It seems like lately guys like the Great Khali Umaga Sylvester Turkey and soon to be Vladimir Kozlov who debut with no gimmick and that they will crush whoever they wrestle. They debut and are unstoppable for the longest time going undefeated and are pushed heavily. After a while, they end up losing and get become mid-carders or get released. Opinions?
Who's tired of Monster Heels?
- Thread starter RH23
- Start date
Well, all of those wrestlers have gimmicks. Umaga has got one of the most obvious ones ever.
I'm not sick of monster heels, I'm sick of bad monster heels. Kozlov is shit. But it's easily sorted by giving him a manager and having him star squashing people again. I'd just have him do big power moves and not much else. No transition or nothing.
Mike Know needs a mask. Kane is one of the best moster heels of all time. Despite being a pile of shit. WWE needs a new wrestler with a mask. Mask Knox. It's proven that wrestlers become 50% more popular if they wear masks. FACT.
I'm not sick of monster heels, I'm sick of bad monster heels. Kozlov is shit. But it's easily sorted by giving him a manager and having him star squashing people again. I'd just have him do big power moves and not much else. No transition or nothing.
Mike Know needs a mask. Kane is one of the best moster heels of all time. Despite being a pile of shit. WWE needs a new wrestler with a mask. Mask Knox. It's proven that wrestlers become 50% more popular if they wear masks. FACT.
eXtremely-Priceless2K9
Occasional Pre-Show
I totaly agree with jake, Mike Knox could be good with a mask and Kozlov is SHIT i have no idea what vince saw in him, i am not sick of monster heels im sick of Monster streaks Kozlov did NOT deserve that streak.
Captain Bean
Pre-Show Stalwart
i think people like umaga and khali and koslov have always got to lose eventually, or they ll end up taking the title off a top face like cena, which wont happen seen as there not that great in the ring ( although i am a big umaga fan). and as soon as they lose they lose all of their momentum and they have not much going for them and just end up becoming upper mid carders. i think umaga was used badly, i would like to have seen him win a heavyweight title, he can wrestle better than koslov and khali and knox, and has the best gimmick! the turning point for him has to be when jeff hardy and HHH started beating him consistently.
I'm not tired of monster heels because they are the only type of heels that won't potentially get cheered by the audience. Being a heel these days is so terribly difficult thanks to "smarks" who like to think they are badass because they cheer the bad guy. Thus, unless you are REALLY good at going heel, you are likely to get cheered if you do anything other than "whining" heel or "monster" heel.
So, I don't tire of them, as I know there is very little options at this point.
So, I don't tire of them, as I know there is very little options at this point.
SneakyGoblin
Dark Match Winner
I think monster heels are fine if used sparingly. For example if Khali was made an enforcer for say... the MacMahons. Their only role is too look dominating against guys that never win, aswell as putting top guys over. Think about it, wouldn't it help Rhodes and DiBiase get over if they were to pick Khali appart and "injure" him?
Still, some Monster heels are actually good in the ring. Umaga for example. He has good speed for a super-heavyweight and the same can be said about his technical ability.
Still, some Monster heels are actually good in the ring. Umaga for example. He has good speed for a super-heavyweight and the same can be said about his technical ability.
One Punch Doug Crashin
I AM INVINSIBLE!
I'm actually not sick of monster heels. some of them actually have a lot of charisma. since we're talking about Khali, he's a legit 7'3 and has a lot of charisma but is shit in the ring because he doesn't know his own strength. Umaga on the other hand knows his own strength and uses it to try to impress the audience but gets injured too much and that ruins his pushes. Koslov is impressive. yes I said it. he's impressive LOOKING. he maybe shit in the ring but he looks impressive because he's squashing guys that make him look good and that's the basic principal of a monster heel. I believe if they had Knox as an enforcer he'd get over more but he's already esatablished as a bully so there's no need to put a mask on him just yet although that could work. by the way Vince saw a 6'6 300lbs impressive looking man in Koslov that would be able to captivate the audience and its working. you can blame Jerry Jarret for that as well
Well, my opinion is that there has never been a great monster heel. The only one I can think of is the Undertaker, but he did not stay a monster heel for long. When he debuted, he was exactly like Kozlov, Khali, etc. Except he was interesting; his character continued to evolve, and they added new elements to it almost every match or promo. Then, when he was defeated by Hogan, he slowly made the transition out of being a monster heel into a normal face/heel wrestler.
The thing about monster heels is that they have a short lifespan. They are created to become an immovable object to the irresistable force, perse. For instance, Khali was created for Taker, Umaga was invented for Cena, so on and so forth. But after they are defeated, as Kozlov has been, they either evolve like Taker did, or they fall into the great abyss of wrestling.
If Kozlov is to become a great wrestler, he must evolve, unlike Umaga, Khali, and Mark Henry have. He must look towards what Taker has done for inspiration, or he is doomed.
The thing about monster heels is that they have a short lifespan. They are created to become an immovable object to the irresistable force, perse. For instance, Khali was created for Taker, Umaga was invented for Cena, so on and so forth. But after they are defeated, as Kozlov has been, they either evolve like Taker did, or they fall into the great abyss of wrestling.
If Kozlov is to become a great wrestler, he must evolve, unlike Umaga, Khali, and Mark Henry have. He must look towards what Taker has done for inspiration, or he is doomed.
dannynandez
Dark Match Jobber
I agree with what evrybody says...Taker is the best of them all becuase he evolved....the only consistant monster heel there ever was is kane...and he as even been a comedy act at times...thats what happens...either they evolve or become a comedy act (Khali)....they are just limited in what they are able to do...gimmick changes is what is necessary...Umaga is able to be great in the rig...he can come off the tiop rope t any given time...but is limited..but he uis limited by his gimmick...i think umaga could really be a good main eventer with the right gimmick adjustments and push...as for kozlov...it will be soon when we start seeing him become a comedy act...dancing to techno or trying to sing...watch!
Monster heels are almost a necessary evil. Matches where both guys are evenly matched can be very exciting and entertaining to watch. But you also have to have the unstoppable monster for the baby face to fight. It's the classic David and Goliath battle.
I agree, the monster heels could be used better in the long run. It is odd how one week they are indestructible, then after losing to a baby face, mid-carders have no trouble in matches with them.
I agree, the monster heels could be used better in the long run. It is odd how one week they are indestructible, then after losing to a baby face, mid-carders have no trouble in matches with them.
TakeAdooKie
CM F'n Punk
I was just thinking back and I remembered who my favorite monster heel of all time was - Yokozuna! Come on, this guy was the man back in the day and had really good matches with Bret Hart...twice at Wrestlemania (9 and 10). Too bad by the end of his WWE career he was a tag wrestler in Jim Cornette's little stable w/ Owen and Bulldog. But this man in the beginning was used right, won the Royal Rumble and beat the Hitman. Best monster heel of all time
Monster heels can work, but only to a certain extent.
The Undertaker and Vader stand out as the best monster heels, but otherwise, they are few and far between.
The problem is the way they are booked. All the "big" dudes have been promoted the same danm way (unstopable, beats down main eventer only to lose at PPV etc.). Fans are not given a reason to care, other then the way they look, which doesn't cut it these days, and it's no help, that they're usually talentless idiots! Who will ever forget SID and Nathan Jones.
I HOPE VINCE READS THIS
WHY do you think these matches were good (they weren't that good.) Because of Yoko' or because of Bret??? The Hitman freakin carried Yoko!
He was allways out of breath within minutes and could hardly move.
His gimmick worked for a while, but look at his match with Luger f.x, that was a freakin stinker and had no heat, even though that match was promoted like no other!
The Undertaker and Vader stand out as the best monster heels, but otherwise, they are few and far between.
The problem is the way they are booked. All the "big" dudes have been promoted the same danm way (unstopable, beats down main eventer only to lose at PPV etc.). Fans are not given a reason to care, other then the way they look, which doesn't cut it these days, and it's no help, that they're usually talentless idiots! Who will ever forget SID and Nathan Jones.
I HOPE VINCE READS THIS
WHY do you think these matches were good (they weren't that good.) Because of Yoko' or because of Bret??? The Hitman freakin carried Yoko!
He was allways out of breath within minutes and could hardly move.
His gimmick worked for a while, but look at his match with Luger f.x, that was a freakin stinker and had no heat, even though that match was promoted like no other!
I liked Kozlov at first. Yes, his in ring work could stand improving but if your looking for the smoothness of a Bret Hart, not going to happen. Not his style and completely goes against his gimmick. I liked the no music. The no flair. The no nonsense. It was logical and believeable. But as many have stated, a good heel has to evolve. If Kozlov doesn't he will become what everyone is predicting. Orton, Jericho, Triple H, and Taker are some of those that evolved. It doesn't matter if you are not a monster or not, there has to be something to your character.
FromTheSouth
You don't want it with me.
Kozlov doesn't botch moves. His gimmick is that he's a world Smabo champion. He's trained in Jiu Jitsu, so he uses submission holds and throws. How is he shit? He is booked to look like a bigger than life MMA fighter. He's 300 pounds. How many flying tiger space drops is he supposed to do. Kozlov is great at what he does, and if you can't see his gimmick then you are another bandwagoning IWC guy that doesn't get the show. He is supposed to do what he does, and he does it well.
Monster heels are necessary in wrestling. When a top guy needs to go over someone to look like he deserves his belt, he beats a monster with a winning a streak. HBK looked impressive beating Kozlov because no one else had. Cena's FU on the Big Show was impressive, and it helped him get over as super man.
Monsters may not be pretty in the ring, but they serve a very valuable function in any wrestling company. They separate the main event form the midcard. Punk doesn't get to beat Khali, Batista does.
Monster heels are necessary in wrestling. When a top guy needs to go over someone to look like he deserves his belt, he beats a monster with a winning a streak. HBK looked impressive beating Kozlov because no one else had. Cena's FU on the Big Show was impressive, and it helped him get over as super man.
Monsters may not be pretty in the ring, but they serve a very valuable function in any wrestling company. They separate the main event form the midcard. Punk doesn't get to beat Khali, Batista does.
Sean Valjean
Lets Bitch About This Thing We Love
I'm tired of the way WWE does a monster heel lately. Instead of their careers looking like this:
Sean Valjean's Ideal Monster Heel
1. Debuts by destroying an established star, igniting a fued with said star and wins.
2. Destroys other mid-card guys; absolutley no jobbers.
3. Eventually fueds with a main eventer, long fued, wins
4. Finally fueds with the world champ. good, decent length fued. Becomes champ.
5. Good reign, drops it to someone worthy and believable. Continues to dominate, though not quite at the level as before. He's beatable, but he damn sure isn't Kane.
Instead, we get this:
WWE's Monster Heel
1. Debuts, squashes jobbers and mid-carders for weeks, maybe months.
2. Jobs to Mysterio for weeks, months.
3. Jobs to just about anyone. Squashes jobbers to remind us that he's supposed to be an "unstoppable force" and a credible threat *snicker* to the world champ
Also, there's too many monsters. The worst was when we had like Umaga, Snitsky, Kane, Mark Henry, Big Daddy V, and Khali all at once. That's like 2 monsters on each show. In my opinion, there should only be one monster in the whole company, two tops. Even now, there's at least one on each show.
With so many monsters, they lose that "specialness" that monster heels have. Especially when they're all medicore. Monsters are usually supposed to look like one of, if not the most dominate thing on the roster. A roster full of them cheapens that to me.
Sean Valjean's Ideal Monster Heel
1. Debuts by destroying an established star, igniting a fued with said star and wins.
2. Destroys other mid-card guys; absolutley no jobbers.
3. Eventually fueds with a main eventer, long fued, wins
4. Finally fueds with the world champ. good, decent length fued. Becomes champ.
5. Good reign, drops it to someone worthy and believable. Continues to dominate, though not quite at the level as before. He's beatable, but he damn sure isn't Kane.
Instead, we get this:
WWE's Monster Heel
1. Debuts, squashes jobbers and mid-carders for weeks, maybe months.
2. Jobs to Mysterio for weeks, months.
3. Jobs to just about anyone. Squashes jobbers to remind us that he's supposed to be an "unstoppable force" and a credible threat *snicker* to the world champ
Also, there's too many monsters. The worst was when we had like Umaga, Snitsky, Kane, Mark Henry, Big Daddy V, and Khali all at once. That's like 2 monsters on each show. In my opinion, there should only be one monster in the whole company, two tops. Even now, there's at least one on each show.
With so many monsters, they lose that "specialness" that monster heels have. Especially when they're all medicore. Monsters are usually supposed to look like one of, if not the most dominate thing on the roster. A roster full of them cheapens that to me.