are there too many DQ finishes?

[hello]

it seems the only time there are any clean finishes on raw is if its a squash match to put over some new talent. kurt angle made a comment about this a month ago and i think its true, that fans want to see clean finishes. theres a lot more clean finishes on TNA it seems, Raw, there is always someone randomly coming down to the ring and attacking just for the hell of it.


i cant tell you how frustratring and repetitive it is to see a great match for 15 min then have some heel come in and hit some one or someone low blows to stop the match. anyone else agree on this? thoughts?



even on PPV, look at Cena Dq'ing himself at unforgiven, what an awful way to end a wwe title match that people payed $40 to see... thats just stealing the fans money at that point, and expecting them to pay to see the next ppv which will be a rematch but in some type of gimmick match.


look at cyber sunday, title match ends in a DQ by low blow, and now we're supposed to pay to see the next ppv again, to see the same match but now with a stupid gimmick of 'no sweet chin music.'

 

[A-Bomb]

I agree. DQ finishes are fine once in a while. It happens entirely too much, though. Personally, I love to see a match finish with a lot of energy, where the crowd is on their feet or really worked up somehow. For instance, one wrestler goes for a move but misses, which opens up an opportunity for his opponent to counter and nail him with a sweet match-ending move of some type. A good match, in my opinion, ends with some high energy twists and turns, to get the crowd really riled up right before the pin.

Speaking of there being too many of something, I think there are too many 1 and 2 counts. I know that unsuccessful pins are exciting, but some matches have way too many of them.

 

[WackerJr]

I agree about the DQs, they seem to have replaced the old WWE ideas of having someone come down and do the exact same thing, but behind the referee's back.

The DQs are becoming much more common recently, especially at PPVs. I enjoy matches which end with lots of false finishes. I thought Cyber Sunday actually did pretty well for this as there were plenty of times where you thought the matches could end, and there was genuine surprise when it continued. Even the Michaels-Orton match had a few exciting counters at the end before the frustrating DQ finish.

 

[Bernkastel]

Moved to WWE Main Section

 

[AnthonyMango/NoFate007]

WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY too many DQ finishes. I completely agree with you.

Sometimes less is more. The only ways I can see DQ finishes being acceptable are:

1. To set up a heel, legitimately. If DQs were rarer, we'd actually be impressed when you're building someone up as a ruthless damn-near-killer and he doesn't care that he gets disqualified because he just wants to take a chair to someone's head.
2. The "cheat lose to retain the belt", like Orton did recently, but this should be used very, very, very sparingly.
3. If there's a big storyline going on (and I mean BIG, like Hart Foundation/DX big, not Kane/Big Daddy V) then I wouldn't mind seeing everything go chaotic and having a ring full of guys that are beating the hell out of each other.


They need to stop having 7/10 matches end in a DQ - or, for that matter, having 2 out of the other 3 left being someone winning through interference by someone else, like distracting the ref and someone else hitting the opponent with a foreign object.

When was the last time we saw someone submit? I haven't seen a Boston crab or a figure four or a sharpshooter win in forever. I was actually very pleased to see Khali tap out when the Undertaker put him in the triangle choke hold cause it was something different instead of just having Batista come in and attack them both or something.

 

[Jeremy Dick]

I agree, very much so. I for one am tired and bored of DQ finishes. It's gotten to the point where you have to pretty much expect a run-in at the end of every match. If done more sparingly, run-ins would mean more and the quality of the matches would be better as it'd be less predictable.

And as for DQ finishes for PPV matches, there's just no excuse for that. I felt like I had been robbed after watching Cyber Sunday.

 

[Freedom 35]

And as for DQ finishes for PPV matches, there's just no excuse for that. I felt like I had been robbed after watching Cyber Sunday.

I felt robbed for more reasons than that at Cyber Sunday. However youre right when a PPV match which is supposed to be the peak of a feud and just plain old wrestling ends in a DQ there really is no excuse. Vince thinks that if a match ends in a DQ that it will interest people more and they will want to tune into the next PPV to see the eventual outcome of the feud which is bullshit if we ordered the PPV we should get to see a real match. and thats my

 

[kenfuu]

I think what WWE should do is quite simply change the rule. If you look at TNA and NWA if you disqualify yourself you lose the belt and adds an interesting dynamic to the matches because lets face it, heels cheat and monster heels beat the shit out of people when they shouldn't, so by getting rid of the disqualifying yourself and you keep the title rule it gets rid of that option. But then there's still the distracting of the ref trick which is just as lame and the ref bump which is more believable if done right but sill kinda lame.

 

[Slyfox696]

it seems the only time there are any clean finishes on raw is if its a squash match to put over some new talent. kurt angle made a comment about this a month ago and i think its true, that fans want to see clean finishes. theres a lot more clean finishes on TNA it seems, Raw, there is always someone randomly coming down to the ring and attacking just for the hell of it.


i cant tell you how frustratring and repetitive it is to see a great match for 15 min then have some heel come in and hit some one or someone low blows to stop the match. anyone else agree on this? thoughts?



even on PPV, look at Cena Dq'ing himself at unforgiven, what an awful way to end a wwe title match that people payed $40 to see... thats just stealing the fans money at that point, and expecting them to pay to see the next ppv which will be a rematch but in some type of gimmick match.


look at cyber sunday, title match ends in a DQ by low blow, and now we're supposed to pay to see the next ppv again, to see the same match but now with a stupid gimmick of 'no sweet chin music.'

And, yet, you buy the PPVs every month.

See, that's the whole point. They are making you give them your money. Not sure what education you are at, but when you study business, you'll understand that is the primary goal of any business. Get the most money out of the customer as you can.

I laugh when people complain that people complain because the WWE makes them order shows every month. They don't even realize that it is the entire point.


As far as too many DQ finishes, I say no. DQ finishes are a great way for both guys to retain heat from the crowd.

 

[Serious Mozzarella]

As far as too many DQ finishes, I say no. DQ finishes are a great way for both guys to retain heat from the crowd.

There's a difference between good heat and bad heat. Good heat is when people pay to see the guy get the crap kicked out of him. Bad heat is when people don't want to watch anymore. For instance, why Orton hasn't won a match yet because when he does end up keeping his title, it's because he DQ'd his way out of it. He only loses when it's a non-title match.

 

[hello]

And, yet, you buy the PPVs every month.

See, that's the whole point. They are making you give them your money. Not sure what education you are at, but when you study business, you'll understand that is the primary goal of any business. Get the most money out of the customer as you can.

I laugh when people complain that people complain because the WWE makes them order shows every month. They don't even realize that it is the entire point.


As far as too many DQ finishes, I say no. DQ finishes are a great way for both guys to retain heat from the crowd.

nope, ive never bought a wwe ppv, and i havent watched one in probably 3 years... seems strange, but i do watch raw somewhat regularly but have no interest in paying to see the ppv's because they never deliver, are predictable, filled with filler matches/segments and are a waste of time


not to mention theyve been gradually raising the price year after year, notice how the ppvs used to be $20-30, now everything is $40, and WM is $50 , iirc



yea they are getting $ out of people, and they dont give a shit about their loyal fans bc they just wanna take your buck and fill a ppv with 'entertainment' instead of good wrestling.


its like shawn michaels said about hogan leading up to their SS match, once the fans are in their seats, the wwe (hogan) already has their $ and dont care about putting on a quality show night in, night out



lets look at Survivor Series, you have...

- divas match
- hornswaggle v khali
- SS match
- ecw match
- michaels v orton
- taker v batista


i dont know how anyone can justify paying for that , as only 6 matches in roughly 3 hours, this is why i dont pay for ppvs and anyone who does is just getting robbed

 

[justinsayne]

There's a difference between good heat and bad heat. Good heat is when people pay to see the guy get the crap kicked out of him. Bad heat is when people don't want to watch anymore. For instance, why Orton hasn't won a match yet because when he does end up keeping his title, it's because he DQ'd his way out of it. He only loses when it's a non-title match.

I think that's the point, he's a heel so why wouldn't he take the easiest way out, I don't have a real big problem with DQ finishes cause they help to extend storylines, and set up the next months PPV match, for example lets look at the Orton/Cena feud, at Unforgiven Cena got DQed, that DQed later helped in the storyline to set up the Last Man Standing match they would have had at NM had Cena not got hurt, Sly's right DQs are a good way to further the storylines and keep heat on both guys

 

[NYSandman]

I've always been against overdoing the DQ thing. And, it seems in the last few years, it has gotten worse. Over and over.

Now, as far as allowing wrestlers to lose their belts in a DQ, I don't agree with that at all. If that happened, there wouldn't be one heel champ in WWE. I don't mind a DQ so much if someone gets beaten to a bloody pulp afterwards, but having 2 or 3 matches a night ending that way is getting played.

As far as DQs in a PPV, only if it a NON-TITLE MATCH! Ending title matches in DQs is bullshit.

As far as PPVs go, I never feel cheated if I buy a crappy one, just stupid. I'm not getting Survivor Series, because I only really care about the title matches, and I'm not spending 40 bucks for two matches when I have a fine site like this one to read the results as they happen.

 

[kenfuu]

I've always been against overdoing the DQ thing. And, it seems in the last few years, it has gotten worse. Over and over.

Now, as far as allowing wrestlers to lose their belts in a DQ, I don't agree with that at all. If that happened, there wouldn't be one heel champ in WWE. I don't mind a DQ so much if someone gets beaten to a bloody pulp afterwards, but having 2 or 3 matches a night ending that way is getting played.

As far as DQs in a PPV, only if it a NON-TITLE MATCH! Ending title matches in DQs is bullshit.

As far as PPVs go, I never feel cheated if I buy a crappy one, just stupid. I'm not getting Survivor Series, because I only really care about the title matches, and I'm not spending 40 bucks for two matches when I have a fine site like this one to read the results as they happen.

I'm gonna have to disagree with you there. I know for some reason a lot of people aren't to fond of TNA but that's besides the point. Having the losing the belt by DQ can work for heels and considering the last 3 out of 4 champions in TNA were heels(Abyss, Cage, Angle)(face:sting) it worked for them. And it only adds to your heel character IMO when you find other ways to keep the title besides disqualifying yourself because it shows the character is more creative then saying oh i'm about to lose i'll do something illegal.

Also i'm not into boxing or MMA so you people out there who watch it can you tell me if you lose the belt if you get Dqed?

 

[roach]

i can understand why people like the idea of a dq ending means the title holder retains, but i think its much better with if u get a dq you lose the belt. i prefer to see clean finishes and nowadays it seems that if a heel wins he hardly ever wins without the ref bump or a dq or some use of a weapon.

i think a heel should be able to pin his opponent more. now it seems the face wins cleanly at a ppv in a non-gimmick match and the heel only seems to win clean when he cant cheat ie a last mans standing match.

also on raw it seems to be always a 30 second match with someone like snitsky winning. i think they should have this guy in a solid 10 minute match and actually beat the guy, maybe he could dominate to get him over, but not under 2 minutes. at the moment there building up snitsky as a monster who cant be beaten but c'mon as soon as he gets a main event(please god no) he'll get beat and sent to the mid-card again (sort of like umaga even though umaga is sorta becoming a main heel). this would have snitsky more credible than he is now cos atm we dont really know much about this new gimmick, he has like 3 moves and one of them is a punch of the ropes, so in reality its a big boot and a pumphandle which really is nothin fresh about him, if he wants to get over he needs to get a better finish that would look like it hurts.

i also cant remember a wwe title match or main event having the heel win cleanly or a title switch. its why i like this jeff hardy and kennedy fued, they are both scoring wins over each other and keeps me entertained.

to get back to the main point, the uses of a dq finish are too over-used, i dont wana see one more than once a couple of months, this would give some major heat towards the heel. now when a heel is dq'ed its more like why the fuck have i watched this raw or bought this goddamn ppv, i wanna see a tense finish to a title match, if randy orton was gona low blow hbk at least have it when the ref wasnt lookin or sumin, the hits the rko, that would of got a lot more good heat. anyway rant over, ive been waiting a while to voice my opinion on this lol.

 

[GWARATEMYBABY]

The only viable DQ that should ever happen in a title match at a PPV is one that should be an out of nowhere run-in that starts a new feud. Not this crap where we have to see Cena Orton 2o times over because they keep DQuing themselves...

 

[Slyfox696]

There's a difference between good heat and bad heat.

As long as the heat is drawing, there is no such thing as bad heat.

Good heat is when people pay to see the guy get the crap kicked out of him. Bad heat is when people don't want to watch anymore.

That has nothing to do with what I said. Perhaps I should say it differently.

DQ finishes allow a match to finish and let both guys save face in the match, thus furthering the current feud and future feuds, without either guy looking weak in the process.

nope, ive never bought a wwe ppv, and i havent watched one in probably 3 years... seems strange, but i do watch raw somewhat regularly but have no interest in paying to see the ppv's because they never deliver, are predictable, filled with filler matches/segments and are a waste of time

Then what the fuck are you complaining for? Do you know how ridiculous you sound? You start a thread, complaining about something that doesn't even affect you!

You said:

even on PPV, look at Cena Dq'ing himself at unforgiven, what an awful way to end a wwe title match that people payed $40 to see... thats just stealing the fans money at that point, and expecting them to pay to see the next ppv which will be a rematch but in some type of gimmick match.

look at cyber sunday, title match ends in a DQ by low blow, and now we're supposed to pay to see the next ppv again, to see the same match but now with a stupid gimmick of 'no sweet chin music.'

You're complaining about fans buying PPVs with DQ finishes, and talking about how they are ripped off, and yet you never ever buy the PPVs. So what the fuck do you know about it?


Seriously, that has to be one of the funniest things I've ever seen in my entire time on this forum. And, I've seen some pretty idiotic stuff.

 

[Jeremy Dick]

It's not that DQ finishes are always bad, but the over abundance of them can really hurt the overall product. Now while I can see the reasoning behind the thought that if they DQ every week and PPV is a business method to keep people watching, but if you do the same thing with every feud and storyline, the product's going to get stale.

It just makes things more predictable and less exciting. Sure, I'll keep watching since I'm a lifelong wrestling fan, but the casual fans are going to keep getting fed up and stop watching. It's probably part of the reason that the ratings have been so sluggish with wrestling as the problem's gotten worse in recent years (predictable and disappointing run-ins and finishes).

 

[IrishCanadian25]

Relax Sly. Don't get all angry.

I am not a fan of the overuse of DQ finishes. I mean, I understand the need for them to "save face" or "continue a feud" but too many of them do slap the fans in the face.

On the other hand, anybody who paid money for Cyber Sunday should have KNOWN what they were getting. Any match they have where the fans pick the match has to end that way, especially a title match. It's an insult for fans to think they may actually effect a major title change.

The exception was Chris Jericho dropping the IC belt to Shelton Benjamin. Benjamin was voted out of 20 superstars, and his reward was the title win. Whomever got voted would have won the belt because WWE wanted it to appear legit. But in that type of PPV, you'd have to expect false finishes, DQ's, Count-outs, and that crap.

 

[a7xoff]

I think that there are too many DQ finishes, and often times you can see them coming. If there's a handicap match and someone has a close ally on the show you can pretty much guarentee that they'll interfere causing a DQ. If a heel is losing badly, often times they'll use a low blow and get DQd. In certain situations like Orton's at Cyber Sunday, you gotta do whatever it takes to keep the belt, but it just seems that WWE likes to have a lot of DQ finishes outside of title matches. It kind of ruins it for me cause most of the time they occur, it's during a 1/2 way decent match.

 

[midgensa]

I must admit I am very upset with the number of DQ finishes on RAW and on PPVs. Even Smackdown! and ECW have their fair share and it is getting very frustrating. Nothing is like a great two-count (remember WM 17 when Rock kicked out of like 9 finishers before taking the pin!)
DQ's seem like a way to drag on a storyline the company wants to keep going because they simply cannot think of a new or better direction.

 

[Papa Shango]

DQ's are without a doubt very overutilized. Now I have no problem with DQ's and count-outs in PPV matches. It increases interest in a fued. All the fans know that there is gonna be a rematch, and it'll me an intense one, and in most cases, a gimmick match. Let me revise what I said. I don't mind DQ's and count-outs in B-list PPV's. I can't stand them in the Biggest PPV's of the year(ie; WM, RR, SSlam, SSeries). Why build up a match for the grand stage, and then end it like that? However, I do not have a problem with a DQ or count-out at something like, say, The Great American Bash. Actually let's use this year's Cyber Sunday as an example, shall we? We had two title matches that ended in ambiguity. First, Kane defeated MVP by count-out, allowing MVP to retain the US Championship. Now, Kane was a replacement for Matt Hardy, so if anyone thought that Kane had a shot of winning the title, I'll assume you know why you're an idiot an move along. Plus, the count-out finish perfectly fits MVP's persona. Then we have Shawn Micheals defeating Randy Orton by DQ. There would have NO POINT in a title change of that magnitude at a C-Grade PPV. What were the other options? 1.) Michaels wins the title. We then just simply have a role reversal, with Randy Orton chasing Shawn Michaels' title. We would STILL have the same match at SSeries. And it wouldn't have the feel of desperation that this matchup has. HBK can't use the SCM, and if he loses, he doesn't get to face RKO again. This is HBK's VERY LAST CHANCE. It has that PPV atmosphere that would have been lacking in a match with Michaels as champ. To sum up, I think there is a place for DQ's, as long as it advances a fued/storyline. I hate, HATE DQ's on TV. Major disappointment. It either just leads to having the same match on PPV or nothing even comes from them.
Something just occurred to me. I think I know why there have been more DQ finishes as of late. This may sound like a stretch, but bear with me. It's because of the lack of talent on the microphone. It used to be that guys could start and intensify fueds through promos and backstage segments. Edge, Chris Jericho and Christian all can keep a fued running for extended periods of time, even upwards of a year, with their mike work. They know how to spend a few weeks talking smack and building up anticipation. Then they can prolong rematches by cutting more promos while at the same time engaging in other fueds. Edge managed to maintain a fued with Chris Benoit for like 7 months back in 2004-2005. First he walked out on their tag title match at Taboo Tuesday. Benoit managed to win on his on own, but edge walked out on their title defense. They were then on opposite sides of the Sseries tag match. They then eliminated each other in a No. 1 contender's battle royal. The next week, they wrestled each other and HHH in a triple threat match for the WHC. This ended in a double pin-submission and forced the title to be vacated. They were then both participants in the elimination chamber for the vacated title. They were then seen working each other over the Royal Rumble. They then also wrestled each other and 4 other men in the Money-in-the-Bank Ladder Match, which Edge won after knocking Benoit off of the ladder with a steel chair. Then, at Backlash, 7 months after thier initial rivalry started, they wrestled each other in a Last Man Standing Match. Now, while this was happening Edge also managed to have another high profile fued, with Shawn Michaels. If WWE started booking their wrestlers like this instead of filling all of the storylines with DQ's, the quality of their product would be way better AND thier superstars would look WAY better to the audience.
But that's just my opinion...

 

[hello]

Then what the fuck are you complaining for? Do you know how ridiculous you sound? You start a thread, complaining about something that doesn't even affect you!

You said:


You're complaining about fans buying PPVs with DQ finishes, and talking about how they are ripped off, and yet you never ever buy the PPVs. So what the fuck do you know about it?


Seriously, that has to be one of the funniest things I've ever seen in my entire time on this forum. And, I've seen some pretty idiotic stuff.

im saying im sick of seeing this shit all the time on raw, and how ridiculous it is to expect a fan to order a PPV when the match ends in a DQ.


look at TNA, they give you world title matches on tv shows, whens the last time a raw had a legit title match? let alone one where the title changed hands.... edge beats rvd/cena in a triple threat ONLY because of rvd's arrest, before that, i think the last title change on raw was when they handed hhh the belt

 

[Slyfox696]

im saying im sick of seeing this shit all the time on raw, and how ridiculous it is to expect a fan to order a PPV when the match ends in a DQ.

So, when you said "we" with regards to getting screwed, you were talking about everyone else. Gotcha.

Face it, you tripped yourself up.

look at TNA, they give you world title matches on tv shows, whens the last time a raw had a legit title match? let alone one where the title changed hands.... edge beats rvd/cena in a triple threat ONLY because of rvd's arrest, before that, i think the last title change on raw was when they handed hhh the belt

September 1 - CM Punk wins the ECW World Title

July 17th - Great Khali won the WHC on Smackdown.

May 8th - Edge won the WHC on Smackdown.

There's three main-event title changes on free TV in the last 7 months.

Happy now?

 

[hello]

So, when you said "we" with regards to getting screwed, you were talking about everyone else. Gotcha.

Face it, you tripped yourself up.


September 1 - CM Punk wins the ECW World Title

July 17th - Great Khali won the WHC on Smackdown.

May 8th - Edge won the WHC on Smackdown.

There's three main-event title changes on free TV in the last 7 months.

Happy now?

hahha trust me, ive never paid for a ppv, i can guarantee you that, i dont know why youre bent on one word, after i said THEY pay $40 to buy ppvs...yes, im really making stuff up to people that ill never meet on an online forum, good one



gimme a break, the ecw, whc are world titles but theyre not the world title, any one whos not a wwe mark can tell you that.. and besides i dont think khali in a match even qualifies as wrestling.. and both those whc matches were due to injuries that some one needed to step in immediately