Can't we all just get along?

[#hamler]

From the time Humans were placed on this planet, we've been in war one way or another. We've battled and killed our fellow brethern for food and resources, land and religion. Now when you look at the wars your country has been in, have you ever stopped and asked yourself-- Why?

What's exaclty the point of War? To satisfy our undying need to be dominant? Is that really a reason to start a war? When you look at the reasons any war has started, they all seem to be over something that has happened to that country that weakens their "foundations" . And once that specific war is won, what exactly is it we've won? To satisfy ourselves with revenge? Killing thousands of people is something to be proud of?

War isn't only human nature, animals and creatures all over our great planet create war. They create war over food and territory. People have evolved this type of simple feuding into something that is inhuman. War turns people into killing machines, and whoever serves in said war, never trully gets over it. For example, take the war in Iraq... when troops come home, they bring back violence, chaos and brutality. Same with WWII and Vietnam war. How many criminals does war create? How long before the next Timothy McVeigh or Nidal Hasan?

War can't really be used to solve a problem. We all know killing a human being is wrong, no matter what you say. Can war be justified...Really if you think about it? It's obvious a lot of people will disagree and say War is natural, but why can't we all just get along. War solves very little problems.

Well, here I am on a Wrestling forum talking about feuds and war, now someone is bound to disagree. Which leads me to the discussion questions;


Does war solve problems?

Can these problems be solved without the use of war?

Is it Justified?

What would your country be like had no war ever taken place?


Here's a pic for the troubles.

Spoiler

Discuss this shit.

 

[Arkham Noir]

I think the problem is that, most of the time, it becomes inevitable..

Let's look at world war II. Germany invaded Poland and began their war on the rest of the world. While not known to the world at the time, the Nazis were segregating thousands upon thousands of jews, homosexuals,the disabled, and many other groups they deemed unworthy of life into ghettos and began their extermination. They were corrupting millions of people's minds an commiting some of the worst crimes in history.The point here is that sometimes you can not turn a blind eye. What if war had never been declared on Germany? The world would be one fucked up place right about now.

War is a way of taking a stand against those who need to be denied and for defending that which needs to be both preserved and guarded. Conflicts have existed for as long as organisms have existed. We need to clash, to argue, and to defend ourselves. It is a means of progressing as humans. I don't mean all this for war but more so for just the general idea of conflict. As terrible as it is, society made huge progression in technology through war.

Does war solve problems? Sometimes. WWII stopped the Nazi regimen, so I guess it solved that problem.

Is it justified ? Sadly yes. As I said earlier, these war don't simply start because people don't like eachother. They start because people need to be stopped sometimes.

I would love to see a world without war, but it just wouldn't happen. Conflict itself needs to happen, but not on that kind of level.


*Side note: "Dicuss this shit" is officially your catch phrase*

 

[RockFan89]

War can't really be used to solve a problem. We all know killing a human being is wrong, no matter what you say. Can war be justified...Really if you think about it? It's obvious a lot of people will disagree and say War is natural, but why can't we all just get along. War solves very little problems.

What world do you live in? War has solved many problems, freed people, delivered justice. Just looking at America, the revolutionary war brought us freedom, the civil war ended slavery, WWI and WWII help keep Europe free, the first gulf war protected Kuwait, etc.

We all know killing a human being is wrong, no matter what you say

No, that is just your belief. You can't make an argument by making up assumptions that you think everyone agrees with (especially when very few will). There are situations where killing someone is not wrong, namely self defense and war is often a form of self defense or defense of another.

So to answer your questions:

Does war solve problems?

It can, see above examples.

Can these problems be solved without the use of war?

Yeah, if both parties in a war don't want war they can find a way to avoid it. But when one side is not willing to talk/compromise, you may not have a choice.

Is it Justified?

Yes, there are causes worth dying (and even killing) for like safety, freedom, justice.

What would your country be like had no war ever taken place?

Hard to say. Depends how far back you go in time. War has played such an influential role in history speculating won't get us anywhere.

 

[#hamler]

Basically dude, I asked your opinion on the matter. Not to judge mine. Dicuss the question.

What world do you live in? War has solved many problems, freed people, delivered justice. Just looking at America, the revolutionary war brought us freedom, the civil war ended slavery, WWI and WWII help keep Europe free, the first gulf war protected Kuwait, etc.

In WWII look at how many innocent lives were taken. It may have freed Europe but look at what Germany and most of Europe was reduced to. Months of Famine and Depression. The civil war also cause a lot of backlash on our country. We still had 200 years of discrimination. First Gulf War--there's more tension there now than ever buddy. War causes a huge backlash in any country after that war is over.

No, that is just your belief. You can't make an argument by making up assumptions that you think everyone agrees with (especially when very few will). There are situations where killing someone is not wrong, namely self defense and war is often a form of self defense or defense of another.

Assumption? So kiling people is fine with you? Check your morals. It's morally wrong to kill another individual. How is that an assumption?

All I'm saying is War is a pointless way of handling situation. I get the whole defense thing, but look at it from the other point of view. Kids waking up to bombs going off and shots being fired outside their window, no one can be that heartless to say that is perfectly ok.

 

[LSN80]

Yes to all of your questions. War has solved more problems in history than any other method of diplomacy, provided the war is completed to a decisive end.

Many countries have changed from expansionist and aggressive to cooperative, but only through force. Adolph Hitler could not have been negotiated with to end WW II in Europe, apologize to the Jews, and make things all better after sitting down with a counselor for a while. The same for Japan. Now they are both nice countries with very good world relations.

The history of war and the many to pick and choose from as examples is vast and varied, but as long as there are humans, there will be battles. Some end up worse than others, some are unjust, but in the end, the peace after a decisive war is generally more stable than the unrest prior to the war.

Its hard for me to imagine a United States without war. We had to go war just to have the right to come and settle here, and have fought valiantly since to protect the rights and freedoms that we have. Some of our worst eras in this country have been when our President has decided that going to war was a bad option and diplomacy was the answer. Jimmy Carter, our 39th President, is an example of this.

Iran took all the personnel of the American Embassy prisoners, Jimmy Carter did nothing but negotiate patiently while the American people cried for war. As a result,many of these innocent people died as a result of failed negotiations. In contrast, his predecessor Ronald Reagan gave diplomacy a small value choosing instead aggressiveness and confrontation. The result was the freeing of many of those people, and Reagan becoming one of the most respected American Presidents of all time. Our foreign policy was cemented and remains firm as it is to this day, as Iran hasn't crossed us since. This is just one example. War, while an evil, is a necessary one.

 

[RockFan89]

Basically dude, I asked your opinion on the matter. Not to judge mine. Dicuss the question.

So you get to put your opinion out there and don't want people to judge it, but then you go on and judge other people's. If you didn't want your opinion critiqued, you shouldn't have put it out there.

In WWII look at how many innocent lives were taken. It may have freed Europe but look at what Germany and most of Europe was reduced to. Months of Famine and Depression.

Well, when you compare it to what Hitler wanted to do, I'm pretty sure most people recognize going to war was the right choice.

The civil war also cause a lot of backlash on our country. We still had 200 years of discrimination.

We ended slavery and kept the country together, I'm pretty sure that was worth it. Besides, discrimination exists all over the world, regardless if there was a war over the issue or not. And if you want the truth, the U.S. has less discrimination then most parts of the world (including liberal Europe).

First Gulf War--there's more tension there now than ever buddy. War causes a huge backlash in any country after that war is over.

That war is not what caused the tension or backlash. Only radical Muslims took issue with that war. Most rational people understood that Saddam Hussein had to be stopped.

So kiling people is fine with you? Check your morals. It's morally wrong to kill another individual. How is that an assumption?

I never said that and you know it. I clearly pointed out that there are situations where the moral thing to do is kill someone, namely when that person is attacking someone else.

All I'm saying is War is a pointless way of handling situation.

No, there are plenty of points, you just won't accept them.

Kids waking up to bombs going off and shots being fired outside their window, no one can be that heartless to say that is perfectly ok.

That statement right there is the crux of your straw man. I have never heard someone make the argument that war is a perfect solution. No one has argued that there are no negative effects of war. Yes innocent people die and live in fear, but when you compare it to the alternative, war is often times the best solution.

If you were a young Jewish kid in Germany during WWII, I'm sure you would rather hear shots be fired outside your window than be forced with your family into gas chambers.

 

[LigerBomb]

We,—humanity at large—are fear based, generally selfish and have a fierce survival instinct. Since we've limited supplies, globally speaking, eventually there is inevitable competition for survival and expansion. War, as a means to secure and maintain an accustomed way of life—and repel those of outside cultures—becomes necessary if not flat out mandatory.
Does war solve problems?
Yup. No other way to take stuff from people who don't want to give it up/protect your stuff when others come to take it.
Can these problems be solved without the use of war?
Probably not. In these days of micro-terrorism and enemies on all fronts capitulation via sanction and intimidation isn't very likely.
Is it Justified?
It depends. Case by case basis. POV.
What would your country be like had no war ever taken place?
A hodgepodge of European and Latin American colonies most likely.

 

[Cena's Little Helper]

I can see the justification for a limited amount of peacekeeping missions, but nothing in my eyes justifies war on the scale of the two World Wars we had in the 20th century (and there's nothing anyone can say to me that would ever justify the US's bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki...I love living in America, but these are, in my eyes, the two biggest war crimes ever committed).

I've never understood why nations need to fight each other. Way more often than not, war is waged for the most pointless of political and economic reasons. I hate the idea of having to engage in combat with (and maybe even kill) someone whom I've never met and who just may have the same values, thoughts, and outlook on life as I do.

On the other hand, I do think it is in our nature to be violent. However, I'd rather be violent with someone for personal rather than impersonal reasons.

 

[Ultra Awesome]

Does war solve problems?

More often then not, war is inavetable. There's no denying it; it will come; and it will affect you. Regardless of whether you like it or not, chances are, you will experience war at one point or another. With that said, as evil as war may sound, it is quite reasonably a solution to alot of problems. I'm remineded of WWII where we faced the problem of Adolph Hitler as well as Mussolinni and Emperor Hirohito wanting to take over the world. Now, it's safe to say that this was a major problem to the us--the alies. So what did we do? We went to war with the son's of bitches and kicked therir asses. We nuked the shit out them with the Atomic Bomb and thus America reigned supreme.

Now, would the same have happened if we tried to negotiate with Hitler and the others? Would we have ever come to equal terms? Considering how those three guys were I sincerely doubt that any peaceful agreement would have ever been made. Thus, the only solution we had available was war. Of course, I just gave a brief explanaition to the way things went down in WWII. As we all know, there is much bigger story to be heard here.

Even still, war was able to solve the issues that we had and ultimately the end result more than justified the means.

Can these problems be solved without the use of war?

It all depends on the severity of the issue. There are some issues that are well negotiable such as when it's just a minor disagreement between nations. It is in this case that war is not needed. But when you have mass histeria all over the place (etc), then the only option that should even corss your mind should be war. Yes, war is not pretty and no one wants to experience it. But if war is something that is inavetable, then there should be no prolonging it as doing so could cause greater damage than the war itself will be able to cause.

Is it Justified?

This is the question that I'm having a hard time finding an answer for. At first hand, yes, war is justified as in the end, it is nothing more than a 'means to an end'. And in this case, the end justifies the means, so there is no reason why war should not be just.

However, when you look at this through a different perspective--such as a more pacifistic way, the first thing that comes to your mind is the 'Just War Theory'. The Just War Theory states that war should only be fought if it be the last resort. All other options have been exhausted and war is inavetable. There were a few other guidlines that were involved in it but I just cannot bring myself to try and remember them. But anyways, war will always bring sufferring and there's no denying that. So, in this case, is war really just? Is all the suffering worth the end result? My opinion is yes; but in the just war theory, it states that war should not happen until it is the final resort. In other words, it's rarely ever justified.

What would your country be like had no war ever taken place?

We wouldn't be in the place we are at the momment. Had war have never happened the west side of the United States would have probable still belonged to Mexico and the East side would have probably still been colonies ruled by England. As much suffering as war brings initially, the end result always outweighs the other consequences. War, although ugly, is really something that is really needed. Because, had it not happened, we would have never existed and would not be in the glorious country we are in today. No matter how stupid it has become...

 

[Dr. Stinger A. Zoidberg]

Does war solve problems?

In a way, it does. If a country wants revenge for an attack on their country, or one of their country's officials (ala 9/11, or the death of Franz Ferdinand), then war seems to be the only answer. Like Mister Awesome said, war is inevitable, it's going to affect you at some point. Everyone of us, even our great-great-great-great-great-great grandchildren are going to experience war at some point in this life. There's no avoiding it. Until we have world peace, which many people doubt will ever happen, there is no way to stop these wars from happening. Whether we like it or not, war is something that affects all of us in a different way. Nobody likes it, but it's always bound to happen.

Can these problems be solved without the use of war?

Well it really depends on what the problem is. If it's something like a country not paying back a debt, or wanting to drill for oil in an overseas nation, then war shouldn't be a thought. The United Nations should be taking care of those problems. That's what it was created for. Now as said before, if there's an attack on your country, or a country's official, and there is panic everywhere, then war really is your only answer. No country ever wants to look weak by not going to war after something like that because it tells other countries that they don't care if they're attacked because they're not going to do anything to prevent it.

Is it Justified?

Mr. Awesome has the right idea here. At first it is justified, but then towards the end, it really becomes nothing more than a game. Look at the war the US is in with Iraq and Afghanistan right now. We did what we needed to do there, but troops are still stationed there. Luckily, President Obama sees that there's nothing left to do, so he's already started to withdraw troops from these areas.

What would your country be like had no war ever taken place?

It would be a hell of a lot different. First and foremost, we would most likely still be under British rule. When the US tried asking for independence, Britain refused. Also, the US never would've solidified itself as a world power. In World Wars I + II, when the US came into the battle, it was pretty much over. No country was able to withstand the US, and eventually surrendered. In World War II, when the US was attacked by Japan, we dropped nuclear bombs on them in revenge. That also told countries that we were a force to be reckoned with, and it put us on the map as one of the world's strongest countries.