWE shows draw the type of numbers that Cena/Owens drew, especially at this time of the year where house show attendance is expected to suffer.

The more relevant number to illustrate how much people care about Owens was the comparisons to last year's Cena/Bray numbers, which the company was reportedly very happy with at that time.

The Orton/Sheamus number also helps drive home the point that WWE house shows haven't necessarily been a "hot ticket", but pairing Owens and Cena bucked that downward trend with relatively huge house show numbers over the summer season that haven't been seen by the company on a consistent basis in quite some time.

I don't think anyone is arguing Owens' ability to be a draw. I think everyone in this particular thread knows he is.

We may know it, but if we are to believe leaked information about how Owens is viewed by the powers that be, it seems that the backstage opinions of those who matter are not nearly as unanimous.

What were say Cena vs. Rollins numbers like? That would be a big one to know given that Rollins is the champ and a main event guy.

It would be interesting to make such a comparison, but there isn't extensive data yet as Cena/Rollins house show work is a new occurrence and they haven't yet worked the prolonged series of dates that Cena worked against Bray or Owens(or far less successively against the likes of Rusev, or Kane).

And much like we can't compare "A and B" show numbers, these recent month's shows can't be accurately compared to the numbers that Cena's house show tours with Rollins in early 2015(which admittedly drew similar numbers to what Cena/KO drew), as well as his tours working Orton in early 2014, as the numbers at that time of year are always higher no matter who competes, as Mania season inflates attendance.

 

[Bernkastel]

There needs to be more fat guys in wrestling. We need something to offset the vanilla midgets and the jacked up roid freaks.

Vader should return to the WWE. We can have Vader vs Sting for the WWE title.

 

[Alastor]

The WWE brand draws. Not the wrestlers.

 

[Papa Pillman]

The WWE brand draws. Not the wrestlers.

Yet some wrestlers can still be counted on to draw more than others. Funny how that works.

 

[Alastor]

Yet some wrestlers can still be counted on to draw more than others. Funny how that works.

Don't you dare argue with Punk's logic.

 

[klunderbunker]

Yet some wrestlers can still be counted on to draw more than others. Funny how that works.

Back in the day, the stars were the horses the the WWF rode on.

Today, the stars drive the WWE car.

Those are two very different worlds.

 

[Bernkastel]

Yet some wrestlers can still be counted on to draw more than others. Funny how that works.

True, but not like like it was back in the 80's or really even 90's.

 

[Papa Pillman]

Back in the day, the stars were the horses the the WWF rode on.

Today, the stars drive the WWE car.

Those are two very different worlds.

No doubt, any brand itself is artificially strengthened once it has no peer in its market.

Just like the NFL draws regardless, yet more casual viewers will tune in to watch Brady helm the Pats then would tune in to see Garoppollo, even if the overall difference is ultimately peanuts.

 

[Bernkastel]

No doubt, any brand itself is artificially strengthened once it has no peer in its market.

Just like the NFL draws regardless, yet more casual viewers will tune in to watch Brady helm the Pats then would tune in to see Garoppollo, even if the overall difference is ultimately peanuts.

I don't even know who this is. But granted I don't follow or watch football.

 

[Papa Pillman]

I don't even know who this is. But granted I don't follow or watch football.

He's the Pats backup who was scheduled to start the season for the Patriots if Brady's deflategate suspension was upheld.

He is only in his second year, drafted in the second round of last year's NFL draft out of Eastern Illinois. Hence no one blames you for a lack of familiarity.

 

[Dirk]

Can anyone justifiably be a Kevin Owens detractor with these numbers coming out?

Yes, they can. I mean, I love him to bits, but you don't have to like something just because it's popular. It can be popular while still being a steaming pile of crap. (See: Jepsen, Carly Rae)

 

[Cena Is A Punk Rocker]

Unless you are personally profiting off of these numbers, why the fuck should you care? That is the real question.