All TNA "hyped" stars that had packages - TNA needs to improve their character dev.

[Marty2Hotty]

Russo and Ferrara are doing decent shows.. but they suck overall in my opinion.. and will not have a chance of holding onto casual viewers. "duhh.... let's shove desmond wolfe in the fans' throats"

desmond's promo this week was pretty corny.

Beer Money is not cool

Beautiful People are lame and those segments are absolutely horrendous. Their promos are lame as hell too.

3D/Rhino is somewhat interesting.... that's about it.

---

Now... TNA has hyped stars with packages before letting them debut. They do that and then throw them into "normal" wrestlers that don't do jacksh*t...

- Suicide: hyped for months. Nobody now.
- Consequences Creed: hyped for weeks - now a nobody
- Shiek Abdul Bashir: lots of good controversial packages/promos. Had a few good interviews. Now a guy on the roster
- Brutus Magnus: hyped a bit.. but then now part of a group and doesn't do much
- The Pope D'Angelo Dinero: has a bit of a role and cuts promos now and then; no new characters
- Sarita: she is tag women's champ. Used okay
- Robert Roode: they kept hyping him in 2005. but now he's part of beer money. doesn't really have a character

I am not a big fan of TNA lately. They really need to get their act together because they have Russo/Ferrara, who used to not be afraid of taking risks. Maybe Dixie wants a boring "sports oriented" show that doesn't draw new viewers. But the shows lack substantially in creativity.

 

[FromTheSouth]

Russo and Ferrara are doing decent shows.. but they suck overall in my opinion.. and will not have a chance of holding onto casual viewers. "duhh.... let's shove desmond wolfe in the fans' throats"

It's tough to be decent and suck at the same time, so they've got that going for them. But, you fail to realize that Nigel is an IWC hero, and TNA is written for the IWC. Furthermore, I think the Desmond Woolfe shit has been pretty badass.

desmond's promo this week was pretty corny.

Not really.

Beer Money is not cool

Of course not, they're just superover with the audience because of the scooter. That must be it, the scooter.

Beautiful People are lame and those segments are absolutely horrendous. Their promos are lame as hell too.

And yet, they remain over with the live crowd too. I get it. You're one of those guys who is too cool to like something that's popular.

3D/Rhino is somewhat interesting.... that's about it.

Proof! You like the segment that isn't over. Awesome. You also like black licorice, liver and onions, and brussel sprouts, right?

Here's the problem with everything you just said. These segments that you don't like are the ones that people actually care about. People love beer money. People hate the Beautiful People.

People like 3D, but no one cares about Rhino. It's just like in the WWE, Rhino gets thrown into important segments just for the sake of ruining them.

---

Now... TNA has hyped stars with packages before letting them debut. They do that and then throw them into "normal" wrestlers that don't do jacksh*t...

You can curse here. Fuck, shit, bitch, cunt. It's OK.

- Suicide: hyped for months. Nobody now.

Two X division titles and still a contender.

- Consequences Creed: hyped for weeks - now a nobody

Figures in the tag picture, always on TV.

- Shiek Abdul Bashir: lots of good controversial packages/promos. Had a few good interviews. Now a guy on the roster

Started World Elite.

- Brutus Magnus: hyped a bit.. but then now part of a group and doesn't do much

World Tag Champ

- The Pope D'Angelo Dinero: has a bit of a role and cuts promos now and then; no new characters

Prominent figure in the X Division.

- Sarita: she is tag women's champ. Used okay

I don't know how that helped you prove your point.

- Robert Roode: they kept hyping him in 2005. but now he's part of beer money. doesn't really have a character

That's because his personality is more interesting than the character. He has a persona, like Cena, Orton, etc. That has worked in wrestling for quite a while. HHH doesn't have a "character" HBK doesn't have a "character" and it seems to have worked for them.

What troubles me about this list is that you are crying for everyone to be in the main event. These guys got hyped and have made an impact in the portion of the show that they are suited for. Just because someone has a video package doesn't mean they need a night one World Title match.

I am not a big fan of TNA lately.

That's because it's more popular, and you have decided that popular is bad.

They really need to get their act together because they have Russo/Ferrara, who used to not be afraid of taking risks.

They put the X belt on Amazing Red. They feuded heel factions against each other. They put five guys who should lead a stable in a stable together. These things are all against the grain.

Maybe Dixie wants a boring "sports oriented" show that doesn't draw new viewers. But the shows lack substantially in creativity.

You are wrong in so many ways. Viewership is up. The conversation is up on this board. TNA is drawing new viewers, and causing a stir. You're going to get left behind.

 

[Rip]

I think the first two posters completely exemplify the two extremes of this. I also think they're both off.

desmond's promo this week was pretty corny

That's your opinion... not fact in ANY way. I don't think it was corny at all, my opinion.

Beer Money is not cool

See above.... Not cool to whom? To you maybe... the iMPACT! zone seems pretty stoked though...

Beautiful People are lame and those segments are absolutely horrendous. Their promos are lame as hell too.

They not as popular as they used to be, but I think you're exaggerating to prove your point... and again... your opinion.

Suicide: hyped for months. Nobody now

Really? He's not as hot as he was... but a NOBODY? Really? He's constantly in X-Div contention.

Consequences Creed: hyped for weeks - now a nobody

Exact same as above, except tag division as well.

Shiek Abdul Bashir: lots of good controversial packages/promos. Had a few good interviews. Now a guy on the roster

He's probably the closest to a "nobody" that you've mentioned... but I don't really remember him ever being hyped too much to begin with. Again... I think you're exaggerating to prove your point.

Brutus Magnus: hyped a bit.. but then now part of a group and doesn't do much

Aren't the British Invasion tag champs? I guess that's not doing much...

The Pope D'Angelo Dinero: has a bit of a role and cuts promos now and then; no new characters

Didn't he like... JUST debut like a month ago? Give it time before you criticize.

TNA is written for the IWC

Wow... that's a whole lot of bullshit, dude. While I admit they're doing good right now... for the last like 2 years TNA took a HUGE dive. You're sounding like a total fanboy when you say that.
Does having 40-50 year old wash ups that were made another company be your champions over the young talent sound like it's for the IWC, or does it sound like wCw?

People like 3D, but no one cares about Rhino. It's just like in the WWE, Rhino gets thrown into important segments just for the sake of ruining them.

That's bullshit too. You may not like him and I admit he hasn't done jack for a couple years... but you're just straight making shit up to prove your point. "Just drop him into segments to ruin them"? Yes I'm sure that's why they use him. In 2005 he was red hot, SUPER over with the crowd and actually won the title at BFG if you remember. The crowd went NUTS. And his feuds with Abyss? Dude.... yeah he's useless and they specifically keep him around to ruin segments...

That's because it's more popular, and you have decided that popular is bad.

You're putting words in his mouth and... kinda being a dick.

You are wrong in so many ways. Viewership is up. The conversation is up on this board. TNA is drawing new viewers, and causing a stir. You're going to get left behind

Really? Viewership is up? Didn't it just drop from a 1.3 with Hogan to a 1.1? Aren't these around the same numbers they've had for like 3 years? Just because you say it doesn't make it true...

 

[Fuel The Fire]

Dude what are you talking about desmond like that for? He is what has got my interested in T.n.A. Its really interested to see how he gets pushed with angle. By the looks like it im not the only one that likes desmond so far. I really dont need to go on about anything else you said because you have been school in every sentence you made

 

[FromTheSouth]

Wow... that's a whole lot of bullshit, dude. While I admit they're doing good right now... for the last like 2 years TNA took a HUGE dive. You're sounding like a total fanboy when you say that.

Not really. Those stars constantly break kayfabe, make insider comments, etc...

I don't know how being a fan means I'm being a total fanboy, but I do know that you have no right to call anyone a dick.

Does having 40-50 year old wash ups that were made another company be your champions over the young talent sound like it's for the IWC, or does it sound like wCw?

Because AJ, EY, the British Invasion.....these guys aren't champions right now? Those guys held onto the belts and made the young guys earn it, and as soon as they did, Angle comes out and cuts a pro-youth promo. Do you watch the show?

That's bullshit too. You may not like him and I admit he hasn't done jack for a couple years... but you're just straight making shit up to prove your point. "Just drop him into segments to ruin them"? Yes I'm sure that's why they use him. In 2005 he was red hot, SUPER over with the crowd and actually won the title at BFG if you remember. The crowd went NUTS. And his feuds with Abyss? Dude.... yeah he's useless and they specifically keep him around to ruin segments...

Who's being a fan boy now?

You're putting words in his mouth and... kinda being a dick.

Sounds like someone else.....

Really? Viewership is up? Didn't it just drop from a 1.3 with Hogan to a 1.1? Aren't these around the same numbers they've had for like 3 years? Just because you say it doesn't make it true...

A year ago they were doing .9's and 1.0's, not they are doing 1.1's and 1.2's. So yes, viewership is up 10-20%. A tenth of a point is a big deal when you're doing 1.0.

a 0.1 is about three times the ROH audience, so yeah, I would say viewership is up.

 

[Rip]

Not really. Those stars constantly break kayfabe, make insider comments, etc...

I don't know how being a fan means I'm being a total fanboy, but I do know that you have no right to call anyone a dick.

That's all it takes to be labeled as "written for the IWC"? Um... OK. I didn't say "being a fan makes you a fanboy". I said it makes you sound like a fanboy when you say it's written for the IWC because that's a huge fucking stretch. Secondly,

Because AJ, EY, the British Invasion.....these guys aren't champions right now? Those guys held onto the belts and made the young guys earn it, and as soon as they did, Angle comes out and cuts a pro-youth promo. Do you watch the show?

you're talking about what's going on AT THE MOMENT. But who as reigned and ruled for like 2 years? Foley, Angle, Sting, The MEM. Jesus dude, I said I admit they're doing good now BUT for a damn long time it's been the aforementioned BS week in week out.

Writing a good wrestling show for the last several months doesn't just erase or justify the BULLSHIT that went on for years before it!

Who's being a fan boy now?

Uh... I just stated facts where all you did was exaggerate the fuck out of the situation. Tell me which part about Rhino that I said wasn't fact and then tell which part of your whole "They use him to make ruin segments" theory is actual fact? Why in holy hell would you keep someone specifically to ruin segments?

A year ago they were doing .9's and 1.0's, not they are doing 1.1's and 1.2's. So yes, viewership is up 10-20%. A tenth of a point is a big deal when you're doing 1.0.

OK so, here's a snapshot of TNA's ratings from late 05 to mid 07:

http://100megsfree4.com/wiawrestling/pages/nwa/impactrat.htm

As you can see, in January of 2007, they pulled their first 1.1 rating. Yeah, it fluctuated between .7 and 1.2, but as you can see they're were pulling 1ish. Now tell me what was iMPACT's latest rating? 1.1. Oh and by the way, January of 2007 was almost THREE years ago. So you stating "A year ago they were doing .9's and 1.0's, not they are doing 1.1's and 1.2's. So yes, viewership is up 10-20%." is exaggerating, over simplifying and pretty inaccurate.

 

[FromTheSouth]

That's all it takes to be labeled as "written for the IWC"? Um... OK. I didn't say "being a fan makes you a fanboy". I said it makes you sound like a fanboy when you say it's written for the IWC because that's a huge fucking stretch. Secondly,

OK, the show caters to...

Is that a better explanation? The show looks like a cross between Attitude and old ECW.

you're talking about what's going on AT THE MOMENT. But who as reigned and ruled for like 2 years? Foley, Angle, Sting, The MEM. Jesus dude, I said I admit they're doing good now BUT for a damn long time it's been the aforementioned BS week in week out.

The story for the last year was about making the young guys overtake the older guys. They wrote the week to week sheet to illustrate the struggle of the younger guys to get over. This has been the plan for a year. It is the nWo done right.

Writing a good wrestling show for the last several months doesn't just erase or justify the BULLSHIT that went on for years before it!

Yes it does. It shows direction in the booking. TNA has always slowburned everything. They didn't rush this angle either. They let it run its course. I applaud them for that.

Uh... I just stated facts where all you did was exaggerate the fuck out of the situation. Tell me which part about Rhino that I said wasn't fact and then tell which part of your whole "They use him to make ruin segments" theory is actual fact? Why in holy hell would you keep someone specifically to ruin segments?

OK, I don't know why sarcasm is so hard to find. Look, obviously, he was not kept just to be bad. He just is bad. Look at the invasion. Every segment he was in was slow. He sucks on the mic. His matches are horrible. All he is good for is extreme style matches. He is the most overrated performer ever. He has such little value to the company, and now he is bringing 3D down with him. If you don't see that you are a fan boy.

OK so, here's a snapshot of TNA's ratings from late 05 to mid 07:

http://100megsfree4.com/wiawrestling/pages/nwa/impactrat.htm

As you can see, in January of 2007, they pulled their first 1.1 rating. Yeah, it fluctuated between .7 and 1.2, but as you can see they're were pulling 1ish. Now tell me what was iMPACT's latest rating? 1.1. Oh and by the way, January of 2007 was almost THREE years ago. So you stating "A year ago they were doing .9's and 1.0's, not they are doing 1.1's and 1.2's. So yes, viewership is up 10-20%." is exaggerating, over simplifying and pretty inaccurate.

So going from the occasional 1.0 to consistent 1.1 isn't progress? My arguments are overly simple, you are.

 

[Rip]

The show looks like a cross between Attitude and old ECW.

WHAT!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!???!?!!??!!??!?!?!?!???!

It is the nWo done right

WHAT!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!!!!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!

Writing a good wrestling show for the last several months doesn't just erase or justify the BULLSHIT that went on for years before it!

Yes it does. It shows direction in the booking. TNA has always slowburned everything. They didn't rush this angle either. They let it run its course. I applaud them for that.

WTF!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!

Every segment he was in was slow. He sucks on the mic. His matches are horrible. All he is good for is extreme style matches. He is the most overrated performer ever. He has such little value to the company, and now he is bringing 3D down with him.

Opinion, opinion, opinion.... no facts stated. Again, I only stated facts about him.

So going from the occasional 1.0 to consistent 1.1 isn't progress? My arguments are overly simple, you are.

Again, you stated "A year ago they were doing .9's and 1.0's, not they are doing 1.1's and 1.2's. So yes, viewership is up 10-20%. A tenth of a point is a big deal when you're doing 1.0." And yes.... that is exaggerating and over simplifying. They viewership is NOT up 10-20 percent. They had about 1 million viewers 3 years ago, and while more of that 1 million tune in more often, the number hasn't gone up. Yes it's progress, but it's like celebrating the fact that you've added ONE BRICK to the house you're in the middle of building.

You're getting all huffy and stating shit that's completely untrue and trying insult me at the same time. You're turning this into a total tard-fest and I'm wasting my time trying to convince the un-convincable fanboy that you now CLEARLY are.

DONE!


cya...

 

[PEP3]

Again, you stated "A year ago they were doing .9's and 1.0's, not they are doing 1.1's and 1.2's. So yes, viewership is up 10-20%. A tenth of a point is a big deal when you're doing 1.0." And yes.... that is exaggerating and over simplifying. They viewership is NOT up 10-20 percent. They had about 1 million viewers 3 years ago, and while more of that 1 million tune in more often, the number hasn't gone up. Yes it's progress, but it's like celebrating the fact that you've added ONE BRICK to the house you're in the middle of building.
.

Actually, the growth they are showing is steady and good. In the current market, every 1.0 rating = 1, 149,000 households viewing. That is in the range of about 2-3 million viewers, possibly more.

As a result, every 0.1 percent is about 115,000 more households watching. That could equal in the range of 115,000-250,000 more people, which is fairly significant. It's an extra 100,000 people talking/buzzing about their product.

TNA isn't going to reach the 3.0 ratings WWE is pulling any time soon, but again, I seriously think they should stop judging themselves against the competition. They should use their own track-record as the measuring stick to judge their growth by. It would be much more productive!

 

[McNewfall]

The story for the last year was about making the young guys overtake the older guys. They wrote the week to week sheet to illustrate the struggle of the younger guys to get over. This has been the plan for a year. It is the nWo done right.

Yeah I think FTS is right. You know, that feud with sting and angle was what sting REALLY needed to finally get over with the fans. And you know, booker t and steiner and team 3d's feud was awesome. I mean, it's about time team 3d got some titles on them.

 

[Derekjt]

I can't agree with this post at all. Are you even a TNA fan??? To say Nigel(Wolf) has been anything, but good for the company is ridiculous. He's the reason why I keep coming back, oh and Velvet Sky of course. If TNA is lame to you than I'd love to know what you have to say about WWE. The Dudley's definitely deserve gold. They're one of, if not the best tag team of all time. Beer Money has proven that they are legit as well. More than legit.
I will agree that I don't like how Creed is booked. I feel that he has a lot of talent and not enough face time. I do like the gimmick tho. Why him and Lethal haven't gotten another shot is beyond me. I like them both.
So maybe you should turn on Monday Night Raw and watch two guys over 40 wear green and ban a midget from wearing their gear. Better story lines I guess. TNA is getting bigger viewership as it grows. Where it goes from here is anyones guess. Hopefully people stop being such critics and enjoy the run. I'm enjoying every bit of a national product besides McMahon's shit. Really tho, I'd like to hear what you have to say about Raw or ECW.

 

[FromTheSouth]

WHAT!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!???!?!!??!!??!?!?!?!???!




WHAT!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!!!!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!




WTF!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!



Opinion, opinion, opinion.... no facts stated. Again, I only stated facts about him.



Again, you stated "A year ago they were doing .9's and 1.0's, not they are doing 1.1's and 1.2's. So yes, viewership is up 10-20%. A tenth of a point is a big deal when you're doing 1.0." And yes.... that is exaggerating and over simplifying. They viewership is NOT up 10-20 percent. They had about 1 million viewers 3 years ago, and while more of that 1 million tune in more often, the number hasn't gone up. Yes it's progress, but it's like celebrating the fact that you've added ONE BRICK to the house you're in the middle of building.

You're getting all huffy and stating shit that's completely untrue and trying insult me at the same time. You're turning this into a total tard-fest and I'm wasting my time trying to convince the un-convincable fanboy that you now CLEARLY are.

DONE!


cya...

Congratulations on being completely wrong about everything. You know nothing about wrestling or business and your failure to say anything new or dispute the analysis I give proves that. How is 20% increase not progress? You can't answer that, so you call me names. This is what six year olds do.

It's cool though, you haven't done anything that's smart in this thread. Your "facts" about Rhino are nothing more than an explanation of man crush on him. He sucks, but he's not nearly as bad as you are.

I also enjoy the way that you try and flame at the end and act like your above this debate. That simply isn't true, as you are an idiot who doesn't understand basic math or how to read ratings. Nice try, you suck, please don't try this again.

 

[Rip]

Um, hypocrite much?

You're the one that turned this into flametown USA. You're suggesting this is what "six years olds do". Interesting....

Your "facts" about Rhino are nothing more than an explanation of man crush on him. He sucks, but he's not nearly as bad as you are.

Oh snap! My pride! Yeah not hypocrisy AT ALL.

See, the thing is, you've done everything you claim I've done, but you're being all huffy. When I originally said you "sound like a fan boy when you say that" you got all *********. And then just pull shit out of NOWHERE

How is 20% increase not progress? You can't answer that, so you call me names.

I did answer that. All I've done is use facts, then you rebuttal by immaturely swerving it into a "man crush" that I clearly have for Rhino, a wrestler I feel pretty indifferent about.

Actually this is all pretty fucking ironic. The only thing I ever called you eventually was a fanboy, after you refuse to listen to anything that is against your precious TNA. But if you look at the thread you've called me what.... idiot? Simple? A six year old? Need I go on?

Don't forget I joined this thread more on your side than the thread starter's, and you've acted like a whiny baby about anything that counters you.

See, the fact that you said the current TNA product is a cross between the old ECW and the Attitude Era, along with the current storyline as the "the nWo done right".... that's.... I don't even know if there's a word for it because ridiculous is an understatement by light years. So no, I won't bother arguing that point against you because it's your (RIDICULOUS) opinion, and going any further just incites your bizarre ineptitude for keep a debate intelligent and for perhaps looking at facts and countering as opposed to getting childish about it, which is all you've done.

Now let me make myself clear. I acknowledge that TNA's ratings are higher than ever. I do NOT consider it NOTABLE progress when you were pulling 1.1s kinda consistently to 1.1s consistently. Why? Because let's just say for simplicity's sake that 1.0 equals 1 million households. Which means, let's say 2 millions fans (that watch through TV, and it's not like the entire household is watching it). Of those two million, some stopped watching when they got .8 and .9s, then tuned back in when they go 1.1s etc. All it proves is that they've been able to get those same viewers to watch more consistently, but they haven't increased that 2 million, that's my point. Progress? Maybe... depends on your point of view. Seriously people, TNA has to pull in more people right? Not JUST get the fans they already have to watch more often.

Now any mod worth his salt should close this thread since it's just turned into a flame-fest by FTS and gone WAY off topic.

 

[FromTheSouth]

But, you see, I am a mod, and there's no reason to close this thread. And, as a word of advice, the others don't like to be told how to do their job.. No we've turned this into a debate of the future stars vs. Rhino. That's cool. I will apologize to you though. I can be an ass sometimes.

Look at it this way, one year ago, they were lucky to get a million households once a month, not they get 1.2 million housholds every epidsode. Let's stick with your assumption that two people are watching in these housholds. Lucky to get 2 million viewers < Consistently getting 2.2 million viewers. That is signifigant progress.

But, back to the point at hand.

We do agree that the hyped TNA stars are not failures, and I do challenge someone to tell me how they are.

The Beautiful People are the perfect example. This is a tried and true heel forumla. It's basically three Rick Martels running around spraying "Arrogance" in the faces of their opponents. It has always worked.

Burke is in his divisions title picture, as is Suicide. The Suicide gimmick is about to run it's course and I would say it has been effective.

Beer Money is the most over tag team in the company.

The thread starter is wrong about his evaluations of talent.

I assume he thinks that if someone gets hyped and is not in the title picture, they have failed. This is a common IWC misonception. The second anyone shows promise, IWC types think that they should instantly be contenders. I think that as much as the IWC loves to hype up the midcard, they often fail to understand that jsut because someone is effective in the midcard that isn't a clincher that will be in the main event. Look at Matt Hardy. He is a great midcarder, but not main event material.

 

[Kenny Powers]

Come on Marty, you are one of the regulars in the TNA section that always hypes TNA up, and say what a good show Impact is week after week. I don't think you were complaining a few weeks ago, when Russo and Ferrera were in charge of the booking then too. I don't see a problem with it, nothing is perfect but I mean every talent is shown in a feud or has television time.

TNA knows that if a talent isn't on TV they aren't getting paid, unless it is your bigger stars like Angle, Nash, etc. That's why they try to put everyone on television. Maybe a few talents wont have matches, but its only a 2 hour show. Hopefully TNA will be able to get some new programming, which it sounds like it will happen shortly.

As far as the talent being used incorrectly or Desmond Wolfe being shoved down our throats that's ridiculous. Wolfe has only been on Impact about 2 weeks and has shown nothing but promise since his feud with Angle. Give the guy some time. The same can be said about The Pope. He has been red hot since his debut. His feud with Suicide has been one of the best feuds going. He has just been off television due to his family problems. As far as The Beautiful People, I'm not a fan of Lacey but I am a fan of the group. They probably aren't the best as far as in ring ability, but damn they have the best entrance in wrestling. At least they are in segments, if they worked for WWE they would be escorting David Arquette to the ring on Raw.

Beer Money is the most over tag team in TNA and probably in Industry right now. British Invasion are the tag champs and are always put over. The same can be said about World Elite. All the TNA champions now are TNA originals. Isn't that what people wanted? First they complain about the old guys being champs and now they complain about the new guys getting the spotlight. Make up your minds.

You need the more credible people like Angle and Sting to be champions to make the title credible, that way when AJ Styles or Samoa Joe wins the title they can be elevated that much more. If people think Russo is garbage, I can't wait to see what they think of Hogan. Hopefully Hogan can do some good on the creative side, but if he can't I'm sure the whole IWC will be begging for Russo and Ferrera.

 

[Rip]

But, you see, I am a mod, and there's no reason to close this thread. And, as a word of advice, the others don't like to be told how to do their job.. No we've turned this into a debate of the future stars vs. Rhino. That's cool. I will apologize to you though. I can be an ass sometimes.

Turning it into a different thread topic doesn't warrant closing it?

Look at it this way, one year ago, they were lucky to get a million households once a month, not they get 1.2 million housholds every epidsode. Let's stick with your assumption that two people are watching in these housholds. Lucky to get 2 million viewers < Consistently getting 2.2 million viewers. That is signifigant progress.

OK well, you see that as significant progress, I don't. Progress? Yes I suppose, but in my eyes not notable. But they've been on TV for like 4 years (almost 5), second thing is they've had huge "shake-ups" like Sting coming back, winning the title, Angle jumping ship, Foley, Booker T.... all these different things. My point is, with alllllll that stuff, all they've been able to do is get the fans they already have to tune in more regularly. I think praising that is awarding mediocrity because they've had the tools and roster and the talent and everything, but they haven't been able to really grow that fanbase too much, just get it to tune in more regularly, see? If Hogan and Bischoff don't do it (and it might, we don't know yet) then what will? Cena jumping ship? The Rock? Undertaker or HBK or HHH? Let's be realistic, that won't happen. To me this really does seem like their last chance to finally break that lower 1s ratings.

Just to make myself clear, I AM a fan of TNA. Just like WWE, some parts are great, some are shitty. I've said already that the current product is good, but it was real bad for a while. I'd say I like them both fairly equally, just depends which week we're talking about. So I'm not on the side of TNA or the side of WWE, I'm on the side of the truth.