Is There Enough Demand For TNA Wrestling?

[Shadow of Darkness]

Hell Yeah...

First of all let me clear you all, that i am a die-hard TNA fan...
but...
Reading the ratings news for TNA in the past month and after reading some of the comments about TNA's struggles with ratings, I decided to start this thread to spark some conversation for the folks...

Here is what I think is the reason for the low ratings for TNA and why TNA has not increased their viewership:

There is just not a demand for another wrestling show in another Time. Plain and simple.

WWE fans / viewers - give them credit - they are pretty damn loyal to the WWE product and don't want to try anything else. Plus your asking those viewers to not only watch 3 hours of RAW, 2 hours of Smackdown but now you are asking them to give 2 more hours of their lives to TNA in another Time slot? That's too much.

I know the knockouts were a highly rated segment and with them no longer the focus of the promotion it has hurt the rating. But if people are going to stop watching Impact because there are no longer any knockouts then they were never a fan of TNA to begin with.

Is lack of Vince Russo a factor for the poor rating?
Well, How would the general viewer know the difference between a Russo produced show and a Prichard produced show?

Where is the "lost" WCW fanbase?
Well, They've moved on and are watching something else.

Unfortunately the real reason is...no more wrestling. There is no demand for another wrestling show in another Time slot. The Pro-Wrestling market is already ruined by the so-called BIG WWE...

it is not an anti rant TNA. You could give ROH, Chikara, PWG, New Japan, All Japan that same timeslot on Spike TV and it would probably do the same type of rating if lower.

We always hear that the WWE needs competition Do they really need competition? Who has time to devote more hours watching another show in another Time slot?

The Only way i can see is to put IW in wrestling Timeslot... the Time slot againt WWE... Thats it...

What you people say???

Hell Yeah

 

[mike_j2k]

I think there is a demand for TNA but as you rightly point out it certainly isn't helped with WWE producing so many hours of programming every week. I have watched WWE since the mid 90s and only really still put up with it these days through habit and the hope that they will sort themselves out. Impact actually does pretty decent ratings over here in the UK but WWE is literally on all the time and it is complete overkill. At times it is honestly like they are trying to piss off their viewers until they move on to something different.

The reason why I think that there will always be a demand for TNA is quite simply because WWE continues to insult their fans on a weekly basis with poor television so people want an alternative. I find myself just skimming through Raw and Smackdown now and believe it or not when you take out the ridiculous amount of adverts and awful promos it doesn't actually take that long to watch it. The difference is that I really enjoy Impact and don't find myself skipping bits. WWE usually makes me fall asleep but I can't quite allow myself to give up on it completely for some reason. If WWE continue this slump then even though TNA will never seriously threaten them in the ratings, I can only see more and more people giving it a try and actually realising it is the better wrestling show.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

Hell Yeah...

First of all let me clear you all, that i am a die-hard TNA fan...
but...
Reading the ratings news for TNA in the past month and after reading some of the comments about TNA's struggles with ratings, I decided to start this thread to spark some conversation for the folks...

Here is what I think is the reason for the low ratings for TNA and why TNA has not increased their viewership:

There is just not a demand for another wrestling show in another Time. Plain and simple.

WWE fans / viewers - give them credit - they are pretty damn loyal to the WWE product and don't want to try anything else. Plus your asking those viewers to not only watch 3 hours of RAW, 2 hours of Smackdown but now you are asking them to give 2 more hours of their lives to TNA in another Time slot? That's too much.

I know the knockouts were a highly rated segment and with them no longer the focus of the promotion it has hurt the rating. But if people are going to stop watching Impact because there are no longer any knockouts then they were never a fan of TNA to begin with.

Is lack of Vince Russo a factor for the poor rating?
Well, How would the general viewer know the difference between a Russo produced show and a Prichard produced show?

Where is the "lost" WCW fanbase?
Well, They've moved on and are watching something else.

Unfortunately the real reason is...no more wrestling. There is no demand for another wrestling show in another Time slot. The Pro-Wrestling market is already ruined by the so-called BIG WWE...

it is not an anti rant TNA. You could give ROH, Chikara, PWG, New Japan, All Japan that same timeslot on Spike TV and it would probably do the same type of rating if lower.

We always hear that the WWE needs competition Do they really need competition? Who has time to devote more hours watching another show in another Time slot?

The Only way i can see is to put IW in wrestling Timeslot... the Time slot againt WWE... Thats it...

What you people say???

Hell Yeah

So lemme see if I get this straight. You're basically blaming TNA's ratings & growth issues on WWE fans not willing to try anything else and WWE's own success for being able to front so many different television shows each week?

Accusing WWE viewers of just not wanting to give TNA a shot is an old excuse. It's one I haven't heard in a while, but it's still an old one. Now that's not to say that there aren't some fans that are like that. In actuality, there probably are some like that. I'd be shocked if there weren't. But basically just lumping the entire WWE audience together in not wanting to give TNA a shot doesn't hold water. It's a far too convenient explanation for things. There's also another possibility that you've neglected to include: maybe a lot of fans just simply aren't interested in TNA. All in all, I enjoy TNA programming now. It used to flat out suck donkey dick but it's pretty solid overall right now. Maybe there's just other stuff on Thursdays that people want to watch instead and they're just not interested in TNA. TNA has been doing essentially the same numbers now that they've been pulling for the past 5 years or so when Raw was still 2 hours and SD! was still the only other real show WWE had. As a whole, I see very little WWE influence in any of TNA's rating/growth issues. The ratings as a whole hasn't changed since Vince Russo left. The quality of the show is head & shoulders above Russo's time as head booker but, again, maybe people just aren't interested.

WWE is a brand that people know even if they're not at all into wrestling. In order to be able to have a shot of being able to do that themselves, TNA simply needs time. Rome wasn't built in a day and it's going to take more than a decade for TNA to equal what WWE has grown into.

As far as putting TNA on against WWE, where were you in 2010? They tried that once. Remember? TNA moved to Mondays in very early 2010 to go head to head with Raw. The January 4th, 2010 TNA episode drew 2.2 million viewers, still the most watched show in the history of TNA. By the time they ultimately moved back to Thursday nights several months later, their audience had dwindled down to the 700,000 to 800,000 range, which was roughly half of what they were averaging prior to moving to Mondays. TNA lost somewhere in the neighborhood of 50% going head to head against Raw. Now Raw's ratings stayed the same, generally in the low to mid 4s, while TNA's numbers kept dwindling. TNA's audience didn't seem to be tuning into WWE, they just simply turned TNA off.

It didn't work nearly 3 years ago and nothing's happened to suggest that it'd work now. Spike certainly isn't going to go for it as they ultimately forced TNA back to its Thursday timeslot.

Whether you prefer TNA to WWE or vice versa, at the end of the day, the numbers are ultimately all that matter to the men & women running these television networks. Quality is subjective and always will be. TNA isn't able to generate the numbers to successfully take on WWE head on. It's been tried and it was a failure. TNA will not be going head to head against WWE again anytime soon because, I'm sure, Spike simply won't go for it and there's no legitimate reason why they should.

 

[It's Damn Real!]

This is not a TNA problem. It's a wrestling problem.

Wrestling simply isn't cool anymore. It really is that simple. There are not enough fans, period, to make a difference, because the product is boring. That's not an issue exclusive to either company. The product, as a whole, is boring. We watch out of tradition, not interest, despite the latter perhaps successfully convincing you otherwise from time-to-time. So , the reason TNA can't manage to drive things above 1.5, or whatever they are averaging, is that there simply aren't enough fans to actually allow them to even tap into in the first place.

Yes, I'm aware that WWE/RAW frequently pull in a higher figure, but they're also working on 20+ years of tradition, and as was already admitted in this thread, a lot of their fans are there by default. It's habit/tradition, not necessarily piqued interest. They do it because it's like Monday Night Football if you grew up in a football house. You watch it because it's on, not because you actually have a rooting interest in either team playing.

 

[RD_21]

This is not a TNA problem. It's a wrestling problem.

Wrestling simply isn't cool anymore. It really is that simple. There are not enough fans, period, to make a difference, because the product is boring. That's not an issue exclusive to either company. The product, as a whole, is boring. We watch out of tradition, not interest, despite the latter perhaps successfully convincing you otherwise from time-to-time. So , the reason TNA can't manage to drive things above 1.5, or whatever they are averaging, is that there simply aren't enough fans to actually allow them to even tap into in the first place.

Yes, I'm aware that WWE/RAW frequently pull in a higher figure, but they're also working on 20+ years of tradition, and as was already admitted in this thread, a lot of their fans are there by default. It's habit/tradition, not necessarily piqued interest. They do it because it's like Monday Night Football if you grew up in a football house. You watch it because it's on, not because you actually have a rooting interest in either team playing.

I completly agree with you on this one. People have to realize that WWE can't even pull a 3 rating anymore when they used to pull a 6 during the Attitude Era. If WWE can't pull a 3 (when they were pulling a low 4 a couple of years ago still), I think 1 for TNA is good.

While Jack Hammer was quick to dismiss the TC idea, I kind of agree with him. Lately I can barely watch Raw because there's so much wrestling on TV each week and I feel burn by it. I DVR TNA and most of the time lately I don't even watch it when for a while last year it was the only wrestling show I didn't want to miss.

So I think it's a mixture of IDR reply and the TC topic. There's not a big market you can grab at the moment and if you add the WWE fans who don't watch TNA, why would they go watch it when they already have so (too) many hours or wrestling each week.

 

[Mustang Sally]

As far as putting TNA on against WWE, where were you in 2010? They tried that once. Remember? TNA moved to Mondays in very early 2010 to go head to head with Raw.

And the thing with that move was....who asked them to do it? I thought TNA's original mission was to position itself as a viable alternative to WWE; not look to compete with them, but rather offer a different type of experience in pro wrestling.

Instead, they stick their heads in the lion's mouth and force us to compare them directly to the absolute ruler of the product. They put the newly-hired Hulk Hogan out in front, promising to beat the giant at it's own game. Ridiculous.

Is there a place for TNA programming? Maybe, as long as they keep to their own niche. Further, it depends on whether they can generate enough revenue to keep themselves in business, especially in the face of flat TV ratings. Despite the notion that many people on this forum "know" that TNA is profitable or "know" that they sell an astronomical amount of merchandise, the fact is that none of us know these things at all.

In the end, their survival depends on whether they can sustain themselves financially, particularly if their investors ever decide to pull the plug and let the company fend for itself. If they can't, it won't matter how much "demand" exists for what they've got.

 

[scomvp316]

I had a thread a few months ago about TNA and how to improve it to attract new viewership. Almost every WWE loyalist never gave a reason on how to improve TNA but the mistakes TNA has made. TNA has made alot of mistakes and I think thats one reason why the anti-TNA fans won't give TNA another chance. I think the one thing TNA must do is just have better wrestling with different types of storylines compared to WWE. I do think the more times WWE copies some of TNA's storylines in the long run WWE will lose some fans. TNA just has to be consistent for 2-3 years with stories that makes sense with no backstage issues. EB does have a long-term plan for TNA which he didn't have with WCW. Keep one thing in mind EB and VKM are similiar but EB does care more about the wrestling part of the biz. It will be interesting over the next two years with TNA,ROH,and DGate where two of them will merge

 

[It's Damn Real!]

I completly agree with you on this one. People have to realize that WWE can't even pull a 3 rating anymore when they used to pull a 6 during the Attitude Era. If WWE can't pull a 3 (when they were pulling a low 4 a couple of years ago still), I think 1 for TNA is good.

While Jack Hammer was quick to dismiss the TC idea, I kind of agree with him. Lately I can barely watch Raw because there's so much wrestling on TV each week and I feel burn by it. I DVR TNA and most of the time lately I don't even watch it when for a while last year it was the only wrestling show I didn't want to miss.

So I think it's a mixture of IDR reply and the TC topic. There's not a big market you can grab at the moment and if you add the WWE fans who don't watch TNA, why would they go watch it when they already have so (too) many hours or wrestling each week.

There's certainly something to the theory that within the existing fanbase there's too much content — I won't deny that, but I'm looking bigger picture here. I'd even concede that it's highly likely that there's simply too much programming between both companies, but at the end of the day, even if that was slashed in half, I just don't think pro-wrestling itself is cool enough to regain the ground it's lost since WCW went under.

 

[SpecialFNK]

TNA has not only gone live this summer/fall, but they changed from 9-11 to 8-10. I think they need to switch back to 9-11. the 1st hour hasn't done well at all in ratings for most of the time they've been there.

I don't watch any of the MMA/UFC/ect, so I can't really comment on what their ratings are like. but I think maybe many wrestling fans have gone to watch them instead. not because there is more action and less talking, but because it's real. you know they are fighting with real punches and kicks. if someone gets punched in the face you know it's a punch in the face, and if it looks like it hurt it's likely because it did hurt rather than the guy getting punched having to "sell it".
what can wrestling do to compete with that? you know professional wrestling isn't a lot of real moves.
can TNA have more matches like last night's ladder match at Turning Point? that match was so sick! it had so many moments that were crazy because it had a ladder involved and it would be hard to fake/sell that. do you always have to have that type of a match on a PPV? what would happen if TNA was to have that type of match on Impact?

personally I think TNA needs to get the Knockouts on TV more. screw Bruce Pritchard. they get so little air time, but even the air time they get doesn't do a whole lot. you only see the 2 KO that are feuding, and once that feud is over after the month they aren't seen much again. when was the last time you saw Mickie James? or Gail Kim? even Madison hasn't been seen much. KO don't get the promo time they should.

 

[Zeven_Zion]

The main problem with wrestling shows in general is that they're working with a fixed audience which seemingly keeps on shrinking.

Shows such as Breaking Bad, for example, can appeal to just about anyone. You don't have to be a certain fan of a certain genre in order to watch it. You just have to enjoy how fucking amazing Bryan Cranston is.

With pro wrestling it's a whole new ball game. Firstly, it's a dying genre that was very popular in the 80's and the 90's. You know, like game shows. I don't watch American TV but is there really a huge game show on TV nowadays? Something that can rival TV series and maybe reality TV? Can't think of anything.

Secondly, like I said, they're working with a fixed audience. Since WWE has the largest audience, I'll boldly assume that this is the total amount of wrestling fans available today, plus about half a million (if not more) who watch only TNA, for example. Don't know if that's true, I just assume it is. T

Then you're working with what? 3-4 million viewers? At best? Of course wrestling is dying. It appeals to certain people, not everyone. So the less of those people there is, the less wrestling will succeed.

TNA's issue goes beyond that. I truly believe that there are some ******** WWE fans who won't watch it EVEN if they adore TNA and love WWE. There's just boneheads like that and they can go fuck themselves. However, there's also the portion that know of TNA but just don't like it. Then there's those who are not THAT big of wrestling fans, they just follow the WWE (casual fans, or a sub-category of casual fans) and FINALLY you have those who might give TNA a shot. Also you have the ones who already watch TNA.

So looking at those groups, TNA is fucked. Even if their product is AMAZING they have a slim chance of attracting the pool of wrestling fans (WWE fans).

For TNA to make wrestling cool in general (since WWE sure as hell won't fucking do it), they need to rival WWE and eclipse them. To do that, they need ALL of WWE's audience which will ... not ... happen. Drawing outsider fans also won't happen. Wrestling isn't that good and it hasn't been for over 12 years. Doubt it ever could be.

So in the end, let's just face it - wrestling's dying a slow death and so are the companies within it. TNA's having it easier on them since they really have nothing to lose. Their ratings dropped by half a point, big fucking deal. WWE on the other hand is in the shitter. They have something to compare themselves to. They had a standard, a legacy and a bar which they never went below. Now it's so far they can't see it.

To answer the OP's question, there is no demand for TNA because there is no demand for wrestling. There's FAR better things on TV right now. Game of Thrones, Breaking Bad, even Arrow, the new Green Arrow TV series is freaking awesome. How can wrestling compete with that? They can't. Not as things are right now. Sad but true.

I'll enjoy it while it lasts. And believe me, it will last for AT LEAST 20+ years. WWE isn't going anywhere and neither is TNA. We just have to stop daydreaming about another wrestling boom, face the facts and enjoy what's left of wrestling.

 

[SinCityBlitz]

There is enough demand the problem is that TNA has no clue on how to hook people. Their PPV buy rates speak for themselves. Their "fans" are not buying what they are selling which is always going to be a big problem. But they are only a decade old. They still have time to right the ship in that regard. It takes time.

Another big problem I see all the time is seeing people comparing today's ratings to the Monday Night Wars ratings. Don't bother because it is futile. The MNW was an anomaly. That is not going to happen again. Wrestling has always gone through ups and downs and that will not change any time soon. But you have to take a levelheaded approach when trying to compare eras.

The ratings for WWE right now fall in line with the usual ratings that wrestling pulls. For being a new company TNA is doing good as well.

 

[MrPlatano1989]

There is definitely enough demand for TNA! Some people focus on the USA and forget about other regions in the world! They are just as important to TNA as any other region, and they are very successful around the world. I dont even have to comment on the UK, I think the impact tour taping in January will show that. The reason TNA has low ratings is because people aren't the same as in the past. I have many friends who love TNA but barely watch it because of their schedules. If thats just my friends, imagine around the country! TNA gets a lot of DVR recordings of the show that are played afterwards, they usually add those numbers to their live ratings to get a good idea of their viewers count. Wrestling isn't as popular as the 90's, it doesn't mean that the product is worse or quality is worse, people are just busy doing or watching other things. If we didn't have previous ratings in wrestling, 1,250,000 sounds like a lot of viewers to me! I c=could go my whole life and wont be able to name that much people. If that much people know about TNA then it is already successful and will only grow in time.

I for one believe if ratings weren't available to the public, we wouldn't be having so many conversations about what TNA needs to do to improve. I for one think TNA has the perfect mix of quality story, wrestling, action, star power, legends, future stars, knockouts, and history to be as incredible as it is!

One of the best things about this business is looking back at history. I started watching TNA back in 2006, they only had 2002-2006 to serve as their history or mark. Thats only 4 years of content and time to grow and expand. Since then they got 2 hours of show, multiple titles, multiple road ppv's, champions, fued, etc. Now we have 10+ years of content and growth. If you trace back a 10 years period in other wrestling companys, you will see many of the stars started off at a lower position, midcard, tag team, openers, dark matches. Eventually some of them became main eventers and have had multiple positions and runs in the company. This is the beauty of wrestling to me, that a guy can sit back one day and run through all their feuds and matches in a company. TNA today has an amazing collection of stars from almost every era, who each are continuing their story and mark. We have seen Storm, Roode, and even Aries rise from their start in the company to what they are now and where they are going! This is why I feel TNA will only get better and better, just imagine an in ring segment one day with an old and retired james storm and bobby roode.. classic!

 

[Weems2k]

Wrestling just isn't as mainstream, as it was back in the late 90's. I highly doubt we'll eve see ratings as high as Raw, and Nitro had back then. Heck, even Monday Night Football was getting beat by the Ratings War.

Speaking of ratings, you can't really judge a show by that. Just because it pulls a 1, doesn't make it a bad show. Just look at all that reality crap on now these days. Most of them are garbage, yet they seem to get high ratings somehow.

 

[GameOver]

as much as i take pot shots at TNA and rightly so, there is always a demand for "more" wrestling, the issue is neither WWE or TNA really provide that awesome overall show, TNA is mediocre at best and WWE is a shell of it's former self.

 

[T2KFreeker]

Demand for TNA? Over a million people watch it a week. I know, it's not the three million thyat WWE pulls down, oh well. Yes, there is a demand. Truthfully though, the company needs to find a fine line between where they are now and where they were around 2004 or so. Bring back enough of what was great in 2004 to being back the old fans. More focus on X-Division, Knockouts and Tag team wrestling. These three things are what got so many people to watch TNA in the first place. Sadly, the Tg team divisions is nothing like it used to be. Mostly just thrown togther teams that will never stay as a Tag Team. Example, the Gut Check segment from last week. We have Prichard asking if he thinks Christian York can survive as a singles star and get that contract. My question is why? Why not pair him up with one of the other Gut Check winners to make a new Tag team? If anything, seems that York would be a fine Tag team wrestler as he is seasoned on it and already has that mentality. Proof that the current plan doean't involve Tag team's. The X-Division is nothing like it used to be. Back when Joe, Daniels and AJ were feuding for the belt, there were so many other great talents in the division that you loved watching just to see who was going to come out nexst week. Remember the World X Cup? Fans loved it. WTF happened to it? The Knockouts are nothing like they were five years ago or so. Now they barely get used and, like it or not, some of TNA's highest ratings numbers has been Knockouts matches, so why not go with it?

In this respect they are following the WWE mold where nothing seems to matter other than the World heavyweight title. Dunno', but I used to love watching wrestling back in the day because there was a variety of what you would see and TNA has seemed to go farther andf farther from that as the years have worn on and that's what everyone loved about TNA back in the day because it was different. If they could find that fine line between the two era's of the company, it would work out for them and help out with ratings.

 

[George Steele's Barber]

TNA is fine. They are still on TV and have gone from taped to live while moving in to a more competitive time slot even though original programming like BBT and 30 Rock are back new. These things cost money and the money must be coming from some where. I can sit here and list a million things that are wrong about TNA (why is Bruce Pritchard on tv and why does he dress like Cam from Modern Family?) and the external influences (I'd marry my DVR if my wife was in to that) that stand in it's way but at the end of the day they seem to be growing as a company even if their ratings say otherwise.

Just build some new real face super stars and the audience will grow. Tough guys with charisma, wittiness and a sense of humor. Easier said than done but not impossible.

 

[ABMorales787]

Do we really need more threads to validate TNA's existance? It gets passable ratings, right? It gets PPV buyrates, right? It's got a good roster, right? Quality TV, right? Then why do people talk like if it was a sinkhole of money and such? It's not. It's doing OK. Why the hell worry so much? Who gives a damn if WWE is doing better?

 

[The 1-2-3 Killam]

I agree with IDR, for as much of his post that I actually read. Which was pretty much the statement: "Wrestling just isn't cool anymore." It's the sad, but inevitable truth. The bigger reality is that television is simply a much more over-saturated market. There is no great demand for TNA, because there is no great demand for professional wrestling among all the other sources of entertainment out there.

Look at Thursday night's alone. At any given time during a broadcast of Impact Wrestling, they are competing with The Office, Big Bang Theory, 30 Rock, Parks & Rec, Up All Night, The X Factor, Glee, Two and a Half Men, Person of Interest, Grey's Anatomy, Last Resort, and god knows what else on all the other channels. And that's just comedy night in America; if they were competing on Mondays against the NFL, they'd be dead in the water.

But it's not just TNA that isn't in high demand. THe only reason WWE is still doing decent cable ratings is that they're a household name. They've been around for so long, people tune in every Monday Night. There are still many, MANY casual wrestling fans that don't use the internet and have no idea what TNA or Impact Wrestling is. You think the kids that wear John Cena shirts know who AJ Styles is? You think they remember Kurt Angle, and check to see what he's up to these day?

And WWE is even doing shitty. Their stocks have sucked for years, and financial experts are saying that their investments will tank in the next two to three years. I guess they're paying twice as much out in investments as they're pulling in annually? THat's kind of a problem. People like to say things like "WWE is fine, they're just competing against the NFL is all." False. THe NFL happens every year (it almost didn't happen last year, but whatever). WWE cable ratings are hitting all-time lows, and they've lost their second and third biggest challengers: Two and a Half Men, and House. One went to Thursdays, and the other ended last season. The Monday TV block is absolutely pathetic right now - probably the weakest it's ever been - and WWE is still pulling in less than a 3.0 during bad NFL game weeks.

There is no demand for pro wrestling. It's just there, it has its fans, and it allows for sustainability. But I doubt it will boom again. I don't think people want it, and I don't think there's a big enough re-capturable audience to be "cool" like it was with the nWo and the start of the Attitude Era. They certainly don't believe it's real anymore, like they did in the 80's and early 90's.