No matter how hard WWE tried, Brock Lesnar as a heel ultimately failed

[BringThePain834]

This may be a highly unpopular opinion that I believe to be a fact. Why? Because he did everything he and Paul Heyman said he would do. Breaking the streak and beating Cena's ass for the title were both clean wins. He didn't do anything dirty, he didn't lie, he didn't cheat, which all of those things are what heels are supposed to do. He followed the rules and beat people down. Those are the traits of a face. Hell, he was even screwed out of the title twice. First by Money in the Bank at WrestleMania, and everybody knows what that led to. Then he had that title match with Rollins at Battleground, and he gets screwed again.

My point that is full on heel Brock Lesnar simply doesn't work and will never work again no matter how hard WWE tries.

Exhibit A:

[YOUTUBE]sDPtQpFTMb4[/YOUTUBE]

Vince McMahon about to fire Paul Heyman, Brock Lesnar's music hits and out he comes. "Oh no! Brock is here to do something to Vince! Where's Triple H? NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!" ..........and people cheered for this anyway

Exhibit B:

[YOUTUBE]jm7HWeqJklU[/YOUTUBE]

Batista says that nothing is going to change the fact that he will become WWE World Heavyweight Champion at WrestleMania 30, very heelishly might I add. Enter babyface Brock.

And Exhibit C:

[YOUTUBE]b0m-MJyGGiE[/YOUTUBE]

Plan C, Plan C. The "evil" Brock Lesnar and Paul Heyman plan to go after John Cena in a way to get the WWE World Heavyweight Championship away from him. Well, my question is how does the fans cheering the reveal of "Plan C" actually make it an evil plan? And ironically this Raw took place at the same arena that Lesnar first made his WWE return in to confront Cena and lay him out with an F5.

So yeah, keep him and Heyman as fan favorites.

 

[BestSportsEntertainer]

WWE doesn't try to make Brock Lesnar heel. At least, they don't do a good job in doing so.

Why should Brock Lesnar get heat? He shouldn't. Why? Then ask yourself what he does to garner heat? The answer is nothing.

When he pushed Zach Gowen down stairs, he got booed. When he attacked Josh Matthews backstage, he got booed. Why can't we get more stuff like this?

These days, he gets cheered. Wrecking cars will get cheered. Returning after a long absence will get cheered. Attacking an "out of touch owner" (according to many) will get cheered. Interrupting Batista and Randy Orton (two of the biggest heels in the company) will get cheered.

Basically, if you want to get heat, do stuff that gets heat. If you want to get cheered, do stuff that gets cheers. More often that not, Lesnar does stuff that gets cheers and gets cheered. Perhaps WWE wants Lesnar as a face, which I would say is "best for business."

 

[Navi]

This may be a highly unpopular opinion that I believe to be a fact. Why? Because he did everything he and Paul Heyman said he would do. Breaking the streak and beating Cena's ass for the title were both clean wins. He didn't do anything dirty, he didn't lie, he didn't cheat, which all of those things are what heels are supposed to do. He followed the rules and beat people down. Those are the traits of a face. Hell, he was even screwed out of the title twice. First by Money in the Bank at WrestleMania, and everybody knows what that led to. Then he had that title match with Rollins at Battleground, and he gets screwed again.

My point that is full on heel Brock Lesnar simply doesn't work and will never work again no matter how hard WWE tries.

Or it might just be something even more simplistic than that. The fans who attend these shows are desperate for someone to cheer, someone to get behind, and right now Lesnar is their guy.

They did it with Daniel Bryan, he's gone for the forseeable future. They're behind Ambrose, but he's not main eventing right now, and same with Ziggler. So who else do they have? Lesnar is the logical choice.

Some might argue Cena should be getting the loudest pops, but the reaction to him is half n half. Orton gets decent pops, but he's a heel at heart. And poor Reigns, he's sort of in the same boat as Cena. Some love him, some hate him, again a mixed reaction. Cesaro is getting there slowly but surely. Each week his reaction seems to be louder.

The problem right now is even though there is a lot of faces, the fans for some reason or another are only half assing it. The heels like Rollins, Owens, of course get a great heel heat, but faces have to work a little harder. It's getting there but takes longer.

So right now Lesnar is the biggest name that's a face, and the fans got behind him after his tiff with the Authority and don't look to be going away from him anytime soon. Bring Daniel Bryan back and you might see a huge difference, but as long as he's out of the picture, it's going to stay the way it is.

 

[d_henderson1810]

WWE doesn't try to make Brock Lesnar heel. At least, they don't do a good job in doing so.

Why should Brock Lesnar get heat? He shouldn't. Why? Then ask yourself what he does to garner heat? The answer is nothing.

When he pushed Zach Gowen down stairs, he got booed. When he attacked Josh Matthews backstage, he got booed. Why can't we get more stuff like this?

These days, he gets cheered. Wrecking cars will get cheered. Returning after a long absence will get cheered. Attacking an "out of touch owner" (according to many) will get cheered. Interrupting Batista and Randy Orton (two of the biggest heels in the company) will get cheered.

Basically, if you want to get heat, do stuff that gets heat. If you want to get cheered, do stuff that gets cheers. More often that not, Lesnar does stuff that gets cheers and gets cheered. Perhaps WWE wants Lesnar as a face, which I would say is "best for business."

Well, for starters, Brock hates wrestling, because he shows up when he feels like it, and takes money that harder-working guys on the roster don't make.

So, why not have Brock and Paul Heyman brag about how Brock has achieved everything in wrestling, and shows up when he wants to, and makes more money than anyone else.

Then, bring out a guy who doesn't get the same opportunities, the same TV time or the same money, but works harder and longer, and say how Brock is an ungrateful bitch. He has been handed everything and given back nothing to the industry, while others work their butt off and aren't given nearly as much.

This coming from a Zach Ryder, or some guy who the crowd has felt has not been given chances for years, would make people cheer that babyface, because he is (a) telling the truth, and (b) he was over already and fans would agree that he should have all the opportunities that Brock has, because this guy works harder and entertains for longer.

But then, people will still cheer Brock, since they share in his complete apathy about wrestling.

 

[Sexcellence of Sexecution]

Yeah you know who else failed as a heel? Stone Cold Steve Austin. I'm not talking about his horrendous heel run in 2001 either. Don't get me wrong, that was a failure, but I'm referring to his heel run prior to the famous double turn at Wrestlemania 13. The crowd was supposed to hate the guy and boo him, but they cheered the hell out of him. So he failed at doing the job of a heel, but he ultimately succeeded at becoming a megastar. It's the same case with Lesnar.

Look there's no question that Lesnar was being positioned as the biggest monster heel of all time coming off of his match with Taker at Mania 30, but since then he has become the most over babyface since Stone Cold, and even though it wasn't by design that's okay. Lesnar has become something very very special as a babyface. It was a transition that was completely natural and unexpected, and entirely fan driven. If you would have asked any wrestling fan if the man that ended Undertaker's streak would become the top babyface in the company and would even get cheered over the Undertaker himself, no one would believe it to be even remotely possible. That is what Lesnar has become. So yes, his heel run failed but it was for the greater good. He has become so much more as a babyface.

The interesting question though, is why/how did this happen? And there are three main reasons.
1. Legitimacy. Everyone knows that Brock Lesnar is for real, and reality always draws in wrestling. This mystique is the main reason why he is so elevated above the rest of the roster. He embodies the big fight feel, and people respond to that.
2. John Cena. His first feud after ending the streak was with John Cena for the World Title. From half the audience John Cena automatically gets heat, and so naturally these fans will cheer his opponent. In this case Lesnar. So already we have Lesnar getting mixed reactions, setting the stage for an eventual turn. Magnifying this is the fact that Lesnar beat him for the belt, and beat him in a manner we have never ever seen Cena beaten before. Certain fans ate this shit up especially, but that win added to his mystique overall. By January Lesnar was over huge as a babyface, and every Lesnar match between Mania 30 and January of the next year featured John Cena. Cena was undeniably a huge factor.
3. Lesnar doesn't give a fuck. The WWE as a company has never been more hated by its fan base. Brock Lesnar is the complete opposite of a company man. He doesn't give a fuck about the WWE and he's there just to kick ass and get paid. This is something that certain fans in particular respond to. In a broader sense this attitude just adds to his general badass demeanor. And people by and large like badasses. Notice that Lesnar isn't like other babyfaces, he never ever high fives the fans on the way to the ring. Little actions like thay speak volumes. Also in transitioning from being a heel to a babyface Lesnar's attitude has largely remained unchanged. Again, because he doesn't give a fuck. This is what people like about him.

Since the Road to Wrestlemania 31 Lesnar has been booked as a babyface. He is clearly being put in a position to be cheered now rather than booed. The Kofi match and Bo Dallas segment are good examples. Also he was screwed by a chickenshit heel and set up to chase the belt. Classic babyface booking. Even with the Undertaker rematch he was booked as a babyface. It basically was just a big face vs face match, but if anyone was acting more like the heel in that whole angle is was the Undertaker, not Lesnar. Going forward, Lesnar will continue to be positioned as a badass babyface, because at the end of the day the people just want to fucking cheer the guy.

 

[Teddy Irving]

This may be a highly unpopular opinion that I believe to be a fact. Why? Because he did everything he and Paul Heyman said he would do. Breaking the streak and beating Cena's ass for the title were both clean wins. He didn't do anything dirty, he didn't lie, he didn't cheat, which all of those things are what heels are supposed to do. He followed the rules and beat people down. Those are the traits of a face. Hell, he was even screwed out of the title twice. First by Money in the Bank at WrestleMania, and everybody knows what that led to. Then he had that title match with Rollins at Battleground, and he gets screwed again.

My point that is full on heel Brock Lesnar simply doesn't work and will never work again no matter how hard WWE tries.

Not every heel has to cheat to win. It's a trait that is common among heels but not necessary. Hell HHH won matches clean as well in his prime heel days. Eddie was a face and he cheated all the time, guess he was a failure as a face then??

Are you going to tell me that Rusev wasn't a heel going into wrestlemania as well? He won clean all the time. Never used shortcuts and beat his opponents fair. Yet he got booed?

When he was going up against Rollins somebody had to be the temporary face. Heel vs Heel matches don't work the fans have to cheer for somebody. Rollins is full time and the future of the company. He needed to remain as the heel so Brock turned into a temporary face.

People booed Brock when he faced Taker at Mania, they hated him for ending the streak so booed him after Mania.

They cheered him against Cena, simply because the majority of older fans who tend to be the most vocal "hate" Cena. If Brock was put in against Ambrose, Ziggler or Cesaro fans would have boo'd him.

He was boo'd against Taker at SS as well. It is all to do with who he is paired up against and nothing to do with his dominant fashion of winning matches

 

[Jack-Hammer]

In some ways, I have to disagree. When Lesnar returned and began his program with Triple H, he was getting booed for quite a bit because they ultimately portrayed him as, essentially, what he is: a high priced mercenary who doesn't particularly care about WWE, MMA or anything else for that matter. This was when Big Johnny was on the air and Lesnar "held WWE hostage" by wanting an even more lucrative contract than he already had. He also demanded that, in the show's opening promo, it'd say something like "WWE Monday Night Raw Starring Brock Lesnar", which they did for approximately 1 week. Lesnar continued to be booed throughout his program with Triple H, though it's not surprising that they cheered when he put Vince in the F-5 as Vince was arguably the most hated heel in pro wrestling history for years. Lesnar was booed in his program against CM Punk, he was booed by fans during his brief programs with Mark Henry & Big Show, he was booed during his program with The Undertaker for WrestleMania XXX and he's still booed to this day whenever Paul Heyman harps about Lesnar ending the streak.

So no, I don't believe they failed whatsoever with Lesnar as a heel and we all know that there are numerous smarks out there who deliberately cheer for heels almost no matter what. Lesnar, whether a heel or tweener, is portrayed as this ultra tough, nigh unstoppable badass who can take on any challenger, though he'd be completely one dimensional if he didn't have Paul Heyman as his mouthpiece. They could plant a local indie wrestler in the audience with a cast around his leg & on crutches, some normal looking guy without 20 inch biceps, have Lesnar drag him out over the barrier, smack the piss out of any security personnel who tried to stop him, beat the absolute crap out of this "crippled" kid by giving him about a dozen or so trips to Suplex City before planting him in the middle of the ring with an F-5 and, just to match things out, put him in a Kimura Lock and "break" his arm so that he has a matching set and there are fans who would still cheer the shit outta the guy for doing it.

One of the few ways to probably get genuine heat on Lesnar would be for him to carry out unprovoked attacks in wrestlers that all fans, but especially smarks, love to cheer for like Daniel Bryan, Dolph Ziggler, Dean Ambrose, Cesaro, Neville and a handful of others.

 

[Mustang Sally]

Well, for starters, Brock hates wrestling, because he shows up when he feels like it, and takes money that harder-working guys on the roster don't make.

All that, in addition to the rantings of Paul Heyman, are what cast Brock as a heel the first couple years into his return to WWE. No matter how well he wrestled, the 'mercenary' aspect of his tenure was real, in addition to part of the storyline. We could guess how other hard-working members of the roster might feel about Brock's deal.....and perhaps it made some of us think of our own workplace situations, in which we saw people advanced over us whom we felt were not deserving.

In addition to all that, Brock did no 'acting.' He came out, did whatever fighting the script called for, and left......often for months. Plus, there was always the threat he'd leave when his contract expired and return to MMA. How could we see him as anything other than a bad guy?

But look at it now. The whole Dana White business has been dispensed with and Brock has publicly announced he'd rather work for WWE. That alone would turn many fans into Brock appreciators......but there's more.

He seems much more into the part now; the look on his face when Undertaker suddenly appeared in the ring to confront him, was priceless. He didn't do that before; the only thing we got from him was a smirk as Heyman stood in the ring extolling Brock's virtues. Watching Brock play to the crowd is a positive, too.....it makes us believe he really wants to be here, which adds to his new image as a hero.

I don't think his period of 'heel-dom' was a failure......Brock & WWE accomplished what they wanted to.......yet I vastly prefer what's going on now because his attitude seems to reconcile with his wrestling mission ......adding up to a more pleasurable viewing experience for us.

 

[DualShock]

Fans cheer Brock because he is that type of character fans wanted for years since Stone Cold left. A big part of WWEs fanbase are still these older fans asking for WWE to be less family-friendly, less PG and more Attitude Era like that blurred the lines of babyface-heel, black or white so you can't give the fans Brock Lesnar who is representing all of this and make the fans boo him only because Vince and Triple H said he is supposed to be a heel. He would be booed guaranteed if it was still the Attitude Era because in that era there were enough babyfaces who acted like Brock many fans could identify with so they would accept Brock as a heel.
That's like the Chris Jericho SummerSlam 1999 promo, when he said in 1999 that he came to WWE to save it, that the whole company is boring and called the event SummerShame many fans laughed and treated him as a comedy act because WWE was back then red hot and there was nothing to be saved but if he did that promo 10 years later at SummerSlam 2009 everybody would cheer him for that

 

[kumarjtk]

nowaidays people love to cheer heels and whoever's against cena and roman reigns.
so I won't care about those cheers. even Brock get cheers when he go against cena last summerslam. even their prime heel Rollins get cheered against cena. Brock is not a face he is heel and tweener. if he go against Bryan then he gets booed out of arena.

 

[George Steele's Barber]

Professional wrestling fans have the worst memories...

Brock was getting near universal negative heat when he was in the heel role. His 'I'm just here to get paid' stuff worked. The smarks believed it. They forgot how much they don't love their jobs and how they would do the same thing as Brock if they could. They really thought he hated pro wrestling. Pro wrestling is not meat packing or being a cashier - you can't do it if you hate it. It is too dangerous. He may have chosen to not do the road like most everyone else but he never hated wrestling and entertainment.

But moving on, the guy got people to cheer for HHH. HHH! The guy every smark was born to hate. Brock gave Punk his last great match. He got people to root for a guy they now chant to retire. He was an amazing heel.

And now that has changed. The smarks love him ever since he got the rub from UT. That meant something, it made it impossible to continue to believe that Brock was just there for a pay check. Throw in his decisive win over Cena and 'Suplex City Bitch' and there was no keeping him a heel for much longer.

But he was the only truly effective heel wrestler WWE had in their line up for a time.

 

[stingray11214]

Well, for starters, Brock hates wrestling, because he shows up when he feels like it, and takes money that harder-working guys on the roster don't make.

So, why not have Brock and Paul Heyman brag about how Brock has achieved everything in wrestling, and shows up when he wants to, and makes more money than anyone else.

Then, bring out a guy who doesn't get the same opportunities, the same TV time or the same money, but works harder and longer, and say how Brock is an ungrateful bitch. He has been handed everything and given back nothing to the industry, while others work their butt off and aren't given nearly as much.

This coming from a Zach Ryder, or some guy who the crowd has felt has not been given chances for years, would make people cheer that babyface, because he is (a) telling the truth, and (b) he was over already and fans would agree that he should have all the opportunities that Brock has, because this guy works harder and entertains for longer.

But then, people will still cheer Brock, since they share in his complete apathy about wrestling.

First of all, brilliant post. Brock is first, last and always about the money. He is a mercenary from the word go. If it were not for Rena Lesnar, he would be living in a cave hunting for food and loving it. He does NOT need WWE. WWE NEEDS Brock. As for having someone saying that Brock stole their chances? Nobody is that stupid to get into a storyline like that. Do you think anyone is going to want to be on the receiving end of what may turn out to be a worked shoot fight with the Beast Incarnate?

 

[BestSportsEntertainer]

First of all, brilliant post. Brock is first, last and always about the money. He is a mercenary from the word go. If it were not for Rena Lesnar, he would be living in a cave hunting for food and loving it. He does NOT need WWE. WWE NEEDS Brock. As for having someone saying that Brock stole their chances? Nobody is that stupid to get into a storyline like that. Do you think anyone is going to want to be on the receiving end of what may turn out to be a worked shoot fight with the Beast Incarnate?

WWE doesn't need Brock. Also, most marks would 100% buy into that.

 

[Aquaman6686]

First of all, brilliant post. Brock is first, last and always about the money. He is a mercenary from the word go. If it were not for Rena Lesnar, he would be living in a cave hunting for food and loving it. He does NOT need WWE. WWE NEEDS Brock. As for having someone saying that Brock stole their chances? Nobody is that stupid to get into a storyline like that. Do you think anyone is going to want to be on the receiving end of what may turn out to be a worked shoot fight with the Beast Incarnate?

WWE does NOT need Brock Lesnar. If Lesnar once again decided to ditch WWE to pursue one of his "real" dreams, maybe professional soccer next time, WWE wouldn't hurt one bit. Brock Lesnar is nothing but a money-hungry scumbag.

As much as I hated him as a talk show host, Jon Stewart was right. WRESTLING FANS will always hate Brock Lesnar, because he ended The Streak. If Lesnar truly did have respect for the industry, he would have said no and refused to do it, the same way Kane and Kurt Angle did.

Brock Lesnar coming back is the worst thing that ever happened to WWE in my book, and that will never change.

 

[Prince Vee]

WWE has learned from their mistakes I persume. They finally had started to listening to the fans at least on few things. WWE universe fancy the idea of Suplex City B***h thingy and it's garnacing the face status of Brock among the fans. That's the reason why WWE doesn't try to make him a heel again. Hell, they even made him look like a face against The Undertaker albeit it was him who broke the Streak!

In other side, it's the type of superstars whom Brock feuds with, it also is the key for him to be the face as WWE seriously lacks the MainEvent level Baby face. Anyhow why should we complain against the best thing in Sports Entertainment history?

Cheers!!

 

[LuckyLouie]

Brock is Brock.

There are a few men in this business/world who surpas what they do.

In terms of wrestling, there are only few men who rose above wrestling to become icons.

Bruno Sammartino
Hulk Hogan
Ric Flair
John Cena
Brock Lesnar
The Rock

To me, these are all the guys in USA who are wayyy above wrestling. They are a draw within themselves.

The Rock is not a wrestler, he is a world superstart. Just like Hogan and Flair. Everyone knows these guys. No matter what they play, the good or the bad guy. People want to see them no matter what.

As much as I love Orton, I dont care for him pondering to me. Since I know thats not who he is.

But Brock comes in, does his thing, and leaves.
Just like Big Show said in an interview, how he should have been used sparingly to make him look like a monster.

Brock is a beast. He comes in, kicks ass. Everyone, the good and bad. He is a tweener.

People dont care is Brock is being meant to them or not. They just want to see him come in, wreck shit up and leave. Just like Goldberg.

 

[BestSportsEntertainer]

Brock is Brock.

There are a few men in this business/world who surpas what they do.

In terms of wrestling, there are only few men who rose above wrestling to become icons.

Bruno Sammartino
Hulk Hogan
Ric Flair
John Cena
Brock Lesnar
The Rock

To me, these are all the guys in USA who are wayyy above wrestling. They are a draw within themselves.

The Rock is not a wrestler, he is a world superstart. Just like Hogan and Flair. Everyone knows these guys. No matter what they play, the good or the bad guy. People want to see them no matter what.

As much as I love Orton, I dont care for him pondering to me. Since I know thats not who he is.

But Brock comes in, does his thing, and leaves.
Just like Big Show said in an interview, how he should have been used sparingly to make him look like a monster.

Brock is a beast. He comes in, kicks ass. Everyone, the good and bad. He is a tweener.

People dont care is Brock is being meant to them or not. They just want to see him come in, wreck shit up and leave. Just like Goldberg.

You are very much overrating Lesnar. He's nowhere close to Hogan or Rock. That's really the only two recognizable names among non-wrestling fans.

 

[Terry Gyimah]

To me Brock is an icon and the fact that he is not even an icon but a beast I mean when he is in the ring it is always a sight to see because Brock is a once-in-a-lifetime type superstar there is no one like Brock Lesnar probably never ever will be again

 

[kadroan]

This may be a highly unpopular opinion that I believe to be a fact. Why? Because he did everything he and Paul Heyman said he would do. Breaking the streak and beating Cena's ass for the title were both clean wins. He didn't do anything dirty, he didn't lie, he didn't cheat, which all of those things are what heels are supposed to do. He followed the rules and beat people down. Those are the traits of a face. Hell, he was even screwed out of the title twice. First by Money in the Bank at WrestleMania, and everybody knows what that led to. Then he had that title match with Rollins at Battleground, and he gets screwed again.

My point that is full on heel Brock Lesnar simply doesn't work and will never work again no matter how hard WWE tries.

Exhibit A:

[YOUTUBE]sDPtQpFTMb4[/YOUTUBE]

Vince McMahon about to fire Paul Heyman, Brock Lesnar's music hits and out he comes. "Oh no! Brock is here to do something to Vince! Where's Triple H? NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!" ..........and people cheered for this anyway

Exhibit B:

[YOUTUBE]jm7HWeqJklU[/YOUTUBE]

Batista says that nothing is going to change the fact that he will become WWE World Heavyweight Champion at WrestleMania 30, very heelishly might I add. Enter babyface Brock.

And Exhibit C:

[YOUTUBE]b0m-MJyGGiE[/YOUTUBE]

Plan C, Plan C. The "evil" Brock Lesnar and Paul Heyman plan to go after John Cena in a way to get the WWE World Heavyweight Championship away from him. Well, my question is how does the fans cheering the reveal of "Plan C" actually make it an evil plan? And ironically this Raw took place at the same arena that Lesnar first made his WWE return in to confront Cena and lay him out with an F5.

So yeah, keep him and Heyman as fan favorites.

They don't put Brock in a box which is a great thing. They let him be himself. I think he's a great heel/face. WWE does a great job with him.