Has the WWE killed "Pro Wrestling"?

[It's...Baylariat!]

Now read this carefully...

In the past few years, I've personally seen a decline in the overall quality of professional wrestling. It's clear to me that the WWE doesn't set a high priority on actual wrestling and sets higher priorities on using Raw and Smackdown to further agendas like promoting movies, social media apps, and goodwill towards men.

That's all well and good and I understand that the WWE's a public company that has to generate revenue to make investors happy. But at the same time, the tradition of pro wrestling's dying - if it's not already dead.

So what's your opinion on this subject? Has the WWE killed "pro wrestling" as we used to know and love? Has is IMPROVED pro wrestling?

 

[Redemption-2012]

You say that "the overall quality of wrestling is declining"I don't agree one bit. The WWE still hire guys like Daniel Bryan and look how entertaining he is. They still are all about wrestling in some ways but in other ways, times just change. The times have changed and the WWE are no longer just about wrestling and are now a publicly traded Co.

Deal with it or get out! Simple as 1 2 3

 

[dotty_84]

Out of curiosity did this Thread get created from reading questions to Jimmy Garvin on Reddit?

I don't think they've killed it only monopolised it and i can't blame them for that, bottom line is they're a business.

Wrestling in general has gone in popularity, Teens maturing quicker, UFC and just more to do in general has seen Wrestling hit a decrease, that's all.

 

[DethMetal]

Triple H did an interesting interview about a year or two ago (I don't remember when exactly; it was around the time they had just referred to the company as WWE, rather than "World Wrestling Entertainment") where he was asked about the new direction that WWE had been moving in. He compared the WWE to KFC in the sense that KFC's main thing may be the fried chicken (and WWE's is wrestling), but they serve other foods as well (akin to the WWE doing things like movies). I kind off get where he's coming from; KFC couldn't be known just for the fried chicken, they had to expand and garner a broader audience, much like the WWE had to do things to appeal to things that didn't solely revolve around wrestling.

I would agree that the overall state of pro wrestling has been on a bit of a decline, but I wouldn't say that the WWE has killed pro wrestling. I personally don't think that the actual sport of pro wrestling is as focused on as it should be; rather than pro wrestling being the "main dish" that WWE has to offer, so to say, what should be the "side dishes" that the company offers take just as much precedence, if not a little more than the main course. While the goal at the end of the day is to acquire monies, WWE may be focusing too much on the little things.

I wouldn't say that the WWE has killed pro wrestling, but has probably put it on a decline.

 

[bittermang]

They didn't monopolize it. They globalized it. Look at the business they do when they go overseas. People are nuts for the WWE product all over the globe, now more than ever before.

If they monopolized it, then where are we getting all these indie wrestler signings from? Business is cyclical, many have said about many types of business, and I see the territories coming back. A lot of people are doing stuff in the North East, out West. Further, WWE is showing a support for wrestling by starting to tap these territories for their talent pool, the performers they've been hiring over the past few years are wrestlers first, not sports entertainers.

But as far as I'm concerned, you're being an anti WWE cynic, Lariat. Wrestling dead? Have you not been watching The Shield put on solid 10 and 20 minute bouts on RAW week in and week out? And Smackdown, and house shows, and PPVs, and anywhere else they get called upon? And it's not just The Shield you need to believe in, the entire program as a whole has shifted back toward a very heavy wrestling focus in the past few years (when they're not airing commercials for WWE Films -_-). While they still struggle with plot consistency, the fact is matches like Punk vs Mark Henry last year, Jack Swagger vs Alberto Del Rio a few weeks ago on Smackdown, and a multitude of other matches throughout the calendar years featuring guys like Kofi, Caesaro, and Team Hell No have been solid wrestling matches. Well paced, telling excellent stories within the context of the matches themselves, and true examples of the art and the sport of professional wrestling.

You say it's dead? I say we're witnessing the dawn of a new Golden Age, but the "IWC" is too full of rage to take a deep breath and appreciate it.

 

[Da Solo]

If WWE wasn't here, it'd be hard to imagine if pro wrestling would even still exist on such a plane of existence as it does today: ECW crumpled, WCW was bound to implode internally, ROH is a glorified indie promotion and TNA can barely draw any outside attention at all, so if it wasn't for Vince's little exploits, no matter how annoying they are, we might be forced to get our fill from regional shows in high school gyms rather than on live TV.

And as for quality, in-ring competition in WWE is ridiculously high. In the past year, they've put on so many PPV quality matches on free TV: Cena vs. Punk, Kofi vs. Cesaro, Jericho vs. Dolph, Kofi vs. Dolph, Del-Rio vs. Big Show, Hell No vs. Shield, Bryan vs. Ambrose, and the list goes on for days. It's just the booking that's shot right now, which sucks but is a result of no competition on the horizon (unless you count UFC)

 

[George Steele's Barber]

Oh stop it, they've killed nothing. I don't know what 'Pro Wrestling' means to you but to me it's a circus/carnival-like act of entertainment. They've always been about making money in one shape or form. For crying out loud the wrestlers have been wearing shirts with their own faces on them (that can be purchased) for years. The difference now is that there is more stuff to spend your money on and too many hours of TV each week to fill.

Some of the characters and storylines and not as good as the past but the match quality is as good as I ever remember or go back and watch on Youtube. As long as they have two or more men fighting things out in or around a ring 'Pro Wrestling' has not been "killed".

What "traditions" are you talking about? I'm sure they all still have sex with teenagers on the road.

Are you trolling?

 

[asiatic7]

No, I wouldn't say that. The game is still alive and well. It flourishes in Japan, where tradition is still respected and also in Mexico and the U.S. indy scene.

I understand what you're saying about WWE. Vince did to WWE what Diddy did to Hip Hop in the late 90's. He took the raw grittiness of it, dressed it up real nice, put a spotlight on it, pissed off the purists and dumbed it down for mainstream. Sure, doing this made both men super rich, but to real wrestling fans, there will always be a sub-culture or counter culture (ROH, New Japan etc.) There are still companies who respect tradition and it shows in the locker rooms and it reflects in the ring and how matches are still booked.

At the end of the day, Vince is a business man first, then a wrestling promoter then everything else he tries to be. I think at heart, Vince is a wrestling fan. He cares about tradition, hence the Hall Of Fame and tries to preserve the history of the sport and business of it.

We get annoyed lots of times at how WWE tries to insult our intelligent and force feed us lame stories and weak bookings of matches, blah,blah blah, you get it. But What Vince has done in hindsight is great because he is trying to get new eyes on the product (and he does), there will always be wrestling schools and indy promotions where guys can hone their skills and wrestling purists will always get their fix of realpro wrestling. Don't you notice that whenever WrestleMania season rolls around, certain indy promotions do better business, especially promotions that run shows in the same city as 'mania.

I get what you're saying OP, and I can respect that, but I think wrestling is more alive and well than it's ever been.

 

[It's...Baylariat!]

Oh stop it, they've killed nothing. I don't know what 'Pro Wrestling' means to you but to me it's a circus/carnival-like act of entertainment. They've always been about making money in one shape or form. For crying out loud the wrestlers have been wearing shirts with their own faces on them (that can be purchased) for years. The difference now is that there is more stuff to spend your money on and too many hours of TV each week to fill.

Some of the characters and storylines and not as good as the past but the match quality is as good as I ever remember or go back and watch on Youtube. As long as they have two or more men fighting things out in or around a ring 'Pro Wrestling' has not been "killed".

What "traditions" are you talking about? I'm sure they all still have sex with teenagers on the road.

Are you trolling?

Not trolling, but to me it seems the focal point isn't on building an actual storyline or making the wrestling product compelling. It seems more focused on furthering an agenda like merchandise, app promotions, or other non-wrestling related things.

I also say this because too many people have a say so in what goes on TV. I didn't know this but there wasn't as many writers as there are today. It's as if each wrestler has a writer catered toward them as opposed to being able to simply give two wrestlers and agenda or reason to wrestle each other and let them go. I'm sure the money's still good, but the quality of product's deteriorated and there's a decreased interest in actual skills and an increased interest in marketing.

You say that "the overall quality of wrestling is declining"I don't agree one bit. The WWE still hire guys like Daniel Bryan and look how entertaining he is. They still are all about wrestling in some ways but in other ways, times just change. The times have changed and the WWE are no longer just about wrestling and are now a publicly traded Co.

Deal with it or get out! Simple as 1 2 3

Yea, it's replies like this that bring out these episodes of irrational ranting and blowing up at people.

No, I wouldn't say that. The game is still alive and well. It flourishes in Japan, where tradition is still respected and also in Mexico and the U.S. indy scene.

I understand what you're saying about WWE. Vince did to WWE what Diddy did to Hip Hop in the late 90's. He took the raw grittiness of it, dressed it up real nice, put a spotlight on it, pissed off the purists and dumbed it down for mainstream. Sure, doing this made both men super rich, but to real wrestling fans, there will always be a sub-culture or counter culture (ROH, New Japan etc.) There are still companies who respect tradition and it shows in the locker rooms and it reflects in the ring and how matches are still booked.

At the end of the day, Vince is a business man first, then a wrestling promoter then everything else he tries to be. I think at heart, Vince is a wrestling fan. He cares about tradition, hence the Hall Of Fame and tries to preserve the history of the sport and business of it.

We get annoyed lots of times at how WWE tries to insult our intelligent and force feed us lame stories and weak bookings of matches, blah,blah blah, you get it. But What Vince has done in hindsight is great because he is trying to get new eyes on the product (and he does), there will always be wrestling schools and indy promotions where guys can hone their skills and wrestling purists will always get their fix of realpro wrestling. Don't you notice that whenever WrestleMania season rolls around, certain indy promotions do better business, especially promotions that run shows in the same city as 'mania.

I get what you're saying OP, and I can respect that, but I think wrestling is more alive and well than it's ever been.

So are you saying that wrestling can survive long term based on cult alternatives as opposed to simply buying into what the WWE's selling?

 

[One to Remember]

Why are you guys attacking the OP as some crazed purist who is bitter? In fact he plays the role of professional wrestling's Sitting Bull..

WWE has not only hurt wrestling but has hijacked it. You say all of these indy feds would be in high school gyms and no one wants it but was the sportatorium Austin always talked about a gym? Was World Class not a strong territory? Did SMW not feel a void in East Tennessee? Would the AWA had been in high school gyms at this point in its history if it had survived? What do rinky dink fly by night promotions have to do with actual territorial strong holds like Mid Atlantic, WWC, Mid-South or others in the past that had regional footholds exclusively but still appeared professional or had quality? Unless your old enough to remember what wrestling was in ur area pre Hulkamania who are you to speculate or proclaim what a post WWE reality would be?

Who wants an organization that seems ashamed to promote its main thing anyway? You see Hocky trying to look more like Golf? You see rugby trying to be football? WWE not only occupies the top of the pecking order in this sport but also shits on those underneath it in on said ladder..

KFC doesnt stand for anything anymore but atleast I know I'm not gonna walk into one seeing capachinos too the left or burgers to the right, get real people..

 

[thebowtiekiller]

they definatly havnt killed it but they dont seem to be trying massively hard to improve it either they have no real competion so theres no need to take risks they also seem to be trying to hard to be cool in recent years with endless social media references,did you know clips,tacky celebs ect.i get why they shy away from being known strictly as a wrestling company tho pro wrestling will never die out completly but i think wwe figure at some point in the future it wont be as globally popular as it is today.

 

[EastCoastFan]

WWE hasn't killed wrestling, but they have watered it down in order to appeal to a greater audience.

 

[TheHitMark-SirJoseOle]

To an extent, I agree with points made by both the OP and One To Remember, I understand WWE wants to diversify themselves and be more than just a "wrestling company". But in my opinion, I don't feel they've gone about it the best way. For instance, there are SEVERAL corporations who multi-brand. In fact that is the way these companies truly grow and expand. It's because they know they have to appeal to certain demographics, and one challenge in doing that is if you only have one brand that you try to encompass all of your other ventures. For instance, the Walt Disney company over the years has bought and owned several other companies. ABC, Marvel Comics, Miramax Pictures, Dimension Films, ESPN, etc. Could you imagine Pulp Fiction in the 1990s having the Walt Disney logo on its movie poster? It would be a bad move, I am no business expert but I'm pretty sure that seeing the Walt Disney logo on a movie like Pulp Fiction would have hurt business for it. As I'm sure that when people are going to see movies if they see the WWE logo on the poster, it tends to scare non-wrestling fans away because they automatically assume the movie will not be good. And in my opinion, that usually tends to be the case. For instance, I could not stand The Marine. Just didn't care for it, and while these films I'm assuming have some success, it's obviously not enough success to be on par with major Hollywood companies. If that were the case, then you wouldn't see this movies be in the theater for a weekend, and then in a Wal-Mart 5 dollar bin the next month.

A lot of that comes from the fact that WWE is too wrapped up in having most of their film projects revolve around having their wrestlers star in the projects. Again, I know they have made a couple films where that's not the case. But just the same, I feel if they were really serious about such an endeavor, they'd have created a different name for their film studios, and tried to distance themselves from their WWE name as much as possible. Again, I stand by what I said, other media conglomerates do the same thing because it's in their best interests to do so.

Triple H using the KFC analogy is a weak stance to take in my view. No one will ever take WWE seriously outside of their wrestling enterprise, if they continue to try to fit that scratch logo on anything outside of their wrestling product. Another thing that irks me as well is the insistence of correcting people in the media when someone refers to their roster members as wrestlers or calling the artform itself professional wrestling. That's what it is, those words should not be treating like profanities. But sadly enough the WWE of today is very adamant about that. It's a big reason why I am alienated from the organization and am not the fan I once was.

Call me a dinosaur for all I care, but there are just some things that should stay time honored. Because WWE wants to have its cake and eat it too with their supposed quest for "legitimacy" in the entertainment world. In the end WWE will find itself in a very ridiculous position should they continue their attempts. After all, we saw how splendidly the XFL and WBF went all those years back, their other ventures don't look any better in my opinion.

 

[The Dragon Saga]

Nah, not really, they can't really kill anything.

I know many on this forum "don't care" or see value in indy wrestling cause you know "lulz, small arenas, spot fests, ring psychology" and all that other generic crap that has been the response since 2006 and probably before, but when you got guys in Ring of Honor (it's not an indy, just go with it), Pro Wrestling Guerrilla, Evolve, Dragon Gate USA, Chikara, Absolute Intense Wrestling, Squared Circle Wrestling and this place, that place and the other place killing themselves every weekend to get that call from the WWE one day like CM Punk, Daniel Bryan, Seth Rollins, Dean Ambrose, Kassius Ohno, Antonio Cesaro, Evan Bourne, El Generico and Luke Harper have gotten, wrestling will never die.

As far as the matches this year I think Raw and Smackdown have been delivering more quality than they have in years goneby. Every week or at least most we seem to have at least one match that has people saying, "well that was awesome," yes it does get annoying that they promote "12 Rounds: Reloaded, another crappy action film starring Randy Orton" and Twitter and Tout and that God awful WWE App every fifteen minutes but they are a business trading on the stock market and that is the stuff that sells.

The angles aren't as good anymore - CHIKARA, this little promotion in Philidelphia with fuck all finances, wrestlers with odd names and weird ass gimmicks under a PG rating like WWE have just began a HUGE angle where they are actually shutting the company down for a bit just to get the angle over, WWE doesn't have that sort of creativity, but at least as of this morning they're advertising a new head writer position in the company so instead of some dumbass who worked on Days Of Our Lives for two years they'll bring in someone with a little bit of knowledge in wrestling.

I do agree that the quality has gone down and to be honest if it wasn't for places like Ring of Honor, Pro Wrestling Guerrilla, New Japan Pro Wrestling and TNA when they do things right (Slammiversary was great) I'd have probably stopped wrestling. I know that before I found ROH in 2004 I was extremely sick of WWE and Evolution cutting promos every ten minutes. More specificially Triple H about "this business!"

 

[oneofakind318]

WWE didn't kill pro wrestling, they just separated themselves from it before it ran its course. We all long for the days of old (or at least the days when we first fell in love with wrestling) but they're long gone. And it's not because of WWE. Life goes on. Times change and WWE has been the company/promotion most willing to change when times called for it. It's called survival and smart business. Can't fault them for it at all, but you don't have to like it either. If you've outgrown it, then find something new. Otherwise, just accept it.

 

[Blade]

My problem with the idea of classifying one era of 'Pro Wrestling' as better or worse is that the idea of Pro Wrestling is completely subjective.

Some say the best time for wrestling was in the Attitude Era, when the matches weren't that great but the angles and storytelling was enthralling and edgy. Some say the best time for wrestling was the New Generation of the early and mid 90's, when gimmicks were a little blander and angler were a little more tame, but the likes of Bret and Owen Hart, Michaels, Razor Ramon put on consistently great matches. Some like the Ruthless Aggression (2002 - 2010, I'd say) era the best because WWE experimented with their champions, with Booker T, Edge, JBL, Guerrero and Benoit picking up world titles. All of them were great pro wrestlers, sure, but none of them were ever top draws. But because of that, it felt fresh and exciting, like most of the roster could get their hands on the title with the right angle or feud.

And yes, I'd bet that there's some people who are big fans of the current generation, myself included. Punk, Cena, Orton, Sheamus and Alberto Del Rio aren't the greatest batch of main eventers we've ever had, but they're far from the worst. They have consistently decent matches. And we have the most solid midcard talent ever seen in WWE. Ziggler, Barrett, Kofi, the Shield, Swagger, Kane, Daniel Bryan. I would probably take that midcard over any other in WWE history.

I'm much more excited about wrestling now than I was 5-10 years ago, when Cena and Triple H just seemed to dominate everything. Sure, those guys are still around. But when you look at very talented wrestlers like Punk, the Shield and Ziggler getting plenty of TV, it makes me want to tune in. I feel the WWE is much more accessible now than it's ever been. Punk, Ziggler and the Shield for the hardcore wrestling fans. Cena, Orton and Sheamus for the casuals. I think the variety works well.

My point is that pro wrestling is, like all entertainment, subjective. There are some that feel like WWE has killed pro wrestling by turning its back on and forgetting its roots and most of its traditions. But there's some that feel that WWE made pro wrestling evolve. You say you've seen a decline in the last few years, and that wrestling has died in the last decade? Okay, that's your opinion. Some believe it died with the attitude era. Everyone's entitled to their opinion, but who are we, whether wrestling tradionalist or modernist, to decide whether or not wrestling is getting better or worse?

We are in a time where social networking is the way we communicate. I use social networking, but I do think it's not as good as, say, a phone call. But it doesn't ruin wrestling for me. I deal with it, because that's the age we live in. No point fighting what's around us, why not just go with it, or at least just tolerate it.

Believing a current version of something is a worse or basterdised version of what you grew up with is natural. Your parent thought their music was the best and that the music you listen to is crap, whatever. Without wanting to get too personal, do you just not connect with today's product because it has changed and you haven't?

Honestly, there is a shit ton more I could write on the subject, because the question you posed is a big ass question on a very complex subject, Lariat. It's not a question of just wrestling, it's a question of opinions, psychology, ideology and even age. To come out with a statement like "WWE has killed pro-wrestling" is simplifying the subject far too much. Hell, there are some who believe that wrestling will die the day that WWE goes under. Like I said, big ass question, complex subject.

 

[#heel420]

You say they don't care about wrestling and that's partially true, but they've had and made guys that can actually wrestle as champions. And that's only gonna increase with all of their indy acquisitions.

They're never gonna completely kill the wrestling because at their base that's what they are. As soon as Vince retires/dies and HHH takes over it's gonna be more of a wrestling product than it ever was under Vince.

 

[Headman]

Now read this carefully...

In the past few years, I've personally seen a decline in the overall quality of professional wrestling. It's clear to me that the WWE doesn't set a high priority on actual wrestling and sets higher priorities on using Raw and Smackdown to further agendas like promoting movies, social media apps, and goodwill towards men.

That's all well and good and I understand that the WWE's a public company that has to generate revenue to make investors happy. But at the same time, the tradition of pro wrestling's dying - if it's not already dead.

So what's your opinion on this subject? Has the WWE killed "pro wrestling" as we used to know and love? Has is IMPROVED pro wrestling?

What are you talking about? The quality of matches on RAW has greatly improved over the last year. Tonight alone we had three lengthy competitive matches that I would consider ppv quality. Yes, they promote movies and social media but it's a 3 hour show. They've got plenty of time to do all of this. If there's an argument to be made it's that the WWE has dropped the ball creatively. The in-ring product however is better than it's been in a long, long time. And the thought that WWE is killing wrestling is a bit over dramatic. That statement alone makes it hard to take this thread seriously.

 

[LascoX]

I kind of have to agree that WWE has made some strides to bringing back wrestling to its roots match wise over the past year. I think HHH has had a good effect in that respect. I do understand what Lariat is saying though from an old school purest perspective. It's also one of the reasons I do appreciate TNA and what they are trying to do over there. WWE has done what they needed to as they branched out to other markets. You can't blame them , but at times its annoying. Sort of like how the rappers and rock artists throw in their name in every song, its just an annoying distraction just designed for self promotion that while effective in one way ,draws negative reactions as well. Wrestling evolves and has its ups and downs in popularity. WWE certainly hasn't killed it and has kept it's popularity going on a global scale. Let's just hope they keep going in the direction they have with the talent and matches where we have seen improvement on in the recent past.

 

[It's...Baylariat!]

What are you talking about? The quality of matches on RAW has greatly improved over the last year. Tonight alone we had three lengthy competitive matches that I would consider ppv quality. Yes, they promote movies and social media but it's a 3 hour show. They've got plenty of time to do all of this. If there's an argument to be made it's that the WWE has dropped the ball creatively. The in-ring product however is better than it's been in a long, long time. And the thought that WWE is killing wrestling is a bit over dramatic. That statement alone makes it hard to take this thread seriously.

The ball's been dropped creatively for many months. The last legit angle I was into was when the original Nexus came about and destroyed the set and left Cena laying in the middle of the ring. It was amazing. Since then, nothing's came real close to it. And yes the overall talent pool is as good as it's been in years, but that doesn't mean it's as good as it has been overall. Daniel Bryan said himself that the WWE isn't 'wrestling'. Think about that. A major player in the WWE doesn't even consider what he's doing wrestling.

And don't get it twisted - I'm not a WWE hater. I enjoy wrestling and have enjoyed it for a long time, but I don't see the WWE taking the angles, storylines, and characters seriously anymore. Maybe once the Wyatt Family debuts and ends up shocking most of us, then I'll rethink my stance. But as far as the wrestling most of the world loves, the WWE's been decreasing it's focus little by little over the past few years.

 

[The Phantom Rebel]

You compare the quality of matches on wwe to the quality of matches on roh ,njpw,dragon gate or pwg and the matches from the other promotions blows wwe out of the water. the only time wwe really seems to care about the quality of there matches is a wrestlemania or summer slam. perfect example is Daniel Bryan fantastic wrestler . but watch him in roh and compare it to what he does in wwe he was better in roh . i have to seen him use cattle mutilation once in wwe . its as though wwe puts a wall of concrete around the suppers stars and it is only take off at wrestlemaina .in a lot of was i agree the product has fallen and they only seem to care about pushing products and brands . i don't need to be told 10 billion times in a 3 hour span to download the wwe app. i don't fucking give a flying fuck about what is trending on twitter , i watch wrestling to see wrestling and to watch promos . not to have some bullshit annoying brands shoved down my throat

 

[Jack-Hammer]

I know WWE is sort of viewed as the big bad monster that ate professional wrestling in the eyes of some people. At the same time though, WWE is the obvious & easy target because it's the only big dog left in the game in the minds of most American fans. As a result, it tends to get blamed for all the various woes affecting pro wrestling as a whole. If WCW had won the Monday Night Wars and WWE had gone the way of the dinosaur, if even ECW had somehow risen to great prominence and toppled both titans to become #1, I think we'd almost certainly have the same complaints, griping, criticism and general hate directed towards WCW or ECW.

Like a few others pointed out, there are alternatives to WWE out there on the indy scene. But, to be totally honest, the vast majority of fans in the states don't really give a shit about them. WWE is a company that's had international television exposure and renown for decades. That's the company that springs to mind when the VAST majority of Americans, whether they're fans or not, think of pro wrestling. WWE is viewed as the big time while the others aren't. I see no reason to vilify WWE because other pro wrestling companies are unable to get themselves to that next level. If you read various statements, such as statements put out by ROH or PWG brass congratulating some of their former wrestlers for signing with WWE, they themselves give the impression that WWE is simply on that next level. A year or so back, I read an interview given by Cary Silkin, former owner & current president of ROH, basically called ROH a training ground for wrestlers to get to that next level.

There are various definitions these days in the minds of some as to what "pro wrestling" is. If you're a genuine traditionalist, then there's pretty much nothing left of "pro wrestling" in the modern market. While some fans refer to themselves as "real wrestling fans" because they prefer certain promotions over others, they're forgetting or conveniently ignoring history. When you look at "real wrestling" in my eyes, that was back in the days when you had guys like Frank Gotch and Georg Hackemshmidt wrestling each other for 3 hours. Over the coming decades, professional wrestling was transformed from a legit sport into, for all intents & purposes, mock combat with the outcomes predetermined. From the 40s through much of the 70s, "real wrestling" consisted of greats like Lou Thesz, Vern Gagne, Danny Hodge, Nick Bockwinkel and various others spending 20-60 minutes trading arm bars, side headlocks and spinning toe holds. Pro wrestling began to change in the 70s especially with the emergence of personality driven pro wrestlers who got over with fans because of charisma rather than technical wrestling ability. Among such wrestlers were guys like Dusty Rhodes and Superstar Billy Graham. There were still great technicians going around, such as Bob Backlund, but Rhodes & Graham were a sign of things to come. When Hulk Hogan had his prominent role in Rocky III, it catapulted him to another level. Not only was this guy an intimidating physical specimen, he was loaded with charisma and personality that his contemporaries simply didn't have. When he was in the AWA in in 1982 & 1983, he was the one the fans wanted to see and the one they felt should be the champ. Many AWA fans simply felt that watching Hogan do his thing was much more entertaining than watching Nick Bockwinkel wrestle Otto Wanz.

Now as we were all kids growing up during the 80s and on up through the 90s into the Attitude Era, we saw just pro wrestling change even further. Guys like Randy Savage, Hulk Hogan, the Honky Tonk Man, Ultimate Warrior, Ravishing Rick Rude, etc. were all the guys we thought were great. Even to this day, many of us look back at those guys and praise how great we thought they were in the late 80s. In the late 60s, with those characters, they'd have been laughing stocks in the minds of many fans and promoters. They certainly wouldn't be viewed as "pro wrestlers" in the eyes if many. During the Attitude Era, we saw wrestling change again and many things taking place that didn't seem to be "real wrestling", yet we praise most of what we saw while many blast WWE today if they do an angle that generates controversy and discomfort.

I get that some people aren't into WWE anymore. People's tastes can change over the years whether it be the kind of food they eat to the music they listen to or the programs they watch on television. I've never looked at pro wrestling through rose colored glasses because the same perceived problems that plague WWE have plagued pro wrestling as a whole. There's never been a "perfect" era for pro wrestling. There have always been angles, storylines, feuds and matches that simply just don't click with some people. That's how it was 30 years ago and that's how it'll be 30 years from now. As I said, WWE just happens to be the most convenient target, thusly being a convenient scapegoat, to blame for shortcomings that every wrestling company had, has or ever will have one way or another.

As far as the WWE App goes, it does get annoying at times. This is coming from someone who doesn't even own a cell phone. Yep, that's right. I'm a dying breed and proud of it. I couldn't care less about the WWE App or Twitter or any other aspect of social media. However, I'm in the VAST, VAST minority on that. I wouldn't be at all surprised of some of the most vehement anti WWE App fans actually have downloaded the App for no other reason than to simply have it. The WWE does push social media heavily because, let's face it, social media is a big part of the future. As I've mentioned in earlier posts, Nielsen is going to be incorporating into its ratings people who are watching TV programs on their computers, phones and tablets starting this fall. As a result, who knows, WWE's viewership could flat out skyrocket when those numbers are calculated along with traditional television viewership. It's a social media world, that's all there is to it, and WWE didn't get to be the last man standing, so to speak, by stubbornly ignoring the effects of a radically changing world. Gagne, Geigel, Hart, Von Erich and many other promoters did and now all their companies are nothing more than legally owned properties of WWE.

 

[The Phantom Rebel]

You make good points and i think another reason why wwe's product and quality of matches have fallen is because they have no competition . when wcw was around and they were beating them every week wwe was pushing the envelope every monday night to try and get the edge on wcw . can remember many people my self included constantly flipping back between nitro and raw

 

[Jatkuva]

I don't think WWE killed "pro wrestling" I think websites like these have damaged the product for us. We've take all the unpredictability out of it, we can read who is getting a push and expect them to win their next 6 or 7 matches. I work a third shift, so I get on here every monday night and read the results and what im reading now makes me want to watch it way more then i did a few years back. They could write anybody beating anybody on any given night and shock us, but they don't.

Cena winning every match doesn't help, but when someone comes along and shocks us like CM Punk did, it drags you in better it adds excitement and thats something thats missing now in the product.

Another thing is, They don't have those moments anymore where someone has worked their for 10+ years and then given the belt, like when Foley,Eddie, Chris, Edge, and Jeff won their first championships. I mean Shemus and swagger were both given their championships earlier when we didn't really connect with them, we hadn't seem them go through wars over the belt to come up short.

 

[King Patrick Star]

I don’t think the WWE has killed “Professional Wrestling”. I think the WWE has improved “Pro Wrestling” into “Sports Entertainment”. Using Raw and Smackdown to further agendas like promoting movies, social media apps, and goodwill towards men is all well and good and because the WWE's a public company, it has to generate revenue to make investors happy. Even TNA, “where Wrestling matters”, is “crossing the line” into Sports Entertainment. I mean, if you think about it, they are currently running the “McMahon-Helmsley” angle and the “New World Order vs. Sting” angle at the same time.

If you want “Pro Wrestling”, watch ROH or any other Independent company. If you want Sports Entertainment, turn your TV on. That says it all.