Impact Support Club House | Page 48 | WrestleZone Forums

Impact Support Club House

Frankly, I want a Zeb Colter avatar, but we don't have one. So yeah, Swagger it is.

So, yeah, don't get your point here.

Colter's daughter was killed by a driver under the influence. She wasn't beat up by her boyfriend, or raped by some dude, but her life was taken by a man who decided to get behind the wheel while high. Yet, here you are rocking an avatar of a man who committed the same crime that killed her you heartless son of a bitch. If Swagger was ever arrested for rape, would you rock his avatar? I didn't think so. But DUI, oh, no big deal, right?

........................................

Tenta, that above is how you post. Don't you see how stupid it is? You say I'm "ignoring" the subject matter, I addressed it already. But if you want people to take you more seriously and you want to raise light on a certain subject, you have to learn how to present and also pick your arguments better. It's hard to take you seriously when A) you're an asshole, B) you make generalizations, and C) you pick an irrelevant battle such as this to make your argument over.
 
As a general question to everyone here while I continue to watch this conversation unfold: If you were a TNA booker tasked with crafting a Dixie Carter vs Bully Ray feud, how would you proceed?

New idea. Send a recording to TMZ of Dixie telling Spud to fuck all the black dudes that he wants but stop posting pictures of black dudes on his Instagram and bringing them to her Impact tapings.
 
I've made this argument plenty of times in the Symposium; I'm not exactly doing something I've never done. If you're willing to discuss this, I've given plenty of topics to discuss this topic, plus a post that explains exactly my point, in this thread. Which, you sidestepped, to talk about my argument style.
 
We're in the bar, right?

Much like getting off on rape porn doesn't mean you're into raping people, enjoying Bully Ray crushing Dixie's stupid face doesn't mean you're into beating up chicks.
 
You're wrong. I care about his point. The line should be drawn at some point. You forget that wrestling, unlike Game of Thrones, Dexter or any of those shows, is marketed as a FAMILY product. Whether the rating is PG or TV14. Wrestling, just like actual sports, is the kind of thing you'd take your kids to. And in essence, you'd be cheering along with them as this woman is thrown through a table. Guess what the kids are blissfully unaware of that we know well about. Kayfabe. We know its an act. They dont. And neither do must non-wrestling fans who are ignorant to its inner workings. You can say its accepted behavior all day long. But it doesn't change the negative teachings behind it.

I get that its a twisted world. I'm all for equal treatment and freedom of expression. But I don't like pissing on other people's genuinely well explained morals to get a sick laugh like you, you piece of shit.

Fair point, but there's one giant ass flaw in it (as usual). IS wrestling really a family product? I'm sorry, but this ain't no Sesame Street. People bleed, get hurt, go through tables, thumb tacks, glass shards, flames and they generally hurt each other quite a bit. The minute you allow your children to watch that or attend one of these events is the minute you become a parent who is fine with exposing his or her children to different forms of violence.

What's worse for a child? Seeing a woman who is portrayed as a villain go through a table, or see a grown man go back first into real thumbtacks? Weigh those two and tell me which would actually scar a child.

And for the record, TNA has never been marketed as a family product. Neither has wrestling. Not anymore. TNA has been marketed as a wrestling company, don't confuse them with the WWE. WWE is marketed as family friendly, TNA does a whole different deal. That's why they're marketing Xplosion as a family friendly show, not Impact Wrestling. Nobody knows what the hell Impact is supposed to be, but it sure as fuck is not marketed as a family show. Neither is wrestling in general. Perception is one thing, reality is another.

TNA is TV-14. End of story. If TNA was marketed as a family product it would've been TV-PG. Hence, they have content that kids under 14 years old might have nightmares about. Such as a middle aged woman being driven through a table. You don't want your kids to watch it? Check the damn rating and keep them away. Whatever happens on the show is within all guidelines and is allowed. What some PC douchebags might think of it is their business.
 
We're in the bar, right?

Much like getting off on rape porn doesn't mean you're into raping people, enjoying Bully Ray crushing Dixie's stupid face doesn't mean you're into beating up chicks.

I think you're missing the point but more importantly...

What does being in to rape porn mean for you?
 
Fair point, but there's one giant ass flaw in it (as usual). IS wrestling really a family product? I'm sorry, but this ain't no Sesame Street. People bleed, get hurt, go through tables, thumb tacks, glass shards, flames and they generally hurt each other quite a bit. The minute you allow your children to watch that or attend one of these events is the minute you become a parent who is fine with exposing his or her children to different forms of violence.

What's worse for a child? Seeing a woman who is portrayed as a villain go through a table, or see a grown man go back first into real thumbtacks? Weigh those two and tell me which would actually scar a child.

And for the record, TNA has never been marketed as a family product. Neither has wrestling. Not anymore. TNA has been marketed as a wrestling company, don't confuse them with the WWE. WWE is marketed as family friendly, TNA does a whole different deal. That's why they're marketing Xplosion as a family friendly show, not Impact Wrestling. Nobody knows what the hell Impact is supposed to be, but it sure as fuck is not marketed as a family show. Neither is wrestling in general. Perception is one thing, reality is another.

TNA is TV-14. End of story. If TNA was marketed as a family product it would've been TV-PG. Hence, they have content that kids under 14 years old might have nightmares about. Such as a middle aged woman being driven through a table. You don't want your kids to watch it? Check the damn rating and keep them away. Whatever happens on the show is within all guidelines and is allowed. What some PC douchebags might think of it is their business.
It would be glaring. If I hadn't addressed it. Now what was the name of thing TNA does on its house shows?


"TNA Invites Fans & FAMILIES"

I reckon you're wrong, cowboy. TNA is geared as a family friendly event. You gonna tell me New York is the sole exception to that? Or that TV and house shows are totally different stories? Its the same product, regardless.
 
Shit's going down

Told ya.

I'm not. But goddamn if I'm not fucking sick of this.

So you're pissed off that some form of sexual assault (arguably) took place on Impact. Fine. But what about the violence and the bad language? You have people swearing when there's kids in the crowd. Heck, John Cena even spits out a naughty word here and there. You have people on both shows hitting each other with chairs and we know it's all scripted. But why is it this particular situation which bugs you so much?

Back_away_slowly.gif

:p
 
Told ya.



So you're pissed off that some form of sexual assault (arguably) took place on Impact. Fine. But what about the violence and the bad language? You have people swearing when there's kids in the crowd. Heck, John Cena even spits out a naughty word here and there. You have people on both shows hitting each other with chairs and we know it's all scripted. But why is it this particular situation which bugs you so much?

He works with mistreated women.
 
Ah OK. I get why he feels so strongly about this, but what about those which are abused verbally and physically? None of us would want that happening to somebody, regardless of how our lives have some connection with it. Are we saying that all the fighting and promos should be cut though? I mean, we all know it's staged and I get that in society, rape is seen as something a lot worse than physical and verbal abuse but it was only just a kiss. I don't think it was much of a big deal, but that's just my view.
 
Ah OK. I get why he feels so strongly about this, but what about those which are abused verbally and physically? None of us would want that happening to somebody, regardless of how our lives have some connection with it. Are we saying that all the fighting and promos should be cut though? I mean, we all know it's staged and I get that in society, rape is seen as something a lot worse than physical and verbal abuse but it was only just a kiss. I don't think it was much of a big deal, but that's just my view.

Not everyone is as mindful or understanding as you or me. Haiku basically makes his living by seeing the worst of it all. So I get why he's reacted the way he has even if I have some disagreements.

Sadly, we live in a society where impulsive, unthinking people outweigh rational thinkers. And that's how he sees it.
 
If wrestling is truly a kids show, then we have a fundamental hurdle to get over, and that's the lesson being taught by allowing kids to believe this is how adults settle problems.

Person A has a problem with Person B. Solution? Kick the shit out of each other until one guy taps out or is pounded into the ground for a three count.

Where do you draw the line over what is or isnt' acceptable?

And here's some more Devil's Advocate for you... male-on-female violence is actually in line with feminism if you are a true feminist. True feminism is about equal footing, so why would any true feminist be arguing for exceptional rules for females like the idea that a man shouldn't hit a woman? Why not if we're all equal and the same? In that world, everyone is fair game or no one is fair game. No exceptions over size, religion, race or gender.
 
"True feminism" isn't a thing, and if it was, it wouldn't be that.

...

...

...

...

Drums in the deep...

IT IS COMING.
 
“Bitch had it coming” - A Consideration of Violence Against Women in Professional Wrestling

Several weeks in the future TNA star and 300lb male Bully Ray is going to enlist the assistance of his similarly sized brother to brutally assault a women one third of his size whilst an arena full of men shout encouragement. Warning, the preceding sentence, as well as many subsequent sentences, contain spoilers for TNA Impact, so those of you living in caves on Mars are recommended to stop reading two minutes ago.

Two large men powerbombed a comparatively helpless female through a table, and the consensus from the crowd at the event, as well as the keyboard warriors reading about it online, is that this was somewhere between 'perfectly OK' and 'fuckin awesome'. I'd like you, the reader, to take a few minutes of your life to accompany me on a journey as we look into why this is the case, and search for the conclusion as to weather or not it is a good thing.

Contemporary wrestling has had a very hit or miss relationship with its treatment of women as characters, with significantly fewer hits than misses. Researching the issue, I was alarmed to discover that TNA is actually the high point of the American industry in this area. SPIKE TV has always maintained an iron-cast boycott on male on female violence, and those angles Impact has run which crossed into this territory, Bobby Roode abusing Tracy Brooks and Bobby Roode (again!) punching Sharmell, were handled with what for the medium accounts to class and sensitivity.

Ring of Honour, which likes to pride itself on being the highbrow wrestling alternative, is guilty for allowing the continued existence of those appalling “She's a crack ****e” chants long into the new millennium, and once ran an angle where the late Larry Sweeney punched a women in the back of the head and then forced his client to publicly rape her whilst a section of the audience chanted “Suck her tits”.

The WWE's record has been extensively scrutinised already. The attitude era was a hotbed of exploitative male on female violence being played of shock value. The man at the centre of next month's controversy, then named Bubba Ray Dudley, made a habit of powerbombing women for what amounted to shits and giggles. Since the swing towards PG content things have got a lot quieter on the eastern front, but I'll remind you that it was only a couple of years ago that Randy Orton was sexually abusing an unconscious Stephanie McMahon in order to sell a Wrestlemania main event.

The less said about WCW and ECW the better.

So, to the surprise of nobody, we've successfully established a pattern in the hyper-masculine pro-wrestling industry's treatment of the fairer sex – next we have to establish the extent to which this is unacceptable. Obviously this will vary from person to person. There are those out there for whom any kind of physicality directed against women will always be several steps over the line. Similarly, those sub-human creatures who were in the Ring of Honour crowd applauding Sweeney's escapades probably wish he'd ripped Alison Danger's clothes off and taken a shit on her face.

In the interest of full disclosure, I'm going to be approaching the topic from the perspective that violence against women is wrong, but I'm going to attempt as close to an objective analysis of the situation as I can. I can't promise a total absence of personal bias, but this is not a cunning 2000 word Trojen horse to smuggle my viewpoint into your head.

In honour of that, despite being firmly against violence against women in professional wrestling, I'm going to begin my analysis by looking at a few of the times that I feel it has been used well, or at least acceptably, over the years. Like any sufficiently detailed historical analysis, we're going to start with Chyna.

Chyna was routinely beaten up by men. Eddie Guerrero attacked her from behind with a title belt at survivor series and not an eyebrow was raised. This is because the cultural taboo against violence towards women does not actually have anything to do with women; it's a taboo against violence towards those who are unable to defend themselves. Violence against women elicits much the same reaction as violence against the disabled, or violence against children.
Chyna was an imposing athlete who routinely locked up with male competitors on equal terms – no vulnerability, no taboo.

Another occasion that comes to mind of violence against women being used well comes from the TNA angle I alluded to earlier, where Bobby Roode punched Booker T's wife in the face. For those without a basic grounding in TNA, just imagine a mildly better executed version of Jericho punching Rebecca Hickenbottom. When Roode inadvertently punched Sharmell it was taken seriously by everyone involved. The commentators, athletes and even Roode himself recognised it as being incredibly serious, and there was absolutely no question that, accident or not, Bobby Roode was the bad guy. It wasn't exploitative like Vince McMahon's abuse of Trish, and it wasn't played for shock value like Sweeney. Wrestling tries to tell stories, and sometimes in a serious story you have to show a bad guy doing a bad thing – as long as the situation is treated with respect and not played for laughs or exploitation then I don't see a major problem.

Where I start to feel incredibly uncomfortable is when violence against women, or children, or the physically or mentally disabled is presented as something funny or entertaining. It's not funny. Where I find it even more troubling, is when I see it being presented as acceptable, appropriate or (as in the case of future TNA) commendable.

“Ahha!” I hear someone somewhere declare at this point, “I have spotted the hypocrisy in this argument. Even if we all agree that violence against women is wrong, so is violence against the elderly, but I didn't see people complaining about Bret stoving Vince's head in with a chair at Wrestlemania.”

Personally I complained loudly because that match was a pile of shit, but to take this not unreasonable counterpoint seriously for a minute, and to leave aside the obvious dodge of Vince probably being able to run circles around Bret – there's a greater point to be considered here. Violence against women is, I hope, unquestionably wrong, but so is almost all violence. There are absolutely no circumstances, outside of self defence, in which it is tolerable to hit people with a steel chair, yet we happily tolerate that in our wrestling broadcast – why then should the same logic not be applied to the powerbombing of women through tables.

My counter to this is that, as a society we don't have a major problem with this kind of physical violence. Steel chair assaults and random suplexings happen, but they're not a major aspect of our day to day lives. What we do have in our culture is an enormous problem when it comes to violence against women. Around two-and-a-half-million women are assaulted or raped by their partner in the United States EVERY YEAR.

There are those out there who will pretend that this has nothing to do with professional wrestling, but those people are wrong. It has very little to do with professional wrestling, but the connection is there. The justification of this claim: history. You remember that fucking terrifying domestic abuse statistic I gave you seventeen seconds ago? Well that's about the best it's ever been. It used to be, and in sections of the world still is, considered culturally acceptable for men to beat their partners. It wasn't until 1970 in the US that courts even started to recognise the idea that marital rape could exist, and before those days violence against women was routinely tolerated or ignored.

That cultural taboo we all grew up with against hitting women didn't just happen. It took a fucking lot of hard work from a lot of people over a long period of time to make it happen. The violence against women acts, recognition of equal legal rights and the portrayal of women in the media are all battles that are continuing to this day. Every time any form of media belittles, trivialises or otherwise contradicts this taboo it works against it and very gradually moves us back the way we've come. I'm not going to blow things out of proportion and say wrestling is causing violence against women, but it's working to strengthen an eminent social structure that defines the beating of women as acceptable behaviour.

Going back to Dixie Carter (remember her) for a few minutes; I was cruising the internet recently absorbing the reception to this segment and a disconcertingly large number of people seemed to be making remarks in the vein of 'Dixie getting beaten up was OK because she was evil'. Her character was a baddy, and therefore had it coming.

The university of Arkansas commissioned a study into domestic violence motivation in 1997 wherein perpetrators of violence against women were asked to explain their motivation in the wake of incidents, and the overwhelming majority of rationalisations given by the domestic abusers was that there were provoked or enraged by their partner, who in some way shape or form 'had it coming'.

Correlation does not imply causation, but when you have the same reaction to violence against women in the media as to real life, it makes you wonder. We have a very significant portion of the population, mostly young males who fit snugly into wrestling's target demographic, who appear to be of the opinion that there are circumstances, outside of immediate self defence, in which it is wholly appropriate to hurt, molest, abuse, rape or otherwise kick the shit out of women who can't defend themselves.

With this in mind, I humbly submit that having televisual media directed at these young men re-enforce this world view is not a good thing.

Obviously I don't beat women, and hopefully neither do you. As such we should be free to enjoy watching Dixie Carter consensually go through a table for our entertainment; but the world is a bit bigger than just us. We don't see the ten million victims of domestic violence since 2010, but as long as I know that they are there, I don't want to enjoy media which visibly contributes towards their fate.

Violence against women is not funny, it's not entertaining, and in the real world away from internet hypothetical involving shotgun toting transgender Hitler, it's almost never appropriate. If your showing it as a bad thing in a serious story then more power to you. If you're writing that inevitable Wonder Women movie then have at it. But showing a gang of men delivering a beating to a defenseless women whilst a larger gang of men cheer them on, that's not cool, and I don't plan on watching it.

* * *

That's the consensus that I've arrived at after subjecting the matter to quite a lot of thought. You doubtless have your own and, conditionally on it being more eloquent than 'it's wrestling so who gives a shit', I am at this point legitimately interested in what it is. Oh, and because I feel the need to do this post every piece of writing I produce here, the TL : DR jokes are not even remotely funny, and are made exclusively by people with small penises.
 
“Bitch had it coming” - A Consideration of Violence Against Women in Professional Wrestling

Several weeks in the future TNA star and 300lb male Bully Ray is going to enlist the assistance of his similarly sized brother to brutally assault a women one third of his size whilst an arena full of men shout encouragement. Warning, the preceding sentence, as well as many subsequent sentences, contain spoilers for TNA Impact, so those of you living in caves on Mars are recommended to stop reading two minutes ago.

Two large men powerbombed a comparatively helpless female through a table, and the consensus from the crowd at the event, as well as the keyboard warriors reading about it online, is that this was somewhere between 'perfectly OK' and 'fuckin awesome'. I'd like you, the reader, to take a few minutes of your life to accompany me on a journey as we look into why this is the case, and search for the conclusion as to weather or not it is a good thing.

Contemporary wrestling has had a very hit or miss relationship with its treatment of women as characters, with significantly fewer hits than misses. Researching the issue, I was alarmed to discover that TNA is actually the high point of the American industry in this area. SPIKE TV has always maintained an iron-cast boycott on male on female violence, and those angles Impact has run which crossed into this territory, Bobby Roode abusing Tracy Brooks and Bobby Roode (again!) punching Sharmell, were handled with what for the medium accounts to class and sensitivity.

Ring of Honour, which likes to pride itself on being the highbrow wrestling alternative, is guilty for allowing the continued existence of those appalling “She's a crack ****e” chants long into the new millennium, and once ran an angle where the late Larry Sweeney punched a women in the back of the head and then forced his client to publicly rape her whilst a section of the audience chanted “Suck her tits”.

The WWE's record has been extensively scrutinised already. The attitude era was a hotbed of exploitative male on female violence being played of shock value. The man at the centre of next month's controversy, then named Bubba Ray Dudley, made a habit of powerbombing women for what amounted to shits and giggles. Since the swing towards PG content things have got a lot quieter on the eastern front, but I'll remind you that it was only a couple of years ago that Randy Orton was sexually abusing an unconscious Stephanie McMahon in order to sell a Wrestlemania main event.

The less said about WCW and ECW the better.

So, to the surprise of nobody, we've successfully established a pattern in the hyper-masculine pro-wrestling industry's treatment of the fairer sex – next we have to establish the extent to which this is unacceptable. Obviously this will vary from person to person. There are those out there for whom any kind of physicality directed against women will always be several steps over the line. Similarly, those sub-human creatures who were in the Ring of Honour crowd applauding Sweeney's escapades probably wish he'd ripped Alison Danger's clothes off and taken a shit on her face.

In the interest of full disclosure, I'm going to be approaching the topic from the perspective that violence against women is wrong, but I'm going to attempt as close to an objective analysis of the situation as I can. I can't promise a total absence of personal bias, but this is not a cunning 2000 word Trojen horse to smuggle my viewpoint into your head.

In honour of that, despite being firmly against violence against women in professional wrestling, I'm going to begin my analysis by looking at a few of the times that I feel it has been used well, or at least acceptably, over the years. Like any sufficiently detailed historical analysis, we're going to start with Chyna.

Chyna was routinely beaten up by men. Eddie Guerrero attacked her from behind with a title belt at survivor series and not an eyebrow was raised. This is because the cultural taboo against violence towards women does not actually have anything to do with women; it's a taboo against violence towards those who are unable to defend themselves. Violence against women elicits much the same reaction as violence against the disabled, or violence against children.
Chyna was an imposing athlete who routinely locked up with male competitors on equal terms – no vulnerability, no taboo.

Another occasion that comes to mind of violence against women being used well comes from the TNA angle I alluded to earlier, where Bobby Roode punched Booker T's wife in the face. For those without a basic grounding in TNA, just imagine a mildly better executed version of Jericho punching Rebecca Hickenbottom. When Roode inadvertently punched Sharmell it was taken seriously by everyone involved. The commentators, athletes and even Roode himself recognised it as being incredibly serious, and there was absolutely no question that, accident or not, Bobby Roode was the bad guy. It wasn't exploitative like Vince McMahon's abuse of Trish, and it wasn't played for shock value like Sweeney. Wrestling tries to tell stories, and sometimes in a serious story you have to show a bad guy doing a bad thing – as long as the situation is treated with respect and not played for laughs or exploitation then I don't see a major problem.

Where I start to feel incredibly uncomfortable is when violence against women, or children, or the physically or mentally disabled is presented as something funny or entertaining. It's not funny. Where I find it even more troubling, is when I see it being presented as acceptable, appropriate or (as in the case of future TNA) commendable.

“Ahha!” I hear someone somewhere declare at this point, “I have spotted the hypocrisy in this argument. Even if we all agree that violence against women is wrong, so is violence against the elderly, but I didn't see people complaining about Bret stoving Vince's head in with a chair at Wrestlemania.”

Personally I complained loudly because that match was a pile of shit, but to take this not unreasonable counterpoint seriously for a minute, and to leave aside the obvious dodge of Vince probably being able to run circles around Bret – there's a greater point to be considered here. Violence against women is, I hope, unquestionably wrong, but so is almost all violence. There are absolutely no circumstances, outside of self defence, in which it is tolerable to hit people with a steel chair, yet we happily tolerate that in our wrestling broadcast – why then should the same logic not be applied to the powerbombing of women through tables.

My counter to this is that, as a society we don't have a major problem with this kind of physical violence. Steel chair assaults and random suplexings happen, but they're not a major aspect of our day to day lives. What we do have in our culture is an enormous problem when it comes to violence against women. Around two-and-a-half-million women are assaulted or raped by their partner in the United States EVERY YEAR.

There are those out there who will pretend that this has nothing to do with professional wrestling, but those people are wrong. It has very little to do with professional wrestling, but the connection is there. The justification of this claim: history. You remember that fucking terrifying domestic abuse statistic I gave you seventeen seconds ago? Well that's about the best it's ever been. It used to be, and in sections of the world still is, considered culturally acceptable for men to beat their partners. It wasn't until 1970 in the US that courts even started to recognise the idea that marital rape could exist, and before those days violence against women was routinely tolerated or ignored.

That cultural taboo we all grew up with against hitting women didn't just happen. It took a fucking lot of hard work from a lot of people over a long period of time to make it happen. The violence against women acts, recognition of equal legal rights and the portrayal of women in the media are all battles that are continuing to this day. Every time any form of media belittles, trivialises or otherwise contradicts this taboo it works against it and very gradually moves us back the way we've come. I'm not going to blow things out of proportion and say wrestling is causing violence against women, but it's working to strengthen an eminent social structure that defines the beating of women as acceptable behaviour.

Going back to Dixie Carter (remember her) for a few minutes; I was cruising the internet recently absorbing the reception to this segment and a disconcertingly large number of people seemed to be making remarks in the vein of 'Dixie getting beaten up was OK because she was evil'. Her character was a baddy, and therefore had it coming.

The university of Arkansas commissioned a study into domestic violence motivation in 1997 wherein perpetrators of violence against women were asked to explain their motivation in the wake of incidents, and the overwhelming majority of rationalisations given by the domestic abusers was that there were provoked or enraged by their partner, who in some way shape or form 'had it coming'.

Correlation does not imply causation, but when you have the same reaction to violence against women in the media as to real life, it makes you wonder. We have a very significant portion of the population, mostly young males who fit snugly into wrestling's target demographic, who appear to be of the opinion that there are circumstances, outside of immediate self defence, in which it is wholly appropriate to hurt, molest, abuse, rape or otherwise kick the shit out of women who can't defend themselves.

With this in mind, I humbly submit that having televisual media directed at these young men re-enforce this world view is not a good thing.

Obviously I don't beat women, and hopefully neither do you. As such we should be free to enjoy watching Dixie Carter consensually go through a table for our entertainment; but the world is a bit bigger than just us. We don't see the ten million victims of domestic violence since 2010, but as long as I know that they are there, I don't want to enjoy media which visibly contributes towards their fate.

Violence against women is not funny, it's not entertaining, and in the real world away from internet hypothetical involving shotgun toting transgender Hitler, it's almost never appropriate. If your showing it as a bad thing in a serious story then more power to you. If you're writing that inevitable Wonder Women movie then have at it. But showing a gang of men delivering a beating to a defenseless women whilst a larger gang of men cheer them on, that's not cool, and I don't plan on watching it.

* * *

That's the consensus that I've arrived at after subjecting the matter to quite a lot of thought. You doubtless have your own and, conditionally on it being more eloquent than 'it's wrestling so who gives a shit', I am at this point legitimately interested in what it is. Oh, and because I feel the need to do this post every piece of writing I produce here, the TL : DR jokes are not even remotely funny, and are made exclusively by people with small penises.

I did read the whole thing and it makes better sense than the other responses I've read earlier. I still don't see it as horribly wrong as some make it out to be and still see it as the culmination of a story with a villain getting punished for her crimes. The fact that she's a woman has little bearing on it in my mind.

Regarding what you said about the "she had it coming" issue, that makes sense but there's a difference that draws a line for me: this is wrestling, where everything is meant to be over the top and often not taken seriously. When you have control of a company being decided inside a steel cage or grown men wearing underwear to a fight or having a carnival show up at a wrestling show or whatever other over the top thing wrestling is doing, it changes the way the show is viewed.

Those things almost act as comic relief. There comes a point when you stop and look at what you're watching and realize how completely insane it really is. The fact that the violence against Dixie is taking place in a wrestling ring as over the top characters chant for it and a previously cut table is involved with a commentary team prattling on about some kickboxing event, it makes it seem far less serious than a man who comes home every night with a half empty can of beer and nails his wife in the jaw so that she has to wear extra makeup so her boss doesn't see it. The fact that the scenario is so over the top takes some of the edge off.

As you said, I don't think anyone is seriously suggesting that this is going to cause men to go out and punch women in the face over and over, but I also don't think it's going to be taken all that seriously. Someone earlier said the same people that cheer this would likely all say that violence against women is entirely wrong. Wrestling has often been like a live action cartoon in a lot of ways. Just because I see Bugs Bunny cause Daffy Duck to get shot over and over again doesn't mean that I want to go put a bullet in a duck. Why? Because it's not meant to be realistic.
 
"True feminism" isn't a thing, and if it was, it wouldn't be that.

...

...

...

...

Drums in the deep...

IT IS COMING.

I'm aware. My point is, there's a fundamental flaw in the idea of equal footing among the sexes and special rules for a one of those sexes co-existing in the same world.

If violence against women is inherently wrong, then women are simply never going to be equal to men (in this realm) unless we're operating from the position you just posited using Chyna as the benchmark (or, in other words, the case for physical stature).

Sorry every Knockout on the TNA roster — you just aren't big enough to swim in this pond. The only one who might make the cut is ODB, but even she'd fall short of the Chyna law in my eyes.
 
Yet again; what is acceptable in "sports entertainment"?

Is it okay for the face of anti-bullying to have a giant knockout a pensioner? For the same woman to have a monster terrorize an injured man and his wife? To have three in-ring competitors attack a middle aged non-competitor?

Is it okay to assault the father of someone you are feuding with?

Is it okay to repeatedly beat on someone with a weapon with the aim to take them out?

Is it justified to powerbomb a middle aged woman through a table because she put you through a table, kneed one of your best friend in the testicles, has routinely had you beaten to a pulp and tried to end your career?

To me, there are many things in wrestling that are far from acceptable in real life and it comes down to individuals as to what is "too far". Were this angle has gone too far from me is the Devon kiss - up to that stage, it was the evil boss getting comeuppance and both female employees and fans were supporting such. However, the kiss, to me, was a step too far and moved it beyond the justice storyline. I'd be very surprised (and more than slightly disappointed) if that is included in the actual production.
 
And here's some more Devil's Advocate for you... male-on-female violence is actually in line with feminism if you are a true feminist. True feminism is about equal footing, so why would any true feminist be arguing for exceptional rules for females like the idea that a man shouldn't hit a woman? Why not if we're all equal and the same? In that world, everyone is fair game or no one is fair game. No exceptions over size, religion, race or gender.

As someone who isn't a feminist but holds respect for their cause, I really don't like it when people bring out the "Well, if you're seeking out equal rights, you'd be better off not complaining" argument. Physically, Dixie is nowhere near as powerful as Bully Ray, and as such, she should be entitled to some form of respect due to their unchangeable inequality. A barbarous assault on a defenceless middle-aged woman is a villainous act, no matter how you look at it, and not only harmful in damaging the audience's relationships with Bully Ray as a babyface character, but also damaging to people's perspective on TNA as a whole.

To put this into perspective, let's say I am Robin Hood, stealing from the rich and giving to the poor. I am often considered a hero to many for my actions in attempting to bring equality to the land. Now, imagine if I started stealing from the poor as well. People are capable of defending that action with "If the rich are being stolen from, why shouldn't the poor be also?" Simple: The poor are vulnerable and incapable of surviving without my help in this example. The rich aren't. Why should I still be considered anything close to a hero if I target vulnerable people along with the rich? Why should Bully Ray be considered anything close to a hero if he targets vulnerable women as well as men?
 
As someone who isn't a feminist but holds respect for their cause, I really don't like it when people bring out the "Well, if you're seeking out equal rights, you'd be better off not complaining" argument. Physically, Dixie is nowhere near as powerful as Bully Ray, and as such, she should be entitled to some form of respect due to their unchangeable inequality. A barbarous assault on a defenceless middle-aged woman is a villainous act, no matter how you look at it, and not only harmful in damaging the audience's relationships with Bully Ray as a babyface character, but also damaging to people's perspective on TNA as a whole.

To put this into perspective, let's say I am Robin Hood, stealing from the rich and giving to the poor. I am often considered a hero to many for my actions in attempting to bring equality to the land. Now, imagine if I started stealing from the poor as well. People are capable of defending that action with "If the rich are being stolen from, why shouldn't the poor be also?" Simple: The poor are vulnerable and incapable of surviving without my help in this example. The rich aren't. Why should I still be considered anything close to a hero if I target vulnerable people along with the rich? Why should Bully Ray be considered anything close to a hero if he targets vulnerable women as well as men?

Then again, the exact same argument could be put forward for Spud. In fact, Dixie has caused more pain to Bully physically than Rockstar.
 
Can we all just agree that we see things differently and that Zion is a twat? Cause I'm seriously getting the itch to go play some Mortal Kombat and practice my Fatalities on Kitana and Sonya Blade.
 
If wrestling is truly a kids show, then we have a fundamental hurdle to get over, and that's the lesson being taught by allowing kids to believe this is how adults settle problems.

To be fair, WWE is PG. Parents ideally should be careful as to what their kids are watching. How many times do you even hear about children getting into fights under Randy Orton's influence? When you do, I think it's all down to parenting. Nevertheless, the show can still be for children. I mean matches have changed, characters are very childish and they do several campaigns with kids. With TNA though, it's a different tale.

And here's some more Devil's Advocate for you... male-on-female violence is actually in line with feminism if you are a true feminist. True feminism is about equal footing, so why would any true feminist be arguing for exceptional rules for females like the idea that a man shouldn't hit a woman? Why not if we're all equal and the same? In that world, everyone is fair game or no one is fair game. No exceptions over size, religion, race or gender.
THIS, like a frikin' hundred times.
 
Then again, the exact same argument could be put forward for Spud. In fact, Dixie has caused more pain to Bully physically than Rockstar.

Spud is a wrestler. He signed up to TNA as a wrestler in kayfabe after winning British Boot Camp. There's a big difference.

I'm willing to drop this now. Wondering if I should just make a new thread for the discussion to continue.
 

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