Heavyweight Unification - Second Guessing Myself

[chicagokmc]

Given how much attention was paid to the WWE title and how little was paid to the World title, I was a big advocate of unifying those belts. Well, WWE did that and now that I've had time to see the result, I can honestly say I'm second guessing it. I look at all the folks not involved in the Authority storyline basically floundering on the roster, wrestling each other in the same boring feuds week after week, that more importantly are feuds about nothing.

Given that only a select few, Orton, Bryan, Batista, Lesnar, Cena, Punk (when around), get to be involved in the Heavyweight title picture, or bitch about not being in the heavyweight picture, do we need that other Heavyweight championship after all? It just seems so boring to have ruined partnerships/friendships be the main impetus for feuds these days.

 

[LoudClearVoice]

It's a perfect opportunity for WWE to build up the US title and IC titles and they're just not doing it. The IC title was at one point, the secondary title in WWE, like what the World title used to be. It wasn't just for midcarders. I think that WWE needs to capitalize on the unification and emphasize the IC title and US titles more. That would alleviate the problem you're talking about.

 

[chicagokmc]

It's a perfect opportunity for WWE to build up the US title and IC titles and they're just not doing it. The IC title was at one point, the secondary title in WWE, like what the World title used to be. It wasn't just for midcarders. I think that WWE needs to capitalize on the unification and emphasize the IC title and US titles more. That would alleviate the problem you're talking about.

I've always agreed with this, but now that it has gotten so bad that not defending the US belt is sort of an in-storyline gag, I guess I've given up hope that they'll ever restore importance and PPV prestige to the IC/US belts.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

For the last several years of its existence, the World Heavyweight Championship kind of became, unofficially, the upper mid-card championship. Even though it was referred to and called the World Heavyweight Championship, for the most part, it was occupying the spot that was generally reserved for the Intercontinental Championship. There was a time when the WHC was booked with equal importance to the WWE Championship, but that hasn't been since around 2010 or so. As there's already the Intercontinental and United States Championships, I see no need for a third mid-card title.

With the WHC out of the picture, whatever time was devoted to it can now be given to the IC & US titles. While neither title has been a big deal during WrestleMania season, I still prefer what they've done this year over last year anytime. At least Big E and Ambrose aren't being buried poor Wade Barrett and Antonio Cesaro were at this time last year. What was being done to them while they were mid-card champions was damn near criminal.

In my opinion, having one main event championship, two mid-card championships, a tag team championship and a women's championship is a perfectly good balance. I'd even be fine with only one mid-card title.

 

[TheICChampion]

I think it will be more official when they finally get rid of one of the major World titles that Orton's holding. Right now we're second-guessing the unification because we can see both belts. Once they either find a way to put two belts into one or get rid of one belt, then we know that there is truly only one World champion.

 

[lordj2010]

you see this as being bad i do bealive i read a report on here not to long ago that the WWE is also considering unifying the IC and US title..... this will jsut make it that much worse

 

[TempestH]

you see this as being bad i do bealive i read a report on here not to long ago that the WWE is also considering unifying the IC and US title..... this will jsut make it that much worse

The United States and Intercontinental Championships SHOULD be unified. I do agree that we need more than one midcard title, but the IC and US Titles are meant to be equal in status, and thus having both is redundant. There should be one belt for the upper midcard and one for the lower midcard.

 

[Vance Ryan]

God I see why wwe doesn't care what u people think. First it's unify them now it's no. Man it's to hard to please people now a days. Look if wwe want to get it defended all they have to do is take it off dean Ambrose he's too rapped in the sheild to take it defend it. There ya go iwc smarks that's how you solve the problem of it not being defended it. I repeated myself like 2 times now this is why I can't stay on this website to long it seems too contradictory. First people said end the brand extent ion , then they say bring it back. Then it's unify the wwe and world title there should only be one. Then it's like no they should've been left alone because cesaro is gonna win it. Omg please

 

[Vintage]

I think it will be more official when they finally get rid of one of the major World titles that Orton's holding. Right now we're second-guessing the unification because we can see both belts. Once they either find a way to put two belts into one or get rid of one belt, then we know that there is truly only one World champion.

To quote a great jobber.. Are you serious Bro?

The unification isn't being second guessed because you can see both. It's not a true unification and never been promoted as such. There is no WWEWHC belt, only a WWE champ that is also the World Heavyweight Champion. Eventually there will be some kind 3 way ladder match between Batista, Orton and Bryan where the belts will be grabbed by 2 different men and we'll once again have a proper mid card champion. However WWE wanted to make sure the authority storyline went over and the only way that was possible was having Orton beat Cena in a match that many felt he would probably win, cementing Orton as top tweener. Now that this championship means so much more Punk would have gotten fed to Orton and lost, setting up D Bryan's "ascension". It's all marketing. There was no other reason this needed to be done and you can flush the prestige argument down the toilet. Only 1 title counts, only 1 title ever counted and only 1 title ever will.

 

[Kris Benwa]

I was one of the ones that was opposing this from the get go. In my opinon there's a lot of talent that could be competing for the World Heavyweight Championship and looking like stars out there putting on main event teir matches but because of the unification are suffering. I think they had Sandow and Cody Rhodes made, Ziggler, Sheamus, Christian, etc are suffering from not having a second World Title Belt IMO. I think they had a way to make the WHC mean something again when they ahd Cena holding it. Just have him talk it up and defend it close to the last match again and he should have eventually have dropped it to Sandow at around RR. IMO Cody Rhodes has all the talent and potential and everything to be the #2 guy and without a WHC I don't think he'll rise above mid card for at least another 3 years. There's a lot of talent that was already at that level to carry a world title or ones that could have been built up easily to have world titles now those talents are toiling in irrelevancy. I might have agreed the titles could have been unified a few years ago but with so many guys on the cusp of becoming stars and guys that are already stars (beneath the WWE title stars) doing it now was not the right move IMO

 

[Vintage]

The United States and Intercontinental Championships SHOULD be unified. I do agree that we need more than one midcard title, but the IC and US Titles are meant to be equal in status, and thus having both is redundant. There should be one belt for the upper midcard and one for the lower midcard.

Bad Idea

Why? See The WWEWHC situation. A roster with lets say..60 talents,and I'm sure that's a pretty low ball figure with only a tag division and heavy division for the male talents, needs more than 3 championship props or what you end up having is a promotion of characters that just don't matter. It's going to be 1 meaningless feud after another with the same small list of names dominating the title picture until injury or age switches things up. Thrown together tag teams are ok, but their shelf life is short at best.

 

[chicagokmc]

I don't care if it is another heavyweight title or unified IC/US title, my plea to WWE is put another title in play, make it important, create storylines around it and make wrestlers and fans care about it. Hard to care about a title when the holder spends more time in 6 man matches than defending his title.

 

[justinept]

The WWE has done a piss poor job with the unification thus far. It's that simple. The unification made sense in December, it still makes sense now, and I'll go so far as to say it NEVER made sense to bring in a second main title - not even during the brand split (instead of going to a second title, the WWE should've had a 'traveling' champion like the NWA used to do. That would've been cool, especially back when pay-per views were brand specific.)

Think about this: If you're the WWE Champion, it says you're the best wrestler in the company. If you're the World Heavyweight Champion, it says you're the best wrestler in the world. The idea that you can have two guys walking around the company with claim to being the best wrestler in the company is just dumb. That the two guys claiming to be the best didn't think to cross paths for 10 years is even dumber.

Now that my tangent on the WHC is out of the way - let me say this: If the WWE actually used the friggin' IC Title and US Title, then you wouldn't notice the lack of a WHC. The WWE needs to stop using those belts as a prop to differentiate one new guy from the next. They need to start putting those belts on guys that are ready to ascend to the main event. Let a guy like Cesaro hold the title. Let him defend it against Sheamus. Give the US Title to Roman Reigns. Let him defend it against Bray Wyatt. Those are the guys that should be fighting for the mid-card titles - guys who are close to, but aren't quite ready for, the main event.

...instead of doing that, though, we get Dean Ambrose never defending the US belt. We get Big E. not even being booked for pay-per views despite holding the IC belt. It's no wonder you guys want the WHC back so soon. It would give guys like Wyatt, Reigns, Cesaro and Sheamus something to shoot for...

---

Note: I get that Sheamus is above the mid-card scene, but I included him because he's never really been accepted into the main event scene by the fans. I'd see nothing with sending him back and forth between the top of the mid-card and the bottom of the main event.

 

[three count bout]

The WWE has done a piss poor job with the unification thus far. It's that simple. The unification made sense in December, it still makes sense now, and I'll go so far as to say it NEVER made sense to bring in a second main title - not even during the brand split (instead of going to a second title, the WWE should've had a 'traveling' champion like the NWA used to do. That would've been cool, especially back when pay-per views were brand specific.)

Think about this: If you're the WWE Champion, it says you're the best wrestler in the company. If you're the World Heavyweight Champion, it says you're the best wrestler in the world. The idea that you can have two guys walking around the company with claim to being the best wrestler in the company is just dumb. That the two guys claiming to be the best didn't think to cross paths for 10 years is even dumber.

Now that my tangent on the WHC is out of the way - let me say this: If the WWE actually used the friggin' IC Title and US Title, then you wouldn't notice the lack of a WHC. The WWE needs to stop using those belts as a prop to differentiate one new guy from the next. They need to start putting those belts on guys that are ready to ascend to the main event. Let a guy like Cesaro hold the title. Let him defend it against Sheamus. Give the US Title to Roman Reigns. Let him defend it against Bray Wyatt. Those are the guys that should be fighting for the mid-card titles - guys who are close to, but aren't quite ready for, the main event.

...instead of doing that, though, we get Dean Ambrose never defending the US belt. We get Big E. not even being booked for pay-per views despite holding the IC belt. It's no wonder you guys want the WHC back so soon. It would give guys like Wyatt, Reigns, Cesaro and Sheamus something to shoot for...

---

Note: I get that Sheamus is above the mid-card scene, but I included him because he's never really been accepted into the main event scene by the fans. I'd see nothing with sending him back and forth between the top of the mid-card and the bottom of the main event.

I guy like Sheamus would actually bring a lot of credibility to one of the mid-card belts especially while there's only one world title. It's silly that they merged the world titles and the Mid-Card belts are actually being showcased and defended less when they should be thriving right now.

It sucks that Big E is just being used as a catalyst for the Real Americans animosity when he should be grounded in a real feud with a top heel. It seemed like they were going to be adding the fact that Ambrose never defends his title into the storyline but that lasted all of a week.

I don't know maybe the paths will open after Mania season is over but right now I'm not a fan of how the US and IC titles are being used.

 

[CrucifiedRaven]

I agree with everyone else that this is easily solvable by just putting the IC on guys like Del Rio, Sheamus, Ziggler, Christian, etc. It will also raise the credibility of the title to what it used to be in the 80's / early 90's.

Keep the US title as the lesser mid-card belt used as a stepping stone for younger guys you want to slowly elevate like Ambrose, Rollins, Reigns, Bray Wyatt, Barrett, Cesaro, Swagger, etc. Then you push these guys up the card and have them feud with the upper midcarders/part-time main eventers for the IC.

World: Orton, Bryan, Batista, Cena, Punk, Lesnar
IC: Sheamus, Del Rio, Christian, Ziggler, The Big Show, Mark Henry, Ryback
US: Ambrose, Rollins, Reigns, Wyatt, Barrett, Big E, Cesaro, Swagger, Sandow, Rhodes

Guys can move up and down tiers. But were you ever realistically going to put the WHC on Sandow? No? Than don't put the IC on him, put it on a legit main eventer in the making.

 

[TempestH]

I was one of the ones that was opposing this from the get go. In my opinon there's a lot of talent that could be competing for the World Heavyweight Championship and looking like stars out there putting on main event teir matches but because of the unification are suffering. I think they had Sandow and Cody Rhodes made, Ziggler, Sheamus, Christian, etc are suffering from not having a second World Title Belt IMO. I think they had a way to make the WHC mean something again when they ahd Cena holding it. Just have him talk it up and defend it close to the last match again and he should have eventually have dropped it to Sandow at around RR. IMO Cody Rhodes has all the talent and potential and everything to be the #2 guy and without a WHC I don't think he'll rise above mid card for at least another 3 years. There's a lot of talent that was already at that level to carry a world title or ones that could have been built up easily to have world titles now those talents are toiling in irrelevancy. I might have agreed the titles could have been unified a few years ago but with so many guys on the cusp of becoming stars and guys that are already stars (beneath the WWE title stars) doing it now was not the right move IMO

Yeah, but they really didn't give Cena the belt to build up the World Heavywegiht Title. They gave him the belt to slowly phase him out of the spotlight. Cena hasn't been as prominent as he previously was since winning the title.

Also, what would be the point in having that second world title? YEs, a talent like Cody Rhodes or Sandow would be a "world champion" on paper, but most likely they will never main event a show as champion, and 3-4 different feuds will be treated as more important. Look at Daniel Bryan. He held the World Heavyweight Title before, yet we're all acting as if he "never won the big one" because he never got a decent length run with the WWE Title. Also, whenever we talk about certain stars, saying that "They won't be a WWE Champion, but they'd make a great World Heavyweight Champion", it just comes off as a backhanded compliment.

Plus having two world titles killed the midcard. It led to WWE super-pushing and overprotecting this backup reserve of 12-15 people, and there were just way too many "main eventers". There were so many "top guys" and "former world champions" and every one of them has to have a match or appearance on both RAW and SmackDown, leaving very little room for the midcard to shine.

 

[theblasterkid]

I agree with everyone else that this is easily solvable by just putting the IC on guys like Del Rio, Sheamus, Ziggler, Christian, etc. It will also raise the credibility of the title to what it used to be in the 80's / early 90's.

Keep the US title as the lesser mid-card belt used as a stepping stone for younger guys you want to slowly elevate like Ambrose, Rollins, Reigns, Bray Wyatt, Barrett, Cesaro, Swagger, etc. Then you push these guys up the card and have them feud with the upper midcarders/part-time main eventers for the IC.

World: Orton, Bryan, Batista, Cena, Punk, Lesnar
IC: Sheamus, Del Rio, Christian, Ziggler, The Big Show, Mark Henry, Ryback
US: Ambrose, Rollins, Reigns, Wyatt, Barrett, Big E, Cesaro, Swagger, Sandow, Rhodes

Guys can move up and down tiers. But were you ever realistically going to put the WHC on Sandow? No? Than don't put the IC on him, put it on a legit main eventer in the making.

This makes sense but I would put some guys you listed in the IC hunt (Rhodes being an example), and some guys like Ryback (who has never won a title) in the US hunt. Also, guys like The Miz, Kofi, and Mysterio in the IC. One other name is Axel, although he has won the IC before, maybe put him in the US hunt perhaps. In addition, maybe guys in the Tag Team hunt should stay soley to it unless competing in battle royals, MITB, etc.

 

[mlp420]

This again? For god's sake, it's the writing. Plain and simple. WWE could very easily elevate the Intercontinental, US, and Tag Team titles but they just won't do it.

Anybody complaining about WWE having "only one" World Championship needs to do themselves a favor and go to Youtube and watch some Raw/SD from 98-2001. You had guys like Jericho, Benoit, Eddie Guerrero, and Kurt Angle feuding for the Intercontinental title. You had the Hardys, Edge & Christian, The Dudleys, the APA and others in the tag title division. And then you had the 'Super Tag Teams' that would occasionally have tag title runs like Taker/Kane, Rock N Sock Connection, etc. You had the wacky stuff with the Hardcore title. Even the European title had it's moments.

It's amazing that WWE booking in recent years has conditioned people to think only the world title matters therefore we need more world titles.

 

[resignedknight]

It seems like the WHC just wasn't getting anyone over anymore. It's certainly the WWE's fault that was the case, but it simply had more value in getting a single champion more over than not getting anyone over at all. As willing as I usually am to follow these theoretical rabbit holes to the bottom, it really seems like anything else is just overthinking it. I'd also echo some other posters that the Midcard title or titles will be pushed, and pushed hard, after Wrestlemania. There's not really a Midcard right now, so it's hard to push a Midcard title.

 

[JJ15776]

The sooner people realize that title belts are irrelevant props, the better off we'll all be. The US and IC titles don't matter because they're irrelevant props, not because of anything the WWE has or hasn't done with them. Titles don't mean what they used to and they never will. It's part of the evolution of the business.

 

[Softcore Holly]

I was against the unification from the start, it was something I was hoping to be wrong about since so many people said that it would make things better, but as we all know that isn't the case. The WWEHC doesn't feel any more important than the WWE title did, the only noticeable difference is Orton has 2 belts to carry around instead of one. The US/IC certainly didn't benefit from the WHC leaving, they're both as lousy as they were before. Only difference there is back then we didn't notice Ambrose's severe lack of title defenses as much as we do now.

Now I get that the obvious solution is to just make the mid-card titles seem actually important again, and I would LOVE that. But the simple truth is they don't seem to care, I'm sure how far the mid-card titles has fallen doesn't need explaining. As of now the only title that's scheduled to be at WM is the WWEHC, it wouldn't surprise anyone if the IC/US isn't on the card at all. But just from it's name and prestige alone the WHC would've gotten a WM match, but now that's gone we're going to get some filler match they're going to do again on Raw instead.

And that's one of the best things about the WHC, sure they will let that fall too but unlike the other mid-card titles they couldn't flat out ignore it. It was too big and important to totally leave off a PPV, or not be defended for months on end, or not give the champ any mic or promo time. Even people that said it was a glorified mid-card title was totally right, the attention they had choice but to give it was still a lot more attention than the attention the other titles are getting now. And until they were actually ready to push the other titles the WHC should have never left.

 

[theblasterkid]

If you look at the WWE.com page of retired title you will see the WHC on there. I have little doubt that the US Title will be on there soon as well. One guy already stated that it's the writing and I agree. A lot of the greats of the past like Mr. Perfect, Steamboat, and Piper were amazing upper-midcarders that held the IC belt. For guys like Sheamus, ADR (if he doesn't leave), and Christian could possibly bring the IC division more prestige if they chose to unify to IC and US belts, which I think is a great idea because it would lead to some interesting feuds for the belt.

 

[theblasterkid]

Simple, the fueds wouuld be surrounding the belt. Think about it, right now you have Sheamus and Christian going at it right now weekly for what? Would it not be a little more interesting if Sheamus was IC Champion and Christian was trying to take the belt from him. These guys are former world champions but now are involved in this meaningless fued. Most of the time when Ambrose or Big E are defending the titles, it's just something the creative team just throws together. I just basically watched Main Event and saw Henry vs. Ambrose for the US Title for the second time in a row in which Ambrose retained again. The IC and US are no longer possible stepping stones for future main eventers. They are just trophies now.

 

[CrucifiedRaven]

This makes sense but I would put some guys you listed in the IC hunt (Rhodes being an example), and some guys like Ryback (who has never won a title) in the US hunt. Also, guys like The Miz, Kofi, and Mysterio in the IC. One other name is Axel, although he has won the IC before, maybe put him in the US hunt perhaps. In addition, maybe guys in the Tag Team hunt should stay soley to it unless competing in battle royals, MITB, etc.

Yah, you can slot guys anywhere you want as long as they get pushed and booked accordingly. Ideally, you get to a point where it'd be a stretch for a newcomer to go straight into an IC feud. And when it does happen, it's because this newcomer is something special.

But until they actually book the midcard titles in a meaningful way, they'll just be props. For most of 2012 and 2013 it almost seemed like the "kiss of death" to hold one of these titles. It actually meant you weren't given any kind of feud and you were going to lose a lot of non-title matches. Booking champions so poorly has certainly played a role in nobody caring about these titles anymore.

 

[jrush1978]

This again? For god's sake, it's the writing. Plain and simple. WWE could very easily elevate the Intercontinental, US, and Tag Team titles but they just won't do it.

Anybody complaining about WWE having "only one" World Championship needs to do themselves a favor and go to Youtube and watch some Raw/SD from 98-2001. You had guys like Jericho, Benoit, Eddie Guerrero, and Kurt Angle feuding for the Intercontinental title. You had the Hardys, Edge & Christian, The Dudleys, the APA and others in the tag title division. And then you had the 'Super Tag Teams' that would occasionally have tag title runs like Taker/Kane, Rock N Sock Connection, etc. You had the wacky stuff with the Hardcore title. Even the European title had it's moments.

It's amazing that WWE booking in recent years has conditioned people to think only the world title matters therefore we need more world titles.

Very well said, in the same vein its conditioned us that upper card guys are "above" those 2 titles. I personally think they have done a much better job in elevating the tag titles but they do still need to go further. There's no reason the I-C title can't be treated like the WHC was for the past few years. No reason guys like Sheamus, Christian, Del Rio, Mark Henry, Big Show, Ryback, Miz, Ziggler (along with guys like Swagger & Cesaro who have recently) etc be in matches for this title as well as the US title. They should also have #1 contender matches or 1 night 4 man mini #1 contender tournaments. Use these as storylines to make the title mean more. Anything they could do with a newly re-created 2nd "world" championship could be done with the I-C & US titles.