How do you build credibility?

[Manee]

I stayed up to the early hours of the English morning to watch Summerslam on Box Office and smiled gently as I saw SuperCena (TM) fight his way to victory over the Nexus. People are mostly upset about this, I was rather lukewarm to the prospect of Cena saving Team WWE, but do agree with it - as it was the top star of the company against two rookies, one of whom pretty much eliminated himself by missing the 450 splash.

My question is, why are their complaints about SuperCena but not when Austin pulled off similar superhuman feats against the odds against the Corporation, Corporate Ministry, etc. How do you build the credibility that Austin had, but Cena doesn't? Cena is built like a tank, has won multiple titles but people are still frustrated when he dominates - where did WWE go wrong?

I'm not only talking about Austin, of course, as The Rock could whoop a lot of ass as a face without half an arena (if not more) chanting Rocky sucks. In fact, Cena's career and The Rock's career were quite similar. They both rose quickly as faces, then became heels (though Rock was more high profile as a heel), then bad ass faces and then moved more comedy into it as they became main event superstars.

 

[SpoodBeest]

The credibility is already there it's just that a lot of people aren't willing to accept it and that's where the problem is. Up to when he won his first WWE title Cena had the support of all the fans and everyone was into him there wasn't a single boo back over five years ago. Then for some reason throughout his first title reign a portion of the crowds turned on him. i think it is because it was during his first reign as a world champion that he started over coming in human odds such as multiple handicap matches and what not. Every time he did this portions of each crowd began to loath it more and more. Every big time match he would have over the years after wards those same portion of fan's hatred grew more and more and they ended up just hating his character all together.

John Cena is the top face of WWE and those same fans who have this hatred for his character that started five years ago didn't go away. They also influenced other fans who try to be "cool" by booing as well as heckling Cena also. Over the last five years the hate has grown a little bit in size but the main target audience who WWE caters too largely pout weighs those same resentful fans who began to hate Cena's character years ago. They are not willing to accept that this is the main guy they see every week, this is not the guy they perfer to be dominant all the time, and because of this they boo and heckle. It is strange yes, but that's the way they are. If they could get their heads out of their asses and see all the good Cena has done for WWE throughout these five years then maybe they will see that all of Cena's dominance is justified. Until they learn to accept that WWE's top star is Cena and that WWE is not catering to them anymore, I think those portions of boos and heckles we hear so often will continue as those crowd members continue to be ignored for their troubles.

 

[Dowdsy McDowds]

The Rock/Cena comparison was made a day or 2 ago on another thread.

I think the main things to consider are that Austin was a bit more wild and outgunned, but represented people who had been screwed over in life. Cena doesn't represent this.

As for comparing Rock and Cena, Cena has had more and longer runs as the WWE champ than Rock did, but Rock didn't really need the belt that often as he was, after all, the 'People's Champ'. Rock also rarely did a 'SuperCena', that is, take a huge beating which made him look dead, then pop up again for a couple of moves and then seem absolutely fine again. Rock's selling was pretty good and under-appreciated as he more often than not got the balance right of when to be hurting, when to have recovered, but continue to sell an injury. Cena, for all his experience, doesn't do this

 

[billm75]

I have to agree with Spood on this one. There's not a lack of credibility on Cena's part, there's a lack of supporting him that's prevalent throughout the fanbase. I'd still say that better than 70% of the live crowd is all for Cena, if not more, but the ones who want to boo him and put him down have money to get good seats up close to the microphones and band together to start chants.

Personally,if I didn't care for the current product or entertainers, I damn sure wouldn't spend my hard earned money on tickets for the chance to BOO them live. That's really counterproductive in my mind.

 

[shogunsrampage]

The credibility is already there it's just that a lot of people aren't willing to accept it and that's where the problem is. Up to when he won his first WWE title Cena had the support of all the fans and everyone was into him there wasn't a single boo back over five years ago. Then for some reason throughout his first title reign a portion of the crowds turned on him. i think it is because it was during his first reign as a world champion that he started over coming in human odds such as multiple handicap matches and what not. Every time he did this portions of each crowd began to loath it more and more. Every big time match he would have over the years after wards those same portion of fan's hatred grew more and more and they ended up just hating his character all together.

John Cena is the top face of WWE and those same fans who have this hatred for his character that started five years ago didn't go away. They also influenced other fans who try to be "cool" by booing as well as heckling Cena also. Over the last five years the hate has grown a little bit in size but the main target audience who WWE caters too largely pout weighs those same resentful fans who began to hate Cena's character years ago. They are not willing to accept that this is the main guy they see every week, this is not the guy they perfer to be dominant all the time, and because of this they boo and heckle. It is strange yes, but that's the way they are. If they could get their heads out of their asses and see all the good Cena has done for WWE throughout these five years then maybe they will see that all of Cena's dominance is justified. Until they learn to accept that WWE's top star is Cena and that WWE is not catering to them anymore, I think those portions of boos and heckles we hear so often will continue as those crowd members continue to be ignored for their troubles.

so basically were supposed to drink the cena -kool aid and cheer lol.... no... people pay their HARD EARNED MONEY to do whatever they like... people boo cena bc hes stale and too goody goody... most of the times booing or cheering leads to a guy getting a turn. look at orton..he went from being booed to cheered and is now the adults top choice for the face of the company.... the kids face is cena...i would guareentee u 8/10 male adults cant stand cena and thats who boos, bc they GET IT..... cena either needs to turn or somehow reinvent his character , cuz right now its stale and catered to only kids who DONT get it

as far as topic, as someone else said... u cant compare cena to the rock or austin.......austin was your everday dont take crap from anyone type of guy who hated his boss like most people do, this is why people loved him......cena is very much not like that at all...cena is too goody goody and from memory both rock and austin knew how to sell...... if ur gonna compare him to someone compare him to 80s hogan as they both use to get beat down then "hulk" up as if they are back at 100 percent and not damaged

 

[goldbergiswrestling]

The credibility is already there it's just that a lot of people aren't willing to accept it and that's where the problem is. Up to when he won his first WWE title Cena had the support of all the fans and everyone was into him there wasn't a single boo back over five years ago. Then for some reason throughout his first title reign a portion of the crowds turned on him. i think it is because it was during his first reign as a world champion that he started over coming in human odds such as multiple handicap matches and what not. Every time he did this portions of each crowd began to loath it more and more. Every big time match he would have over the years after wards those same portion of fan's hatred grew more and more and they ended up just hating his character all together.

John Cena is the top face of WWE and those same fans who have this hatred for his character that started five years ago didn't go away. They also influenced other fans who try to be "cool" by booing as well as heckling Cena also. Over the last five years the hate has grown a little bit in size but the main target audience who WWE caters too largely pout weighs those same resentful fans who began to hate Cena's character years ago. They are not willing to accept that this is the main guy they see every week, this is not the guy they perfer to be dominant all the time, and because of this they boo and heckle. It is strange yes, but that's the way they are. If they could get their heads out of their asses and see all the good Cena has done for WWE throughout these five years then maybe they will see that all of Cena's dominance is justified. Until they learn to accept that WWE's top star is Cena and that WWE is not catering to them anymore, I think those portions of boos and heckles we hear so often will continue as those crowd members continue to be ignored for their troubles.

my question to you is what has he done for WWE? u mean his job? what they pay him to do? because other than that look at the shows, they had been boring up untill Nexus. he is somewhat of a house hold name if the person in that house knows someone who is a wrestling fan. I remember when everbody in the world knew the names stone coldm the rock, hogan, goldberg, sting, nash, Mankind, Shawn Michaels, Bret Hart, John Cena just doesnt measure up to the standards set by these people. dont get me wrong I dont hate cena, I just think he is stale, which is what sets him apart from those people, they were able to always keep u interested, Im tired of cena though

 

[Zigglerfan227]

You forgot to add one other thing about what Cena and the Rock have in common, they both are disliked by me.

Yeah, They are similar to a degree. I respect them as a person especially for their decision to put their body's on the line for the WWE fans. As a wrestler I dislike them because they are so popular and Superman like. Superman is great, but when other characters try to be him they suck. Only Superman can be Superman.

I actually used to like John Cena back from his debut up to about 2006. He used to be really funny, in fact I still thought he was funny sometimes up to about 2008. At about mid 2008 he got super lame because he was boring in all areas. He started to make really bad jokes. Sometimes he made me feel embarresed for watching WWE.

I will see this though, as long as he is Super Child-loving Cena I will dilsike like him, however I understand his importance to the company. Even though I do not enjoy seeing him I fully understand his significance and for that I put up with him.

 

[Karaoke Superstar]

I stayed up to the early hours of the English morning to watch Summerslam on Box Office and smiled gently as I saw SuperCena (TM) fight his way to victory over the Nexus. People are mostly upset about this, I was rather lukewarm to the prospect of Cena saving Team WWE, but do agree with it - as it was the top star of the company against two rookies, one of whom pretty much eliminated himself by missing the 450 splash.

My question is, why are their complaints about SuperCena but not when Austin pulled off similar superhuman feats against the odds against the Corporation, Corporate Ministry, etc. How do you build the credibility that Austin had, but Cena doesn't? Cena is built like a tank, has won multiple titles but people are still frustrated when he dominates - where did WWE go wrong?

I'm not only talking about Austin, of course, as The Rock could whoop a lot of ass as a face without half an arena (if not more) chanting Rocky sucks. In fact, Cena's career and The Rock's career were quite similar. They both rose quickly as faces, then became heels (though Rock was more high profile as a heel), then bad ass faces and then moved more comedy into it as they became main event superstars.

It was just a bad move, WWE spent months building these guys as an unstoppable force only to be buried by Supercena. It's an ending that has been used and abused countless times. It took John Cena about a minute or less to finish off both of them, so where can they go from here? It's not so much team WWE winning although I think Nexus should have won so they would look like that much more of a threat afterwards. Cena pretty much squashed Gabriel and Barrett.

 

[kingofkings01013]

It was just a bad move, WWE spent months building these guys as an unstoppable force only to be buried by Supercena. It's an ending that has been used and abused countless times. It took John Cena about a minute or less to finish off both of them, so where can they go from here? It's not so much team WWE winning although I think Nexus should have won so they would look like that much more of a threat afterwards. Cena pretty much squashed Gabriel and Barrett.

I have totally agree with this when Austin did this more than 3 months was used so you expect at one point the Corporation would lose. I was expect SuperCena but not till like November at Survivor Series. But apparently creative felt the need to bury Nexus at a 6 match Summerslam that had only 3 results was a great plan. I love how they thought Bret using a chair was cool clearly people forgot about him trying to use a chair at WM.

 

[MrHashasheen]

How do you build credibility? You have the wrestler put on good matches, good promos, build a relationship with the crowd and those watching. When he wins matches he does it in a way that completes his gimmick and his face/heel position. When he loses, he can blow it off or excuse it if he's a heel or promise to come back even harder if he's a face.

 

[The 1-2-3 Killam]

First of all, the title of this thread doesn't really match the question asked...

How do you build credibility? There's plenty of ways really. You can slowly build a guy, giving him several wins over a short period of time, and let him cut some good promos before giving him a mid card title. You can continue slowly building him until the fans are very familiar with him, and he's over. And then you can push him to the top with a MITB win or something like that. I find that in those cases like CM Punk, the reaction is sort of lukewarm though.

I think the best way, even though I'm not really a fan of it, is to get his face all over the place. Look at Miz. The guy is just pure gold. His promos are awesome, his ring-work is awesome, and he's being billed as the next face of Raw. He came out of nowhere from the midcard with a MITB win and is now in every angle and every promo and is being shoved down our throats. But he's good... The reason Miz worked though, is that he had history. The fans knew who he was. They could have hated him, but at least they knew him, and sort of knew his ability.

Now, look at Sheamus. They screwed up with Sheamus. He came out of nowhere, and was shoved down our throats even more than the Miz. He got high profile wins and an immediate WWE title win. That did NOT give him credibility. It gave him heat, but not the right kind either. They have had to work backwards and give Sheamus more mic time and whatnot to give a champion credibility that he should have had before his push even started.

So, basically I think a guy needs to establish himself, and then push the hell out of him. You can't JoMo the guy and keep him in the midcard forever, or people will just stop caring.

I'm not gonna address what you asked in your post, cuz I really don't like the Cena/Rock/Austin cred. debate. I liked the original question in the title a lot more...

 

[MoneyMan]

the hip hop gimmick had something to do with it also. also his overly sypathetic to the soldiers (whole Soldier-USA thing stance/gimmick had something to do with it. Austin was an anti-hero. Rock was an anti-hero. Deep down we all crave anti-heroes. Cena is like a friggin blast of sayin prayers, takin your vitamins, drink your milk hoganesque cartoonish hero ala The 80's. This generation loves anti-heroes. that concludes the credibility issue and why half of the crowd turned on CENA besides mostly kids. ALA hogan again. The older fan craves his anti-heroes LOOK AT RANDY ORTON and how big his anti hero VIPER persona/character is getting. just my two cents.

 

[Agent-67]

1) Get rid of the two world titles. The US title & IC title should be the belts for the two shows. The world champ should be on both shows. Like a traveling champ like Flair was. Get rid of the two womens titles as well. Same traveling idea for womens champ & tag champs.
2) Let people hold the belts for longer periods. When you pass the belt around like a wh**e, you totally discredit it. People will actually care when the belts change hands.
3) Hate to say it, but tone down the matches on Raw & Smackdown. By that I mean, what the hell is the point of buying the ppv when you get ppv matches on the two shows. Half the damn time the show after the ppv features a rematch or two anyway. I know people may disagree, but they give you too mucy these days. The anticipation of wanting two guys to lock horns is part of what makes the fueds.
4) Too much wrestling. Monday Raw, Friday Smackdown, Tuesday NXT, Thursday Superstars, hell theres probably some weekend show I don't know of as well. 2 shows and the guys have to stay on the brand they were drafted on.
5) Get some stars off Raw & onto Smackdown. Smackdown is terrible, especially now with Kane as champ. Meanwhile one of the best in the game today, Jericho, is jobbing constantly on Raw.
6) and your all going to bite my head on this one. How about a tournament at the next wm for a unified world title where the Undertaker gets a few more wins at WM before having his streak ended by a heel turing Cena at WM in the final match. I know everyone loves the Taker, but whats the point of this streak if no one beats it? If Cena turned at the WM ppv in the final match & ended UT's streak, that could be similar to Hogan at Bash at the Beach 96.
Just my thoughts

 

[JT2005]

What's the real point of the thread here? How to build credibility or where WWE went wrong with John Cena?

If it's credibility you want then look no farther than WWE. They know how to give it or kill it. You build up a superstar a star is made over night in that company. Austin, The Rock, Orton, Batista, HHH. They all came up gradually they took some losses and made them up with bigger wins. They went into rivalries and made it look good. they had good mic skills, they sold their matches and they got the crowd to cheer or boo them. they earned their spots. Cena did this too until about 2007. Sheamus, overnight, not much credibilty there.

Now as for where WWE went wrong with Cena. they pushed too far. when Cena was on smackdown, he was great. built up right, good rivalries, used enough to keep interest. when he came to raw, he was still going strong. then 2006 hit. Cena was on Raw at the beginning of the night cutting a promo. pretty good. then he was cutting a promo backstage about halfway. then he had a match at the end of the night. his rivalries started to become too predictable. no matter who was against him, cena was going to win in the end. with austin and the rock, they would go a few months without title matches. Cena would lose it and get it back a month later. essentially, cena was the rivalry. the other person didnt matter anymore. thats pretty much it.

 

[hArdyPUNKmArk]

I stayed up to the early hours of the English morning to watch Summerslam on Box Office and smiled gently as I saw SuperCena (TM) fight his way to victory over the Nexus. People are mostly upset about this, I was rather lukewarm to the prospect of Cena saving Team WWE, but do agree with it - as it was the top star of the company against two rookies, one of whom pretty much eliminated himself by missing the 450 splash.

My question is, why are their complaints about SuperCena but not when Austin pulled off similar superhuman feats against the odds against the Corporation, Corporate Ministry, etc. How do you build the credibility that Austin had, but Cena doesn't? Cena is built like a tank, has won multiple titles but people are still frustrated when he dominates - where did WWE go wrong?

I'm not only talking about Austin, of course, as The Rock could whoop a lot of ass as a face without half an arena (if not more) chanting Rocky sucks. In fact, Cena's career and The Rock's career were quite similar. They both rose quickly as faces, then became heels (though Rock was more high profile as a heel), then bad ass faces and then moved more comedy into it as they became main event superstars.

I’m not annoyed that Cena won. I’m not pissed off that team WWE won. I am pissed off with how it was done though. I believe that Nexus should have won. They should have carried onto Raw with a win, an arrogance and a cocky attitude that they just whooped WWE’s ass. I mean, their momentum over the past few months has slowly drained. When they were first on the scene everyone was going crazy about this new original concept.

Now that they lost and have been shown they aren’t much as individuals they’ve turned into ‘just another stable’ for me. Don’t get me wrong, they still have momentum and credibility but they’re no where near as special as they were when they first popped onto the scene.

What I had a problem with is how Cena managed to get up so quickly after being DDT’d onto cement. What was the point in that? If they were going to have Cena win, why not have it just him and Barrett at the end. Wrestle for 10mins by themselves, make Barrett look like gold and then have Cena beat him in the end. I wouldn’t have cared that WWE won because they still built Nexus and made it (semi) realistic.

I am far from a Cena hater. I’m usually the one defending him but lately he’s being put over when there is no need. We all know that most of the time Cena will win. We all know his credibility as a champion. We all know he can be put into a World Title match with a very strong possibility of winning. What’s the harm in having him lose from time to time cleanly against someone who deserves to be put over? It’s not Cena’s fault, it’s the booking. Out of the whole roster Cena is the most over as a credible threat against a title (bar Undertaker), he can lose cleanly without losing any aspect of his integrity.

Times are also different now where more and more people are aware of how wrestling works ie, booking, writing, creative etc. We analyse the product and critique it. Back when Austin was doing similar things to what Cena is doing (in terms of overcoming the odds all the time) people were so much more enveloved in the story to care. Their hero is winning, the bully/villain is getting his ass kicked. Now, we look and go “why isn’t he putting him over?”, “why is he always being booked to win?”.

I went on a bit of a rant there but I hope I’ve answered the original question in there somewhere but I feel I’ve given my thoughts on the whole ‘Super Cena’ discussion.