Can/Will the Boys Get Paid Because of CM Punk?

[wrestler36]

Punk put on the table regarding some serious issues and payment to the wrestlers. I'm not saying that the boys can go all wild west on Vince and demand pay or walk out, but just like steroid allegations, recreational drug use and concussion incidents, this can be a real public relations nightmare for WWE. With WWE switching from PPV to the Network, superstars were put in the dark regarding royalties/bonuses paid to them. Much of their salaries are eaten up with hotel, plane, car, food costs, so much of their income is in merch/PPV bonuses. With the knowledge that the next crop of top level talent may not be making as much money as Cena, Orton and other top guys, will this create dissension? If enough guys make enough noise about it, will there be a cut and dry payment system? Or will WWE just have a take it or leave it attitude?

 

[Charismatic Enigma]

This won't change anything, until someone offers a legit competition to WWE and WWE becomes white hot again.

They are the only game in town, and there are more wrestlers available than there are spots on the roster. WWE could get some young kids that would be willing to do virtually anything including stupid risky moves because they want to be a part of WWE so badly. This is the same reason why there will never be a union in wrestling, because the guys are all out for themselves and wouldn't be able to stay unified long enough to accomplish something for the greater good because they'd be too busy trying to find ways to get themselves ahead.

The network has created a HUGE problem for WWE, they are just too early in the process to admit defeat, but they are losing tons of money, and of course that trickles down to all other areas of the product where they have to make cuts to compensate for those lost revenues. Thing is, it's a catch 22, because PPV sales would've continued to go down as the product hasn't been great, and basically every B list show was getting illegally streamed, so they needed to do something to win back their paying audience, but unfortunately this isn't working to the level they need it to.

I'm positive this Punk podcast will evoke a change of some kind, but I don't know that it's for the best. I think the biggest thing it's going to do, is that they are going to force every new talent to sign a non-disparagement clause upfront, because between Punk and Del Rio, they don't want anyone else giving them this level of bad press ever again.

 

[Prince Vee]

The podcast of CM Punk drew a lot of heat on WWE right now. But it had provided a spotlight and drew a lots of attention and with now Ryback claiming that he'll reveal more truth about Punk the talk of the industry and it's rating will go high again!!

People will watch the shows to find if there will be more kayfabe in the storylines regarding Punk!

But as for as the payments WWE won't raise it! Vince had lost a lots of money in the last couple of years and he had a huge loss in creating and streaming the WWE network as well!

there are lots of wrestlers yet to be signed to WWE and they might provide them with creditability if the main roster starts decide to walk out which obviously won't happen!

They don't want to lose their job and end up in indie circuits which doesn't provide enough money!!

 

[THTRobtaylor]

Don't be so sure it won't.

There are several issues to come out of this, first of all he addressed the major elephant in the room for the talent... "How do I get paid now there is a network?" which Vince will now be obliged to answer definitively, the talents there haven't asked the question, Punk did...publicly. If they don't get an answer then it not only reflects badly but could become a shareholder issue...one of those will ask and Vince will have to have a proper answer.

What Punk did more damage with was once and for all banishing the spectre of WWE's contractual system. He spelled out that as an indie contracter any talent, who is not bothered about continuing in the business and can sacrifice outstanding payoffs CAN just walk. While younger/less over talents might not be as able to, it means any major talent with some time served has some power back... Even as "low on the card as "someone like BNB, who just got his green card, doesn't want to do it anymore or like the money now and wants to do TV instead... he can quit... and more importantly this and the ADR case have proved their no-competes can not only be challenged but beaten relatively easily, so the "only game in town" argument isn't an issue.

Someone wants to get paid properly or walk cos they know the indies/Japan will do them as well if not better? They can now, cos Punk AND ADR won their no complete cases, so even if WWE tried to play hardball with a talent, they're 0-2 in enforcing it. It's all bringing exactly what Vince doesn't want and as Punk said..."people looking at his contracts/how he does business" because a lot of what goes on is not enforceable in reality and groups like SAG will now see blood in the water... if Punk's legacy was that he was the guy who got SAG interested enough to make a run at WWE, and the talent ended up paying "dues" but were protected the same as any TV show talent... he'd take that... Vince and Trips...probably would want to kill him for that... but after all it's not wrestling huh Vince?.

I am seeing a lot of stuff about "hope AJ is ok" she will be, they can't be seen to say boo to her... or she files suit like Sable did and she'd win big. Much more likely is you see AJ prominently for a few more months and she then "leaves" with a well wish note from WWE on the website and they move Paige and Charlotte into her spot. They can't say boo to her, punish her, job her out etc... now that culture has been "exposed" in the way it has, especially the ADR stuff, a sexism/bullying suit would cripple the company in terms of cred.

 

[Kodo Sawaki]

Bussiness is like there is and isnt changed for decades. Even Punk said that there are top guys like Orton who dont question stuff like that as long as they got paycheck. If someday they maybe organise(perhaps in union or something) and demand whats theirs, then maybe. Like this they are all indipendent contractors and probably dont care about network and stuff like that as long as they get checks.

Oh, and top guys will always make considerably more money. Its capitalistic bussiness, not socialism. And even in socialism that equality was just on paper. Cena, Rock and others will always make considerably more then some average guy on roster because they draw more. Its that simple.

 

[sMark]

WWE deserve every thing coming to them, i feel no sympathy whatsoever for Vince and his family if what Punk said is true. They could kill the guy because their horrible doctor wasn't willing to care about Punk's issues. And i doubt they'll ever admit their incompetence if Punk died for real.

They got away with Benoit, like him and only him was fully responsible for the deaths, when in reality, if i remember the reports correctly, it was pills that caused all of this and WWE doctor checked on Chris the day before and said nothing to anyone and didn't took him to the hospital in time. Now WWE erased Benoit from their history and blame him for everything...if Punk died, WWE will blame him as easily as they did with Benoit as well.

They did put drug policy after Benoit's death, but i simply refuse to believe it act like it should be, because i can say Ryback is a steroid freak simply by looking at him, RVD have part time contract, so he can do 3 months program and then back to his drugs, then clean his body and go back to WWE, like he didn't ever took it, when everyone knows he did, but on paper he is clean. I'am sure there are alot of stuff top talents get away with backstage (like steroids, drug abuse etc), and WWE knows about it, but do nothing, because it they fire someone like Orton (like they should couple of years ago), this means Orton will go to TNA and cause them financial troubles, so they just put their eyes shut and pretend nothing happened, but if something will happen in reality again, they will blame Orton for everything and say they knew nothing.

As for paycuts, if NJPW's launch in USA will be succesfull enough, and they will continue to be televised here, i'am sure in a year or two alot of guys you see today on WWE roster, who tired of McMahons, will jump ship for bigger money and new opportunities.

 

[Navi]

Someone wants to get paid properly or walk cos they know the indies/Japan will do them as well if not better? They can now, cos Punk AND ADR won their no complete cases, so even if WWE tried to play hardball with a talent, they're 0-2 in enforcing it. It's all bringing exactly what Vince doesn't want and as Punk said..."people looking at his contracts/how he does business" because a lot of what goes on is not enforceable in reality and groups like SAG will now see blood in the water... if Punk's legacy was that he was the guy who got SAG interested enough to make a run at WWE, and the talent ended up paying "dues" but were protected the same as any TV show talent... he'd take that... Vince and Trips...probably would want to kill him for that... but after all it's not wrestling huh Vince?.

What I don't understand is, since a lot of these guys make movies, Cena, Orton, Ambrose, HHH, Austin and now Santino, why aren't they already members of SAG?

I thought in order to be cast in a movie you had to be part of that union. I'm sure the Rock is, considering how big he is now. If anyone can bring SAG down on the WWE, it would be someone like him. God help Vince if the Rock ever becomes SAG president, and it could happen.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

As a business, WWE is not really any different than anything else. You have corporate management that weigh every decision based on what they think will be the most financially stable, you have employees who aren't corporate that don't know what the inner most goings on are as far as business goes and most employees get nervous whenever any degree of financial trouble is looming because it means people getting laid off

Also as with any other business, you're going to have some employees who're disgruntled and some employees who aren't. The ones who aren't disgruntled are the ones who make out the best, from a financial standpoint, and who're viewed as the top money making talent for the company. Those who are disgruntled are usually those who don't make as much money, though they still make a good living, feel that they're underappreciated, feel that they deserve more than what they're getting, etc. As a rule, you're gonna have more disgruntled employees than satisfied ones.

Navi mentioned the Screen Actors Guild and any of those guys could join if they wanted to. However, it's not required for any actor to join SAG if they personally don't want to. The criteria can be found on SAG's Wikipedia page. Essentially, if you're an actor, have had verifiable jobs as an actor and can afford the initiation fee and annual dues, you're eligible to join.

If The Rock ever became president of SAG, I wouldn't see him doing anything to step on WWE's toes. The Rock is one of those guys that's obviously done extremely well and WWE has been the cornerstone of his success. As a result, he'd be more likely to sell his mother to a sideshow than attempt to do or say anything to hurt WWE. At the same time, just like most other organizations associated with mainstream media entertainment, I wouldn't be surprised that wrestlers who occasionally act in low budget, straight to DVD movies aren't high priorities.

Also, the guys Navi mentioned are also the guys who're less likely to raise a stink over anything because they've done well. Of those guys, only Santino isn't or hasn't been a top guy but if the various reports on him are true, he's quite content & satisfied with his role in WWE and the money that it's brought him. Santino's always done whatever's been asked of him without complaints, without gripes and, as a result, he'll probably always have a job of some sort in some area in WWE for as long as he wants it.

At the end of the day, most pro wrestlers are 100% selfish in the sense that their primary concern is for themselves. In order to organize into some sort of union or genuine walk out, they'd have to be willing to genuinely behave as a brotherhood that's looking out for and caring for each other and I don't see them doing that. Like a lot of businesses, wrestling is pretty cutthroat and there are always a good deal of wrestlers who're looking to improve their lot in life by stepping on the backs of others. At one point, pretty much every major star in WWE or anyone that's ever really been a somebody in pro wrestling has done that. Thesz, Sammartino, Race, Hogan, Flair, Sting, Savage, Warrior, Hart, Austin, Taker, Lesnar, Cena, Orton, Triple H, HBK AND CM Punk have all played politics to get ahead or to at least attempt to get ahead. Triple H said it best several years back: "In this business, you can make friends...or you can make money."

 

[bioshock]

I think a possible issue with WWE might be if the wrestlers and enough of them wanted to create a union for wrestlers, I'm not in favor of unions just because they can ruin a work force, but it seems like wrestling needs one because it would put Vince in his place, and if enough stars of the WWE said enough is enough and were done until we have proper union then WWE would have no choice.

And reports been that WWE wrestlers are in support of what Punk said, plus major media outlets are picking up the story, this is just something the WWE wont be able to get out from, and who knows.

What about another animal in the room? What if NBC/USA Network steps in, or major sponsors like Mt. Dew and others, this could have a gigantic trickle effect. Lose sponsors on top of already losing money, and I'm sure NBC could void the tv contact if they feel that WWE is a mismanaged company with a completely unsafe working environment. When NBC/USA hears about how the staph infection could of killed CM Punk and you hear that WWE wanted him in the ring wrestling, I'm not sure NBC/USA would want a black eye like that, like the Eddie & Benoit story all over again.

 

[Cats Pajamas]

If the interview doesn't manage to break open serious cases of neglect in the WWE Medical Policies, then the only thing it was good for was making Vince, Triple H, and CM Punk all look like Grade-A ********s for a few days.

Punk couldn't get himself a better contract and he sure as sugar didn't do "the boys" any favors either. While the rest of the roster was coming to terms that they were going to have to tighten their belts, Punk was staging a protest that only he and a few others could afford. But he really, reeeaally overplayed his hand when he walked out because WrestleMania 30 played out better without him and he proved that he as well as most of his co-workers were disposable. Punk asked Hunter why he wasn't going to get paid like Rocky, Taker, Cena, or Hunter and he got a two part answer: Part 1 at WrestleMania 30 and Part 2 via text on his wedding day. The message couldn't be any clearer. Don't like what you're earning? There's the door.

No, the "please-don't-compete-clause" can't stop them from doing what they love, but that's nothing new. The WWE couldn't enforce that BS back when Lesnar's NFL career didn't pan out and he decided to wrestle in Japan. WWE would have loved to block Lesnar with that ridiculous contract, too, but it wasn't happening. Not only that, but Lesnar even put it back in Vince's face when he went off and became a larger star in the UFC. That's how you get paid like a megastar and get sponsors in the WWE, Phil. You become bigger than Vince McMahon!

Suing the WWE didn't solve shit for anyone besides Punk and even that came with a price. If the roster is actually praying for salvation, Punk's not their prophet. What they need is legitamite competition coming in and giving them a realistic alternative. Until then, up-and-comers in the wrestling biz can only hope to "chase the WWE dream"... maybe strike it rich like Punk did.

 

[CalciferBoheme]

It might do a little, but unless the guys working there are willing to stand up for themselves, it will do nothing major or long term.

Unfortunately, while you get guys here and there who try, I doubt we'll ever see a large scale attempt to unionize or change things in any way. they are too scared for their jobs, and when a small group do start, someone undermines them.

Jesse Ventura tried in the 80s, but Hogan told Vince and ended it. Sadly, Hogan being behind it probably would have made it happen, which is why Ventura went to him about it. I'm not sure anyone has the kind of clout it would take now, even someone like Cena.

 

[George Steele's Barber]

No one with any power cares about professional wrestlers and their plight. The people on the internet who do care, are not going to stop watching because of convoluted pay disagreements. Don't make more of Punk's ranting than need be. No one is going to make more money because Punk doesn't know exactly how wrestlers will get paid for Sunday night television shows on The Network.

These guys have no other comparable option. Bouncers don't get paid enough and all those steroids have made their balls too small to become strippers. Punk's rants were just to self serve his ego. He is the Voice of his Voice.

 

[FromGlasgow]

I think its a bad time in wrestling just now for the wrestlers as the WWE mainly holds the monopoly of professional wrestling now and I would imagine its basically the WWE's way or the highway for most of the employees and theres not much competition for the WWE to worry about unhappy employees being tempted away by another company as there was in the past and if your not happy theres really not much other options other than taking a step down to maybe TNA or ROH.

 

[lil steroid meat]

I thought this thread was about the idea that Punk proposed of having wrestlers wear sponsors on their gear. Which was brilliant and TNA would be smart to scoop it up (if anyone on their roster is big enough to get sponsors). It legitimizes the "sport" next to MMA, it looks cool, and it puts more money in the boys' pockets.

Even if Vince's excuse about the RAW sponsors not allowing it was true and not some BS excuse (considering Brock came in with sponsors a few months later), they could start having wrestlers negotiate with the RAW sponsors to have some guys wear some logos on their gear.

As far as the royalties from the PPV's, that's a valid concern and Vince has only gotten away with ignoring it because he's essentially the only game in town that is paying out the checks that he is.

The bigger issue here though is the fuckery that the doctors were engaging in by not diagnosing/treating a fucking Staph infection lol. That will be the biggest story to come out especially considering all the bad press they got after Benoit.

 

[wwesux]

The podcast of CM Punk drew a lot of heat on WWE right now. But it had provided a spotlight and drew a lots of attention and with now Ryback claiming that he'll reveal more truth about Punk the talk of the industry and it's rating will go high again!!

People will watch the shows to find if there will be more kayfabe in the storylines regarding Punk!

But as for as the payments WWE won't raise it! Vince had lost a lots of money in the last couple of years and he had a huge loss in creating and streaming the WWE network as well!

there are lots of wrestlers yet to be signed to WWE and they might provide them with creditability if the main roster starts decide to walk out which obviously won't happen!

They don't want to lose their job and end up in indie circuits which doesn't provide enough money!!

What the hell are you smoking on? WHat the hell are you talking about? Whomever speaks first says the truth as the story goes! Rycrap will say anything that Vince feeds into his mouth as his slogan goes" feed me more" so the more crap vince feeds him he ll say anything to get back to him and no one will be interested in hearing what the big buffoon Rycrap has to say!
worst wrestling excrement at its best folks I have been saying it for so long!

 

[wwesux]

If TNA can see what CM Punk went and suffered through and give him the extreme amount of money Phil Brooks will be grinning and laughing. HIs words will be " lets fuck these fuckers" ( towards wwe) when TNA gives him a huge amount! wwe gave him nightmares he thinks all wrestling business is like this which is not true! TNA needs to shape up and become next WCW and beat this wwe sesame street live cartoon show at its best and put them out of business. WHat comes around goes around

 

[Goththing]

If TNA can see what CM Punk went and suffered through and give him the extreme amount of money Phil Brooks will be grinning and laughing. HIs words will be " lets fuck these fuckers" ( towards wwe) when TNA gives him a huge amount! wwe gave him nightmares he thinks all wrestling business is like this which is not true! TNA needs to shape up and become next WCW and beat this wwe sesame street live cartoon show at its best and put them out of business. WHat comes around goes around

And some guys already far more popular than Punk tried that and they failed miserably!! If there's that much unhappy wrestlers, why are they still working there!! Punk is a millionnaire thanks to WWE!! Punk without WWE is just a regular tattoed guy wanting to be a wrestler/rockstar!! Punk got owned for being too selfish!! I want more money and I'm already millionnaire thanks to you!! CM Punk looks very hard to work with when he has to lose a feud or match!! Anyway he's a selfish little prick and I don't feel no Sympathy for him!! I used to be a fan of him, but no more!! He got Hulk Hogan's ego while not being Hulk Hogan!! He just thought he was that damn good!!

About a union for wrestlers, they can form one, Vince will use the wrestlers he wants and you'll see a lot of high names not joining because they still wants to make the money they do right now with WWE and Vince!!

PPV Buyrates shouldnt even be considered for entertainements!! I'm a huge wrestling fan for over 35 years!! But a script sport with ppv bonus? Ok you can have this for showing up, but if the WWE is not here to produce the PPV, you will not even get a pay to live on!!

Take for example Hockey, the guys has a union to set basic rules about how they are treated and for their safety!! But when a game is on and there's 4 millions watching, the players doesn't get more money... why? Because the money they do is in their contract!! You don't like the contract, don't sign it!!

Thanks for watching!!

 

[thebarber]

If Punk didnt walk, Mania 30 would havge been fucking unwatchable. Listen to the podcast Cats.

 

[Honkey_Kong]

I highly doubt CM Punk's speech is going to raise money for the wrestlers at all. Even if WWE wanted to pay them, they're losing the revenue from the PPV buys to do it with because of that WWE Network. Now I think in the long-term this is probably the best solution since the PPV market is dwindling for them. It's difficult to put together a solid card that will generate 1 million+ PPV buys when you have Vince's imbecile writers, poor booking and an out-of-touch old man running the show. In the long term, it will provide the company with a financially solvent model. They'll most likely have to operate on less revenue though.

As far as the medical issues go, this is going to be the same thing as every other time an issue like this comes up. WWE will claim to step up their "wellness policy" and make a few BS rules that they don't even follow consistently. They'll only enforce them once in a while when they can afford to (to make it appear like it's working). But it will be business as usual at the WWE camp.

People like to say the wrestlers are too selfish to unionize, but you can say the same thing about NFL, NBA, MLB players and just about every worker in every blue-collar industry. They all managed to organize unions, the same can be done with wrestling. It's just a matter of getting experienced union organizers to put it together and to step up to WWE, NJPW, All Japan, TNA, CMLL, ROH, NWA and AAA.

But wrestling isn't even the worst sport that isn't unionized. MMA and boxing both have guys who beat the living crap out of each other for very little money. They're abused by their promoters and then dropped like a bad habit as soon as the promoter gets somebody else.

 

[Y2JBL]

I really find it hard to believe that the entire roster of this company suddenly started getting paid tons less money once the network kicked off, any everyone just put up with it, kept coming to work, and are still there to this day. Yes there are a lot of acknowledged reports that people were asking how exactly the switch from PPV to Network was going to work and there weren't clear answers, I'm not saying that isn't the case, but I doubt that the company is really trying to "pull a fast one" on their entire roster and hope that nobody notices or complains that they aren't getting huge PPV checks anymore. Everyone still coming to work is clearly still getting paid what they expect to be paid, or were willing to continue working without the PPV bonuses.

This is a public corporation now, I really doubt they risked trying to scam their entire talent roster.

So no, I don't expect any huge changes. I don't think stockholders are going to be up in arms during the next conference call based on what Punk said; the reports were there all along about this confusion of missing PPV bonuses, it's not new information.

I don't study every single aspect of this company and how their contracting works, but if PPV bonuses were always separate from guaranteed money, then the talent can't really demand it anyway. The money was given to them when the company could afford it and maybe belts had to be tightened as they launched this network and stopped relying on the PPV model.

People love their money. I'll give Punk credit, he seemed like the only person willing to speak up about a lot of things, but if the entire lockroom is suddenly noticing that they aren't getting half of their salary, we'd already be seeing some other names who stopped showing up for work. The almighty dollar is the one thing that trumps all.

 

[Mustang Sally]

I highly doubt CM Punk's speech is going to raise money for the wrestlers at all. Even if WWE wanted to pay them, they're losing the revenue from the PPV buys to do it with because of that WWE Network.

Eventually, it will all work itself out. Fiscally speaking, the company is still essentially at the launch point of the Network; they don't know where it's going and how all areas of the company will be affected. Surely, one of the factors considered were the salaries paid the employees, as that must represent their largest cash outlay, no? It seems rather callous of management to leave the workers floating in the wind as to how their paychecks will be determined.....if that's what they're doing.....but for better or worse, the Network is the way WWE has decided to go.

Yes, the cannibalization of the pay-per-view revenue has likely turned the salary structure upside down.....and with the company (apparently) not getting as many folks to sign up for the Network as originally hoped, management is probably more in the dark about paying their workers than people like CM Punk think they are....for now.

Is management likely eliminating "uncertainty of wages" for people at the top, like John Cena, Randy Orton and a few others? My guess would be.....yes, they probably are. For the rest of 'em, it will all be sorted out. That may not sound fair, but I'd guess it's realistic.

Still, my feeling is that almost all of them will decide it's better to ply their trade as professional wrestlers in the largest sports entertainment organization in the world, regardless of how this salary thing comes out.

 

[Mighty NorCal]

Were the fuck is everyone getting their inside financial info for the WWE? Madden wails on about this in every column, but were is anyone's confirmation that this isnt adrressed by the WWE anyways (most likely in peoples downside garuntees, and a portion of subscription dollars)

Just because Punk didnt see or get any of it doesnt mean it doesnt exist.

 

[#tamale]

Were the fuck is everyone getting their inside financial info for the WWE? Madden wails on about this in every column, but were is anyone's confirmation that this isnt adrressed by the WWE anyways (most likely in peoples downside garuntees, and a portion of subscription dollars)

Just because Punk didnt see or get any of it doesnt mean it doesnt exist.

And who besides Punk is complaining? I have not read one report anywhere stating that WWE talent is unhappy with the payoffs.

Even if they are, JR said it best that the talent will never be happy with the payoff because it's never what they expected.