When You Think About It, The WWE Hall Of Fame Isn't All That Bad

[Jack-Hammer]

Over the past several years, I've heard a lot of people basically say that the WWE Hall of Fame is a joke, or is watered down due to the inclusion of some inductees that some feel simply don't deserve it. I myself have thought this same thing more than once but I was browsing the net today and came across a few facts about other halls of fame, both in and out of wrestling, that puts things in a different light, at least to me.

I was recently browsing a list of inductees into the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame and I couldn't help but think that the the R&R HOF is the definition of "watered down". It seems that damn near everybody who has ever had anything to do whatsoever with Rock & Roll music is eligible to be inducted. The term "Rock & Roll" has basically become an umbrella term that incorporates country, folk, pop, hip hop, r&b, jazz, blues and damn near any other form of music. There are many inductees in the R&R HOF who are/were record executives, disc jockeys, journalists and various other "industry professionals" who are in there. There are even inductees who spent their careers as nothing more than session musicians.

In the NWA Hall of Fame, there are a couple of inductees who had nothing to do with wrestling or promoting or booking. Teddy Long was inducted in 2012 as a referee. Bill Apter, the editor of Pro Wrestling Illustrated, was inducted in 2011. In the Professional Wrestling Hall of Fame & Museum, again, it seems like everybody who ever laced up a pair of boots is considered eligible for induction. Included inductees are wrestlers who spent much of their careers as jobbers and there are several midget wrestlers included.

WWE has some in the HOF that many wouldn't consider to be "worthy". Koko B. Ware was never a major player in WWE. Hacksaw Jim Duggan never won a title in the more than 6 years of his initial WWF run. The height of the Junkyard Dog's WWF career came about when he was mostly a Hulk Hogan sidekick. Celebrities like Pete Rose and William The Refrigerator Perry didn't make huge contributions, but were involved in memorable angles during their time. However, some of the inductees did other things elsewhere. For instance, Dugan & JYD were big stars in Bill Watts' Mid-South Wrestling Association. Koko was a star in the Memphis territory. Rose & Perry garnered WWE mainstream media attention for WrestleMania.

I guess my point is that, all in all, I don't see the WWE Hall of Fame as the joke some do. There are a few inductees that I'm not wild about, such as the small number of celebrities, but their presence doesn't take away the fact that WWE has some of the greatest names in all of wrestling history in their HOF. When you think about it, especially after looking at the R&R HOF, there are different ways for anyone involved with pro wrestling to make a positive & memorable contribution.

 

[The Butcher]

Some people just take pro wrestling too seriously in my opinion. Personally, I take the WWE and it's subsidiary elements in the spirit they're intended- as entertainment. The WWE Hall of Fame ceremonies are a opportunities for us fans to get a big jolt of nostalgia and celebrate the past. If some fans would rather not take that opportunity, that's on them. Would I like Randy Savage or The Ultimate Warrior to be in the WWE Hall of Fame? Of course, but it doesn't impact my enjoyment of the HOF classes that WWE presents. Who's worthy to be in or not is irrelevant. Wrestling isn't a meritocracy.

I don't see the WWE HOF as good or bad in terms of who's in and who's out. In terms of it being a fun night of remembrance, I think it's terrific.

 

[fenderjapan]

The WWE HOF isn't so bad. All of the major halls of fame have their controversies. Pete Rose, the greatest hitter ever, isnt in the BBHOF. The rock and roll hall of fame left out Rush until this year...and put the Beastie Boys in before them. The basketball hall of fame has had controversy for inducting too many obscure players.

I like the WWE HOF. I wish there was a physical hall of fame and museum as well but it doesnt ruin my enjoyment of it.

 

[The Perfect Max]

You can't really criticize the WWE Hall of Fame because the superstars matches and storylines are predetermined. In Football, no one writes it in that the New York Giants will be the New England Patriots after a perfect season. In Baseball, no one writes that you're going to score a home run. What I'm trying to say is those guys got in based on the moment, and whilst the WWE Hall of Fame consists of guys like "Stone Cold" Steve Austin, Hulk Hogan, Shawn Michaels and Bret Hart, they did have some help on the way. Yes, they made the moment, but they wouldn't have been able to if they hadn't been put in the match.

That's one argument and I can understand that. But me personally, I think that every superstar and diva in the WWE Hall of Fame deserves to be there. Yes, there are superstars that deserve to be in there that aren't, but those that wan't to be there will be. Like the first post said, other Hall of Fame's out there are pretty watered down and don't consider the very best and sometimes consider some of the worst.

I think the reason people think the WWE Hall of Fame is stupid is because of certain individuals in the Celebrity Wing that take up room. Bob Uecker and Drew Carey shouldn't be there, and no one needs to reiterate that, but this reason seems to be the only logical thing to me that gives people the idea the WWE Hall of Fame is stupid.

 

[The Butcher]

I think the reason people think the WWE Hall of Fame is stupid is because of certain individuals in the Celebrity Wing that take up room. Bob Uecker and Drew Carey shouldn't be there, and no one needs to reiterate that, but this reason seems to be the only logical thing to me that gives people the idea the WWE Hall of Fame is stupid.

Yeah, I think the celebrity wing drives a lot of folks nuts. "How can Drew Carey be in there but not (insert wrestler here)?" The thing that either they don't realize or fail to realize is that many halls of fame have places for special contributors. Celebrity involvement has been a big part of WWE in the WrestleMania era of the company. Those same might argue that Andy Kaufman or Mr. T deserve induction ahead of Uecker or Carey, but, to take what you said a step further Max, every inductee deserves to be in there. Whether or not we value their contributions, the people in WWE who determine who gets in do. Personally, I thought Uecker was an inspired choice. He was entertaining, and he always seemed to "get it" as they say.

There are other complaints I've heard, though. The lack of a physical HOF building bothers many, chief among them Bruno Sammartino. Others cite the lack of some Superstar or another, and even I agree that it's sad that Macho Man passed away without being able to give us a "Oooh yeah!" on that stage. Then of course there's the "wrestlers who don't deserve to be in argument." For my part I was a Koko B. Ware mark as a kid, so I was actually pleasantly surprised that he got in. My favorite argument against the WWE HOF, though, is that there isn't a more public vetting/election process. This is one I could actually see myself advocating. A list of HOF finalists and/or a fan vote would be nice. Hopefully that one does come to fruition one day.

 

[Swarles Barkley]

The rock and roll hall of fame left out Rush until this year...and put the Beastie Boys in before them.

That shouldn't be controversial at all. Rush fucking sucks and the Beastie Boys are awesome. Fuck Rush and their stupid fucking songs about talking fucking trees.

But the WWE Hall of Fame is what it is. There are guys that should be in that aren't and guys that shouldn't be in but are. It's no different than any other Hall of Fame.

 

[d_henderson1810]

Over the past several years, I've heard a lot of people basically say that the WWE Hall of Fame is a joke, or is watered down due to the inclusion of some inductees that some feel simply don't deserve it. I myself have thought this same thing more than once but I was browsing the net today and came across a few facts about other halls of fame, both in and out of wrestling, that puts things in a different light, at least to me.

I was recently browsing a list of inductees into the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame and I couldn't help but think that the the R&R HOF is the definition of "watered down". It seems that damn near everybody who has ever had anything to do whatsoever with Rock & Roll music is eligible to be inducted. The term "Rock & Roll" has basically become an umbrella term that incorporates country, folk, pop, hip hop, r&b, jazz, blues and damn near any other form of music. There are many inductees in the R&R HOF who are/were record executives, disc jockeys, journalists and various other "industry professionals" who are in there. There are even inductees who spent their careers as nothing more than session musicians.

In the NWA Hall of Fame, there are a couple of inductees who had nothing to do with wrestling or promoting or booking. Teddy Long was inducted in 2012 as a referee. Bill Apter, the editor of Pro Wrestling Illustrated, was inducted in 2011. In the Professional Wrestling Hall of Fame & Museum, again, it seems like everybody who ever laced up a pair of boots is considered eligible for induction. Included inductees are wrestlers who spent much of their careers as jobbers and there are several midget wrestlers included.

WWE has some in the HOF that many wouldn't consider to be "worthy". Koko B. Ware was never a major player in WWE. Hacksaw Jim Duggan never won a title in the more than 6 years of his initial WWF run. The height of the Junkyard Dog's WWF career came about when he was mostly a Hulk Hogan sidekick. Celebrities like Pete Rose and William The Refrigerator Perry didn't make huge contributions, but were involved in memorable angles during their time. However, some of the inductees did other things elsewhere. For instance, Dugan & JYD were big stars in Bill Watts' Mid-South Wrestling Association. Koko was a star in the Memphis territory. Rose & Perry garnered WWE mainstream media attention for WrestleMania.

I guess my point is that, all in all, I don't see the WWE Hall of Fame as the joke some do. There are a few inductees that I'm not wild about, such as the small number of celebrities, but their presence doesn't take away the fact that WWE has some of the greatest names in all of wrestling history in their HOF. When you think about it, especially after looking at the R&R HOF, there are different ways for anyone involved with pro wrestling to make a positive & memorable contribution.

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I would add, that the boxing HoF is "watered-down" by adding Sylvester Stallone, someone who was never actually a boxer, but only played one on-screen.

Still waiting to see if they also induct Robert DeNiro and Hilary Swank for playing boxers in movies as well!

 

[d_henderson1810]

Yeah, I think the celebrity wing drives a lot of folks nuts. "How can Drew Carey be in there but not (insert wrestler here)?" The thing that either they don't realize or fail to realize is that many halls of fame have places for special contributors. Celebrity involvement has been a big part of WWE in the WrestleMania era of the company. Those same might argue that Andy Kaufman or Mr. T deserve induction ahead of Uecker or Carey, but, to take what you said a step further Max, every inductee deserves to be in there. Whether or not we value their contributions, the people in WWE who determine who gets in do. Personally, I thought Uecker was an inspired choice. He was entertaining, and he always seemed to "get it" as they say.

There are other complaints I've heard, though. The lack of a physical HOF building bothers many, chief among them Bruno Sammartino. Others cite the lack of some Superstar or another, and even I agree that it's sad that Macho Man passed away without being able to give us a "Oooh yeah!" on that stage. Then of course there's the "wrestlers who don't deserve to be in argument." For my part I was a Koko B. Ware mark as a kid, so I was actually pleasantly surprised that he got in. My favorite argument against the WWE HOF, though, is that there isn't a more public vetting/election process. This is one I could actually see myself advocating. A list of HOF finalists and/or a fan vote would be nice. Hopefully that one does come to fruition one day.

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I've always thought that they should build a proper HoF one day.

Maybe they should do it in the WWE buildings at Stamford, or find some venue where they can put it up permanently.

I would like to see it done like this. They should have glass cases, with a piece of a costume, some weapon, something representing the wrestler/s.

For example, take the Road Warriors. You could have a case, and ask Animal (the living member of the HoF) to contribute the shoulder pads he and Hawk wore. Also, on one wall of the case you could have a picture, and the list of their title history or achievements.

An even better idea (but a more costly one) is to do a Madame Tussad's, and make wax figures of each HoF, with their career history beside it. Charge admission, and I am sure that WWE fans would flock to it.

Also, have the celebrity wing be a seperate wing, and have each celebrity's career achievements, and their contribution to WWE beside them (such as which WMs they appeared at, etc).

WWE could even draw people by occassionally having actual HoFs make guest appearances, and fans have the chance to get autographs and photos with said HoF/s.

I think this would be a classy and cool way to make the HoF more "legit".

 

[fenderjapan]

That shouldn't be controversial at all. Rush fucking sucks and the Beastie Boys are awesome. Fuck Rush and their stupid fucking songs about talking fucking trees.

But the WWE Hall of Fame is what it is. There are guys that should be in that aren't and guys that shouldn't be in but are. It's no different than any other Hall of Fame.

Nothing says "rock and roll" like a bunch of rich white guys rapping.

I think a WWE museum would be great though. Memorabilia from every HOFer, all of the big events...you could have a booth where guests could call legendary matches (they have those at the basketball hall of fame) and all that stuff...it would be great. I literally cant imagine how it couldn't be profitable

 

[ilapierre]

When you think of it, the WWE Hall of Fame really isn't that bad. It's not really a place you can go visit. It's just a ceremony prior to Wrestlemania. If there were a Hall of Fame shrine that people all over the world could come to visit, then, in a way, the Hall wouldn't be a joke. It doesn't matter whose inducted or who isn't as long as the best of the best are represented. If the WWE was to create a Hall of Fame building then they would have to include and accurately represent the accomplishments of five of the greatest wrestlers not in the WWE HOF: Bruno Sammartino, Randy Savage, Bob Backlund, Ultimate Warrior and Chris Benoit. When I think 'Hall of Fame' I think of these guys being honoured with magnificent displays in a physical building. But the reality is there is no building. There is just a ceremony. So, in that regard, the current HOF isn't really a joke. It's just honouring wrestling's past and most of the key people who were there when the whole thing started to take off in the mainstream. If WWE were to create an actual 'Hall' to showcase wrestling history then it could not leave this guys out or undervalue their importance as punishment for not accepting the invitation. Bruno was the biggest draw of the 20th century before Hogan. He was the face of wrestling for 20 years and held the WWE world title longer than anyone in its history. Randy Savage may be the most complete wrestling entertainer of all time. He meant so much to wrestling that there could be a Randy Savage Hall of Fame. Bob Backlund was champion for almost 6 years. He was the Cena of his generation. Benoit may be, pound for pound, the greatest technical wrestler ever. And Ultimate Warrior, even though his career didn't amount to as much as it could, was just about as big as Hulk Hogan for the peak years of Hulkamania. He may not be deserving as he did not pay his dues but he was and still would be a massive draw to such a building. He was larger than life and had some epic Wrestlemania moments that my generation of wrestling fanatics will never forget. Even though there is no building, I still find the HOF not all that 'official' with these 5 who should have been inducted years ago.

Even though wrestling matches don't have real endings and it's not as important that a wrestler had an amazing track record, it is important to show how key wrestlers shaped wrestling or influenced future generations. And no one can deny that these 5 were among the top 20 or 25 of all time when it came to what they were able to bring to the sport. This is why the HOF, to me, doesn't feel authentic enough. And it's not like it's only a matter of time. There's a strong possibility that Bruno, Savage, Benoit and Warrior, 4 of the 5, will never be inducted. It's like leaving Bonds, Rose, McGwire, Clemens and Shoeless Joe out of the MLB Hall. It's ridiculous and destroys credibility.

Only problem I have with anything here is Swarles Barkley disliking Rush. Rush deserves to be in the Rock N Roll Hall of Fame. Anybody who thinks otherwise has no taste in anything.

 

[dd23beatlesfan1]

First off, to address a couple of issues about the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame that have been discussed.

Both the Beastie Boys and Rush deserve to be in the RNRHOF. Both are iconic, massively influential groups for their genres and periods. I do think both bands are kind of acquired tastes, but both were very accomplished bands that influenced many of their peers and those that came after. And for those that think the Beasties were just a bunch of punk, white, wannabe rappers, they never really payed attention to them. As they did play actual instruments (they started out as a punk rock band before turning to hip hop), and incorporated many different styles of music into their sound. They're practically the only legit rap/hip-hop group I've ever heard also be played on alternative rock radio. The Beastie Boys are legends and definitely deserve it, as do Rush. I do agree that it was ridiculous that the Beasties got in before Rush, not due to greatness level, but for chronological reasons. Rush debuted a decade before the Beasties, so they should've gotten in first. Another example of that (which should be more understandable to the more close-minded music fans that think rock and roll music is only white guys with long hair or buzz cuts playing loud guitars) would be Metallica getting in before Alice Cooper. Again not due to greatness level, but for the fact that Alice Cooper debuted almost 15 years before Metallica did. I'm a big proponent of Hall of Fames being chronological in their inductions, to accurately tell the story of whatever subject they're honoring. And there would be no Metallica without Alice Cooper, Rush, and two other bands that still aren't in, Deep Purple and KISS. Heck there would be no Rush without Deep Purple, and even Geddy Lee or Alex Lifeson (can't remember which one), stated that shortly after they were announced for induction and Deep Purple were announced as being left out this year.

And as far as the RNRHOF being "watered down" because they induct artists who aren't white and play loud guitars (basically), rock and roll music's roots are in blues, jazz, gospel, R&B, and early country/bluegrass music. In the early days of rock and roll, guitar wasn't even the primary instrument (until Chuck Berry came along), the piano was. So it makes perfect sense for the HOF to induct artists in the blues, R&B/soul, country, folk, genres, etc. Even disco, pop, and yes rap make sense. All of those genres spawned out of early rock and roll and R&B music, so yes Madonna, the Beastie Boys and Public Enemy belong just as much as Rush, Led Zeppelin, and Metallica. Rock and Roll music isn't just hard rock/metal with loud guitars. It's much more multi-faceted than that. Miles Davis is a bit of a stretch though, I have to admit, though he is one of the greatest artists in overall music history.


Now, onto the WWE HOF. I love it. I love history and Hall of Fames, so I'm just as excited about the HOF as I am Wrestlemania and the Royal Rumble. I don't think it's a waste of time, and I don't think it's a joke either. Could it be better? Sure. I agree that WWE needs to invest in a HOF building. Though I don't think the HOF isn't legit because they don't have a HOF building. Back to the Rock and Roll HOF, they inducted their first class in 1986, but didn't have an official building until 1995. But I do think it would be a good idea for WWE to build one. It would be very profitable. I would like to see a more legitimate voting committee take part, and not just Vince choosing who goes in. I think the Voting Committee (kind of similar to the RNRHOF and other HOF's) should consist of the McMahon family, the executives of WWE, the current roster of wrestlers, and every past living HOF inductee. I would be very interested to see who the likes of Hulk Hogan, Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels, Steve Austin, etc would vote for. I also think that people like Bruno, Bob Backlund, Ultimate Warrior, etc, guys who have not accepted the honor in the past would be more likely to accept it if they knew that their peers would be voting them in. I think Bruno would care a lot more if all of the HOF inductees were choosing him to go in, and not just Vince. So I do think the HOF should look into having a more legit voting process. WWE could also come up with a list of nominees perhaps. 15, and the voting committee chooses who goes in. The top 7-8 vote getters are the ones that get in.

And as far as the celebrity wing. I have no problem with it whatsoever. Many HOF's have other categories of HOFers other than the main inductees. As Jack-Hammer pointed out, there are session musicians, record executives, professional songwriters, disc-jockeys, etc in the RNRHOF. Why is that? Because there are outside categories. There is the Early Influences category (artists that pre-dated and influenced rock and roll music which includes artists like Louis Armstrong, T-Bone Walker, Louis Jordan, Hank Williams, etc.), there is the Sidemen category, now known as the Award for Musical Excellence (which was the category for session musicians), and there was the Non-Performers category (now known as the Ahmet Ertegun Lifetime Achievement award), which honored non performers, like songwriters, disc-jockeys, music executives, promoters, etc. So it makes sense for the WWE HOF to have outside categories. The "celebrity wing" is one of them. Celebrities have played a big part at times in the modern landscape of WWE, so it makes sense to induct ones. Now Drew Carey, even for the celebrity wing, is probably the worst inductee of the HOF. I can think of about 10 celebrities that meant much more to wrestling and have been far more involved over the years than Drew Carey (Andy Kaufman, Cyndi Lauper, Mr. T, Muhammad Ali, Sylvester Stallone, Donald Trump, Aretha Franklin, etc.). But yes, it makes sense to have a celebrity category.

I think the WWE HOF could do better on certain things, but it's certainly not a joke or the most horrible institution in history, like some people make it out to be.

 

[tom9422]

I think too many people misunderstand how HOF's are meant to work or get all worked up over semantics.

The WWE HOF isn't so bad. All of the major halls of fame have their controversies. Pete Rose, the greatest hitter ever, isnt in the BBHOF. The rock and roll hall of fame left out Rush until this year...and put the Beastie Boys in before them. The basketball hall of fame has had controversy for inducting too many obscure players.

I like the WWE HOF. I wish there was a physical hall of fame and museum as well but it doesnt ruin my enjoyment of it.

The Rock and Roll HOF is just a general music hall of fame, especially these days, i don't see whats so wrong about that either. On that topic, the Beastie Boys were far more popular and had far more influence on the musical landscape than Rush ever did. Sorry to say it, but Rush is just a band that gets overrated by progressive rock marks.

I would add, that the boxing HoF is "watered-down" by adding Sylvester Stallone, someone who was never actually a boxer, but only played one on-screen.

Still waiting to see if they also induct Robert DeNiro and Hilary Swank for playing boxers in movies as well!

Rocky was the biggest boxing movie franchise ever and probably raised awareness of the sport like nothing else ever has. Stallone has done a great deal for the sport of boxing, why shouldn't he get in there?


On the WWE HOF, theres a reason they don't induct everyone every year. They have ceremonies and make a big deal about it, so they can't just induct everyone this year, what legends could they then induct in 2014? Savage, Sammartino and the likes will all get in eventually, mark my words, is it so hard to understand?

 

[The 1-2-3 Killam]

It seems that damn near everybody who has ever had anything to do whatsoever with Rock & Roll music is eligible to be inducted.

Yeah, except Rush...UNTIL NOW!

EDIT: Shit, this isn't in the WSZ. Editing now.

EDIT 2: I personally love the WWE Hall of Fame. You're always going to get a few guys that people think don't deserve to be there. And of course there's a huge list of guys that SHOULD, but still have yet to be inducted. "Macho Man" Randy Savage. The Fabulous Freebirds. Bruno Sammartino. Toots Mondt. The list goes on... But on the whole, I feel like their "main event" picks are always incredibly solid. The problem comes when every year, they have to stretch to bring in 5, 6, or 7 big names. I was actually proud of TNA for starting out with only Sting. If WWE keeps going at this pace, it's going to continue getting watered down. But for the last few years, excluding 2011, I've really loved WWE's HOF classes. In fact, I bought the WrestleMania 28 blu-ray just to see the entire HOF ceremony.

2012: Edge, The Four Horsemen, Mil Mascaras, Mike Tyson, Yokozuna, and Ron Simmons. I can see some making a case for Edge not deserving it, but as a big fan of his I think that's complete crap. He was going to get in, sooner or later. Might as well play off the recent drama of his retirement, and send him off into the sunlight. Everyone else belonged in their with very little argument. Tyson was singled out as a "celebrity member", so for those making the case against non-wrestlers, maybe re-think your position. Celebrities have had a long, historic involvement with pro wrestling. Especially the WWE/F.

I will say, HBK had a poor class. I never got into "Hacksaw", and I didn't watch WWE when Sunny was around. Don't give a damn about Drew Carry, and Abdullah was a pretty controversial choice. Just seemed like they were stretching things pretty thin. I actually think this class is the one that made people start hating on the HOF.

 

[THTRobtaylor]

It's kind of an extension of fandom, people get pissed off if their fave doesn't get the world title, or gets it late in their career and it's a "thank you" rather than living up to their potential.

In the HOF WWE is in a difficult position as they started the endeavour as their own way to recognise their past stars. Since 2001 though and with each subsequent purchase of a video library they are now in the position of defacto custodians of the history of the business as well as an active business with their own financial agenda and a TV show with their own continuity.

So it means that certain things cannot happen every year, for example they tend to only induct one "dead wrestler" a year. By this I mean someone who went before their time rather than one who lived to a good age. This makes it difficult as so many have died young yet deserve the honor. Someone like Savage's death is raw with fans and the perceived injustice of his not being inducted while alive means that fans will not rest till he is in. But sadly it brings it's own problems, Liz who would also be inducted, is also dead, and died in very controversial circumstances involving another wrestler. Can they risk Lex being there, after all Liz once called him "the love of her life" so it'd be harsh not to invite him, but the "You Killed Liz" chants on the show could ruin it. Lanny Poffo has said they can't put Randy in without putting their father and he in... again you can see Lanny's point but in no way should he be standing in the way at this point, so WWE won't bother cos the hassle isn't worth it. And all this is before Vince swallows whatever problem he had to put him in... Same for Owen...that one will never happen till his kids demand it.

You also then have the guys who deserve an induction but cos they died young it "looks bad on WWE". Rick Rude, Brian Pillman, Davey Boy, Bam Bam, all have legit claims to be in there now but are not, had they survived longer they would have been without question. I have heard Bam Bam is favourite for this year, I strongly disagree that he should be in ahead of Davey, Pillman or Rude. Their best bet is going to be induct the Hart Foundation stable of 97, Bret and Jim show up, Shawn and Hunter or Austin can induct and that way Davey, Owen and Pillman, 3 guys are in the HOF who should be at one stroke. Bam Bam only works if they induct LT as the celeb and together. Again, if you induct Rude you need Heenan or Warrior as no one else other than Sting would really be suitable. Bret may have been his best friend, but you can't have Bret, Shawn, Hunter and Austin induct everyone. Heenan is not in the shape to induct and Warrior would be too likely to shoot.

For those who are alive still, it's a process of elimination. Each year they induct a promoter of some description, a celeb, they induct a Diva, a tag team and they induct a mid-card/jobber for life type. By sticking to those tropes it means you get a wide range of people in but each year WWE waits they risk the guys not being around to induct. This years has the aura of an "Attitude Era" class so I think we will see.

Foley

DX (All bar Chyna, and possibly even her if they can get her to behave, again solves the
Rude issue as he is still a crucial part of DX's legacy. Having the NAO also sets up their inevitable tag run.)

Bam Bam & LT (For their Mania feud)

Goldust (with Cody inducting)

Shane McMahon

Sable (As a sweetener for Brock re-signing and she was a pretty major part of the Attitude era.


Guys like Bruno can stick it as far as I can see, at the end of the day, WWE is now the keeper of the flame... Bruno, Superstar and their like can hate it as much as they want but at the end of the day they are only preventing their story being told at all by being negative rather than saving their integrity.

 

[Mustang Sally]

Koko B. Ware was never a major player in WWE.

Yes, his name always seems to come up in discussions of this type. If they put him in HOF, what justification is there for failing to induct anyone else? I don't even remember if he won any minor titles, but whether he did or not, what difference does it make? A load of parrot shit?

I would never waste my time worrying about who's in and who's not in a form of sports entertainment in which results are predetermined. Once they stuck Pete Rose in there, all bets were off, as far as I was concerned. Am I saying it bothered me to have him in there? No, it just accented the silliness of the WWE Hall of Fame..... it's the same thing as the Slammy Awards; just an excuse to put on an annual show the fans might enjoy. Not everything they do has to be depicted as serious competition, as much as the "purists" on this forum detest anything except straight wrestling.

As it is, during the last few years, the company seems to have "serious-ed up" whom they've chosen for induction. Almost all of the people chosen do belong there.

But, hey! When you think about Pete Rose and Drew Carey being inductees, isn't it ironic that the guy who put both of them in there was Kane?

You want to blame anyone for the inclusion of two non-wrestlers, blame him.

 

[MCMG]

I think there are too many people in the Hall of Fame. It should be 3/4 entrants every year but they promote the HoF event before mania so they need fillers. Therefore, the quality gets diluted. Also, there are too many celebrities in there for it to be a WWE hall of fame.

I looks great when you think that The Rock, HHH, Taker, Kane still all need to get inducted but I'll tell you now that guys like Santino and the Great Khali will be in the hall of fame, making the former's achievement of getting in less glorious.

 

[THTRobtaylor]

Guys like Koko B. Ware have an important part to play in the history of WWE... He never won titles, but was a major step in putting over talent over the years... he was the first guy to get cuffed and beat by the Big Bossman on PPV and the first to take the Tombstone from the Undertaker. Jobbers to the stars like he and Tito Santana are just as worthy as someone who benefits from their initial favor. Taker wouldn't be where he is if people like Koko, Snuka etc had not put him over at the start to look devastating.

Also, there is a story in Bret's book about how Koko was quite badly wronged by Vince's #2 and by extension Vince who fired him. So in Koko's case it was probably a case of "making it up to him".

Someone like Santino is the modern equivalent, they won't go in to the HOF till they are much older... but eventually when the time comes it'd be hard to say the guy won't deserve it.

 

[fenderjapan]

First off, to address a couple of issues about the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame that have been discussed.

Both the Beastie Boys and Rush deserve to be in the RNRHOF. Both are iconic, massively influential groups for their genres and periods. I do think both bands are kind of acquired tastes, but both were very accomplished bands that influenced many of their peers and those that came after. And for those that think the Beasties were just a bunch of punk, white, wannabe rappers, they never really payed attention to them. As they did play actual instruments (they started out as a punk rock band before turning to hip hop), and incorporated many different styles of music into their sound. They're practically the only legit rap/hip-hop group I've ever heard also be played on alternative rock radio. The Beastie Boys are legends and definitely deserve it, as do Rush. I do agree that it was ridiculous that the Beasties got in before Rush, not due to greatness level, but for chronological reasons. Rush debuted a decade before the Beasties, so they should've gotten in first. Another example of that (which should be more understandable to the more close-minded music fans that think rock and roll music is only white guys with long hair or buzz cuts playing loud guitars) would be Metallica getting in before Alice Cooper. Again not due to greatness level, but for the fact that Alice Cooper debuted almost 15 years before Metallica did. I'm a big proponent of Hall of Fames being chronological in their inductions, to accurately tell the story of whatever subject they're honoring. And there would be no Metallica without Alice Cooper, Rush, and two other bands that still aren't in, Deep Purple and KISS. Heck there would be no Rush without Deep Purple, and even Geddy Lee or Alex Lifeson (can't remember which one), stated that shortly after they were announced for induction and Deep Purple were announced as being left out this year.

And as far as the RNRHOF being "watered down" because they induct artists who aren't white and play loud guitars (basically), rock and roll music's roots are in blues, jazz, gospel, R&B, and early country/bluegrass music. In the early days of rock and roll, guitar wasn't even the primary instrument (until Chuck Berry came along), the piano was. So it makes perfect sense for the HOF to induct artists in the blues, R&B/soul, country, folk, genres, etc. Even disco, pop, and yes rap make sense. All of those genres spawned out of early rock and roll and R&B music, so yes Madonna, the Beastie Boys and Public Enemy belong just as much as Rush, Led Zeppelin, and Metallica. Rock and Roll music isn't just hard rock/metal with loud guitars. It's much more multi-faceted than that. Miles Davis is a bit of a stretch though, I have to admit, though he is one of the greatest artists in overall music history.


Now, onto the WWE HOF. I love it. I love history and Hall of Fames, so I'm just as excited about the HOF as I am Wrestlemania and the Royal Rumble. I don't think it's a waste of time, and I don't think it's a joke either. Could it be better? Sure. I agree that WWE needs to invest in a HOF building. Though I don't think the HOF isn't legit because they don't have a HOF building. Back to the Rock and Roll HOF, they inducted their first class in 1986, but didn't have an official building until 1995. But I do think it would be a good idea for WWE to build one. It would be very profitable. I would like to see a more legitimate voting committee take part, and not just Vince choosing who goes in. I think the Voting Committee (kind of similar to the RNRHOF and other HOF's) should consist of the McMahon family, the executives of WWE, the current roster of wrestlers, and every past living HOF inductee. I would be very interested to see who the likes of Hulk Hogan, Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels, Steve Austin, etc would vote for. I also think that people like Bruno, Bob Backlund, Ultimate Warrior, etc, guys who have not accepted the honor in the past would be more likely to accept it if they knew that their peers would be voting them in. I think Bruno would care a lot more if all of the HOF inductees were choosing him to go in, and not just Vince. So I do think the HOF should look into having a more legit voting process. WWE could also come up with a list of nominees perhaps. 15, and the voting committee chooses who goes in. The top 7-8 vote getters are the ones that get in.

And as far as the celebrity wing. I have no problem with it whatsoever. Many HOF's have other categories of HOFers other than the main inductees. As Jack-Hammer pointed out, there are session musicians, record executives, professional songwriters, disc-jockeys, etc in the RNRHOF. Why is that? Because there are outside categories. There is the Early Influences category (artists that pre-dated and influenced rock and roll music which includes artists like Louis Armstrong, T-Bone Walker, Louis Jordan, Hank Williams, etc.), there is the Sidemen category, now known as the Award for Musical Excellence (which was the category for session musicians), and there was the Non-Performers category (now known as the Ahmet Ertegun Lifetime Achievement award), which honored non performers, like songwriters, disc-jockeys, music executives, promoters, etc. So it makes sense for the WWE HOF to have outside categories. The "celebrity wing" is one of them. Celebrities have played a big part at times in the modern landscape of WWE, so it makes sense to induct ones. Now Drew Carey, even for the celebrity wing, is probably the worst inductee of the HOF. I can think of about 10 celebrities that meant much more to wrestling and have been far more involved over the years than Drew Carey (Andy Kaufman, Cyndi Lauper, Mr. T, Muhammad Ali, Sylvester Stallone, Donald Trump, Aretha Franklin, etc.). But yes, it makes sense to have a celebrity category.

I think the WWE HOF could do better on certain things, but it's certainly not a joke or the most horrible institution in history, like some people make it out to be.

I think what pissed me off more than the beasties being inducted was that they got inducted before some of the people I would say are more deserving. OR at least chronologically, as you highlighted.

The whole celebrity wing of the WWE hall of fame gets so many people butthurt. But its just that, the celebrity wing...no one is saying they are comparable in influence to Bret Hart or Shawn Michaels, they are saying simply that they are notable celebrities. Its like the Ford Frick award from the Baseball Hall of Fame. No one announcer is ever going to be as important in baseball as Babe Ruth or Cal Ripken. But it is what it is.

 

[JUSTINMFNBEEMER]

I find it completely crazy that anyone would believe that an actual physical building for the hof would be profitable. Does anyone remember wwf new york? Probably not. It was basically a hall, containing memorabilia and other old shit, and how long did that last?

And btw, being canadian, rush is fucking HUGE here! I think they suck, but thats my opinion.

 

[The Butcher]

I find it completely crazy that anyone would believe that an actual physical building for the hof would be profitable. Does anyone remember wwf new york? Probably not. It was basically a hall, containing memorabilia and other old shit, and how long did that last?

Solid point. I don't see how the profitability of a WWE Hall of Fame building would be something anybody here could accurately gauge, but WWF New York would be the closest analogue to go off of. I do remember reading that it was being discussed to make it part of an amusement park, and if that was the case I could see it standing a better chance of survival than WWF New York. It's pretty hard to say one way or the other without some real market research, though.

Personally, I'm not really worried if they make a physical location or not. WWE is a circus show. They come to you, not vice versa. I couldn't see myself going out of my way to visit a physical WWE HoF, that's for sure. If I happened to go to the area where it was at, then sure, but I'm not making a pilgrimage to Stamford or NYC or Florida just to look at wrestling memorabilia. That's coming from a fan since '88 and an on-again, off-again IWC member. If I'm not going, then the casual fans probably aren't going to descend on the place en masse, either.

 

[AndThat'sTheBottomLine]

That shouldn't be controversial at all. Rush fucking sucks and the Beastie Boys are awesome. Fuck Rush and their stupid fucking songs about talking fucking trees.

But the WWE Hall of Fame is what it is. There are guys that should be in that aren't and guys that shouldn't be in but are. It's no different than any other Hall of Fame.

They both suck to me. Beastie Boys are no where near rock music as much as Rap. I like the WWE HoF granted the celebrity wing is stupid but a lot of those guys made contributions. RR HoF is watered down with groups that shouldn't be there, like the BEASTIE BOYS because they're NOT rock music.That's like inducting Kid fucking Rock into the Hall of Fame because he has Rock in his name. So people really shouldn't get mad at the WWE HoF because at least their inductees had something to do with the actual product.

 

[The Butcher]

So maybe you hit the nail on the head right there. Maybe the WWE HOF should be a physical, traveling display they set up at events.

I think that'd be very reasonable. It would definitely allow more fans to see it. Get the memorabilia, a bunch of HoF'ers, and put them on the road in smaller venues that are in close vicinity to Raw's emanating from bigger cities. The HOF could come sooner and stay after Raw. They could have autograph signings, panel discussions, and even matches for the old-timers that can still go a little bit. It's a good compromise.

 

[tom9422]

They both suck to me. Beastie Boys are no where near rock music as much as Rap. I like the WWE HoF granted the celebrity wing is stupid but a lot of those guys made contributions. RR HoF is watered down with groups that shouldn't be there, like the BEASTIE BOYS because they're NOT rock music.That's like inducting Kid fucking Rock into the Hall of Fame because he has Rock in his name. So people really shouldn't get mad at the WWE HoF because at least their inductees had something to do with the actual product.

The Rock & Roll Hall of Fame is not and has never been a hall of fame solely for rock music. It has always been a general music thing. It's best that you get that through your head ASAP.