Kevin Kelly Mocks TNA's Ratings: Irony at it's Finest

[Hulkamaniac]

Look, i enjoy TNA from time to time, but I'm hardly a rabid fan. I watch mostly because the Hulkster, for whom I am a mark, is there. In fact, I probably watch Raw more regularly than Impact. But I couldn't let this pass without commenting.

Kevin Kelly wrote a column slobbing all over CM Punk (which is his right to be a fan). Then, at the end, he's decided to take potshots at TNA. Not an uncommon pastime in this world. But this stuck out to me as just dumb:

Some would say that TNA doesn’t focus on guys either because their ratings are so microscopic. In fact, recent recaps of TNA tell me that they are actually looking to make the show even less watchable… is that true?

Now, when last I checked, Kevin Kelly was working for ROH, not the WWE anymore. And when last I checked, ROH had lost it's TV deal, but even before that, it's ratings were much smaller than TNA's were. If he was in WWE, I'd say "hey, that's your right as the big dog to mock the little guy;" but he's not. He's in a less successful, less well-known company that's in worse financial shape than TNA. People in the IWC may enjoy ROH more, that's their right, but people in glass houses shouldn't be throwing stones, especially when you're house is smaller and your glass is already cracked.

 

[Zeven_Zion]

It's ironic but it's also a case of him shitting on another, bigger company to make him feel better about himself and his career. Or what's left of it. Did he even have one? All I remember him do is be Rock's bitch boy.

Anyway, Madden, Kelly, they're all the same. A bunch of overweight, balding, middle-aged "men" who make their living by talking about wrestling, but never being involved in the big companies because they're absolutely useless. Shit on Russo all you want (for instance), but he's got a job and he did his fair share of crap but he also did a lot of good for the business, and all Kevin Kelly would be known for would be the ass print on his chair.

 

[TheWaffle85]

Mark Madden makes his money talking about sports on his radio show. I love Madden's radio show, but his wrestlezone collumns...not so much. He has some good ones. Especially when they aren't focused around talking shit on TNA. And Kevin Kelly is a douche. The popular thing to do is to shit on TNA. I watch both Raw and Impact every week. Some weeks I like Raw better. Some weeks I like Impact better. IMO neither of them are consistently better than the other one.

 

[Rckstrtmmy]

Kevin Kelly knows more about the wrestling biz than all of us combined. ROH had low ratings more because of their network than their product. HDNet is not a basic cable channel like Spike is. Not everyone has it so not as many people had access to ROH. TNA has a great network with a good timeslot and continues to put out a shit product every week. Cant really argue with that. I used to have hope that TNA can turn things around and become a watchable product but they've only gone downhill...especially recently.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

Sometimes I agree with Madden's or Kelly's opinions on this and that. I agree with some of their criticisms about WWE or TNA or certain wrestlers or practices or whatnot. And sometimes, it just sounds like they're typing shit out just for the sake of doing it.

When it comes to TNA's ratings, it's true that they're not setting the world on fire or anything but, as has been mentioned, at least they still do have a television deal. They also have a devoted hardcore following and there's always something to be said about that. Last I heard, HDNet kicked ROH to the curb because it wasn't pulling its weight ratings wise. Kevin Kelly talking trash about TNA's ratings when ROH loses its television deal due to poor ratings make himself look like a real jerk off. People can make all the excuses that they want for why ROH got cancelled but the truth is, it got cancelled. People can debate about which company is better, who has the better wrestlers and all this and that until they're green in the face. Quality is subjective, always has been and will be.

 

[blockanWo]

I just love it when people rip on TNA. Professional Wrestling needs TNA (and ROH for that matter). Now I dont watch WWE anymore (I usually just order Wrestlemania, probably wont next year though) and I primarily watch TNA, so naturally I want TNA to get its act together and become a major threat to WWE. But not only for TNA's sake.

WWE fans will benefit as much as any TNA fan if TNA becomes a threat.

When WCW was king it lead to, arguably, the greatest era of wrestling. You would be a fool to not want the top dog to have to lift its game. I just dont understand what these guys have to gain from ripping on them. Make themselves feel better about their fledgeling career?

 

[MaxSteel]

You know, I just wanted to open the same thread when I saw yours.
You said everything there is to be said.

Gosh, how despise all those pathetic sheep who talk trash about TNA just because it's the "cool" thing to do those days.

 

[CaptainZaltan]

Both Kevin Kelly and Mark Madden WERE employed by the two largest wrestling companies in history. They may not be there now (Madden, in particular, doesn't need to be), but they still know a hell of a lot more about the industry than anyone on these forums, and they've both been endorsed by J.R himself. TNA marks can launch juvenile attacks on their appearances all they want, but it won't make that any less true. True irony is reading posts from forum posters with no connection to the industry criticizing two guys who have actually been there for not having careers (ie: Zevon).

And Waffle? Nothing is popular about pro wrestling nowadays. People rip on TNA because they are frustrated with the companies direction. They express those frustrations on these forums for the same reasons that people enjoying TNA's direction express their opinions. More complaints than praise isn't indicative of some 'trend' or 'fad', particularly when the complaints are about a little known wrestling company. More complaints is indicative of more fans who don't like what they are seeing.

As for the topic itself, it IS possible that this could be sour grapes from Kelly, as ROH is definitely minor league compared to TNA. However, ROH doesn't have the Carter's bottomless wallets behind it, a television deal on a network that used to air WWE programming, Hulk Hogan and Eric Bischoff involved in it's production, or a fraction of the recognizable talent that TNA has. So what I believe he's implying isn't that TNA is failing in comparison to ROH, but that it's failing in comparison to what it should be able to accomplish given the resources it has available to it. I am NOT saying that he is right. As Jack-Hammer said, at the end of the day what counts is whether or not you made it, regardless of circumstances, and ROH didn't. ROH MAY have succeeded if it had had access to the same resources as TNA, or it may not have; it's impossible to tell. However, I get Kelly's point, and respect his right to his opinion. Even if you disagree with his column, a rational response would be something like:

"Well gee, I like TNA, and while Kelly may be correct that TNA could be doing better, I don't feel his slighting them is appropriate given his companies situation. However, I'm secure in my fandom and don't feel threatened by people expressing opinions different from my own."

Rather than a defensive name calling tirade which says more about the insecurity of the poster than the qualifications of Kevin Kelly.

 

[Papa Zapatista]

The reason people like Kelly and Madden write their shitty blogs is because it gets people like us to talk about them. I only watch TNA once or twice a month, but I've never seen anything as bad as Madden describes every week. I see a product that has less money and is under-par to WWE, sure, but not the hellhole that I'm told to expect by the Twinkie Twins. I see a lot of potential in TNA, and they still manage to entertain me quite often... although I do agree that they have poor management/booking that could use a complete re-haul. The backstage stories you hear about talent treatment are cringe-inducing as well.

But in the end, Kelly and Madden are just marketing their opinion. You can't really blame them for it, they've just gotten so fat that some of the shit has to come out of another hole.

 

[Nate DaMac]

I call bullshit. I can't believe you would even say such a thing. I've seen way finer irony than this. Like a daughter telling her mother, "You raised me good" and being pushed down a well.

At any rate, I'm not as hip to Kevin Kelly as I am to Madden. Mark is 90% right every time and I love hearing his take. Kelly, on the other hand just bores me to tears. Maybe it's because he was such an uninteresting person on WWE TV that I refuse to acknowledge anything that pudgy little fella says as being relevant. I just picture him talking and I try to change the channel. This is a new one for me though. Look, I'm very critical of TNA these days, but if I were a hardcore ROH fan(which I'm not) and I criticized TNA for things that they actually do better than ROH, I would look like a moron. That is what Kevin Kelly is proving to me right now, he is a moron. TNA crushes ROH in pretty much every way. Honor may have the edge in the in ring aspect which is all purely subjective, but when it comes to PPV Buys, ratings, etc. TNA is killing them. Sorry Kevin, no way for you to come out of this looking any other way, You're a moron.

 

[Trill Co$by]

Look, i enjoy TNA from time to time, but I'm hardly a rabid fan. I watch mostly because the Hulkster, for whom I am a mark, is there. In fact, I probably watch Raw more regularly than Impact. But I couldn't let this pass without commenting.

Kevin Kelly wrote a column slobbing all over CM Punk (which is his right to be a fan). Then, at the end, he's decided to take potshots at TNA. Not an uncommon pastime in this world. But this stuck out to me as just dumb:



Now, when last I checked, Kevin Kelly was working for ROH, not the WWE anymore. And when last I checked, ROH had lost it's TV deal, but even before that, it's ratings were much smaller than TNA's were. If he was in WWE, I'd say "hey, that's your right as the big dog to mock the little guy;" but he's not. He's in a less successful, less well-known company that's in worse financial shape than TNA. People in the IWC may enjoy ROH more, that's their right, but people in glass houses shouldn't be throwing stones, especially when you're house is smaller and your glass is already cracked.

That's only half true buddy. Kevin Kelly was never involved with the ROH TV deal. The commentators on ROH TV were Mike Hogwood and Dave Prazak. Kevin Kelly is a commentator for Supershow DVDs and iPPVs. Not to mention, ROH had the highest ratings on that low budget cable company and are actually in talks with other networks to be put back on the air.

As for him taking a crack at TNA, he's pretty much right. TNA doesn't need to change its name or anything like that... They need to stick to their guns and fight with what they have. And yes, it is wrong for the bookers to be down playing their own talent.

 

[GameOver]

I know what i'd be watching if it were a choice between TNA and ROH on payTV or even free to air.

Now TNA isn't even an option as Impact has been axed in Australia
Stuff watching it online, not wasting my bandwidth on that.

as for Kelly and Madden, they have a right to there opinion, doesn't mean you have to take them seriously or even bother acknowledging it. Along with CSR and formerly WZR they are opinions and heresay, personally as far as Madden is concerned i hear most of what he's saying as truth. Didn't think much of him when he was in WCW but outside of that he speaks truth. Kevin Kelly i just can't see him as anymore then the goody two shoes gulliable Michael Cole like backstage reporter for WWE in the attitude era.

They are both knowledgeable though.

In general Wrestling is bad period now, it's not the entertainment machine that it was going into the early 21st century. The newer "stars" are spoilt brats who want everything handed to em and refuse to learn how to actually entertain people but that seems to be a society thing in general that's been the case for a decade.

TNA make alot of weird decisions and don't really seem to grow and when they do they shit all over it and put themselves back at square 1.

WWE or Vince McMahon personally seems hell bent on destroying what made him so rich. And everyone around him that helps make decisions is just kissing his ass obviously, with a few exceptions. And now as a result all the good talent has either retired and moved on or is distanced themselves from wrestling altogether

ROH needs decent exposure even if it was just like the exposure ECW got, it would be better than nothing.

 

[rocksuperstarkaos]

You do realize if more people had HDNet then the ratings for ROH would be a lot higher then TNA's right? In NY alone if you have Cablevision (Which is about 3 million people I think here on LI and NYC alone) you don't have HDNet. If ROH had a TV deal nationally I guarantee they would beat out TNA, ROH has the best talent in wrestling, and if they had a TV deal you wouldn't see Tyler Black in WWE or Daniels, AJ, Joe in TNA, they'd be in ROH still. Kevin Kelly is right, TNA has been bad since Hogan showed up and It's only getting worse.

 

[ABMorales787]

You do realize if more people had HDNet then the ratings for ROH would be a lot higher then TNA's right? In NY alone if you have Cablevision (Which is about 3 million people I think here on LI and NYC alone) you don't have HDNet. If ROH had a TV deal nationally I guarantee they would beat out TNA, ROH has the best talent in wrestling, and if they had a TV deal you wouldn't see Tyler Black in WWE or Daniels, AJ, Joe in TNA, they'd be in ROH still. Kevin Kelly is right, TNA has been bad since Hogan showed up and It's only getting worse.

No they wouldn't. They'd need mainstream exposure. The New York base knows them because they tour the area regularly. A national deal would mean nothing if they're obscure to half the country. Not to mention how difficult it is to establish a TV fan following on a national scale. Clearly you're saying stuff for the sake of saying it and not thinking through. ROH's fanbase is all based on the internet. And all of that fanbase amounted to failed ratings and small PPV buys on their iPPV's. I have nothing against the company, but do you call that a success? I sure as hell don't. They have huge support from the net as opposed to TNA who has a collective despise by it, yet who got higher ratings, TV deal, talent and PPV buys? TNA, that's right. ROH with a TV deal? No difference if they can't establish their fanbase properly. And sadly, they didn't even accomplish that on a small time channel.

 

[Matt7584]

Ok lets all calm down for just a minute. Kevin kelly just did his job for wrestlezone perfectly. Write an article and get a reaction. We all know that WWE, TNA, and ROH have their issues. Madden and Kelly aren't always right but their columns are meant to bring discussion to these boards whether you agree or diagree with their statements. Its a sad day when any wrestling company loses a tv deal, its just a has a ECW feel, wrong network right time and then you get dropped. Never seen much of ROH but i am fan of the business since i was 5 years old watching superstars on fox on Saturday mornings. You cant fully disagree with kelly but the question of him being a hypocrite, maybe, but if your going to read his cloumn and hate on him, guess what hes doing Wrestlezone well. Keep your passion guys and support for your company but remember Kelly and Madden get paid for their articles and whether we like it or not We dont.

 

[shattered dreams]

ROHbots are hilarious. They really believe that ROH is the best promotion, has the best talent and would actually be successful on a national scale. But shattered they are REAL wrestlers. Real wrestling fans love ROH. No, Kurt Angle was a real wrestler. Real wrestling fans look at prowrestling and say what the hell is going on? ROH is guys that really took gymnastics in elementary school and wrestled in middle school and stopped growing before high school started and consequently are afraid of public speaking. Real prowrestling fans like to be entertained with all around variety. ROH can be alright in smaller doses but as long as they book for a niche product audience that is all they will ever be.

 

[TellMeWhy]

You do realize if more people had HDNet then the ratings for ROH would be a lot higher then TNA's right? In NY alone if you have Cablevision (Which is about 3 million people I think here on LI and NYC alone) you don't have HDNet. If ROH had a TV deal nationally I guarantee they would beat out TNA, ROH has the best talent in wrestling, and if they had a TV deal you wouldn't see Tyler Black in WWE or Daniels, AJ, Joe in TNA, they'd be in ROH still. Kevin Kelly is right, TNA has been bad since Hogan showed up and It's only getting worse.

Do you realize you're delusional.

If TNA with all of their starpower can't get a certain rating, what in the world makes you think that a wrestling company like ROH with very little compelling characters and very little starpower will trump TNA in ratings. ROH fans seem to think that matches over 10 min. are the key to success in prowrestling. No it isn't. Wrestling fans want variety. Good characters, good storylines, good wrestling. Something TNA is far closer to delivering than ROH which can only deliver on long matches and fail at everything else

As for Kelly, I don't take what he says as really trying to bury TNA as Madden does. But if Madden has answers, he needs to give some to ROH.

 

[Kharma Bites]

kevin kelly has been saying contradictory crap for years so why you all sounding so surprised or shocked

madden is still bitter after getting fired and will continue to be and now we have val venis who thinks slagging people off will make him relevant when he never really was in his prime

there are some good writers here though and everyones entitled to opinions, but its no wonder the IWC gets a bad name with bitter past there best men trying to gain what little lime light they can by writing crap alot of the time

 

[Caitiff]

Do you realize you're delusional.

If TNA with all of their starpower can't get a certain rating, what in the world makes you think that a wrestling company like ROH with very little compelling characters and very little starpower will trump TNA in ratings. ROH fans seem to think that matches over 10 min. are the key to success in prowrestling. No it isn't. Wrestling fans want variety. Good characters, good storylines, good wrestling.

No. "Sports Entertainment" fans want "variety." "Sports Entertainment" fans want the tits to trapse around mindlessly, without knowing how to do anything in the ring, other than showcase the surgeon's work. "Sports Entertainment" fans want comedy that would bomb out of any comedy club. "Sports Entertainment" want, LITERAL shit humor.

Wrestling fans want one very simple thing. Well, it's simple in concept, not quite in delivery. Wrestling fans just want....... Wait for it..........

WRESTLING!!!

Why is this so difficult to understand?

 

[The Suplexer Perfecter]

ROH is guys that really took gymnastics in elementary school and wrestled in middle school and stopped growing before high school started and consequently are afraid of public speaking

That sums up AJ Styles, Christopher Daniels, Samoa Joe, Motor City Machine Guns, Desmond Wolfe, Homicide, Generation Me, Douglas Williams, Jay Lethal pretty well don't you think?

But I don't know why no one brought up Kelly talking about how TNA treats their performers. Like what Daffney is going through right now.

Did ROH really have any ratings? No. But you got to get your foot in the door. TNA had to do Impact online before they got on Spike after FSN.

Also doesn't refute what he said about the ratings.

What he said about CM Punk rang very true as well. Does anyone think Vince will let any other new wrestler use their own name or indy name again?

 

[rjoconnell]

i'm sorry. i can't take anyone who has MATTITUDE in their signature seriously.

i understand the forums are a place for whiny internet fans to come complain about EVERYTHING, but check it out: Kevin Kelly and Mark Madden write columns for Wrestlezone. If they want to talk about TNA, whether positive or negative, they can do that!

i swear man, you TNA folks are strange cats! It's like any shot at TNA is a shot directly at you. Check it out: All Kevin Kelly said was TNA's product is lackluster. Guess what: IT IS! "Oh man, Kevin Kelly must be bitter or something so he has to take shots at TNA."

Get real.

 

[Kharma Bites]

i'm sorry. i can't take anyone who has MATTITUDE in their signature seriously.

i understand the forums are a place for whiny internet fans to come complain about EVERYTHING, but check it out: Kevin Kelly and Mark Madden write columns for Wrestlezone. If they want to talk about TNA, whether positive or negative, they can do that!

i swear man, you TNA folks are strange cats! It's like any shot at TNA is a shot directly at you. Check it out: All Kevin Kelly said was TNA's product is lackluster. Guess what: IT IS! "Oh man, Kevin Kelly must be bitter or something so he has to take shots at TNA."

Get real.

dont paint us all with the same brush though, i never understood the cross band bashing and fanboi mentality, i am 1st and foremost a fan of wrest....

its not football

 

[fenfool]

It's fashionable to mock TNA, it doesn't surprise me to hear that anyone is doing so. I'd be shocked if someone outside the company publicly had anything nice to say about TNA. Most people have even stopped adding the "I really want them to succeed, though..." portion. We have hit the level where the company isn't doing very well, and everyone is positioning themselves for a big "I told you so" if the company goes under. Personally, I think they have been putting on better shows lately...still far from perfect, and problems like everyone saying they have authority for some reason persist, but the in-ring action is starting to get a little more focus again. Let's see who is courageous enough in the wrestling/sports entertainment world to give them a little credit for that...THAT would be more of a story than "x person tweeted an insult about TNA".

 

[blkshp]

What I don't get is why people get so crazy over the same thing over and over again, and I'm not talking about WWE, TNA or ROH. I'm not even talking about Madden or Kelly, I'm talking about internet opinion pieces and message boards. If some here haven't noticed, the majority of "opinions" expressed on the internet about everything is negative in some way. Face we are a world of complainers. We have the right to express are opinions and we tend to use that right to bitch, bitch, bitch (in fact I'm doing it right now!) Just because we know the names Kelly and Madden doesn't make their opinions any more valid then anybody else's no matter how long they've been in the biz, and before a 1000 people disagree with me ill tell you why: because in the end they at one point were fans too, and every fan in their heart of hearts believes they know best, that's why we have the highest hopes and are outraged when our vision of the product isn't realized. My opinion (which of course is no more or less relevant then anybody else's) is too enjoy your product of choice, whether its WWE's sports entertainment, TNA's potluck style 90's throwback or ROH's purely wrestle based type shows. They're all different and have their positives and negative aspects, but that doesn't mean you can't enjoy it. So people, relax. You'll live longer. *the opinion expresses is purely the opinion of blkshp and doesn't represent the opinion of any other wrestling/sports entertainment fan* lol, kidding

 

[themusicman]

This thread has really made me laugh! I enjoy Maddens thoughts here on WZ, but guess what, I dont always agree with what he says! But being a sensible, educated guy I understand that he has a right to express his opinion and that he has a great deal more knowledge about the business than I do. Kelly is exactly the same, he always writes well and it is always clear what he is trying to say, you dont have to agree with him but you have to respect that fact that the guy does and has worked in the industry for a number of years and has way more knowledge of what goes on than a bunch of people on a forum (myself included!) I think what hes trying to point out is that, with the resources avaliable to them, TNA could be doing way more to push WWE. Now dont get me wrong, they are light years away from beating WWE (the failed Monday Night Wars should prove that) but do you really think WWE are looking over their shoulder, I think its pretty clear from the product they arent. Think back to when WCW started to gather momentum (Hall and Nash arriving etc) it took a while for them to start beating WWE but you still had the feeling that they knew where they were going and what they needed to do to get there, they had a game plan. Can the same be said for TNA? Im not so sure.
Kelly and Madden give their time to express their thoughts and views to spark conversation and debate. Take it for what its worth. Oh and cut out the fat jokes and insults, we are all better than that!