Is The WWE Determined To Rewrite History?

[Dave]

This is a thought that I have been mulling over for a few months now and I don't think it has ever been so apparent.

It all started with a Beast and a Deadman. For me, the streak should never have been broken. That piece of history meant more to wrestling fans than Championship reigns do these days. 21 people before Brock stepped up and 21 people went down to The Undertaker. I do appreciate the need for the Streak to mean something in the long term and it has certainly taken Brock Lesnar to a whole new level of dominance. For me though, it was the start of a worrying trend in the WWE where nothing is sacred and everything is do-able.

The next one to rise to the peak of my interest was The New Day's Tag Championship reign that put Demolition into second spot by 5 whole days. I don't believe that either team are the best teams that have ever been but I simply cannot buy that New Day were worth that accomplishment.

John Cena was the next one up in the new trend of the WWE trying to go one better than what was before. He recently equalled Ric Flair's total of 16 Championship reigns. Which, you could argue, was a great accomplishment for a man who has given everything to the WWE. But you'll have to go some to convince me that John Cena is half the wrestler that the Nature Boy was. And, it must be said, you're crazy if you don't think that John Cena will get another run with the belt before he rides off to Hollywood.

The Miz, too, is probably going to be the IC Champion with the most reigns. Jericho is a legend in the WWE and in wrestling. He is an industry icon with the pedigree to boot. The Miz, as much as I like the work he does, came from an MTV show and , somehow, managed to make it work. I have absolutely no doubt in my mind that he will pass Jericho before too long.

So with all of that in mind, I am asking you if you believe that nothing is sacred in the WWE? In 10 years time, will all of the records that we find to be notable right now be washed away with mediocrity? I get that the WWE needs to make Championship reigns seem like a big deal to sell characters and matches. But at what cost?

 

[Vintage Punk]

Most likely they will have Asuka's undefeated streak be broken by Rousey. That's another one. All about the name just as it was with Lesnar. I like Miz too but to think he would have more reigns as IC title champ then the likes of Jericho, Shawn Michaels, Bret Hart, etc. just leaves a bad taste. The WWE needs to think long and hard before they make decisions that will get initial shock value but will leave them with regret afterward or down the line as was the case with Brock defeating the streak.

 

[Rulk25]

2 things to point out
1) not only will Miz pass Jericho for most reigns...he will also soon pass Pedro Morales for most days
2) They also made a big deal of Bella holding the title long enough to pass AJ Lee so much so that they cut the lgs out of the Revolution

 

[therockiswwf]

Records are made to be broken. We have two world/midcard titles and split roster weekly TV shows. Tons of PPV. We are nearing the ends of the careers of people who started around 2002. 2002 was the year of the first split. So obviously people would have inflated title reign counts.

Not really sure I understand what the complaint is.

 

[Psykohurricane55]

If they can make money with it then they will break every records they can break. Look at some of the Records they broken lately.

You mention the undertaker's streak being broken. The reason behind it wasn't to help Lesnar look dominant, it was to increase subscribers to the WWE network since it was brand new at the time and they wanted to send a message that anything could happens. So that's the reason they broke the streak

The new day thing was because Vince was mad at Demolition for suing him so they let the new day beat their record. Same goes for Nikki Bella beating AJ Lee's record.

As for miz, i think it's more because he's done so much for WWE that they wanted to reward him for all his hard work.

As for what's record that might break next.

Right now, as far as Records they could make a lot of money breaking, The first one that comes to mind is Asuka's streak. If you put her in the right match with the right opponent, they could make a lot of money with that match and the match after her first lost.

The other one that could be big money is Cena beating ric flair's record, Again if you do it at the right event (one of the big four) with the right opponent, they could make a lot of money with it.

Outside of that, unless Vince is angry at somebody that has a record, they won'T touch any of them because anyway for Vince, he doesn't take theses record seriously anyway, their just Stats inside a entertainment show and means pretty much nothing and i kinda agree with this.

It's fun to heard about those records and everything but it's not like they mean anything anyway. Wrestling isn'T a real sports, so it shouldn't be treated in the same way as baseball, hockey, football or any other professional sports. they are telling story and part of those story are the record, when they end them or beat them is because they want to tell another story for another performer, that's as simple as that.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

When I saw the title of the thread, I thought that Vince had embarked on a long quest of revising history in order to make history reflect how he thinks it should. He likes to do that sometimes and I thought he'd done something like claim the WWE Championship is now part of Olympic gold medal lineage or something.

We've heard stuff like records are meant to be broken a lot whenever topics like this are discussed and while it might come off as something of a crutch, it's pretty much the truth.

A lot of people were pissed when Hank Aaron took the honor of having the most home runs in MLB history from Babe Ruth just like some felt when Barry Bonds took the honor himself. In New Japan, both Hiroshi Tanahashi and Kazuchika Okada have eclipsed the Great Muta's records of most defenses and cumulative days as IWGP Heavyweight Champion. Someday, someone may well exceed Wilt Chamberlain's records of scoring 100 points in a single game. The world doesn't stand still for the sake of nostalgia and greatness can come along at any given time.

In regards to Taker's streak, I wasn't so much upset that it ended but that it was ended by Brock Lesnar. I always felt that if the streak was to end that it should've been ended by someone who would've really gained something from it, some fresh faced wrestler who already wasn't a mega star in the industry.

In regards to the WWE Tag Team Championship record, I've got no problem with New Day breaking Demolition's record. I agree with Dave's sentiment that there have been better teams than New Day who may have deserved the distinction but, then again, I can most definitely say the same thing about Demolition. To me, Demolition was a poor man's version of the Road Warriors and, in my opinion, New Day's an infinitely better tag team than they were.

As far as Ric Flair's official record of World Championships being tied by Cena, and possibly exceeded someday, it didn't come as any sort of shock or surprise to me and it won't if he winds up breaking the record. To be perfectly honest, I'm surprised it took as long as it did to tie it and I figured he would've beaten it long before now. If it happens, then it happens. I might not necessarily be thrilled about it but, to me, there are worse things that can happen in wrestling.

When it comes to Jericho's record of 9 Intercontinental Championships possibly being tied or broken by Miz, I think it'll happen, I've said as much before and I hope it does. I don't care if Miz was originally the star of a reality show any more than I would care Jericho was originally a wrestler if Fozzy puts out an album that wins the Grammy Award for Best Metal Performance. Miz is a talented guy who paid his dues, stuck it out through rough times and has worked his ass off. Sure Jericho is a legend, but Miz will be as well as much as that might seem like a kick in the nuts to some and that's not to say that I'm putting Miz on the same level as Jericho. I just don't find the notion of Miz beating Jericho's record a travesty; in my opinion, an example of a travesty is that the longest single Intercontinental Championship reign in history is held by a Elvis impersonator instead of someone like Randy Savage, Curt Hennig, Bret Hart, Scott Hall, the Rock, Stone Cold Steve Austin, Triple H or Chris Jericho.

 

[FN-2187]

I don't think it's a matter of nothing being sacred, it's more of people not letting go of the past. Records/streaks are made to be broken, things change, it's a part of life.

 

[Jeff Deliverer of Mail]

There's still one or two sacred records that will most likely never be broken, simply because this is a completely different era.

Bruno Sammartino's 2800 plus day reign of the Heavyweight Title is still intact, nobody will touch that for the longest Heavyweight Title reign in the company.

Andre The Giant went 15 years before he was pinned by Hulk Hogan. A 15 year undefeated streak (Even though he was used as a sideshow attraction more than a serious, regular wrestler for a chunk of his earlier career)
That would be like Asuka going another 13 years before anyone beating her in WWE. It'll never happen. The attention span of today's fans are very short and wouldn't deal with such a reign.

 

[FromGlasgow]

Personally I don't think too much of these records as its not a true account of someones ability its just whatever Vince Mcmahon decides at the time, Nobody is claiming New Day's record tag reign makes them the greatest tag team of all time, The tag team division was very weak during New Days reign but the late 80's during Demolitions reign I would say the tag team division was the best it had ever been at that point but neither is anyone saying Demolition was the greatest tag team of all time. If they never mentioned it I wouldn't have even noticed.
Bruno Sammartino's first world title reign lasted like 8 years I don't think anyone will ever beat that.
The only thing I would have kept was Takers undefeated streak at Wrestlemania as it was becoming more exciting than the world title match, I also think Brock breaking it was a waste I don't think it did anything for Brock but someone like Roman Reigns breaking it for the first time would have at least been huge for Roman Reigns.
WWE is still a business its never been about who does or doesn't deserve a title if they know they can generate interest in promoting John Cena's record world titles attempt they will if they know they can make money out of it. Perhaps in 20 years we will be talking about Roman Reigns beating John Cena's 17 world titles record but its all about making money.

 

[Deoxyribonucleic A.C.I.D.]

What does it really matter? Records are made to be broken, history moves forward and let's be honest here. It's bussiness. Will Ric Flair and Demolition come out and wrestle? No they won't. So having a tag team that are the longest tag team champs in history and a guy that has the most world title championships, be on the active roster, it just makes them a bigger deal and a bigger draw. And since they're staying on the active roster, their matches can be a bigger deal.

For example, look at Reigns vs Lesnar from Wrestlemania 34. You have the two people that have defeated The Undertaker, go one-on-one, for the Universal Championship. There's just so much money and headlines to be made out of that sentence, and it automatically sells the match, so anything else they do for the build-up, it's going to be the icing on the cake.

 

[stingray11214]

History is written by the victors. JCP, the AWA, World Class, USWA, CWF and WCW are now owned by WWE. They can write and rewrite history as they see fit. As much as we may hate or despise it, as the records mean nothing in the world of Sports Entertainment, we accept it or we go somewhere else. But, we can rest easy for that those of us who are fans of professional wrestling will always cherish the greats who were elevated by the fans, rather than the "greats" being rammed down our throats.

 

[shooter_mcgavin]

I don't think it's a matter of nothing being sacred, it's more of people not letting go of the past. Records/streaks are made to be broken, things change, it's a part of life.

I agree but the problem I see with the WWE is that records are broken not organically but instead its to spite somoene else or a group of people and the broken record is just wasted.

example

1.) Orton beats Benoit for the World Title at Summer Slam 2004 becoming the youngest World Champion in history. This was, of course, was done so that Brock Lesnar who walked out of the company earlier in the year from having that record. Now there were probably other factors tha led to the decision for Orton to go over Benoit for the title but I am pretty sure a majority of the decision making had to go with breaking Lesnar's record. In the end this actually hurt Orton a lot since they had to hotshot his main event push, which he wasn't ready for yet, and bombed as a top babyface and derailed him and took 3 years to actually recover from that.

2. ) Nikki Bella breaking AJ Lee's record as the longest reining diva's champion. This was obviously done because AJ is CM Punk's wife and, as we all know, in WWE backstage heat is trasferable to a family member (Matt Hardy after Jeff Hardy didn't resign) or, in this case, your partner. Nikki Bella is an ok talent but had no business carrying the Diva's Title as long as she did. In the end it just delayed the Women's Revolution movmement and set it back for months and really dragged the whole division down when Nikki is the face of the division. Like I said she's an ok talent but had no business being top top woman for that long. This motive was extra obvious Nikki dropped the title not long after she broke the record.

3. New Day breaking Demolition's record. Again this was done because Demolition was suing the WWE and I am 99% sure they broke the record so that it won't be held by Demolition anymore. This was the probably most obvious example because of how they were booked as champions. Basically they jobbed or lost every match where the title is on the line even being the first to be eliminated at that Tag Team Survivor Series Elimination Match. Look at their win loss record in PPV matches not involving the title and you can see them losing all of them. It really made them look like lame duck champions and only held it as long as it did to break the record. And, of course, like Nikki the moment they broke the record they lost the title at the next PPV.

So yeah records are made to be broken but it has to be done in an organic way that is believable and without an ulterior motive because there's heat with another party. Unfortunatley for WWE most records tend to be broken because of said heat and actually does hurt the product.

 

[d_henderson1810]

This is a thought that I have been mulling over for a few months now and I don't think it has ever been so apparent.

It all started with a Beast and a Deadman. For me, the streak should never have been broken. That piece of history meant more to wrestling fans than Championship reigns do these days. 21 people before Brock stepped up and 21 people went down to The Undertaker. I do appreciate the need for the Streak to mean something in the long term and it has certainly taken Brock Lesnar to a whole new level of dominance. For me though, it was the start of a worrying trend in the WWE where nothing is sacred and everything is do-able.

The next one to rise to the peak of my interest was The New Day's Tag Championship reign that put Demolition into second spot by 5 whole days. I don't believe that either team are the best teams that have ever been but I simply cannot buy that New Day were worth that accomplishment.

John Cena was the next one up in the new trend of the WWE trying to go one better than what was before. He recently equalled Ric Flair's total of 16 Championship reigns. Which, you could argue, was a great accomplishment for a man who has given everything to the WWE. But you'll have to go some to convince me that John Cena is half the wrestler that the Nature Boy was. And, it must be said, you're crazy if you don't think that John Cena will get another run with the belt before he rides off to Hollywood.

The Miz, too, is probably going to be the IC Champion with the most reigns. Jericho is a legend in the WWE and in wrestling. He is an industry icon with the pedigree to boot. The Miz, as much as I like the work he does, came from an MTV show and , somehow, managed to make it work. I have absolutely no doubt in my mind that he will pass Jericho before too long.

So with all of that in mind, I am asking you if you believe that nothing is sacred in the WWE? In 10 years time, will all of the records that we find to be notable right now be washed away with mediocrity? I get that the WWE needs to make Championship reigns seem like a big deal to sell characters and matches. But at what cost?

As long as the Honky Tonk Man's IC record title reign is beaten, and the taint that has remained on the title for 30 years from having an Elvis impersonator joke can finally be washed away.

 

[d_henderson1810]

There's still one or two sacred records that will most likely never be broken, simply because this is a completely different era.

Bruno Sammartino's 2800 plus day reign of the Heavyweight Title is still intact, nobody will touch that for the longest Heavyweight Title reign in the company.

Andre The Giant went 15 years before he was pinned by Hulk Hogan. A 15 year undefeated streak (Even though he was used as a sideshow attraction more than a serious, regular wrestler for a chunk of his earlier career)
That would be like Asuka going another 13 years before anyone beating her in WWE. It'll never happen. The attention span of today's fans are very short and wouldn't deal with such a reign.

Also, what about the Fabulous Moolah's 28-year WWF Women's Title reign? That will never be surpassed either, even by Asuka.

 

[HORRORHOLIC]

I don't think all records are made to be broken, or at least shouldn't be. Someone such as Ric Flair for example, that's such a big part of his legacy and I think he deserved to hold on to that record.

 

[Spidey Revivey]

I don't think it's about records being broken. Sure, that is sort of the reason why we have records to begin with, but it seems that they're being broken at an unusual pace lately.

2013 - Roman Reigns tied for most Survivor Series eliminations, attendance record broken at Wrestlemania

2014 - Roman Reigns broke Royal Rumble eliminations at 12, Undertaker's Streak ended (21-1)

2015 - Everything about Wrestlemania 31 apparently

2016 - New Day became longest reigning tag team champions, more Wrestlemania records broken

2017 - Longest title drought by a man (Goldberg), Asuka's undefeated streak, Bliss being longest Raw Women's Champion, Jericho's Royal Rumble longevity, Charlotte's PPV streak ended, etc etc etc

2018 - ???



All of these within the last four years. It's sort of crazy that WWE is applying pressure to these things. My guess is that they want to buff up how their modern program looks compared to wrestling from back in the day, which is understandable. When you have a product, you want it to look good and new. But I'm with those who say it spoils the fun a little. They are determined to break every record they can think to break in a ten year frame it seems. I watch wrestling for the drama, and while setting records and breaking them is part of it, it shouldn't be the crown jewel. I want to watch Jericho be awesome, not be reminded that hey he was in a match longer than the other guys. New Day's run is well-deserved. I can't think of a better face team in the past ten years. But nobody cares if Roman ties the Survivor record, or if Bliss is holding on to a title for a long time when it's only been around for two years.

It's fluff.

 

[ISkye]

They've been trying to do this for over a decade. Yes. It's 2018. Titles and records mean absolutely nothing in sports entertainment at this point and haven't for years. You can pretend they do, because of a night of shock or something like when Undertaker's streak got broken. That's the biggest example more than likely and while people care it's nowhere as near as dire or grave as it would have been in the early years of modern pro-wrestling.

People are desensitized. They can put whatever narrative they want out there and WWE centric fans will lay down and take it. It legit just doesn't matter.

Wrestling is also mostly about money. It's a performance art, but one that draws money. Hot topics draw money. Times change and so do audiences. So with that so do the hot and trending topics. Vince did well because he could create his own buzz and made great business choices. He destroyed his own market and became older and just lost touch with the current business that he literally monopolized. When you fail to create your own buzz and acknowledge what is buzzing business goes down. When you're Triple H or the current WWE regime you take the buzz from other people with offers of money and luxury and rebrand it to your own. Then business does a little better more and more.

Changing stuff that people have grown accustomed to is just part of the business of pro-wrestling. Especially content and aesthetic wise. Since it's predetermined... Records. Title Reigns. are all victim to the creative decision. It's meant to be broken quite literally.

 

[LibSuperstar]

It’s been their SOP since forever, which is quite wack. But I think it’s harder to do that nowadays when ppl can look stuff up.

Also, what about the Fabulous Moolah's 28-year WWF Women's Title reign? That will never be surpassed either, even by Asuka.

This is a perfect example of WWE’s revisionist work. Moolah’s reign was really 10 yrs at most and she lost the belt several times. When she sold the title to WWF in the ‘80s and they made that record up.

 

[Rayne]

So with all of that in mind, I am asking you if you believe that nothing is sacred in the WWE?

With all that in mind,

No. Nothing is sacred in the WWE. If, for any moment, you believe that anything is sacred, it is because you have been led to believe that said thing is sacred so that you are surprised when it is profaned. This includes any note taking on the amount of consecutive days that a performer has had to carry an extra ten pounds in their luggage.

 

[relentless1]

well one record will NEVER be broken and thats Brunos so im cool with that

 

[WWEWrestleFest]

well one record will NEVER be broken and thats Brunos so im cool with that

That's also arguably the most important record. But yeah, they'll never have the patience to match CM Punk's reign again, let alone Bruno's.