1990 Survivor Series - was the champ really not in a fued?

Discussion in 'The Wrestling Archives' started by LBGetBack, Sep 19, 2015.

  1. LBGetBack

    LBGetBack Championship Contender

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    The Ultimate Warrior was the WWF champion at the time, and had been for 6-7 months since WrestleMania 6 when he beat Hogan. At Summerslam 1990 he beat Rick Rude.

    So come Survivor Series.....no feud? His teammate Texas Tornado was feuding with Mr. Perfect. His teammates the Legion of Doom were feuding with Demolition, which now had 3 members.

    So Warrior was basically a throw in, in the opening match?

    His feud with Rude was over and I believe Rude was gone from the company by now. His feud with Savage hadn't started yet. So how did this happen? Anybody got anything?
     
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  2. Hard Hit Prince

    Hard Hit Prince Not really working as a

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    I've searched in the house-show results to see if I could give you a good answer to your problem, but I haven't found a plausible one. He was already fighting Randy Savage by the time Survivor Series was broadcast, so I don't really know if the seeds were already there. Before that he was helping Legion of Doom against Demolition.

    But you made me remember how good Warrior vs. Rude actually was. Still a big fan of their Steel Cage Match. Darn you, pal!
     
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  3. sdelfin

    sdelfin Pre-Show Stalwart

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    You ask a good question. Spoderman got the context right. Warrior was thrown in with LOD to wrestle Demolition on house shows right after Summerslam and that carried on into October before Warrior and Savage got put together. Savage challenging Warrior didn't become a thing on TV until, perhaps, Survivor Series itself with Savage doing an interview. My best guess is they were hoping Warrior's house-show run helping LOD still had some ability to generate interest, despite them booking Demolition pretty weak already. I don't know what they were thinking after Wrestlemania 6. It was probably too soon to go with Rude, but that was not too bad. Rude and Warrior were facing each other on house shows right after Wrestlemania all the way through Summerslam, with the last month or so being in tags. The only other thing I can say about how it turned out that way is that Earthquake was the only heel built up enough to feud with Warrior, but someone decided the put Earthquake and Hogan together. No other heels were built up enough at that point.
     
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  4. Rhodes2TheFuture3313

    Rhodes2TheFuture3313 Getting Noticed By Management

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    Should have had Ravishing Rick beat Warrior to extend the feud. Rude could have had a test/transitional run and Warrior could have won it back. Rude probably left the company because Vince wouldn't put the belt on him.
     
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  5. The Brain

    The Brain King Of The Ring

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    The wheels were definitely in motion for a Warrior vs. Savage feud. As mentioned above Savage did have an interview at Survivor Series where he was basically challenging Warrior. Then on Saturday Night's Main Event which I think was just two days after Survivor Series (so probably taped a couple weeks before) Savage attacked Warrior during a title match against Ted Dibiase. They could have very easily put Savage on The Perfect Team instead of Ax, especially since Ax would never be seen in WWF after Survivor Series anyway. Personally I think they should have done Warrior vs. Savage at SummerSlam 90 and had that stretch into Survivor Series but that's another story. Either way it was curious that Savage was left out of action at Survivor Series when there was a pretty obvious spot for him.
     
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  6. Makaveli31

    Makaveli31 Championship Contender

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    I wouldn't say he was a "throw in". Warrior was featured prominently on the pay-per-view. He was sole survivor of his team and the overall survivor along with Hulk plus he had an interview with Sherri Martel (where he famously turned her down). So the Warrior v. Savage feud was well under way by the time Series '90 rolled around.

    The reason why Savage was left off the team was because they didn't want to make Savage look weak. If Vince has Warrior pin Savage at Series '90 the feud and angle is blown to hell especially because it's a retirement match and lure of the feud is we don't know who is going to win. If Warrior beats Savage from pillar to post it destroys the whole angle.
     
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  7. King Patrick Star

    King Patrick Star K. O. T. R. 2007 -€“ Team Undisputed

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    The Ultimate Warriors vs. the Perfect Team is my second favorite traditional Survivor Series elimination tag team match of all time. Even though the Ultimate Warrior wasn't exactly in a fued with anyone on the Perfect Team, I think he fit right in there nicely as the captain. If Ultimate Warrior wasn't on that team, who would you have inserted in there to replace him, and what would you have the WWF Champion do that night?? Whatever the case maybe, this will always look cool to me!!

    [​IMG]
     
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  8. Just Do It

    Just Do It Getting Noticed By Management

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    I'll never understand why people really want to see "transitional runs" so often when booking the past. To be fair, Hogan wasn't in feuds come to fall either, was he? Nothing is coming to mind.
     
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  9. legendkiller1979

    legendkiller1979 Pre-Show Stalwart

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    I have wondered for years about Randy Savage from Wrestlemania VI to Wrestlemania VII. I don't remember how much wrestling he did on TV, but he basically took the pay per view year off. He fought Dusty Rhodes at Sumerslam and the match didn't last five minutes. He didn't compete and the Survivor Series or Royal Rumble. I've never understood this. I can't find anywhere that he was injured.
     
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  10. WWEWrestleFest

    WWEWrestleFest Pre-Show Stalwart

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    I did hear that he was injured, I can't remember where but I heard it pretty recently. I think it may have been Lanny Poffo who said it.
     
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  11. Wrestlingaholic

    Wrestlingaholic Championship Contender

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    With a bit more foresight, WWE *could* have built up the Survivor Series match more; when it became obvious that Ax wasn't suffering as much as expected, but already having brought in Crush to supplement him in Demolition, they could have continued to have Demolition as a true force to be reckoned with, and give Ax (as a thankyou for long service) a run at challenging the Warrior; obviously coming straight from a long tag run, Ax wouldn't win the belt, but by booking Demolition strong (despite losing the tag belts to the Hart Foundation at Summerslam), it would add a fresh face to the title scene whilst using someone who was already super-over through his tag team; the fact he had Smash and Crush with him would mean Warrior had some serious odds to overcome to retain the belt - and would give a logical reason for the Roaf Warriors to join him, as back up to ensure no shenanigans (much as they did at Summerslam); it would elongate the 6-man tag run they all had; it would add to the Survivor Series match IMO; and it would make LOD's winning of the feud more credible, as what happened in reality was that Demolition were completely jobbed out.

    If they booked Ax in a title feud with Warrior in the Autumn, with a stronger Demolition behind him, you can still have the same storyline arc with Slaughter (who was nowhere near the title picture at Survivor Series) and Savage; but Demolition would get a proper send-off at Wrestlemania VII, losing a competetive match against the Legion of Doom, instead of jobbing to two random Japanese wrestlers and LOD squashing Power and Glory in 59 seconds, two matches than did nothing for any of the 8 involved.
     
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  12. Slash-LN

    Slash-LN Rigistered Post Offender

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    All I know about the situation is when I was a kid I didn't care.
    Both teams had three guys with face paint and that was good enough for me.

    With Warrior's conditioning being what it was maybe they put him in that first match because he had to wrestle that second one later and he'd need the most time to rest compared to other people who wrestled a second match.

    So it didn't really matter if he was in a match without it involving being in a feud with someone.
     
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  13. THTRobtaylor

    THTRobtaylor Once & Future Wrestlezone Columnist

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    Originally that was when they were going to bring Davey Boy Smith in to pick up the IC title feud from Kerry, as he was the original pick to replace Brutus but got hurt himself at the wrong moment... but it went a little longer than they thought... they were even touting it on the WWE magazine around this time. Would have loved to have seen Davey debut that 6 months earlier than he did and win the title instead of Tornado...

    Warrior being in the match served to set up the final battle of survival and get the "dream team" of Hogan and Warrior going - after their match at Mania, it was kind of important that they both be seen to be friends again.
     
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  14. Just Do It

    Just Do It Getting Noticed By Management

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    I still vote WM7 should have been a Hogan / Warrior rematch. That would have been epic in 1991...
     
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  15. The Fabulous Rougeau's

    The Fabulous Rougeau's Championship Contender

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    To answer the OPs question he was in between feuds at that time transitioning from Rude to Macho with the pit stop of losing the title to Slaughter in the horizon. Now the real problem was WWFs lack of support in Warrior. After having Warrior beat Hogan clean at Mania he instantly took a backseat to Hogan with Hogan getting the new top monster in Earthquake and Warrior getting to rehash his feud from a year earlier with Rude. From the day after Mania the only thing that changed was whose waist the title was around. Hogan was still considered and treated like the top dog and by the time the summer ended Warrior's momentum in his title ran had come to an end as a result.

    Had WWF done it correctly by having Warrior feud with Earthquake culminating at the Survivor Series and then transitioning to Macho at Mania with the logical title v career (it still bothers me that Macho put his career on the line for nothing. Just makes no sense from any story line perspective) stipulation with Warrior retaining, then and only then could Warriors title run have been justly reviewed.
     
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  16. FlairFan2003

    FlairFan2003 Mid-Card Championship Winner

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    Hogan was a different animal. Hogan almost never worked a full time schedule as champ, especially after he reached his peak circa 86 range. Hogan often went more than 30 days without wrestling on a single show, sometimes closer to 60. When he did wrestle it was typically just on a FRI or SAT house show and nothing else (keeping in mind there were no monthly PPV here in this era).

    Warrior did work a full schedule as champ. He had a long feud with Rick Rude and transitioned into a feud with Savage while also helping LOD in their run vs Demolition, he worked pretty much the whole time he was champ.
     
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  17. FlairFan2003

    FlairFan2003 Mid-Card Championship Winner

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    It was the same way in WCW when Goldberg was champ
     
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  18. The Warlord

    The Warlord Pre-Show Stalwart

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    Nah...the only thing that should have happened at WM 7 was a Hart Foundation vs Rockers tag title match. Everything else about that card was perfect.

    As far as Survivor Series 1990...in my opinion I think Vince was starting to put the focus back on Hogan as he was the bigger draw. As great as Warrior was, I think his WWF title reign in 1990 took a back seat to Hulk Hogan. They never cared to put Warrior in a serious program for the title. I think the booking back then was done more long term.
     
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  19. LBGetBack

    LBGetBack Championship Contender

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    Appreciate the replies. I didn't realize that Savage-Warrior had kind've already started by Survivor Series. But yeah, definitely makes sense to not have them wrestle each other at all before Mania, given how the feud played out(GREAT feud and Mania match IMO....Savage and Warrior worked well together).

    Still odd that he hadn't been feuding with anyone since Summerslam though. All he did all fall was help LOD against Demolition? He was the champ!

    It's not like Earthquake was the ONLY option(since they were hellbent on giving him to Hogan). They could've re-arranged things. Scrap Dibiase-Dusty, and go Warrior-Dibiase, which could've wrapped up with their title match after Survivor Series.

    As someone else said...have Rude win at Summerslam and continue the feud with Warrior taking the title back right after Survivor Series.

    Feud with Mr. Perfect.....he'd already had a little feud with Hogan earlier in the year.
     
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  20. comrade_mario

    comrade_mario Mid-Card Championship Winner

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    By Survivor Series 1990 I think Vince had made up his mind on Warrior not being a draw as champion so he wasn't a priority. The idea of Slaughter v Hogan drawing 100k in Los Angeles was dancing in front of his eyes so all focus was on that. Hard to blame Vince when you take in to account these house attendance numbers:

    1990: 10,404 attendance for shows with Hogan / 4,778 attendance for shows without Hogan

    Pretty clear that Hogan was still the main man in 1990 and would remain so for at least another year. I know house show draws aren't the closing argument in who was the better draw between wrestlers but they're a solid indicator, particularly in this case as Hogan also sold more merchandise than Warrior in 1990. He was the obvious choice to lead the company then in a way it became skewered later that decade with Bret and HBK (Bret sold more merchandise but Shawn did better at House shows so that's why Vince went back to Hart. Less said about Diesel as a draw the better)
     
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  21. The Fabulous Rougeau's

    The Fabulous Rougeau's Championship Contender

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    Obviously it wasn't based on how the end of 90 and 91 played out but you have to take more than just the gate into consideration. in 90/91 Warrior was in his early 30s while Hogan was in his late 30s. That has to and should have played a part in the decisions made at that time. Without knowing all the drama that would surround Warrior between the summer of 91-fall of 92, you got to give the younger guy who you believe you can build the company around for maybe the next 10 years a true shot.
     
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  22. comrade_mario

    comrade_mario Mid-Card Championship Winner

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    Oh yeah, it shouldn't be all about gate when you're in your first reign but you need to keep in mind that Warrior had been given the push to the moon that Vince has only ever really given to a handful of guys. He was a dominant Intercontinental Champion who had only lost once in his career when he faced off against Hogan. He beat Hogan clean (though obviously Hogan pulled some shenanigans at the end) for the world title at Wrestlemania too. No-one beat Hogan clean in those days, I'm struggling to remember if he actually had lost clean at that point since winning the title off the Sheik.

    You couldn't push a guy to the world title better than they did Warrior and then his house shows were drawing half of what Hogan headlined house shows were drawing. You can see why that would cause Vince to hit the panic button, particularly when you read in the likes of Bret Hart's book about how Warrior wouldn't put in the overtime with fans that Hogan used to. If I were Vince, I'd look at the numbers and look at Warrior's attitude and decide that he was never going to take Hogan's place as well.
     
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  23. The Fabulous Rougeau's

    The Fabulous Rougeau's Championship Contender

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    You also have to consider the material Warrior was given to work with he was re-hashing a program he had the previous year. So when they come around to all the cities without Hogan and Warrior is doing the same thing he did the previous year why would a fan want to pay for the same thing again and no Hogan?

    It goes back to Warrior being booked poorly starting the day after Mania VI. As you point out his ascension was great but once on top he was treated as number 2 before any gate numbers could be established.
     
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