Abyss: Destined to flounder?

[My$terio_Fan]

When I first starting watching TNA again(after not watching it since the weekly PPV thing) the main feud was Abyss Vs. Christian. I was really impressed by this "big man monster" and thought his character, look, skills, and talent were all pretty good. I enjoyed his feud with Christian, and thought Abyss was going to be a huge star in the years to come.

He also feuded with Sting and even won the TNA title. I honestly thought Abyss was going to be the Undertaker of the company and be used as one of the main heels in the mainevent.

Them over the next few years Abyss slowly went from mainevent monster, to midcard filler. Yes he has a feud and is seen on TV pretty much every impact, but he's not headlining or even in the mainevent scene. Instead of The Undertaker, he has slowly turned into Kane(huge push at the beginning, then floundering in the upper to mid card).

He's possible feud with Foley should be good, but do you thin Abyss is more than filler, midcard fueds? Does he have the potential to be a main player? Or is he destined to flounder like alot of the big guys do?

At this point I think Abyss should have take the reported offer from WWE. While he probably wouldn't be a big star there, he'd be making more money. And it's not like TNA is just waiting to re-insert him into the mainevent. Is he just a hardcore gimmick wrestler not worth the time? Or is his more than 10,000 tacks and blood?

I see great potential in Abyss, and with TNA's backing I could see him a main force, but maybe I'm just blinded by the blood and tacks.

 

[Blade]

I agree with you, M_F. He had definate Undertaker qualities, but he's ended up more like Kane. Expcept Abyss's fall down the card has been alot quicker than Kane's...

He's a good wrestler. But TNA see him as their own personal spot monkey, with the tacks and barbwire and flaming tables. He's willing to do anything to himself, no matter how much it might hurt and TNA just seem to be taking advantage of that, using him for only that purpose. He can wrestle regular matches, he's had some really good matches. He's just put into so many hardcore feuds. The only good I've ever seen come from an Abyss feud is making Matt Morgan marginally more over. And some argue that it's not so good.

The really sad thing is if Abyss ever wants to stop doing to the hardcore stuff, and getting taken seriously as a wrestler, he'll never get that world title push. If he asks the TNA bookers to stop putting him in hardcore feuds and start letting him show his actual wrestling talent, they'd probably get pissed off a bury him... Or put him in a hardcore match every week, whatever.

 

[Dexter]

The Foley phenomenon notwithstanding (and even that was called into question with the "greatest jobber ever" debate), I don't think hardcore tacks and blood wrestlers make for good main eventers. So you're absolutely right, the question is whether or not he's more than that.

Personally? I don't see it. Granted, I'm a relative newcomer to the TNA scene (3 or 4 months, give or take), but I've yet to see anything from him that lead me to believe there's any real substance there. Take away the thumbtacks, and he just seems like your typical "big man"... slow, clumsy and awkward. It's entirely possible I've just caught him at a bad time, and if so, I'm happy to be wrong but I just haven't seen any evidence to the contrary.

Hell, if we need something to do with him, lets kill two birds with one stone and solve this and the Rhino question in the other thread at the same time. Tag em up together.

 

[gd]

It is very hard for someone to stay interesting and successful with a character similar to Abyss, Undertaker seems to be the only exception. It appears that TNA has a hard time building fresh foods for him, so they end up sticking him in long and rather boring feuds against guys like Stevie Richards.

I really like Abyss and think that his character is one of the best in TNA, but he just doesn't have a direction. I don't know if he should be a permanent fixture in the main event scene, but I don't think it would hurt for him to be in the title picture every now and then.

 

[Klown_Karnage]

I have to qualify this by saying I'm a huge Abyss fan. This is one man willing to do and put his body through anything which is why he's such a tremendous hardcore wrestler. In other forms of wrestling, its true that he's more of a brawler than an actual wrestler and that has held him back a little bit, but on the other hand many who are still considered great have gotten by with less. He's also become such a staple of the TNA scene that I don't think he ever will disappear. He may be moved to midcard for a while, but I have a feeling he's going to come out swinging, back into the main event, sooner or later.

Why do I say this? He's just too damn good a performer for TNA to bury or even hold down for very long. His commitment to his character both in the ring and out of it are phenomenal. He can sell like mad, can bring the power and incredible toughness, and has a lot of what Foley has, that willingness and ability to do whatever it takes. The audience can see this well enough.

I do have a feeling that TNA creative have dried when it comes to ideas for Abyss. After the whole mental hospital thing, they just don't have much, but I'm hoping that with what seems to be a team-up between Abyss and Foley, that's about to change.

 

[smalltownfan]

I agree...what happened to Abyss? He was one of the mainstays, one of the originals, and always a legitimate threat to the TNA title. Those days need to come back. Perhaps saving Mick Foley at the most recent PPV will help him out. Can you imagine an Abyss/Foley hardcore tag-team? Jeez. Abyss definitely needs a revival. You mean to tell me that a wrestling company can't find a program for a 6'8" 350 lb. beast with his talents and unique look? Give me a break.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

Is he more than a great hardcore wrestler? Honestly, I'd have to say no. Abyss appears to have been relevated to a "niche character", which is basically someone that's kept in certain matches or situations for the duration of his career. When I first began watching TNA, I was interested in the character. For the most part, I still think it was a rip off and amalgam of the Kane/Mankind gimmicks, but it was done well. But, I knew that the guy would be ruined when they started trying to make him more "human". Trying to take the monster out of a man monster almost always ruins "supernatural" or quasi-supernatural characters.

I don't see Abyss as main event material in the direction TNA seems to be going. Abyss is a hardcore wrestler, it's one of the things that ultimately got him over. It's also something that he may well be stuck with for much of the rest of his career unless he were given another offer to go to the WWE. Right now, hardcore matches are really the only matches he has that I find entertaining.

When it comes to him willing to pretty much do anything physically to himself, he's almost like another Mick Foley. As Mankind, Foley started out as the deranged, psycopathic type of guy and managed to turn that into this somewhat unbalanced but lovable guy that really got over with people. I wonder if this is what TNA is ultimately trying to do to Abyss but, if it is, it just doesn't have the same feel. Foley's mic skills helped out quite a bit during the transformation of his character, Foley's real personality came out.

In the end, I don't really know what is going on with Abyss overall nor do I know if TNA ultimately has any clue about what to do with him.

 

[Nate DaMac]

This thread has definitely made me think a bit. I totally forgot Abyss won the World Title off of Sting. What the fuck happened? I am not one of those guys who hate on every guy who's 7 feet tall and 300 pounds, I like SuperHeavyweights. Abyss is one who is actually a bit more agile than most. I would find him much more entertaining in the program with MEM than this BS with Stevie. Looks the tide may be turning though.

 

[TellMeWhy]

When I first starting watching TNA again(after not watching it since the weekly PPV thing) the main feud was Abyss Vs. Christian. I was really impressed by this "big man monster" and thought his character, look, skills, and talent were all pretty good. I enjoyed his feud with Christian, and thought Abyss was going to be a huge star in the years to come.

He also feuded with Sting and even won the TNA title. I honestly thought Abyss was going to be the Undertaker of the company and be used as one of the main heels in the mainevent.

Them over the next few years Abyss slowly went from mainevent monster, to midcard filler. Yes he has a feud and is seen on TV pretty much every impact, but he's not headlining or even in the mainevent scene. Instead of The Undertaker, he has slowly turned into Kane(huge push at the beginning, then floundering in the upper to mid card).

He's possible feud with Foley should be good, but do you thin Abyss is more than filler, midcard fueds? Does he have the potential to be a main player? Or is he destined to flounder like alot of the big guys do?

At this point I think Abyss should have take the reported offer from WWE. While he probably wouldn't be a big star there, he'd be making more money. And it's not like TNA is just waiting to re-insert him into the mainevent. Is he just a hardcore gimmick wrestler not worth the time? Or is his more than 10,000 tacks and blood?

I see great potential in Abyss, and with TNA's backing I could see him a main force, but maybe I'm just blinded by the blood and tacks.

Come on. WWE doesn't know what to do with big men. Big men are a dime a dozen over there. Abyss would be wasted and probably be released within no time. His best bet is to stay with TNA where they've invested time in him. When Undertaker won the belt from Hogan in 1991, he lost the belt about a few days later and didn't win back the title until 6 years later. It still didn't stop Taker from being who he is. Abyss can very well go a similar route.

As for the topic, the reason Abyss' character has gone downhill is due to Dutch Mantell. Dutch Mantell was the one behind him creatively and was the 1 booking Abyss since late 2006 and he hasn't been the same. It was both him and Abyss that played around with the Abyss character and tried different things creatively.

But with Dutch Mantell gone, it'll be interesting to see how the Abyss character is handled from now on.

 

[TellMeWhy]

The Foley phenomenon notwithstanding (and even that was called into question with the "greatest jobber ever" debate), I don't think hardcore tacks and blood wrestlers make for good main eventers. So you're absolutely right, the question is whether or not he's more than that.

Personally? I don't see it. Granted, I'm a relative newcomer to the TNA scene (3 or 4 months, give or take), but I've yet to see anything from him that lead me to believe there's any real substance there. Take away the thumbtacks, and he just seems like your typical "big man"... slow, clumsy and awkward. It's entirely possible I've just caught him at a bad time, and if so, I'm happy to be wrong but I just haven't seen any evidence to the contrary.

Hell, if we need something to do with him, lets kill two birds with one stone and solve this and the Rhino question in the other thread at the same time. Tag em up together.

Lol. Abyss and Rhino have been paired or have been synonymous with each other for years in TNA as the hardcore guys. It's time that these 2 spend time apart and away from each other which is good for these 2.

I've always enjoyed Abyss' work though. He's had some good feuds in TNA's short history. If you want to see some of Abyss' work, I suggest you check out his feuds and matches with AJ Styles, Sabu, Jeff Hardy, Christian, Tomko, Sting, Rhino, Black Reign(Dustin Rhodes), and Raven.

 

[mayhem]

I always felt Abyss was at his strongest when he was in shape around the time he was NWA Heavyweight champion and had James Mitchell by his side. He was aggressive, in shape and felt like a legit monster as Mitchell did the talking for him and he was heel which he hasn't been for like 1 year and a half now.

The last ppv he main evented was 2 years ago at No Surrender 2007 so he has definitely fallen down the card and upon his return at Slammiversary 2008 he came back out of shape and that affected his agility and his charachter lost a little bit of mystique when he could use the mic and do promos for himself.

He is a big man so he should really be pushed and can work very well as both a face and a heel. I really think reverting back to his original gimmick recently helps but he needs to drop a few pounds if he wants to seriously rechallenge for the TNA Championship. In general he has fallen down the scale but by facing established names like Foley in the near future can push him back into the Upper mid card scene. As for him winning the TNA Title again it will take some time for him to rebuild his charachter and regain momentum as a powerhouse.

 

[Uncle Phatso]

Yeah abyss Is deffinatly floundering in tna right now, he's way to heavy and just isn't the monster he was back in the day. Hell I remember him all the way back in the first monsters ball match kicking ass.

Abyss is one of thoes guys in the buisness that can take any type of pain, I've seen him cut open prety fucking bad in the day and he allways keeps comming back so lets hope he can get a good bout of steam on himself and get back to the ways he was a while ago.

 

[LitaTaker]

When I first starting watching TNA again(after not watching it since the weekly PPV thing) the main feud was Abyss Vs. Christian. I was really impressed by this "big man monster" and thought his character, look, skills, and talent were all pretty good. I enjoyed his feud with Christian, and thought Abyss was going to be a huge star in the years to come.

He also feuded with Sting and even won the TNA title. I honestly thought Abyss was going to be the Undertaker of the company and be used as one of the main heels in the mainevent.

Them over the next few years Abyss slowly went from mainevent monster, to midcard filler. Yes he has a feud and is seen on TV pretty much every impact, but he's not headlining or even in the mainevent scene. Instead of The Undertaker, he has slowly turned into Kane(huge push at the beginning, then floundering in the upper to mid card).

He's possible feud with Foley should be good, but do you thin Abyss is more than filler, midcard fueds? Does he have the potential to be a main player? Or is he destined to flounder like alot of the big guys do?

At this point I think Abyss should have take the reported offer from WWE. While he probably wouldn't be a big star there, he'd be making more money. And it's not like TNA is just waiting to re-insert him into the mainevent. Is he just a hardcore gimmick wrestler not worth the time? Or is his more than 10,000 tacks and blood?

I see great potential in Abyss, and with TNA's backing I could see him a main force, but maybe I'm just blinded by the blood and tacks.

Wow some great points about Abyss especially the Kane comments. He really is, just he has the mask still He went from being a feared monster and big star in TNA with James Mitchell to being a face who now talks They really are moving him into the midcard and giving the new (WWE) stars the big pushes and Abyss is kind of being forgotten and in stupid storylines. He was my absolute favorite in TNA when he was a monster, I still like him now, but not as much now.

 

[absent]

Comedy monsters just really don't work for me, not beyond momentary amusement which quickly gets boring. The Abyss/Mitchell pairing and the Abyss/AJ matches were real stand out moments for me with him. Maybe he/they've become too reliant on Abyss pulling off the big hardcore spots but he can deliver so much more than that both in and out of the ring. I feel it's his character that's really come lacking in recent years and this has limited his serious feuding potential. Maybe bring Mitchell back, turn Foley 110% heel, have them both behind Abyss then unleash some real disturbed mentalities.