The Confusing Debacle that is TNA and their fan base

[Kenny Powers]

I don't understand how the forums can be better if TNA fans admit that WWE is better. WWE is better in terms of marketing, ratings, production, and many things, but that doesn't mean someone automatically should prefer WWE to TNA just because they are #1. I was a huge WWE fan ever since the 90s and early 80s. I never gave any other company the time of day. I just got into TNA 3 years ago. I still watch WWE and will give them credit when I see something I like. Just because I prefer TNA mostly over WWE doesn't mean that I or any other TNA fan is a blind mark.

Most people don't prefer TNA to WWE because its an alternative. Some people just prefer unscripted wrestling with a company that takes risks then compared to a company that is scripted sports entertainment that rarely takes risks at all due to their public image. Some TNA fans may unfairly criticize WWE, but a lot of WWE fans on here criticize TNA for no reason. I can't read one Raw ratings thread without someone bringing up TNA's low ratings. If something is bad in WWE people will say, "well at least it isn't as bad as TNA etc. etc.".

I give more criticism to TNA then anything. I don't even write about WWE, because I rarely watch it. To assume all TNA fans are idiots that watch TNA just to hate on WWE is ridiculous. There hasn't been anything to me lately exciting enough on WWE programming for me to talk about or even criticize. TNA has had a lot of things good and bad to talk about and criticize. Whether Impact is good or bad, at least you get something different. For the most part while I watch Raw every week, I feel like I'm watching the same show. It doesn't mean I hate WWE or their fans, it just means that I'm bored with the product.

I am open to be a bigger WWE fan again. If I don't enjoy TNA any more then maybe I'll watch WWE religiously again. I just haven't found anything to keep my interest every week. People shouldn't flame others on here just because they are fans of WWE or TNA. If someone criticizes one product, there is no need to bring up the other.

 

[JJYanks121]

Kenny, I hope that wasn't geared at me because that wasn't what I said at all. My message is that it SHOULD NOT be a contest between the 2 companies. It is stupid to compare the two, and it's stupid to have an agenda to prove that one is better than the other. I do believe that many TNA marks have that agenda, and I believe this place would be better if they had no agenda and simply enjoyed whatever product they chose.

My point is that people can enjoy both, and it's not about liking one over the other.

 

[TheTheDude]

I can remember back in 1997-1998ish when I would diligently wait til 12:00 am on saturday nights so I could watch an hour of ECW as pre-paid programming that consisted of 20 minutes of wrestling, 10 minutes of promos, and 30 minutes of commercials for ECW merch and videos. I was enthralled, because it was different. It got me excited in wrestling again, but then after November 2 Remember 98 i pretty much stopped watching, because ECW was not only losing talent to WWE but was getting national attention.

I imagine that's the way it is for most TNA fans today. The Product is going after a different audience and they feel alienated. I have never been a fan of Flair (i think me and Troy Martin are the only ones alive), Nash, Hall, Sting, etc, but when people at work talk about TNA thats who they point out. The well known names. Heck most people think that Hulk Hogan still works for the WWF, and don't know that its now WWE.

It's growing pains. As the company tries to expand its market they have to try to go with what historically works-- ie getting rid of the 6 sided ring in favor of the traditional squared circle. Trying their hand at building storylines and matches that arent just about having a powerbomb/superplex/hurricarana/ace cutter spot.

I don't agree with all of it, but then again I don't agree with everything WWE does either, and I figure if ROH really wanted me to see their product they would buy some late night saturday night pre-paid programming on a local station. It seems to me that the original or otherwise vocal TNA fanbase would rather see TNA remain a big fish in a small pond than to truly rival WWE

 

[shattered dreams]

However, the product has changed so much from the 2007 version that you would think these marks would be upset. Not the case.

It is now a company that features LESS wrestling than WWE and has a new image based around convoluted, often confusing stories with a focus on creating 90s wrestling in a 2010 environment. All of the things that made TNA a cult favorite have been stripped away, yet the same TNA fanboys that supported the direction are the ones who support it now stronger than ever. You would think that this doesn't make sense, but I will explain to you why it does.

The thing about this is that it implies people that liked TNA then thought it was perfect. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that was not the case. I know my personal opinion back then was that TNA did everything but the uppermid-main event scene better than WWE. Even though TNA has changed a lot in some areas, these changes are clearly not all negative. The main event scene in TNA is easily the best it has ever been right now IMO.

It is hard for me to buy into this x-division style dying etc. when the MCMG are the tag champs. I think TNA still has many similarities to what "it was." In fact, these so called confusing or whatever swerve stories are not necessarily a new thing. They are, however, under a greater microscope because the expectations have changed. I think this is where the hate came from. TNA's success bumped them from little engine that could to train. All of a sudden people felt the need to point out this little engine was not the best train yet in spite of that being obvious and nothing actually changing.

The quality of the wrestling is subjective but I know for me TNA wrestling is still much better than WWE. I'd probably watch WWE to an extent if I could stand their matches but I can't. The wrestling in TNA might not be done like it was a few years back but in some ways the present variety has its advantages over all X all the time. I think you may have missed that there actually are quite a few people who liked TNA then, especially for the indy wrestling style, who do not like it anymore as much.

I do not think people cared all that much that WWE had a monopoly until WWE gave them a reason to. Meaning when the WWE went through its first downturn people realized they missed the existence of the alternative choice. I do not really buy into the "fighting the man" thing. It is and always has been about the way the individual perceives the quality of WWE or really any other company. The reason many of us bring up WWE in comparison is that it is confusing how people bash TNA for things that WWE does. If the point is that all of wrestling sucks now then that is fine, but it is usually presented as a TNA only problem, which is unfair.

It is a sad state that fans have to take two companies of different sizes that offer programming on different days and compare them. As a writer, I cover both companies (well, my site does. I very rarely cover Impact or TNA PPVs because I have a guy who does so) and can find things I enjoy and do not enjoy in each. One thing that I am careful about though is comparing companies. You have to look at each match, each storyline, each plot twist in a vortex. To justify EVERYTHING your favorite company does is just lunacy, but TNA fans have taken to that in fear that if they don't, it is admittance that the WWE is better. This can't happen, because both companies have the capabilities of doing good and bad things. You cannot be blind to only see the good and to fight the bad even when you know it's bad yourself.

The first part of this paragraph is an IWC wide issue that I wish more people understood as well as you do. However, the problem with the second half is that it implies there is some universally obvious bad and good. Every story/action etc. is going to have people that love it, hate it and everything in-between. There is no "right" answer to is this good or bad because personal entertainment is a highly subjective thing. The thing is that when you are generally entertained by the majority of the product of course you are not going to want to waste your time nitpicking the few things you do not like. There is nothing enjoyable about that unless you are watching like a critic instead of a fan. That is how a lot of people that prefer WWE watch TNA and that is where the disconnect in discourse comes from. This whole idea that the TNA marks do not admit any flaws is ridiculously misguided. It basically comes from the idea that we frequently do not agree with certain criticisms many WWE prefers trumpet. Why are we wrong for stating our true beliefs on an issue? Why would we lie about how we feel about things? Some people need to get some perspective because us not sharing your opinion does not mean we are not being genuine. To suggest that is the case is extremely close minded.

 

[JJYanks121]

The thing about this is that it implies people that liked TNA then thought it was perfect. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that was not the case. I know my personal opinion back then was that TNA did everything but the uppermid-main event scene better than WWE. Even though TNA has changed a lot in some areas, these changes are clearly not all negative. The main event scene in TNA is easily the best it has ever been right now IMO.

It is hard for me to buy into this x-division style dying etc. when the MCMG are the tag champs. I think TNA still has many similarities to what "it was." In fact, these so called confusing or whatever swerve stories are not necessarily a new thing. They are, however, under a greater microscope because the expectations have changed. I think this is where the hate came from. TNA's success bumped them from little engine that could to train. All of a sudden people felt the need to point out this little engine was not the best train yet in spite of that being obvious and nothing actually changing.

The quality of the wrestling is subjective but I know for me TNA wrestling is still much better than WWE. I'd probably watch WWE to an extent if I could stand their matches but I can't. The wrestling in TNA might not be done like it was a few years back but in some ways the present variety has its advantages over all X all the time. I think you may have missed that there actually are quite a few people who liked TNA then, especially for the indy wrestling style, who do not like it anymore as much.

I do not think people cared all that much that WWE had a monopoly until WWE gave them a reason to. Meaning when the WWE went through its first downturn people realized they missed the existence of the alternative choice. I do not really buy into the "fighting the man" thing. It is and always has been about the way the individual perceives the quality of WWE or really any other company. The reason many of us bring up WWE in comparison is that it is confusing how people bash TNA for things that WWE does. If the point is that all of wrestling sucks now then that is fine, but it is usually presented as a TNA only problem, which is unfair.



The first part of this paragraph is an IWC wide issue that I wish more people understood as well as you do. However, the problem with the second half is that it implies there is some universally obvious bad and good. Every story/action etc. is going to have people that love it, hate it and everything in-between. There is no "right" answer to is this good or bad because personal entertainment is a highly subjective thing. The thing is that when you are generally entertained by the majority of the product of course you are not going to want to waste your time nitpicking the few things you do not like. There is nothing enjoyable about that unless you are watching like a critic instead of a fan. That is how a lot of people that prefer WWE watch TNA and that is where the disconnect in discourse comes from. This whole idea that the TNA marks do not admit any flaws is ridiculously misguided. It basically comes from the idea that we frequently do not agree with certain criticisms many WWE prefers trumpet. Why are we wrong for stating our true beliefs on an issue? Why would we lie about how we feel about things? Some people need to get some perspective because us not sharing your opinion does not mean we are not being genuine. To suggest that is the case is extremely close minded.

You make some good points throughout your post. I really do appreciate your take on things, but I want to just address a couple of points.

1) You are absolutely entitled to enjoy whatever product you choose. If you choose TNA, cool. If you choose WWE, cool. If you choose both, cool. What I don't like, and I'm not blaming you for this at all, is when enjoyment carries over into a battle of the brands. I just don't understand why everything one company does has to be under the microscope of fans of the other. And furthermore, why do fans have to "choose a side". I personally do not. Heck, I can't, because I am a writer and am paid to be objective of about any and all wrestling programming I cover. With that said, I'm a fan first and a critic second, so I tend to try and find enjoyment where I can.

2) You are correct in that there is no correct way to view "good and bad" and that everyone is entitled to enjoy different things. Why then must there always be defending of angles or matches that you like and others don't? That goes on both ends. If you don't like something, so be it. Some will, others won't. It's the nature of the beast. However, it is the company's responsibility to identify aspects of the business that MORE people like and go with those. If you happen to be in the minority, you kind of have to deal with it. An example here would be my other job. I work with a youth group, and our goal is to make the kids happy. If there is a program that more than half want, we're probably going to do it. If a few don't like it, that's a lot better than the majority not liking it. That is the responsibility of those in charge though (my board) to see. Thus, there will always be opposition, and often the opposition is louder than the majority, but the majority is served.

Why do I mention this? Because there will always be things that those of us like and don't like, but TNA, WWE, ROH, and whoever else has the responsibility of identifying what the most people will like. However, that means some will still not like it, but it doesn't mean that because you don't, you have to point to another company for comparison. Both sides are guilty of this, and it's quite annoying.

3) I have no problem with adapting to the product, but I do feel like a lot of fans who are stringent to one side will accept more things just because they don't want to jump sides or whatever. It's sad that it's come to this, and I dont' believe you, SD, are guilty of it, but some definitely are. All I know is that TNA has changed A LOT, in some ways positive, in other ways negative, and it's hard to imagine the same people selling it then and now, but it's definitely the case. In many ways, the company has become "more like the enemy" but it's still sold. Ya'll are like Billy Mays! I just don't understand why it has to be a competition. I really don't. Especially if WWE and TNA are on different nights. Watch whatever the hell you want, but no need to compare them. Pick what you like and just enjoy. After all, it's what being a fan is all about.

 

[Mr Jones]

I tried to keep faith and think TNA was just going through the motions- this is TRULY the lowest point creatively that this company has ever been in. Don't get me wrong, I'm not on of those wrestling fans who wants the attitude era back and whatnot, but the Hogan/Bischoff era for TNA is horrific. When the smoke clears, I get the feeling that 2011 will be the year that Panda Energy and Spike TV finally pulls the plug.

For the sake of competition, I want to see TNA succeed, but there's no denying that 2010 has been WRETCHED for the company.

I don't think TNA is dying, but damn if it isn't looking like how the AWA looked when the 80s were coming to a close.

 

[SpecialFNK]

when I think of why fans of the older TNA are upset with the way TNA is now, 2 things come to mind.. the X division and the 6 sided ring.
TNA right now does not focus much on the X division and the 6 sided ring is gone.
those 2 things made TNA different than WWE, but just because something is different does not make it right. the 6 sided ring was STUPID! different yes, but stupid. you don't see sports changing the field the play on. WWE created the XFL, different from the NFL. even though it had different rules it was still football played on a football field. wrestling should be done in a wrestling ring, which has 4 sides. I'm so glad the 6 sided ring is gone.

I have only really watched TNA since Hogan/Bischoff came on, and not very much before that. while I do think TNA could/should be better, I still do like the current product. it's not just about wrestling. I've said it before, wrestling is a sop opera. it should be a mixture of exciting/interesting story liens with promos and in ring wrestling. simple in ring wrestling all the time IMO would be boring.

I also think there are people who assume just because Hogan/Bischoff were in WCW which ended up going out of business they just connect that in thinking/assuming that Hogan/Bischoff must have been what destroyed WCW(which is not true) and that they will end up doing the same thing with TNA. there were numerous things that made the end of WCW.

I for one am excited in what Hogan and Bischoff are doing in TNA. while I think they could have/should have done certain things different and think some of the things they have done have been bad I'm still excited in some of what they have done/are doing and look forward to more. I like this new heel story line. Hogan/Bischoff were great heels in WCW.