Has The Undertaker set the standard for the Deadman/Darkness gimmick too high?

[Chicago1989]

As we all obviously know, Undertaker has been around in the WWE for 20 years. He first started and got over back then as "The Undertaker", a zombified, indestructible mortician. As time went by, his gimmick was evolving, also making it adjust with the future. He had basically all the tools it took to play this character well: The entrance, the psychology, the special effects, the music, and the look. To me, Undertaker really did a good job of making this character one of the best ever.

I don't remember ever seeing someone become so successful with this kind of gimmick. Of course, there were imitators (Seven, Mordecai, Sting, Raven) that tried to bank off on the success of The Undertaker, but everyone knew that there was only one Deadman, one Lord of Darkness, and that was 'Taker.

There's a reason why The Undertaker has been able to be a draw and last this long in this business: His character. In my opinion, I think he really has done it all as far as this kind of character goes. He's buried people alive, put them in caskets, crucified them in symbols, and displayed "supernatural" abilities. What else can you do?..

My question is, do you think that there would ever be someone who would be able to surpass The Undertaker with this kind of gimmick or has The Undertaker set the bar too high for this timeless gimmick?

 

[Hazardous]

No chance in hell.

That's what anyone who ever tries to do what 'Taker does has. No one will be able to top the 2 decades of destruction. I don't care if they are wrestling for 3 or 4 decades. Some people's career's just can't be topped. Flair, Hogan, and 'Taker are 3 that come to mind.

 

[One to Remember]

i dont understand why you brought raven up. I always saw him as grundgy/'90s degenerate/gen x slacker filth.. His character was never dead or zombie like. And Sting was based on the Crow. Sting wasn't he was disillusioned, it was a darker form of the earlier Sting... he went from social to asocial.. compare Vegeta to Majin Vegeta.. or Fat Buu to that grey Buu.I think every zombie character has kinda done is own thing. Kane is not really in Takers shadow anymore and his only issue for the last ten years has been the WWE brass making him job.. The biggest issue facing dead characters will be fanswho intentionally call out copy infringement or yell rip off just as an attempt to blast a performer for w/e reason....

 

[RKO_RKO_RKO]

Yes he has, and for it he deserves a proper farewell. However Taker can't retire as the deadman because well....it just wouldn't be proper. I want Taker to go out clean in a normal match like that of Shawn Michaels and Ric Flair. But that can't happen with his character right now. As the deadman, if Taker is going to retire, it's going to have to be like a buried alive match or last ride match or whatever. But the thing is even after all those matches, even if Taker loses, he has always come back. WWE needs to find a way to transition Taker back to his American Bad Ass character, I find this really the only proper solution to this problem. Hopefully this whole Taker being weak storyline will eventually transition into that but who knows, WWE is full of surprises, even if most of them are expected.

Sigh, and here I was hoping Boogeyman would fill Taker's shoes.

 

[One to Remember]

he ca retire as the deadman just fine. WWE would just need to keep it in context suppose. He could retire with the title and then vanish into A cloud of smoke with the title laid in the middle of the ring. he could even lose at WM. I think 20 WMs is all hes lookin to win at anyways... you act like his character leaves no room for defeat or exit.. even in 1991 we knew the Ultimate Warrior would be defeated, we knew Goldberg would have to lose the WCW title. The Undertaker could just give a speech saying he has nothing left to prove..

 

[CyDeez]

Not with the exact same type of gimmick. But I think "Darker" characters can still have their own sort of identity. Just because they are a darker type of gimmick, doesn't mean it has something to do with Taker.

But, with that being said. If there is a gimmick that has a similar tone as Taker's and begins to draw comparisons to him, it will FAIL. He simply OWNED his type of gimmick and anything that tries to compete or use what he was, will get crushed. It would have too much to live up to. One of, if not THE greatest and most productive careers EVER!

I agree with one of the other posters that said he disputed the Raven reference. He wasn't what you would call a dark character. He was much more in a category based on 90s Grunge, Kurt Cobain, feel sorry for myself, my parents don't pay attention to me, suicide, "What about me?" type of angle.

Undertaker is the Lord Of Darkness taker of souls kind of gimmick. Much different from anything Raven even attempted to do.

 

[Serious Mozzarella]

Absolutely not, and simply because no one is going to have that gimmick again. We're way beyond the age of supernatural and larger-than-life gimmicks. The only reason people like Undertaker have gimmicks like they do is for nostalgia. In this era, the way wrestlers are handled, and the way storylines are carried out, people like Undertaker almost break kayfabe. It's almost as if the wrestlers know that Undertaker is just some big dude who chooses to walk around in a robe, especially when they mention things like his pyro.

So no, I don't think he set the bar high enough. I don't think anyone should be using a supernatural gimmick ever again, until another age comes where gimmicks like his become plausible.

 

[Xemmy]

Jeff Meachem from Talk Wrestling said it best.
"The Undertaker Has The Greatest Gimmick of All Time."

Plain. Simple. To The Point.

If someone ever comes up with a gimmick that is actually better, and has the longevity that Taker has had, I'll let an Ice Giant fuck me.

 

[One to Remember]

I agree with one of the other posters that said he disputed the Raven reference. He wasn't what you would call a dark character. He was much more in a category based on 90s Grunge, Kurt Cobain, feel sorry for myself, my parents don't pay attention to me, suicide, "What about me?" type of angle.

thinkin it over perhaps the OP made that ridiculous comparison because of the crucifixion debacle Raven took part in in ECW. It was very similar to angles in which wrestlers, one of the most notable being Steph would be hoisted on to the Undertaker's logo.

Absolutely not, and simply because no one is going to have that gimmick again. We're way beyond the age of supernatural and larger-than-life gimmicks. The only reason people like Undertaker have gimmicks like they do is for nostalgia.

why would anyone reuse any prominent gimmick? You'll never see another bald white guy again chugging beer but as evidenced by Goldberg and Skip Sheffield we will see a bald white guy doing other things..
The Undertaker character is not Casper. Your confusing something supernatural with something cartoonish. The robocop guy in WCW is more in line with YOUR definition of gimmicky or that thing Dustin Rhodes played in WCW or the Christmas Creature.. Surreal characters like Doink, Taker, or Tasmaniac can work if not exaggerated too much. How can we be over the days of larger then life characters if larger then life athletes or phenoms are regularly made on chance or accidents? Even in 1990 The Undertaker was a plausible real life individual. He was a mortician, we have them, some of them are into that, people worship the devils and plenty of normal people value and love earns.. Taker was never a guyin a bed sheet going boo...

 

[bringitback]

Will we see another supernatural/dark/demon-like character again? Probably. Will anybody do it as well as Mark Calloway? Definitely not.

The beauty of The Undertakers character as compared to kane/mordecai/boogeyman is they always maintained his character and never allowed him to job. From the minute taker got to the top, he remained there, consisitently for the remainder of his career and was also allowed some hands on control. The days of that happening in the realm of "sports entertainment" are long gone I'm afraid.

As for the other mini-discussion that began in this thread about how taker will be retired, I'd like to think that the current feud with Kane could bring back the urn and Paul Bearer for one last run leading up to WM....either leading to the end of the streak, or the urn or both. Would be a nice touch for the legend of the undertaker to go out the way it came in.

 

[Dzone]

No one will surpass Undertaker's deadman image, tbh no one will surpass the fan reaction he gets atm in my opinion...

But anyways sure we'll see another deadman type character and they might even be good but never bigger than The Undertaker... Another thing the only way I see a successful deadman character being born is if Undertaker introduces them in the middle of the ring on his retirement and ends up "training" them on screen *maybe off*. If this doesn't happen then the next "deadman" will have a tough time steping from Undertaker's shadow.

 

[Pay Per Ghost]

Well he has had a magical run and has kept his character fresh and interesting.
Whether it be the zombie who debuted to the Taker who talked about 'unintentionally killing his parents' to the downright blood-drinking evil psychopath to the american badass to big evil and then finally back to the Deadman.

His constant morphosis has kept his gimmick in the spotlight and it also helps that he is an incredibly loyal worker, great story-teller, and fine seller of moves.

But he isn't the maverick for the dark character. There was this guy-

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Maxx Payne, brought the dark badass character to WCW in the late 80's. I remember an interview of his where he confessed printing his own T-shirts through a friend when WCW didn't see anything marketable about his character. Skulls before Hitman and Austin.

Also Papa Shango went by the name of Soul Sucker, another zombie personification, in his indy days in the 80's and had to change his gimmick to a witch-doctor when he came to WWF because The Undertaker already had that part.

But just because someone did it first, doesn't mean they did it best. That's what you can take away from this as Mark Calloway still makes this supernatural sh*t unbelievably believable.

 

[Trill Co$by]

Raven, Sting, and Kane held their own and if WWE hadn't dropped the ball then Kevin Thorn could've been a nice asset to Smackdown right about now or maybe even raw.

The point is, Taker's gimmick isn't what got him over... it's the fact that WWE knows how to market the guy, but even then you've still got guys like Raven, Sting, and Kane who are in the same boat and have been around as long as Taker has so no I don't think he set it too high.

 

[Dean Winchester]

Raven and Sting's gimmicks were different then Taker like others said. Sting was based off the Crow an Raven was your anarchist individual...Taker was supernatural demon...totally different gimmicks....and Taker stole some stuff from Raven and Sting...like the cruxifix angle....Raven did that first...Taker coming down from the top of the arena in cable wire, Sting did that first.

 

[Chicago1989]

Raven and Sting's gimmicks were different then Taker like others said. Sting was based off the Crow an Raven was your anarchist individual...Taker was supernatural demon...totally different gimmicks....and Taker stole some stuff from Raven and Sting...like the cruxifix angle....Raven did that first...Taker coming down from the top of the arena in cable wire, Sting did that first.

I know that Raven and Sting did some things before Undertaker ever did them but the reason why I brought up Sting and Raven on this thread was because yes, they had different gimmicks and all that but their personalities and attitudes are what they had in common with The Undertaker. At least in my opinion...