What's happened to the "evil" heels?

[MrMojoRisin]

There is something missing with todays 'heel' in the WWE, and it's basically that they're not really doing much to be heelish. They're not over the top anymore. In fact, for the most part, today most heels aren't that distinguishable from todays faces.

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The above is a classic example of an evil heel at work, and an angle that is well remembered over 20 years after the fact. Jake wasn't just telling the fans not to like him... he was giving them reason to hate him, and that's something that doesn't happen enough anymore.

Kane will occasionally go into evil heel mode, but he's been made to be such a tweener over the years that his evilness is muted. The Big Show is trying the same currently, and Jericho was earlier in the year, but in both of their cases they have much of the same problem.

The funny thing though, is you notice that all three of those examples are older guys. What are the new heels doing to make you hate them? Take Alberto Del Rio for example. He's a heel, but why? Because he's rich and arrogant. Great, but what else? Does he use any of that to make himself especially dispicable? Does he use any of that to make you truly hate him? Truly want to see someone put him in his place? Ted Dibiase had a similar gimmick to Del Rio, and whether it was making a woman bark like a dog, or bringing in a heel ref to buy the championship, he used his means to make you absolutely despise him, and you just couldn't wait to see Hogan or Savage put him in his place.

There have been some simple guidelines throughout history on why a heel does what he does, that seem to have been thrown aside with the new generation.

what makes a heel a heel is that he cheats because he's afraid he is going to lose because he can't outwrestle the babyface. And nobody likes a cheater.

Jake Roberts and Bobby Heenan took this a step further and add that a heel gets his heat by being sneaky and underhanded behind the refs back... because being underhanded in front of the referee doesn't put the heat on them, it just puts it on the referee that isn't doing his job.

Mick Foley and Michael Hayes go even further and state that the heel never feels that he is the bad guy. He always feels justified in doing what he does, even when he's doing the most unimaginable things.

We don't see that in todays generation. To pick on Del Rio again... he wins most of his matches cleanly. Why should I hate that? He's an arrogant jerk, but I don't have a reason to hate the arrogant jerk, just a reason not to like him because he is a jerk. I can respect that he's talented and good at what he does... but should I be respecting the heel? Does this make me care to watch someone finally beat him? Maybe on a smaller level, but not as much as if he was using his evil ring announcer to cheat so he could win every night, or buying off people to hurt his opponents for him, all the while sitting back and delusionally bragging that everything he accomplishes is all on his own.

The problem with all of this, is that on the flip side, we don't have new faces coming up that are super over. Hogan needed the evil Rowdy Roddy Piper to make him in the first place. Austin went to another level with the evil Vince McMahon as his foil. Who's the guy to help take the next mega face to that level?

I think it's time to start seeing some dastardly heels again. Guys that can make your blood boil, and make you invested in seeing them get what they deserve. Enough of the blurred lines. Let's see some heels be truly bad people again.

 

[JaylisJayP]

I think Daniel Bryan is the closest we have to a heel in the sense that you described it these days. Wade Barrett is pretty evil, too, but these guys are lost on Smackdown and then of course Wade got hurt. If he can return on Raw, I think he'll return to the top.

They're "trying" to make Big Show a dastardly heel, but he's such a bufoon, and nobody takes him seriously (at least in the IWC).

I've been saying for a while there are hardly any top heels in the WWE right now. They also had a great opportunity with Cody Rhodes but I feel he's stagnated a little bit, even though he's still prominently chasing the IC belt. Some of that might be his fault.

I'm sure the PG Era AND Linda's campaign combined are heavily playing into it. WWE seems to be walking on eggshells at the moment, and admittedly it's making for some incredibly mundane WWE programming. But whenever a name shows up (Vince, HHH) the ratings spike, so if they really care about ratings, they know they need to develop and massively push some more names...and many of those names need to be made into the mold of a great, memorable heel.

 

[Low_Ki]

Quality post bro.

I completely agree. The Macho Man cobra attack is a vivid memory of mine as well.

I agree whole heartedly that heels these days don't give us enough to hate them. Take The Miz for example. Sure he's a douche. He's Awesome. Fair enough. But do something bad to make me believe that you are as big an asshole as you say. Like you said, too many heels are not using what they have in their gimmick to their advantage. Sure you can have a heel get a tainted victory, but for the most part, it isn't enough.

Look at the Corporation. A beautifully crafted stable that made you hate each member with the same distain. They wanted to please the evil boss Vince McMahon who abused his power at the high of wrestlings popularity. I hated McMahon the character. Every time Austin got one over on Vinnie Mac, I went ape shit. The same went for the Rock.

The Undertaker during his Ministry days was a quality heel too. He kidnapped the bosses daughter and tried to marry her for Christ's Sake. I popped out of my chair when Austin (again) made the save.

This is what we don't have enough of these days. The Miz, if he ever makes it back onto Monday night TV again, needs to do something dastardly. As does Del Rio. They could elevate themselves to crazy heights if they put a little thought into going further with their characters. But, that may not be up to them.

Bring back Jake Roberts I say!

 

[ash brooks]

or undertaker and kane when they heels would kidnap wrestlers or divas or they would attack the vince and shane and stephaine remember when undertaker and kane dropped the steel steps on vinces legs or when for a couple of weeks they came down nearly every match or at the end and attacked anyone in the ring

 

[Diet Soda]

I'm sure the PG Era AND Linda's campaign combined are heavily playing into it. WWE seems to be walking on eggshells at the moment, and admittedly it's making for some incredibly mundane WWE programming.

I think you hit the nail on the head here; you can't really have characters "killing" each other anymore.

On the other hand, there isn't a necessity for heels to be sinister or evil. All they need is to be annoying enough that the fans pop when they get their asses kicked (see, for example, Heath Slater).

It's something I do occasionally miss though, because the irritating heel can easily fall into the category of comic relief, and stop being a credible threat (see, for example, Heath Slater).

My favourite 'evil' heel would have to be Triple H - he's without a doubt done some of the most despicable things in wrestling history; orchestrating Austin being run over, using a sledgehammer to attack people, and just being a downright vicious bugger.

 

[TheReckoning]

I've noticed that problem too. We don't have that one heel that we just wanna beat up or see put in his place. All the heels anymore are whiny or are just monsters with no personality whatsoever.

The last two REALLY good heels were Triple H in 02-05 and Edge from 07-10. Orton was getting there when he was with Legacy, but they killed that momentum too quickly.

 

[George Steele's Barber]

You are all wrong. Nothing has changed, you have picked great moments of the past (probably from your youth) to dwell on. You're making a much bigger deal of the past and in turn not giving the present its due.

So Daniel Bryan comes out and abuses and humiliates his tiny cute girlfriend and no one sees that as evil. Big Show closed fist punches the biggest good guy hero in WWE multiple times out of no where and it is quickly overlooked. Del Rio refuses to break holds and has a lackey who cheats for him all the time doing his bidding but because his promos are "boring" it doesn't matter. Tensai cheats by rubbing green mist in people's eyes but he "sucks". Otunga worships the ground that JL walks on and kisses his ass constantly. Cole is a self absorbed penis. Johnny Ace is a power hungry douche. Barrett throws Orton down the stairs but in the end it was kind of a cool to see. Lesnar does nothing right in or out of the ring but he is part time so let's forget about him.

Things aren't different. The heels are mostly still heels. The only thing that is different is that the audience has grown up and seen it all before. Unfortunately some of that same audience has grown up to be smarks and go out and ruin the show for the kids. Kids who unlike the posters in this thread when they were kids are not able to enjoy the show like the rest of us did as kids.

 

[The_Midnight_Show]

Well thought-out post. I agree with what you're saying as well. They are trying to make Big Show an evil heel but like above posters mentioned, the IWC and even casual fans who have watched merely since WM, know that it wasn't even a couple of months ago that he was a losing face.

As for the rest of the heels in the company, the most "evil" thing they do are attacks from behind, and considering most heels do it, this doesn't produce that one evil heel. Being a coward during matches and cheating to win are all something we expect from heels anymore. It doesn't distinguish one from another. Daniel Bryan, though an excellent heel, is certainly not an evil one. "Annoying" is something we expect out of heels as well, which is why Del Rio and Miz won't work out as evil heels (as they are currently) because "annoying" is a large part of what they have going for them heel-character wise.

The last decent "evil" heel was Jericho for the one-two months that he was tormenting CM Punk. Perhaps WWE could've kept the ball rolling with Jericho into other feuds like Orton, but the suspension put a halt to that. As for how to produce a new evil heel, which I believe we would all love to see again, WWE has to go young like you mentioned. Turning a character such as the Big Show into an "evil heel" just doesn't work because only three week ago (from the turn) he was a bumbling face.

Dean Ambrose (admittedly only familiar with what I have read, and have only actually watched a little of), seems like he may be able to get the job done. He definitely has that perturbed side of him, which always makes for a good evil heel. If the man is unsettled himself, why should he care if everything else around him is chaos? Bray Wyatt is also a possibility with perhaps a lot of religious undertones. As long as WWE is able to convey that Bray isn't portraying a specific religion, and that Bray feels that he is his own religion, then there is potential for an evil heel.

EDIT: I also forgot to throw in Nexus as a recent evil "heel." Destroying legends, beating up Vince, 7-on-1 attacks, etc.

 

[Jomo_mark]

I think the main problem is that now everything is so watered down. One of those "evil heel" moments I can remember in recent (fairly) time would be Randy Orton handcuffing HHH and kissing his Stephanie. I mean damn, that was evil. I'm pretty sure many heels these days would be able to do the same if everything wasn't so watered down.

 

[wrestlingfanatic98]

when you say kane would only go into evil mode for a short period, that was a reputation was for more of his unmasked run, as they were trying to hard because he lost his mask, and kane became lost in the system in the end. Since he returned, apart from a problem with AJ, kane has kept to a very evil heel. The destruction of ryder was a perfect example, but he has left the Punk Bryan and AJ feud, and continues to be a heel. This is the first time since his 2003 monster run, where they have kept kane a consistent monster. When he was in the Punk and bryan feud, he was very destructive, beating both guys, and destroying them with the table, and slamming them with some powerful chockslams

 

[braveh]

That is another reason why I'm starting to think that all the writers are smarks. Smarks hate evil heels and gimmicks.

 

[covieo81]

i dont think it is necessarily that there isnt anyone capable of being the evil heel, its more because there is no imagination anymore. its cool to like the bad guys and its been that way since the mid to late 90s. wrestling doesnt have that awe factor anymore, nor do a lot of things. i attribute it to younger people just not having an imagination anymore.

 

[nWo2]

WWE needs a heel with an attitude, a chip on his shoulder with much disdain of the powers that be and for other wrestlers. We don't have a antagonist to John Cena on an even keel because we don't have an even heel.

CM Punk brings the best out of Cena in the ring, but thats not a great fued & Punk should remain face. Wade Barrett is injured, Drew Mac is being buried, Big Show should fued with Boadus Clay, Daniel Bryan doesn't have an edgey character and Del Rio isn't as interesting without Rey Mysterio around anymore.











Since Brock Lesnar came back I've been salivating over Lesnar vs. Orton, but those two need to form an alliance.

Randy Orton needs to come back as a heel against Cena & Punk & Sheamus for 3 memorable fueds. Simple writing, he's sick of watching Cena get bigger matches. He's sick of Punk's title reign and he's sick of Sheamus' title reign. I think he should have a long program with Cena, short program with Punk and take the title from Sheamus ending in a Mania matchup.

RANDY ORTON please come back!

 

[Kokken Tor]

Does no one think Mark Henry's heel run as champion was good? Seemed like people really enjoyed hating him.

Henry's run as champ was a good one. Even though he "inducted" a lot of ppl into the Hall of Pain, he wasn't evil per se. It was 15 years of frustration culminating in Henry going on a rampage.

A William "D-fens" Foster -light.

 

[JPLioneye]

Henry's run as champ was a good one. Even though he "inducted" a lot of ppl into the Hall of Pain, he wasn't evil per se. It was 15 years of frustration culminating in Henry going on a rampage.

A William "D-fens" Foster -light.

That just becomes a prime example of what was said in the first post, that a heel never feels like the bad guy. He can always justify what he's doing in his own mind no matter how terrible it is.

Mark Henry's run as champ was gold because he was exactly what a monster heel needs to be; He was gonna win the belt, keep it and hurt as many people as he possibly could in the meantime because he could.



But on topic with the rest of the thread here, the reason we're not seeing those dastardly heels in the main event anymore is because the WWE is publicly traded. They need to keep there public relations good and having babyfaces and heels that barely skew the line is what the Board of Directors (the legit board, not this phony TV one) believes is going to keep buying stock. If WWE was a private company like it was for most of the Attitude Era then they'd have the range to have heels do things like crucify Austin. Another big reason is because of Linda's senate run... But f*ck Linda.

All we can really do is hope that WWE sees the real talent that guys like Ambrose and Wyatt have to be these kinds of heels and let them run with it instead of making them a watered down kiddies version of Heath Ledger's Joker.

 

[Waylon Mercy]

There aren't too many of the sadistic type of heels anymore. Those who seem to derive pleasure from pain - both given and received. To me the perfect heel in this sense was Mankind. His original run with the Undertaker was amazing. He was a freakish monster, the likes of which Taker had never faced up to that point. Despite the punishment Taker dished out on Mankind, he kept squealing with delight like a little piglet. He used to pull out his own hair, and was always smiling through all the pain he endured. He kept coming back for more, until his body simply couldn't anymore. Anyhow, these are the types of heels that keep me coming back for more. There hasn't been too many original ones like Mankind before or since he debuted.

 

[bigbootydaddyV]

You are all wrong. Nothing has changed, you have picked great moments of the past (probably from your youth) to dwell on. You're making a much bigger deal of the past and in turn not giving the present its due.

So Daniel Bryan comes out and abuses and humiliates his tiny cute girlfriend and no one sees that as evil. Big Show closed fist punches the biggest good guy hero in WWE multiple times out of no where and it is quickly overlooked. Del Rio refuses to break holds and has a lackey who cheats for him all the time doing his bidding but because his promos are "boring" it doesn't matter. Tensai cheats by rubbing green mist in people's eyes but he "sucks". Otunga worships the ground that JL walks on and kisses his ass constantly. Cole is a self absorbed penis. Johnny Ace is a power hungry douche. Barrett throws Orton down the stairs but in the end it was kind of a cool to see. Lesnar does nothing right in or out of the ring but he is part time so let's forget about him.

Things aren't different. The heels are mostly still heels. The only thing that is different is that the audience has grown up and seen it all before. Unfortunately some of that same audience has grown up to be smarks and go out and ruin the show for the kids. Kids who unlike the posters in this thread when they were kids are not able to enjoy the show like the rest of us did as kids.

I tend to agree with the latter part of this post in regards to the audience ruining it. You do see the WWE trying to get DB to be the evil bad guy as he berates his gf, yet bc he's a big indie Wrestler the older part of the audience still cheers him. When Jake did that to Macho Man you didn't see him get cheered or forced into a face yet that is Exactly what we saw happen to Randy Orton. His DDT'ing stephanie and kissing her was the last real evil thing I remember seeing, yet within a few weeks/months he turned into a face. I think it's just a result of the attitude era carrying over. The expectation of older fans following who are faces and who are heels is over, the problem is though, that doesn't mean they should stop being heels/faces and doing the things those characters are supposed to do. I don't get how with Cena they are ok w/ the love/hate but with everything else it doesn't fly.

 

[R.K.O]

Great post. Heels nowadays are so watered down and generic that they make it difficult to hate them. The only feature they seem to have is cocky, egomaniac, bras, coward, or pretty boy. They do have those powerhouse heels too but they aren't that unique either. Sure, the general "casual" audience will still boo them because they are feuding with their favorite face. But it doesn't last and smarter fans wouldn't do that, which is why there is this heel crush going on the internet for so long.

To me, most heels are more likable than to make me hate them. For example, Cody Rhodes in his most prominent run with the mask was doing underhanded stuffs to Rey because Rey disfigured him, on that basis I was cheering Cody to get his revenge more than cheering for Rey. Dolph Ziggler "shows off" but he is so good in the ring that people cheer for him. Also, as the threadstarter said, Del Rio is rich but what else is there to make people hate him? Even Randy Orton's sadistic attack on Triple H and his family was somewhat justifiable because of what Triple H did to him back then with Evolution.

The last "evil heel" I can think of was CM Punk during his straight edge days. The way he picked on Jeff and insult him in every way possible, his feud with Rey that leads to his creepy rendition of "happy birthday", and even his unmaintained dirty look just make people want to hate him.

Triple H's movement to debut talents only when they know what they are going to do with them looks a good start, with new characters like Sandow and the new NXT roster look promising. But hopefully they don't water them down like they did time and time again or they will find it really difficult to make new stars because most people are sick and tired of generic wrestlers.

 

[Kizzani]

It is true, oh so true. I would love to see Del Rio come out after the Punk match and deck AJ. take those cars and use them as weapons. Del Rio needs an evil streak.

This is the pg era soon to be G era. The writers and vicne are grabage and the storyline are stupid. Bryan/Kane/AJ/Punk. Looks a lot like edge/lita/Kane or Stephanie/Triple H/ Vince. Seriously vince call me I have some ideas that have be used and used.

 

[Boston Made Mark]

Most people that are watching wrestling, even writing on forums such as this and are invested to that nature are the older group of fans that grew up throughout the attitude era. What happened in the attitude era was that it became cool to be a heel. I think this is the double-edged sword that the WWE is faced with at this point. They can create an "evil" heel as everyone has asked for and that character can thrive for years to come, making runs and making other [face] wrestlers in the process. What happens when/if we all start to cheer for the "evil" heel because we incessantly decree the desire to see the attitude era return? I'm not trying to say that this is definitely going to happen in any case, but in my opinion, I'm sure at least one person on the creative team feels that way and has expressed their concerns...possibly.

As you all have mentioned the lack of the heel as well and the characteristics that make today's heel, I am in 100% agreement with you that said arrogance, cockiness and annoyance are the top traits we see today. I do however think that John Laurinaitis was Mr. McMahon, reincarnate and could have absolutely mastered the role that Vince defined during our beloved attitude era and could have pushed CM Punk even further along if they actually allowed that feud to run its course. Instead, they continue to try to make their almighty Super-Cena a fan favorite with all of us and limit his boo's by having him remove the top heel from the company. How well that worked out remains to be seen over the long run, but we all know it was foolish.

Some of the most recent heel runs that were played very well, and already may have been mentioned by a number of people were Mark Henry, Christian (albeit the whiner, he still did well), Sheamus (before they decided to shove him down our throats), R-Truth (before they made it a comedy act), and I can not think of any more on the spot but I'm sure there are.

I think some of this may also have to do with the older guys not wanting to leave the spotlight yet mixed with Vince not wanting to take a chance on some of the younger guys yet. One a true top heel is established, that can set the table to re-define what direction things will go as well as who will take them in that direction.

Someone wrote earlier about "smarks screwing it up for the younger generation" and I can somewhat agree with that. When we were growing up, no one was in our ears telling us how else it should/could have been done and we were naive and inept to come up with our own theories and took everything for face value. We have become extremely demanding and expect every segment, match and promo to be the big payoff. Enjoy it for the entertainment value and let things play out. Everyone's wish for the return of the "evil" heel will come and I bet everyone will be shocked as to who it is when it finally happens and all will be well in the land of the IWC and stay at home bookers.

Sorry I took this in a totally different direction at the end and rambled so long. I will try not to do so in the future if I continue to post anything.

 

[xavyer]

Awesome thread, someone said that the last 2 great heels were Triple H and Edge, and they are right, writters need to back a little into the attitude era or even further, the 80's or early 90's, and learn a little from heels like the Macho Man, Rowdy Roddy Piper, Ted DiBiase, Sgt. Slaughter, or Jake tht Snake Roberts, now those were real heels, we just don't see that anymore, now heels get over and faces get booed, plus whenever there is a good heel, the WWE turnes him face, like CM Punk or Randy Orton, or even Kane, they got something good going with them and then all of a sudden they are faces, what we need right now is heels that people really hate, or that can get under people's skin, heck, we even need a monumental heel to make a monumental face ( beside's Cena ) At this moment i see that kind of potential in Damien Sandow, oviously Wade Barret has that tallent as well, he can be another Triple H, ruthless, methodical and evil, CM punk needs to turn heel and stay that way, and definitly bring Paul Heyman as someone's manager, because Heyman is a real evil genius that a heel needs, Alberto del Rio has potential to be an evil heel also, keep ricardo, but bring a bodyguard or someone who destroy Alberto's oponents, since his character is someone rich, buy people or something to get what he wants, the potential is there, they just need someone who can write storylines for those guys to ve the evil heels that the WWE needs, and now a days the only person who can do that is, and we are back to him, Paul Heyman, i sure hope that the WWE make him head of the creative team........

 

[Soccerjrc18]

I find the heels to be alright as of late, the last really great heel I remember was Edge. He literally made you made watching him alot of times. People tell me Del Rio is a great heel because he makes me hate him. I don't hate him as a heel, he just doesn't entertain me at all, he is really boring same gimmick all career. Daniel Bryan is more of an annoying heel which gains my respect. He is a d bag to his ex gf, he runs around like a moron yelling yes, plus he has great ring skills to put up a fight. Jericho is probally my favorite heel, that segment with Cena last raw made me realize what I was missing when he was suspended. He was sharp and hillarious. Kanes gimmick turned into a joke pretty fast after his Cena feud.

Dolph Ziggler is one of my favorite heels as of right now. He plays the show off gimmick perfectly. He backs up what he says becasue even when he loses, he sells better than anyone. He will go far in his career as well as Cody Rhodes. Cm Punk however should go back to being heel. It was a year ago when Punk stunned the PG era and spoke his mind, attacked the WWE. After that he slowly turned babyface and became what he said he hated (which is basically Cena). WWE needs to rethink things about babyfaces winning all the time. Without heels beating them up, what is there to cheer for? Hopefully Orton returns as a heel and brings back the meaning.

 

[Manof1,004Holds]

Yeah, the heels in today's WWE aren't evil, or evil enough. I blame creative and I put a little bit of the blame of the wrestlers themselves. Sometimes they have to come up with their own ideas that can get them over enough for people to take them seriously. ie: The Miz

 

[greatmuta]

A lot of the wrestlers could be evil villians if they were allowed to be. Punk, Bryan, Orton, Barrett and Sheamus, to me, are great when given the right stuff. Unfortunately, everyone is a tweener. Would love to see someone, anyone, just go straight pyscho. I wouldn't even mind a mind-controlling AJ setting fire to Kane or shaving Bryan's goat beard. As long as she's completely evil, I'd buy it.

 

[DirtyD79]

Let's take off the nostalgia goggles for a moment. The reality is a lot of heels today have much more realistic motivations than just "USA? hawwwk tooey" or derailing Hulkamania. In some ways you can see where the heels are coming from. I mean look at CM Punk during his Straight Edge Savior gimmick. While his character wanting to warn people of the dangers of drugs and alcohol is good in theory, it's the heavyhanded way he went about preaching his message that made him a heel. Some heels feel they've been passed over or jipped. That's what kicked off R Truth's run as a heel. He felt John Morrison robbed him of his title shot. And yeah they do still do nasty underhanded things. Hell Alberto Del Rio, the favorite IWC punching bag broke Rey Mysterio's arm a few years ago and last year he ran over Big Show's leg with a freakin' car. Mark Henry was running around breaking people's ankles with chairs. Kane tried to kidnap Eve by stealing an ambulance. I'd say all that's pretty well up there with siccing a snake on somebody.

Also I'm calling bullshit on the one about how The Attitude Era made it cool to root for heels and smarks boo Cena just to "ruin the show" for the little kids. Whether you like it or not, not everyone is gonna like the same things in this world. Hulk Hogan and Stone Cold had people who hated them too. In a lot of ways John Cena really is annoying. I mean his Star Wars routine this monday and him acting like Ace Ventura a couple weeks ago was annoying as hell. And it ain't just being a smark, when Jim Carrey originally did it I thought he was annoying then too. Plus John Cena's been in WWE for 10 years, 7 of which as the top babyface. Sooner or later people get tired of seeing the same stars doing the same thing all the time and yeah wrestling fans are gonna be vocal about it.