A Sad Realization

[JETER123]

Back when the attitude era was around, there were a lot of stupid angles that I loved. Nowadays, if they had those angles, I'd probably loath them. Why? Because of the snobby "IWC."


When I watch wrestling now, the first thing I think about is, "I wonder what the smarks think about this angle." It's such a wall.


I hate how fans use terminology that the business should only use. For instance, "Edge is getting great heat." "This feud definitely needs a payoff." "I really hope a younger star gets the rub." When I used to watch wrestling and love every part of it, these words would be foreign to me.


I wish I wasn't programmed in the mode of reading other people's opinions on a match or storyline when the only one that should really matter is mine.

 

[Flava Flav's PMing Bitch]

I agree with you, but I also understand, the IWC has adding a new layer to wrestling, it allows fans to be part of the show in other way. The thing is if you don't dig it, you don't have to come on the boards and read about what the 'Smarks' have to say. Wrestling like most movies or shows is about the suspension of disbelief. When I can catch wrestling now a days I through reality out the window and try to enjoy it for what it is. And I think that's what you need to try and do.

 

[Mighty NorCal]

Oh, what is this? another silly "da IWC ruinz wrestling" thread?

Well. News Flash,

DONT COME TO THE FUCKING BOARDS THEN

You said the solution yourself. Your opinion is the only one that matters, to you. So watch the shows, and evaluate them for yourself. Anyone who lets the opinions of a bunch of idiots that they will never meet in their life effect how they enjoy the program is very weak minded.

What does it matter that fans understand some terminology? Its just like movies, and TV shows. Same thing. No on is chaining you to a computer. Watch the programming, and forget it.

 

[finneycom1]

I really wouldnt worry about what anybody thinks in the "IWC" anyway. Hell, 3/4 of the people on these boards think they have all of the answers to what is wrong with wrestling including myself. I initially got on this forum b/c some of the topics I would read while visiting wrestlezone I thought was interesting and wanted to see what other fans in other geographical areas thought about certain subjects. I have only been a posting member for about a month or so and I laugh at half of the shit people post. Not to mention how serious people get on here. I noticed that you are a new poster so let give you some things that I have learned about posting:

1) Everybody uses wrestling "terminolgy" on here. Smarks, pops, heat, heels, faces, marks, jobbers- it's all used on here. BTW, who gives a shit what "smarks" think about wrestling today. Being a wrestling fan of 20+ years, I can tell you that wrestling is like anything else- it has it's ups and downs and nobody on here will have a complete "fix" for anything. If they did they would be a WWE or TNA employee and not sitting behind a computer eating pizza and slurpin' on Mountain Dew!

2) Never post an "anti-TNA" thread starter after watching a TNA Impact broadcast. Well, yeah, actually do that if you want to ruffle the feathers of some TNA "smarks." I did that last Thursday and boy, did I piss some people off. So, I decided to keep to the (for the most part), Pro-WWE posts and not even visit the TNA threads.

Dont worry about those so-called "smarks" b/c in reality, they only make up a very, very small portion of wrestling viewers anyway. Like I said, if everybody on here knew half of what they think they know, they would have some job in wrestling.

 

[JETER123]

Oh, what is this? another silly "da IWC ruinz wrestling" thread?

Well. News Flash,

DONT COME TO THE FUCKING BOARDS THEN

You said the solution yourself. Your opinion is the only one that matters, to you. So watch the shows, and evaluate them for yourself. Anyone who lets the opinions of a bunch of idiots that they will never meet in their life effect how they enjoy the program is very weak minded.

What does it matter that fans understand some terminology? Its just like movies, and TV shows. Same thing. No on is chaining you to a computer. Watch the programming, and forget it.

First of all, does it really look like I talk like this : "da IWC ruinz wrestling."

Okay...good.

The message boards aren't the problem, as they are a great forum to talk about something people enjoy. It's the endless bitching and complaining about the product. The majority of the people on these boards are more concerned about what's happening backstage than what's happening on camera. THAT'S the problem.

Triple H never loses cause he is married to the bosses daughter. Hogan is such an ass for not doing wanting to do the job to Austin...Cena is getting such heat, they gotta turn him heel so we can all boo him legally!

Understanding the terminology and using the terminology are two different things.

 

[Mighty NorCal]

First of all, does it really look like I talk like this : "da IWC ruinz wrestling."

Okay...good.

The message boards aren't the problem, as they are a great forum to talk about something people enjoy. It's the endless bitching and complaining about the product. The majority of the people on these boards are more concerned about what's happening backstage than what's happening on camera. THAT'S the problem.

Triple H never loses cause he is married to the bosses daughter. Hogan is such an ass for not doing wanting to do the job to Austin...Cena is getting such heat, they gotta turn him heel so we can all boo him legally!

Understanding the terminology and using the terminology are two different things.

jokes, you see.

well, they are ignorant assholes. I dont get how that would ruin wrestling for you. It enhances it for myself. I get excited when something happens that I know will piss off everyone on here, becuase then I get to laugh at them. try it.

as for the last part, refer to the first sentance, of my second statement. yea.

 

[Scott Free]

First of all, does it really look like I talk like this : "da IWC ruinz wrestling."

Okay...good.

The message boards aren't the problem, as they are a great forum to talk about something people enjoy. It's the endless bitching and complaining about the product. The majority of the people on these boards are more concerned about what's happening backstage than what's happening on camera. THAT'S the problem.

Triple H never loses cause he is married to the bosses daughter. Hogan is such an ass for not doing wanting to do the job to Austin...Cena is getting such heat, they gotta turn him heel so we can all boo him legally!

Understanding the terminology and using the terminology are two different things.

What turns my stomach more than the bitching about the product is the bitching about the bitching. So don't read the crap if it bothers you, I guarantee you the world will not end. You're not going to find a lot of complimentary remarks on IWC just like you seldom see positive news on the TV because it's the pissed off people that do the most talking and the bad news that gets the most coverage, it's just the way it is, so like someone said "You don't have to love it, you don't have to like it, but you better learn to live with it, because it's the best we have today!" (I'm pretty confident I screwed up that quote royally).

 

[Debisibmania]

uh yea and ur older dude... they redo scenarios with little tweaks... at this point, to just watch it as if u were a little kid, ud have to have never see it before... or else it just looks repetitive. Plus, u know its not real right? cause its kinda hard for a grown man to enjoy something he knows isnt real with bad actors and botchy matches unless u actually care about the inner workings of the buisness.

I envy anyone who can watch it without the Mark point of view, just for the sake of the show, but i also think that person is an idiot.

 

[Smart Mark]

So what your saying is that even though you now have knowledge of how the wrestling business works you'd rather pretend you don't? That is what you mean by knowing terminology and using it are two different things right? This seems like a simple fix, stop coming to sites like this and stop using certain words. What is there to even discuss here, this thread is stupidity.

 

[JETER123]

So what your saying is that even though you now have knowledge of how the wrestling business works you'd rather pretend you don't? That is what you mean by knowing terminology and using it are two different things right? This seems like a simple fix, stop coming to sites like this and stop using certain words. What is there to even discuss here, this thread is stupidity.

Your name is Smart Mark...you are my case and point. Your name isn't your favorite wrestler or something alone those lines, it's "Smart Mark." A name that indicates that you pride yourself on knowing all the stuff that you think the majority doesn't, making you elitist. I think you probably jerk off too much.

What I was intending to discuss is that fans like you ruin wrestling. Just because people have the right to be negative about the product doesn't mean they have to flaunt it.

Again, I come to this site to discuss wrestling. Not particularly the negative side of it. I would venture to say over 75% of the threads are negative.

"Smart Marks" like yourself are now over what made them love wrestling, and now they just act like they are in the business.

You are a fool sir, do everybody a favor and don't respond.

 

[Debisibmania]

The difference between the marks and the anti-marks is one main thing...

The regular fans cheer for their favorite wrestler... priority 1.

The marks cheer for the success of the company... we want it to live on, and we cant help but acknowledge the pros and cons of the current condition.

 

[seanskull92]

Being a wrestling fan of 20+ years, I can tell you that wrestling is like anything else- it has it's ups and downs and nobody on here will have a complete "fix" for anything. If they did they would be a WWE or TNA employee and not sitting behind a computer eating pizza and slurpin' on Mountain Dew!

I think this is the best thing i have read on this site. really after reading that, 80% of these posts should disappear and never be brought up again. im 25 years old and been watching wrestling since about age 4. i was there for the mega powers break up, when warrior won the title, when bret won the title, when savage beat flair (with that qustionable handful of tights haha) and so on and so forth. the best time i had in wrestling was when i was in junior high and the austin era or attitude era happened. it was great, i still believed what i was seeing and it was new and hot. now a days, im just like the rest of you, smart mark or smarks or whatever you want to call us. but i dont get pissed at these storylines today, i dont get pissed at gimmicky finishes, the only thing i want when i watch a wrestling show is a decent match. i dont understand why pushes. and characters, and number of a guys title runs, or how lonely of a guy john cena may or not be get discussed. why dont we start talking about good matches? no one should care to ever discuss why triple h might pass flairs 16 titles, we all know why and it doesnt need to be talked about. who cares that mick foley is tnas champion. did he put on a good match? i ahve no idea i didnt see it, but anyone that did see it mentioned nothing of the match, just why they think it sucks. idk how many of you went to wrestlemania. i was thee, 13 rows from the ring, and besides taker and shawn ill tell you this, the best match of that night was the unification of the tag titles that didnt even get put on tv.
now that ive ranted for 3 jumbled paragraphs, ill once again agree with this post i quoted whos name i cant remember, unless you work forwwe, tna or somewhere in the creative end of the business, eat your pizza, drink your mountain dew and stop fucking bitching. and thats the bottom line, cause skullman said so

 

[JETER123]

I completely agree with you skullman.

All these smarks care about is how business is doing, as if they are apart of it.
They aren't. They are fans.

Do you think baseball fans go on websites and care about what ratings the Dodger-Diamondback game did? Absolutely not. They don't concentrate on that crap.

As I write this, there is a thread on the main site entitled, "How to make title matches a bigger draw." I didn't know Vince McMahon had employees on this website...

 

[ThaRaph]

I laugh when the IWC starts talking about how Vince NEEDS to do certain storylines, or NEEDS to create (or re-create) certain factions...every year, I hear someone in the IWC theorize how the actions of a certain wrestler "will lead to putting wrestlers w, x, y, and z together and have Flair manage them as the new horsemen" or put random Hart Family descendents together to form a new Hart Foundation, or my personal favorite to laugh at, is how everything is somehow "supposed to build up for...." Austin v Hogan at WM #+1, which they've been saying EVERY year since Rock v Hogan

 

[Kid A]

to me what ruined wrestling is just being able to predict whats going to happen. i stopped watching wrestling for over a decade(missed the entire Attitude era) but when i came back into it about 2 months ago, i could still predict exactly how things would play out...as a whole i think this does nothing for the sport and nothign for the fans at all if you're playing things out exactly how they would 10 years ago...not much surprises me these days except for the occasional Cena thru huge light thing haha..

another question, what is the IWC? IWC to me is an indie company a friend of mine was working for so im lost here..my one educated guess would be Internet Wrestling Community?

 

[timmy872]

to be honest, the IWC makes no real difference.
WWE doesn't take any notice, TNA don't. They honestly have to reason to do so.
Us talking about our opinions is just something we enjoy doing. People were 'smarks' before the internet was invented. Theres always been the guy at the live show you go to who says, "Hogan is apparently here!" you just think, yeah right and carry on. Then talk with someone else about your opinions, the only difference now is that we have somewhere to do the same thing on a grander scale.

 

[Scott Free]

another question, what is the IWC? IWC to me is an indie company a friend of mine was working for so im lost here..my one educated guess would be Internet Wrestling Community?

That is right, congratulations ! You win a lifetime membership in the IWC as a reward ! As an official member, you can now:
1) Bitch about anything, including how much other members of the IWC bitch.
2) Use "Inside" lingo at your leisure, doesn't matter if you're not sure what they mean.
3) Be smug beyond human tolerance towards casual fans.
4) Praise classic pro wrestling stars of the past, even if you never seen or heard of them.
5) You get an official IWC Member T-Shirt ! (Which is still pending due to some disagreement on the design by the IWC community, but surely, within this century, there will be an agreement, and you will be mailed one.)

 

[OhCanadaEh2009]

To the topic creator.

What about the Invasion angle? If WWE hadn't royally fucked that up, portraying WCW and ECW wrestlers as clumsy, and having them purposely botch moves, and also if WWE could have signed bigger stars for the WCW roster, I think the Invasion angle could have earned itself a DVD set, complete with every Invasion match.

But honestly, if it was to happen in this era, what would you think?

 

[hArdyPUNKmArk]

Seriously. I like and get what you said JETER and I give you credit for putting your opinion out there, even green rep'd u. But if you are on these boards, if you are posting reguarly then unfortunatly you are one of us. You are apart of the IWC and the IWC is a group of people that discuss the "in's and out's" of wrestling. It's for people that want more than just the 4 shows a week.

If you come onto these forums or any like it then expect to see whiny bitching posts but also expect to see great in depth posts, or ideas about new things... Plenty of things on these boards, to say some of the members bitching has ruined wrestling for you is a bit sad.

Look at the title of the thread, if it's something you're not interested in then move to the next one that sounds like you could enjoy. It's all up to you, I'm not hating on ya dude, just giving my opinion.

Good thread mate.

 

[falconsault]

well, they are ignorant assholes. I dont get how that would ruin wrestling for you. It enhances it for myself. I get excited when something happens that I know will piss off everyone on here, becuase then I get to laugh at them. try it.

This I agree with 100%.

As far as what some have said, there is a problem with saying that the fans aren't apart of the company, because we all are, just in a different aspect. The customer is apart of every company that they buy from, contributing money to a company is being apart of it, you're not just making the important decisions that the company itself is... I hope that makes sense, it did in my head before I started typing it.

And I feel that the people who are just truly concerned with the sucess of the company needs to rely more on cheering for their favorite wrestlers and so on. If you want the company to be a success there is no better way than to buy their gimmicks, and I don't mean their persona, I'm talking about their shirts, fake belts, all that jazz. I would honestly worry less about the pro and cons of the situation and pay more attention to the people that I want to see win and the peope I want to see get beat the hell up. That creates ratings and makes money, that's my opinion though.

Regardless of what people say about the wrestlers that I like, such as Cena, I'm not going to really care what they say. I do, like Norcal, enjoy it when people have been bitching for a month, talking about how Cena has to lose to so and so, only to come on here after the ppv and see all of the posts and threads complaining about how bad it is that Cena is still champion. Because lets face it, these people are being greedy and selfish wanting the company to revolve around what they think is right, and believe it or not, Vince knows what the hell he's doing. He's not trying to sell us, we're all already fans, he's trying to build the next generation of WWE fans and to be honest, I think he's doing a decent job of it.

 

[It's...Baylariat!]

Look. The reason the IWC is bitching and moaning about what's going on is because they're not satisfied with the product. And, of course, backstage activity will have something to do with it. It's the 'smart marks' out there that usually piss and moan, because they weren't swerved or they predicted what was going to happen.

Well to the 'smarks' out there, CONGRATULATIONS! You have no life. Unless you either work, write, or take pictures in the wrestling business, you have no reason to be so stubborn and pissy about what goes on with the wrestling world. I'm a mark. I'll admit it. I've watched atrocious episode after atrocious episode of RAW the past few months. Why? It's definitely not because of the quality programming, it's not because of a favorite wrestler. It's because I'm a fan. I was a fan first. I was a mark first.

I was the kid sitting on his living room floor watching Sting come out, yell, hit the Stinger Splash and lock in the Scorpion Death Lock. I cheered, wore the rat tail with pride, and loved every second of it. I was also the kid who matured into a smarter fan and came to the realization that wrestling was a scripted show when I was in grade school. I read a Hulk Hogan biography out of my school's library and it had a section about wrestling being staged and that the outcome was determined before hand. I mean, even as a kid, I knew the hitting wasn't as real as a real fight, but I DID think the matches were a real showcase of who was the better man, not scripted to determine a winner.

Once I found this out, I seen wrestling differently. I seen Flair, Hogan, and Jerry Lawler differently. Because I knew now that since they were the star, the directors or bookers were making them the winners. Yet, for some reason, I still marked out. Why? Because even in knowing that Flair or Hogan was the man, seeing them get beat was even more meaningful...because they thought someone else deserved to win. Which was a big deal.

Now, we move on to the Monday Night Wars era. This is when the biz became more public about how the matches are ran and how things worked politically. We seen too many 'real' moments during this time and that suspense kept me locked in. I figured someone would just break away from the match and knock the shit out of Hogan on WCW or Austin in the WWF/E. Fact is, these years were the best wrestling has seen for a long time. Why? Because most of the 'smarks' wanted to see who would take the belt from Hogan or Austin. The thought process was, "Will Hogan ever lose that belt?" or, "Will Austin get beat for his belt?" The ECW old school fans invented the 'smark' movement. Cheering about some real moment that happened. Acting like they know what's going on and they're not being fooled. That's not a fan, that's being an asshole. These guys may have pre determined matches, but they bust their fucking ass to put that match on and all these people can chant is "Booooring, BOOORING" or "THIS MATCH SUCKS".

Now, onto the present. Do I think the product is bad? Yes. Do I think some of the wrestling's bad? Yes. Will I still watch wrestling? HELL YES! Because being a fan is being a fan. Whether it's sports or wrestling, every genre has a bad year. Will Ferrell has a bad movie. The Dallas Cowboys will not always win a Super Bowl, The Kentucky Wildcats will not always be in a National Title game in basketball, and sometimes...SOMETIMES...wrestling will hit a lull because maybe creative can't seem to come up with something fresh. It's a struggling franchise and right now, the choices we have are either turning the channel or waiting it out. It's your choice.

Now, for all you 'smarks' who are more worried about whether Jeff Hardy will botch a spot or if Cena will do something to piss us off, try being a 'fan'. Try being someone who finds the positives about what's going on. Find a way to make things seem better about the product instead of suggesting they turn heel. Turning heel only worked as a solution for Hulk Hogan and Steve Austin. It's not the magic answer for everything. So do yourself a favor, stop being a mark for how much you're a 'smark' and become a fan again.