I just got done watching the 2003 No Mercy DVD, which had on it John Cena vs Kurt Angle, and it was actually one of the better Cena matches i've seen. Best match on the card def. John Cena was actaully cheered more then he his today by adult male fans. At one point of the match you could hear the kids and women chanting "lets go Angle" and the males chanting "lets go Cena" which I have never heard. But anyways it was a nice back and forth match that kept the crowd entertained. Plus Cena actually applied a headlock. Also something i've never seen lol. He also did a variety of other moves. Imo if we could see matches like this from Cena always, he wouldnt be hated like he is by a majority of male adult fans. But instead, we the same match, Cena getting his ass beat for 10-20 mins, with Cena only usually using a few shoulder blocks, a Protoplex, a Fisherman Supplex, Leg drop off the top, 5 knuckle shuffle, Attitude Adjustment, STF. and maybe a A throwback and thats it. It may be because he was a heel and heel's tend to dominate matches, but I think he could use different variety of moves in a match and still be a face instead of us having to watch the same match ending over and over agian. Thoughts?
Why can't John Cena wrestle like he did in 2003?
- Thread starter matty256
- Start date
Wasn't Cena awful then? Yeah, he was. I also think Kurt might have been at his peak.
I think the real question is why don't WWE do something to make Cena have that aura again. The rap gimmick is dead. But I'm sure those creative minds at WWE could come up with somthing that would get the fans as into him as they were then.
I think the real question is why don't WWE do something to make Cena have that aura again. The rap gimmick is dead. But I'm sure those creative minds at WWE could come up with somthing that would get the fans as into him as they were then.
The_Predator_Since_1993
Dark Match Jobber
I think John Cena can wrestle like he did in 2003 but i dont think there is a need for him as he gets a reaction no matter what and i feel it depends on the opponent and the match as when John Cena wrestled Jack Swagger or when he has faced Shawn Michaels or Triple H and when he has even faced Randy Orton in the past.
I think when needed to John Cena will wrestle at the level he needs to.
But there is also the way he is meant to be portrayed and how Vince wants to portray him as the superman character who gets his ass kicked and then miraculously comes back to get the victory. So it really depends on how he wants the match to go. But when Cena does to the superman comeback its usually against heels so it would be interesting to see how he would wrestle as a heel.
I think when needed to John Cena will wrestle at the level he needs to.
But there is also the way he is meant to be portrayed and how Vince wants to portray him as the superman character who gets his ass kicked and then miraculously comes back to get the victory. So it really depends on how he wants the match to go. But when Cena does to the superman comeback its usually against heels so it would be interesting to see how he would wrestle as a heel.
ap35hs3on7zso62s
Dark Match Winner
Ehh I wouldn't say the rap gimmick is dead, I don't even think Cena has a gimmick, he's DEFINITELY not the same now as he was in 2003, not even close, and Cena actually was really good back then, not phenominal, but a far more better wrestler. The thing is, he doesn't HAVE to do now what he did then because the WWE isn't about the wrestling, its not about the moves, and the kids will keep watching anyway, so Cena doesn't have to be impressive, infact, nobody really has to be impressive in the ring, in the WWE, its your charsima and talking skills, because really, what do kids know about wrestling? They can see an indy video of a guy doing the CRAZIEST moves, and they'll still say 'he sucks, cena is better'....don't believe me? go on youtube, lol....but yeah, he or anyone else doesn't even have to try :]
ipswichicon80
Pre-Show Stalwart
I was watching survivor series from the same year(2003) and Cena was the first man out in the first match and he got the fabled "100%" reaction,the only diffrence was that he was cheered not booed out of the building. He was really over with the crowd, did a rap ripping on the other guys and was one of two survivers after he struck the big show with his chain. He was turned face (much like Steve Austin) because his edgy personna had got him over with the fans. Fast forward to today, what is his character? He stopped rapping on his way to the ring,his "from the streets image" was shown to be a sham when Edge broke into his middle class surburbion childhood home to beat up his dad, his moves no longer have edgy names due to the PG rating, basically he's been stripped of everything that got him over in the first place and it's been replaced with...well nothing. There is no reason to cheer for him because he doesn't stand for anything (the women and children crowd cheer for him because they're supposed to and because 9 times out of ten he wins). So for me the problem is more with his character(or lack of it) then his in ring style. That said all his matches are quite samey, he spends most of the match getting the crap kicked out of him and then mounts a superhuman comeback. WWE seem to like him in this style of match as it works for the family audience they're trying to attract. They could also try and teach him how to throw realistic punch's and how to apply his finishing hold better.
Just on another note,Cole said this week "there's only one place to see the big show and thats live on Raw" after watching his awful match with Kofi I have to say that sounds like a great advert for not watching Raw!
Honestly I watched another match that year with cena and undertaker and I don't really see where his move set was so different back then as it is now. The reason cena was popular was because he was entertaining on the mic and played a fake thug and at that time it seem cool. Cena charisma and look is the number one thing keep him alive as far as popularity. Once he stop rapping he came off very lame and repititive and turned into a boyscout. He still could have been edgey without the rap gimmack but instead he did a 360 and changed his charecter completely and that why he is booed.
The most entertaining about Cena at that time was his gimmick. He was awful in the ring. Like Jake said that was when Angle was at his peak. If I remember the match right, kurt did make Cena look really well, but Cena is a lot better today then he was back in 03. His matches in the last year have been a lot better then that match. I think people right now are just getting annoyed at Cena, because he has become stale. If they change him up a bit I think the fans will be behind him. I'm not say heel turn even though I would love it, but something just to change it up.
HBK-aholic
Shawn Michaels ❤
I loved rapper Cena. I've gone from really liking him to being indifferent towards him. His gimmick then was hilarious. He was like The Rock or Jericho - cutting great promos on people we didn't like, or really loved and doing it in a way that made us laugh out loud. However, personal preference aside, ask yourself this. Was Cena drawing much then? He probably had a hand in things, however, his 'gimmick' of the last couple of years has been one of the most successful runs a wrestler has had in recent history. Why would the WWE take him back to a time he wasn't as successful?
Because John Cena is the best wrestler in the world right now? Why would he want to regress?
Just because he does certain moves, doesn't make a good wrestler. His ability to put on a match now is far superior to what it was. And, as far as the "get beat down for 20 minutes and make a comeback", you obviously don't watch many Cena PPV matches.
Just because he does certain moves, doesn't make a good wrestler. His ability to put on a match now is far superior to what it was. And, as far as the "get beat down for 20 minutes and make a comeback", you obviously don't watch many Cena PPV matches.
TJ INSANE 1992
Dark Match Jobber
He is vinces child monkey. He cant be that aggressive anymore he hs to be same old every night cuz kids cheer him
Franchize1990
Pre-Show Stalwart
I Think the WWE is starting to let Cena do a little more technical wrestling at the moment in my opinion. If you watch many of his matches from this year, especially the one against the Miz from last Monday night, he has been executing a wider variety of moves. I even saw him do a headlock during that match. I think the reason Cena is hated by so many of the older males is because his matches are predictable and he is the role model to so many kids. It seems to me that when something is widely popular with children, it tends to turn off adults who used to like the product before it became mainstream.
Please tell me you are being sarcastic? And I don't know, maybe so he could start getting cheered like faces are suppose to and not booed. But yeah your right I don't order PPV's anymore unless its Wrestlemania or Royal Rumble. Waste of money to buy any others these days if you ask me.
What the fuck are you talking about? Very few people boo Cena anymore, and the only ones who do are the morons who don't understand anything about wrestling. I remember watching Raw, I believe it was, and there were a group of guys trying to get a Cena sucks chant going...there were like 5 guys...no one joined in.
The Cena hate is dead. The guy is mega over, and gets mega pops. And the guy is a fantastic wrestler, and if you'd watch some of his PPV matches, you'd know that.
Find his match vs. RVD at One Night Stand, his match against Umaga at Royal Rumble 07, and his match against Lashley at Great American Bash 07. Those are three different matches, with three very different opponents, in which Cena has to work three different styles, and three different types of matches.
And they are all fantastic.
Cena can't wrestle like he did in 2003 because he's playing an entirely different character. He's evolved from the thug/rapper gimmick into something totally different, which is a never-back-down role model. Now he works a different style of match, but that doesn't mean that his matches aren't good. The guy just isn't the same wrestler as he was in 2003. A wrestler's style will change as their gimmick changes, and as they evolve as a performer. That's just the nature of the business.
The notion that Cena is not a good wrestler because he has a somewhat limited moveset is silly and played out. He doesn't do that many moves because he doesn't need to. The babyface comeback routine has been around in wrestling for years, and yet nobody complains about it, except when it comes to Cena. And Slyfox is right, a lot of his most successful matches are very back-and-forth, instead of the beatdown and then comeback stuff. Example: his match with HBK in London.
The notion that Cena is not a good wrestler because he has a somewhat limited moveset is silly and played out. He doesn't do that many moves because he doesn't need to. The babyface comeback routine has been around in wrestling for years, and yet nobody complains about it, except when it comes to Cena. And Slyfox is right, a lot of his most successful matches are very back-and-forth, instead of the beatdown and then comeback stuff. Example: his match with HBK in London.
I never said Cena hasnt had good matches since then, I've actually enjoyed his matches with HBK, Triple H, Edge and a few others, its just a majority of his matches are the same. And his match with HBK was only back and forth due to them both being face. Is there any matches that are back and forth that he's done with a heel lately? no
The IWC hating Cena means very little in the grand scheme of things. I like discussing things on wrestling forums and the like, but a lot of people don't understand...Vince and WWE don't really give a shit about what we think. The point that Slyfox was trying to get across is that the people buying the tickets, buying the merchandise, and making the WWE money are the ones cheering for Cena. As long as things stay that way, Cena deserves to be on top. I also strongly disagree with the notion that "technical wrestling" is the only type of good wrestling out there. No one's saying that Cena's a technical wrestler, that's not his style. He's a brawler, and he's a damn good one. That what he's good at, that's what he does.
Saddler The Great
Dark Match Winner
What the fuck are you talking about? Very few people boo Cena anymore, and the only ones who do are the morons who don't understand anything about wrestling. I remember watching Raw, I believe it was, and there were a group of guys trying to get a Cena sucks chant going...there were like 5 guys...no one joined in.
The Cena hate is dead. The guy is mega over, and gets mega pops. And the guy is a fantastic wrestler, and if you'd watch some of his PPV matches, you'd know that. QUOTE]
Yea um....you seem to think that because more kids are attending live wwe events than the last 2-3 years (when cena was gettin booed out of buildings) that the hate is gone? If you look at the IWC people still hate cena...lol i dunno wtf you're talkin about. And quite frankly, the only reason why some people think Cena matches are sooo good is because there is the amount of specials and kickouts after specials overshadow the actual technical wrestling, where Cena is fuckin brutal...
No, I seem to think that more PEOPLE are attending events in general (as in, attendance rates are higher), that the hate is gone.
Who gives a fuck about the IWC? But, since you're mentioning it, the IWC doesn't have even HALF the hate it did back in 2006. Good try though.
Not true. We think they're great because they build a great story, know how to get the crowd hot at just the right time, and then deliver a great climax. You know, the basic art of storytelling...the basic art of pro wrestling.
LOL, how can Cena be brutal at it when he never does it? Cena's not a technical wrestler, and he doesn't work a technical style. And it would be completely stupid for him to work a technical style since that wouldn't fit his gimmick.
Do you know anything about wrestling?
Black Snow
Getting Noticed By Management
I also pine for the 2003 John Cena who actually seemed motivated. Ever since Cena won the WWE title and was deemed to be the one true WWE God he just doesn't seem to care quite as much as he used to. In 2003 his offense was far more varied and he just genuinely seemed to give a shit about every aspect of his character. Today his moves are more limited and a bit sloppier.
I can't totally blame him. He's not the first guy in history to have his arsenal dramatically cut back by "WWE main event style." That would kill my motivation a bit too if I was in his shoes. I'm not saying all of his matches nowadays are bad. They're just very formulaic. It feels like when I watch a Cena match I can easily predict at least half a dozen moves ahead of time what he's going to do. He also follows the old Hulk Hogan formula too much of getting beaten down only to hit a huge comeback consisting mostly of signature moves into a pin. If that entertains people (and clearly it does) then more power to them. But for me personally I find it quite boring.
That's why I boo Cena. I don't boo him because the internet told me to. I boo him because I don't like his character and I'm not entertained by the majority of his matches. People can tell me that I'm following a crowd or that I don't know wrestling all they want. It just rolls off my back. Wrestlers are there for you to form your own opinion on. Half of the crowd loves Cena. The other half hates him. It's the same today as it was 4-5 years ago. Cena haters think the Cena lovers are wrong and vice versa. Nothing one side says is going to convince the other to change its opinion.
I can't totally blame him. He's not the first guy in history to have his arsenal dramatically cut back by "WWE main event style." That would kill my motivation a bit too if I was in his shoes. I'm not saying all of his matches nowadays are bad. They're just very formulaic. It feels like when I watch a Cena match I can easily predict at least half a dozen moves ahead of time what he's going to do. He also follows the old Hulk Hogan formula too much of getting beaten down only to hit a huge comeback consisting mostly of signature moves into a pin. If that entertains people (and clearly it does) then more power to them. But for me personally I find it quite boring.
That's why I boo Cena. I don't boo him because the internet told me to. I boo him because I don't like his character and I'm not entertained by the majority of his matches. People can tell me that I'm following a crowd or that I don't know wrestling all they want. It just rolls off my back. Wrestlers are there for you to form your own opinion on. Half of the crowd loves Cena. The other half hates him. It's the same today as it was 4-5 years ago. Cena haters think the Cena lovers are wrong and vice versa. Nothing one side says is going to convince the other to change its opinion.
Wow, really are you that ignorant? IWC hated Cena 3 years ago, why because he never lost the title. Now many have said they wish they could go back to Cena's long reigns instead having a different champ every month. Yes, kids go to live show, but percentage is still overwhelming for adults. Their was a thread on here not that long ago that was talking about how he was the best wrestler/entertainer in the business today. Get you facts right.
What the crap are you talking about special kickouts? Cena hasn't kicked out of a finisher in forever. Yeah, Cena might not be the best technical wrestler to ever step in the ring, but. He's not as brutal as you say. The guy has become gone to the top for one reason, because he's the best plain and simple. Name me one guy that is in the company right now that is better than Cena.
You want to talk about being not being technical? Look at the majority of Austin's matches. He wasn't that technical, he beat the crap out of his opponents and then gave them a stunner. He made it to where was because he was the best.
Your right, but Cena tends to have better matches with faces cause he actually gets in more moves and its back and forth the whole match, And also that match with Umaga was pretty good I agree with you there but it was a last man standing match.He also tends to have good gimmick matches. Earlier that month he had a regular one on one match with Umaga which was pretty horrible imo
What? The guy doesn't seem motivated? The guy had surgery on his broken neck last year, and then was at the arena the next day. That's a little bit off.
Doesn't care? look what I said above. While his moves may be less, he's not sloppier. He's become solider then they were back when he first became champ.
That's your opinion, I'm not going to bash you for that, but. I believe part of the reason his matches are becoming like that are the way that the man is booked. He's the face of the wwe, in creatives mind, if it ain't broken why fix it. I can't blame them for that, but i agree he can get predictable.
Your opinion, I enjoy his matches that's why I cheer the man.
Good for you, your one of the few that don't get their panties in a wad when someone attacks you.
I disagree, Cena isn't booed the way he was in 07. The man came out and was booed out of the building, he may get a few boos here and there, but not to the level it was then.
Kiss your mother with that mouth kid? I'm not going to put down Cena and I do believe he is way over now then he used to be. But he wasn't mega over when he went up against RVD because they were in Philly ECW territory. Cena got nothing but boos, he tried to throw his shirt into the crowd several times and they threw the shirt back. He was the most hated man in the building. I think because he did the same 5 moves he always does and the Philly crowd chanted same old bullshit. You wont hear that of course in California or other states but I guarantee in Philly for the NOC Cena along with alot of wrestlers will get booed because they are fans wrestling and not entertainment.
LOL
John Cena worked those Philly fans like the fools they are. Cena was MEGA over in that place, just as a heel, and he worked the heel persona in that match perfectly. Taunting the crowd, not breaking holds, doing all his moves slowly and more deliberate...Cena made those Philly fans look like the idiots they are. My favorite part is when the fans are chanting "Same old shit"...while simultaneously cheering the guy who did the same things for the last ten years, regardless of whether he was heel or face.
Cena made those Philly fans look idiotic. He worked them like the fools they were.