John Morrison: A Swagger Repeat

[nasteeinc]

ok, we all remember jack swaggers debut. He was built up to be the next big thing,ECW champ, drafted to raw where he had a very impressive match against john cena and some other guys but slowly started to fade and was buried by losing challenges to santino and had a losing streak almost as bad as mvp's.Then out of no where BOOM he does the unexpected and wins the money in the bank, cashes it in on smackdown things went very bad and you know the rest from there.
Now, this could have been avoided if creative would have built up swaggers "run" with the briefcase, had him tease cashing it in for a couple months and when he was READY then let him cash it in instead of rushing his push and just handing him the title.

I'm sorry to say this but i see the same thing happening with John Morrison.
Hear me out, hes been buried this year and has had no real time to shine on raw due to all the star power on the show already which is not his fault. he stilll sucks on the mic but is very impressive in the ring and no doubt could be heavyweight champion in the very near future.BUT i think creative is bound to do the inevitable and rush morrison out of no where into the title hunt. My gut tells me morrison will win the royal rumble and defeat whatever champ he challenges which would be great for him but IMO he's just not ready! if hes not flipping around in the ring hes kinda boring and barely has any personality, not bashing him im just speaking the truth.If he is rushed into the title picture i see a big failure, and a jack Swagger like repeat.

thats just my opinion, what do you guys think??????http://forums.wrestlezone.com/images/smilies/confused.gif

 

[Malenko316]

Nice to see at least one person not intent on blowing smoke up JoMo's arse.

I've posted a few times over the last few weeks in response to the IWC clamour for JoMo to be pushed into ME status at or before WM, likely against the Miz, that doing so would be a bad idea. However, I would also say that I think the parallels with Thwagger only go so far.

Morrison is where he is right now because he's reliable in the ring and pleasing on the eye for the women dragged along with their families. Since he became a face, his lack of mic skills have been painfully obvious. He had the look of a heel working well, and since becoming a face, has IMHO not found where to go with the character. (Although I am pleased a guy is still being talked about as a ME performer for his ring work alone.) While I believe his move to the ME and title picture are almost invetiable, I've said before that I don't think he will be in the ME at WM, because that likely mean a match against either Seamus or the Miz and that just wouldn't be a big enough draw (especially against the Awful One for the title), and it would mean excluding one of the bigger draws from a high card spot. Thus I don't see him winning the RR (I think JC is nailed on for that), but instead I think he is nailed on to win MitB.

Now this might appear to contradict what I said about him not being the same as Thwagger, as it was MitB that created the HWC run mess. However, the problem with JS was that he was, and still is, trying to be made out as the second coming of Kurt Angle, a mantle he will never live up to. When you start out rehashing a gimmick it's a bad idea, when it's a gimmick your guy has no chance of emulating, it's a terrible idea. Given that, JS was handicapped from the start in trying to gain ligitmacy. When he didn't measure up, I think creative blamed him and not themselves, which is unfair.

JoMo in theory doesn't have the same problem. Yes, you can argue perhaps he is being pushed into the Shawn Michaels Heartbreak Kid esc model, but I would say that is such a generic character, you can do that with it being so obvious that is the aim. If JoMo had say, CM Punk's mic skills, the comparison might be more obvious.

Morrison is a ring worker, more than good enough to be ME standard, escpecially given the low standard it takes to get there (Cena/Hulk et al), but until he develops at least some charisma, he won't be the draw he would need to be. I don't mean charisma as in the scripted crap from the Miz or the cartoonish superman act of Cena or supervillian of Orton, but just enough so that you'll listen to him talk and for a minute believe he doesn't like the guy he's fighting.

Can creative screw up things enough for him to bomb like JS? Sure. But as a potential HBK replacement, it's in their interest not to. PV

 

[Hollywood Naitch]

I dont think he will be a Swagger repeat, I think (and hope) WWE have learned their lesson from this about rushing a guy to a world title he is not yet ready for.

I could see Morrison winning the Rumble, but I hope he doesnt, as I dont think he is ready to be in a world title match at WM. I think he will be a champion within the next 12 months, but I think WWE should focus on making Miz into a credible champion before sticking a title on Morrison too.

He is extremely talented in the ring, but I would much rather see him as a heel champion, as I think his persona suits a heel rather than a face. I just hope WWE really dont fuck up his push, as I see great things for Morrison in the future

 

[Mr. Artistic guy]

Hmmm well for one, I don't see swagger's cash in as a complete failure. I view swagger on smackdown as being an upper-mid carder which is a very good thing, similar to del rio actually. It may just be me who views him like this but in my eyes being an upper-mid carder is the best place to be.

CM punk was an upper-mid card on smackdown last year, and that guy can transition to main event and time he likes because of his past. For me it is just the same with swagger. He has floated around for a long time but if he wanted to have a stint in the main event, it wouldn't be that hard to lift him there.

So for me, morrison isn't in the same situation as swagger, because I view him as a guy who has been mid-card for an exceptionally long time. he's beaten jericho, CM punk when he was champ, sheamus and other big names but as that has never amounted to anything, he is still very much a mid-card man. His rise won't be the same as swaggers but his rise has not been in any sense of the word rushed. His rise to main event is remaniscant of someone like eddie guerrero who got there eventually.

Swagger won MITB which pretty much guaranteed a successful cash-in and title reign, and although as a personality he was nowhere near ready for his reign, the facts of them are actually fairly impressive. His first defence was against big show which he won. He also bested chris jericho and edge in a triple threat match and beat orton at extreme rules! Now to me they did a damn good job of making swagger look like a defending champion, which was only possible because of his in-ring ability. That is something they can catch on to with morrison because he shares that trait.

I think if people are questioning whether morrison is ready for a world title MATCH then I would say unquestionably. He has proven to me he can go with anyone and put on a good match just like daniel bryan. But if someone wants to dispute whether he is ready for the reign, well I can empathise with you. But lets put it this way, people may want to complain about swagger's reign, BUT!!, is swagger any worse off than he worse before cashing in? Nope all it has done is benefit him. Having morrison as champ is not going to hurt him in the slightest, in fact it will only benefit him and let him know what is required for the big times.

I can see him winning the rumble, and maybe losing in tremendous style at mania, leading to a world championship/very high profile feud with someone cementing his place as a big name on whichever show he is then a part of (hopefully not smackdown, I think going back will look bad for his character). And hopefully we'll all see some signs that he will be ready sooner than later for holding then belt impressively. I mean if J.R. sees enough in him, and that is from a charisma aspect as well, I'm sold.

 

[GideonGodsend]

morrison will be nothing like swagger. swagger wasnt there long before he won the title. morrison has been there for years, the reason they are different is that he has been there through the good and the bad. he has paid his dues, gotten pushes, hes even been givin the benjamin and carlito treatment. and he still stayed with the company, so they know he is here to stay and this push will go on for the next 12 years

 

[Spitfire]

I agree with Alex.
Swagger wasn't a complete failure. He bested Jericho and Edge, pinned Orton cleanly and escaped the Big Show. I remember one time on Smackdown when he was giving a speech about his childhood, he couldn't even talk because he was getting so much heat.

As for Morrison, I would love to believe that they are pushing him to the main event scene, seeing as he's the only young face on Raw ready to get his shot but this is the WWE we're talking about. Every time a young guy is getting himself over, WWE buries him.

As for not selling, no one in WWE is selling but Cena and that's not saying much because people are tired of him. PPV buy-rates are dropping because we see the same shit over and over again. Miz has the WWE title but he's going to be fighting Orton and Cena over and over again. Royal Rumble and Wrestlemania aren't the same because we see the same matches over and over again.

When new guys like Rey, Batista, Austin and Benoit would win the rumble, we would have a reason to watch Wrestlemania because we wanted to see if that guy that never held the world title was going to get put over. Now at Wrestlemania, we get world title matches with Undertaker, who we know is not losing and another title match with Cena, who has a 95% chance of winning at Mania. I say pull off a Morrison vs Miz WWE title match at Wrestlemania, let them carry the show and watch more viewers come in.

Jeff Hardy and CM Punk made Samckdown the "A" show because it was something new. Even Vince jumped ship, taking his profile off of Raw's website and putting on Smackdown's.

 

[Mike Diesel]

I agree with you guys. Rushing Morrison to be in a championship match at this years Wrestlemania is a BIG mistake. He's got all the potential with the roll he's been on lately (including losing to Sheamus, he put on a great match). He's been putting on very good matches these past 4 or 5 months, and does more than just "flipping around the ring"


The smart move is to have him be one of the first ten entrants into the Royal Rumble, and have him last all the way down to the final 2 or 3, and then get eliminated by a heel, setting up a match at the next PPV or 2, leading up to WrestleMania. Then, have him in the MITB match, win it, and cash in around June or July, where he could possibly get a trial run as a transitional champ.

NEXT years Wrestlemania is when IMO John Morrison will be ready to headline, but definitely not at this years.

Thoughts?

 

[DecayNYFX]

JoMo definitely deserves ME status & will definitely get it, no doubt in my mind about that, but his case is very different from Swagger, so IMO, a comparison is unfair. He's been around a lot longer for one thing. He's held the tag titles multiple times, as well as the ECW title, and has been languishing on the mid-card ever since, with a few high profile matches here & there. It wasn't a meteoric rise to nowhere like Swagger had.

Aside from being packaged as the "new Kurt Angle", Swagger picked up the ECW title not long after his debut, then did very little after he lost it until he won MITB. That was where they dropped the ball with him, as everyone knows. And he hasn't quite recovered from it either. Saddling him with the Eagle certainly isn't going to help his credibility.

At least they've been more consistent with JoMo. Everyone talks about him & Miz being the new HBK & Jannetty, and it looked like it was going that way, and that it very likely still can, but don't forget one key fact: HBK & Jannetty were launched directly into a feud following the Barbershop incident. The feud between Miz & JoMo is still simmering. I like how they keep dropping hints at it whenever they cross paths. It's like they're reminding us that it's coming, and that builds anticipation. I think it's smarter that they're waiting to pull the trigger on it until both guys are up at the top. And again, it hasn't been a quick rise. Miz had the MITB for almost six months & JUST cashed it in. JoMo has a high profile feud with a top heel & former champion. Mania is still five months away. Plenty of time to get these two guys primed.

If, by some chance, Miz still has the title come WM27 (I have my doubts he will, but I wouldn't be shocked if he actually does either), then it could happen with Orton to winning the Rumble & challenging him in the main event in Atlanta. JoMo, meanwhile, wins the Mania MITB. Miz beats Orton in typical, cowardly heel fashion, then Morrison cashes the contract in on the spot, and wins the title. That way, they have one of their top draws in a main event at WM27, and finally elevate the other two to top status. You guys think that would work well, or have any ideas as to what would work out even better?

 

[Hulk Hogan's Brother]

In my opinion the way they are being pushed is not at all alike. Swagger was losing to the likes of Santino Marella before winning the MITB all of a sudden and becoming World Heavyweight Champion. Morrison has been buried for a long time but is slowly being built up as a guy who can at least compete if not succeed at the highest level. If it is done correctly Morrison could become a useful figure in the compay. I do not think he will main event on a regular basis mostly due to his lack of mic skills but he could become a permanent staple in the upper midcard and maybe even a transistional world champion.

That being said WWE need to go slow with the guy. A sudden push like winning the Royal Rumble will do no favors to the guy. At the moment he is just not ready for such a big push.

 

[WJDwjdWJDwjd]

Here's the thing a lot of you don't realize: Morrison IN NOW WAY SHAPE OR FORM could be built into a credible challenger and headliner for 'Mania this year. I don't see where a lot of you get "Could Morrison challenge for the title at Wrestlemania this year?" because it's not feasible at all. Where Morrison is right now, there is no way he could be built into a headliner for the biggest event in Sports Entertainment.

As for a Swagger repeat, Morrison has been around a lot longer than Swagger and arguably paid his dues over the years. Morrison hasn't been nearly on the same path as Swagger. Morrison for one hasn't been World Champion yet. WWE has not been rushing him like they did to Swagger. Morrison has been a career midcarder. That's it so far. Of course right now he is on the cusp but that's just it. He's not challenging for World Titles right now and he's not main eventing PPV's.

 

[Honkey_Kong]

I don't think JoMo has been given the Swagger treatment at all. They took a long time establishing his name in the midcard. And in that time, they've been trying to get him better on the mic and a hope he'll develop more charisma.

Truth be told, I think he's got the same problem Shawn Michaels had when The Rockers broke up. He's just not over yet and looked as a legit main eventer by the fans. HBK was fortunate enough to have Sherri Martel as a manager. Let's face it, she could get anybody over. And then HBK had two epic feuds that I can remember off hand. With Marty Janetty and the one with Razor. I mean people still talk about those ladder matches for the IC title. And then after that, he had the boyhood dream angle and the royal rumble to propel him to the top.

All Morrison has really was a really good feud with CM Punk that was on ECW (So hardly anybody saw it).

 

[LSN80]

Morrison has been given something else in career that Jack Swagger hasn't: A DVD. Why? Because nobody put on better TV matches then JoMo in 2009.

Morrison hung around the main event scene while on Smackdown. He had excellent matches with both Edge and CM Punk while they were champion, even defeating Punk. He won a title shot against Jeff Hardy, and pushed him to the limit. After a nice IC title reign, he again hung around the main event, as he competed in The Smackdown Elimination Chamber at the PPV of the same name.

Morrison has been lost in the shuffle somewhat on Raw. I think he's shown he belongs though due to his recent feud with Sheamus. He defeated Sheamus on PPV, and became only the fourth person to ever pin Sheamus(HHH, Orton, and Santino being the others). He then advanced to the Finals of KOTR, and lost to a fresher and healthy Sheamus in a great match.

I don't see Morrison getting the Swagger treatment at all. Even John Cena has stepped out of the championship picture since this summer. Everything is somewhat circular in that regard. Randy Orton spent over a year between title reigns. We're talking about 9 and 7 time champions here! Swagger didnt even qualify for the KOTR tournament, while Morrison was in the Finals. He's a 3 time IC champion, and a 5 time tag champion since being introduced in 2005. Morrison is doing fine, and even if he were to get a title shot and a short title reign, it wouldnt be a disaster.

 

[CuddleBuns84]

Swagger's run wasn't that bad at all. In fact, it's another good mid-card heel for Smackdown to have. And a mid-card heel that can be billed as a former world champion. Hell, I won't be shocked to see that guy get another title run. He knows how to work a crowd, and has a decent in the ring skills. I find him interesting to watch.

Now, as it comes to Morrison, I think the WWE has been working on him for years! His gimmick has changed so much over the years. Can't stand him on the mic... He sounds like a robot. His moves are extreme, but his gimmick is just boring. I can't believe the WWE wasted the King of the Ring on Morrison and Sheamus again. A lot of good talent on that show that would of been better to have won that title.

So, no, John Morrison won't be a Swagger repeat. Morrison actually has to step his game up to even to that.

 

[mikeyb46]

Swagger's run wasn't that bad at all. In fact, it's another good mid-card heel for Smackdown to have. And a mid-card heel that can be billed as a former world champion. Hell, I won't be shocked to see that guy get another title run. He knows how to work a crowd, and has a decent in the ring skills. I find him interesting to watch.

Now, as it comes to Morrison, I think the WWE has been working on him for years! His gimmick has changed so much over the years. Can't stand him on the mic... He sounds like a robot. His moves are extreme, but his gimmick is just boring. I can't believe the WWE wasted the King of the Ring on Morrison and Sheamus again. A lot of good talent on that show that would of been better to have won that title.

So, no, John Morrison won't be a Swagger repeat. Morrison actually has to step his game up to even to that.

to quote the miz REALLY REALLY REALLY John morrison is 10 x the performer swagger is Morrison is probally one of the top 10-20 "wrestlers" in the world right now don't get me wrong swagger is good but not as good as morrison

 

[Aeon Mathix]

Morrison won't be like Swagger, even though its impossible to tell what JoMo's title reign would be like if we havent even seen it yet. I like both Swagger and Morrison, I was excited for Swagger when he won, the WWE tried all they could with him, but he just wasnt ready and he had not been built up at all. The fans were just kind of like...wtf? The heat he got was the get the hell off my screen heat not the "You suck" heat. Vince needs to realize a Brock push can never be duplicated, brock was one in a million and the only who came close was sheamus, but even then all sheamus did was kick the hell out of jamie noble for 6 months. Brock went on to beat RVD, Hogan, The Hardys, was even supposed to be austin before he saw his first world title. The WWE needs to pit these younger guys with the established guys and give them some credible matches/wins over them before thrusting them into the main event.

As far as JoMo goes, I could see him taking a kind of laid back/surfer type gimmick, he already surfs as seen on his DVD. Would go along great with his parkour gimmick he has going already. He could even use some of that poetry of his into his promos and make them sound funny. Kind of like when Cena rapped just...not rap lol. Im just throwing stupid ideas out there though. I think John Morrison will be a good champion. I dont give a shit about his promos all I love to do is watch him in the ring.

 

[CuddleBuns84]

to quote the miz REALLY REALLY REALLY John morrison is 10 x the performer swagger is Morrison is probally one of the top 10-20 "wrestlers" in the world right now don't get me wrong swagger is good but not as good as morrison

Well, one guy is decent on the mic, the other guy has a hard time on the mic. One guy can build heat like no other, and reminds people of Kurt Angle, the other guy has some sweet moves, and still hasn't found his sweet spot in the industry.

Morrison is decent don't get me wrong, but I don't see him as a main event guy. He isn't entertaining as the guy they proclaim him to be. HBK. Swagger can build good heat, puts on some good technical matches. Morrison has tons of flips and high impact moves, but after that, we have stale robot. Maybe a couple more years down the road, when his mic skills or better or he has a new mouth piece, I'll buy it.

PS... Morrison was a much better Heel, when him and Melina were trying to be the "Hollywood" couple. They build great heat, even had a decent feud with John Cena... That John Morrison was a good gimmick.

 

[Undertaker the 5th]

I don't see how he is going to be another Swagger. He has been there for a longer time and hasn't been World Champion.I think he is already a main eventer after that feud with Shaemus. Loosing the finals of the KOTR doesn't always mean you will be forgotten. Look at Lashley. He lost in the finals of the KOTR and he became a main eventer soon after. His push was obviously pushed, but he was bigger man and it was believable. Morrison has to go the old route of getting there slowly. If he is pushed to the moon to main event Mania this year it would not be so credible. Maybe wait another 5 or 6 months and have him on some good main event feuds, maybe with a returning Jericho to keep him looking strong and then give him the title.

 

[TheHitMark-SirJoseOle]

I personally would like to hope that this will not happen with John Morrison, he's a great talent and he has so far shown very well in WWE since entering Tough Enough III and winning the competition. He also was able to transition into success with his John Morrison persona after MNM dissolved and he no longer went under the name Johnny Nitro. Persona overhauls are not always a good thing for an individual or in this case abrupt changes, but in Morrison's case it worked out well, sadly enough his breakout at a singles star regrettably can be traced back to Chris Benoit's inability to participate at Vengeance 2007 for reasons that I don't need to elaborate on, because we all know what happened there. While the Miz has beaten him to the punch with winning the WWE Championship, I don't think we need to jump the gun and assume Morrison's push will necessarily die out.

Realistically speaking, Morrison not being pushed to the World Title just yet might not be such a bad thing, I don't like elaborating on backstage behavior at all, but as far as I know, Morrison's a constant presence on television and has had several success in the tag team title and IC title divisions, therefore he must have a certain amount of professionalism and reliability to WWE. Or else he'd never have gotten this far. Sometimes too much, too fast isn't good.

It took Shawn Michaels for instance almost a decade to be the World Champion in WWF/E and therefore that didn't happen over night. My only hope is that Morrison while I love his athleticism should take a hint from Michaels book and vary his style as he gets older. For instance, HBK became a much better performer who just plain outright wrestled better as he transitioned into the singles ranks and started wrestling in the IC and World Title divisions. What I'm basically trying to say is that at some point, I'd like to see Morrison's psychology work more into his matches and not that I begrudge his high risk and acrobatic moves, I'd like to hope we'll see an evolution in him as a performer. Which I think will more likely than not happen.

He's been around this long, and I don't think he's going anywhere. Miz might have gotten one of the two major World Titles first, but I'm not pressing the panic button on Morrison yet, I still hold hope and don't think the title hunt and possible win is out of the question for him.

 

[ABMorales787]

Swagger's run wasn't that bad at all. In fact, it's another good mid-card heel for Smackdown to have. And a mid-card heel that can be billed as a former world champion. Hell, I won't be shocked to see that guy get another title run. He knows how to work a crowd, and has a decent in the ring skills. I find him interesting to watch.

Now, as it comes to Morrison, I think the WWE has been working on him for years! His gimmick has changed so much over the years. Can't stand him on the mic... He sounds like a robot. His moves are extreme, but his gimmick is just boring. I can't believe the WWE wasted the King of the Ring on Morrison and Sheamus again. A lot of good talent on that show that would of been better to have won that title.

So, no, John Morrison won't be a Swagger repeat. Morrison actually has to step his game up to even to that.

No. He was an embarrassment to any proffesional wrestling Heavyweight Champion. This is the only World Champion to lose more matches as champion than Rey Mysterio. And unlike Rey, he also lost in title matches by DQ. Not to mention that lisp or not, listening to him is like listening to a blackboard being scratched.

John Morrison on the other hand, was for one relevant at that time, coming short at the Elimination Chamber. Jack Swagger was a total obscurity at the time. If John Morrison would've gotten Swagger's push, it would have been the abomination it turned into, because Morrison had crowd support and he had good steam. His reign would have gone very well working with the likes of CM Punk and Smackdown's other talent.

 

[Tech N9ne]

I understand what was said in the original post. But I do not see the similarities with Swagger. Sure Morrison hasn't hit the Main Event yet, and has held numerous Tag and Mid Card titles.

But he is and has been on a different route to this moment than Swagger has. Swagger's push was forced and was way too soon.

I think WWE has done exactly the right thing with Morrison. It has taken a number of years for him to get to this spot in his career. I think all the stars are aligned and this is Morrison's time.

If anything, I see him being this generation's HBK. Not that he can be HBK or whatever, but more of an HBK type character for the company. The performances, matches, and skill set should have his success limitless.

I think he will surpass anything Swagger has done or will do, Morrison will soon take his place as a top guy in the company. He has become interesting, his mic work has significantly improved. His strong suit has always been his athleticism. But even that is at an all-time high as far as his skill set and excitement goes.

I think he is beyond Swagger already, he just hasn't been World Heavyweight or WWE Champion yet!

 

[JMorrisonfanone]

I think John Morrison is amazing (as you can tell by my screen name).
To compare him to Jack Swagger is basically saying he sucks as bad as JS.
Let's not forget, JM doesn't have a stupid mascot.
Oh wait, JS's mascot was whipped thanks to Randy Orton.
Starship Pain FOREVER!!!!!