What Are Your Thoughts On High Spots In WWE?

[Jack-Hammer]

According to the Wrestling Observer Newsletter, NXT officials have asked Sami Zayn, also known as El Generico, to cut back on the number of high spots he does in his matches. It's being reported that NXT officials are very pleased with Zayn; feeling that he's very good on the mic & inside the ring and that he's intelligent. They simply don't want him to pack his matches with so many of them.

This report got me to thinking about high spots and how they're both a detriment and a benefit. They can obviously be spectacular to witness and inject a certain level of excitement into a match. They can also be extremely dangerous to both the wrestlers involved and can be major contributing factors to the general wear & tear of the business.

Some call this "watering down" the product but I don't see it that way personally. From a purely business perspective and from the perspective of a decent human being, doing what you can to maintain the safety & well being of wrestlers working for you makes complete sense. As I alluded to, high spots can contribute to and result in serious injuries to the wrestlers involved. Also, packing matches with them does cause the spots to lose some of their luster. The extraordinary becomes ordinary if it's used all the time.

Also, let's face it, wrestlers who pack matches with high spots are often labeled spot monkeys. Generally speaking, it's not a term of endearment among wrestling insiders or fans. Getting labeled as a spot monkey when you're working for larger companies like WWE or TNA can be a detriment to a career. As a whole, spot monkeys aren't taken all that seriously in the long run. Their speed & athleticism is often appreciated & respected but these particular wrestlers usually sacrifice telling a story, the use of psychology and developing a persona/personality for fans to rally behind for the sake of the momentary excitement frequent in spot fests. In some cases, the wrestlers don't really have any real storytelling ability, understand psychology or have the personality/charisma to get fans behind them; so the high spots are really all they've got. If that's all that's in you, well then I guess that's that. Just don't expect very, very many at all to reach the upper levels of stardom in the bigger wrestling companies.

 

[Odisho]

I think spots make for a memorable match.I believe WWE needs to have mor spots on raw. Raw has been pretty boring these days.

I personally love spot monkeys as I love TNA's X division.

The thing that I have noticed is by doing less spots, they get bigger reactions.

In Tna petey williams does canadian destroyer, if he did it in WWE people would talk about it for weeks. Because in WWE spots feel more special than in TNA andd that's what kinda makes me feel sad for TNA. Cuz they do a lot of spots.

 

[Raiden46]

One of the reasons I originally stopped watching WWE back around the time of the WWF/WCW merger was due to the increased number of high spots and lack of believability in matches. Case in point, rewatch Stone Cold VS The Rock from WM17. Rock was getting plastered with all sorts of moves and then finally took a direct chair shot to the head (which would have put down anyone), McMahon is in the ring counting along with the referee, yet Rock kicks out. At the time I was a big Rock mark, but even I knew that Rock shouldn't be kicking out of that shit. McMahon was in there as insurance and Austin ended up winning the match anyway, so why not just end the match there instead of having 15 more chair shots to the head and body? My point is that there are some moves that simply need to END the match and put a definitive statement on everything.

Moves that would have normally ended matches ages ago (Jake Roberts' DDT) are now just used as general repertoire or to setup for a true finish. Also, the fact that Kofi Kingston's Ranhei/SOS, Randy Orton's hanging DDT, hell even John Cena's top rope legdrop across the neck are not used as finishers is just mind boggling. I understand that people want to see more and more exciting moves, but I just can't suspend belief to allow myself to think someone could kick out of some of these go-home moves. Watching John Cena and Rock kick out of 1000 finishers at WM 29 was so ridiculously dumb that it turned comical. Why not just USE A NEW MOVE instead?

 

[Dan Severn's Moustache]

It's a double edged sword. On one hand, they can really be used to effect in multi man matches, such as Money in the Bank or the Royal Rumble; guys like these really set the tone for the event and make it all the more exhilarating. On the other hand, it really effects the development of the wrestler, and it's kind of like a relegation. Just look at Shelton Benjamin or Paul London, amazing in-ring talent, and in Benjamin's case; good on the mic (never seen London on the mic) but they never got what they deserved in the WWE in my view. My overall opinion on spot monkeys is that they should be bestowed on guys that really don't have the potential to be a main eventer, but they can still entertain the fans regardless.

Although from what I've heard, London was supposed to get the push that Kendrick eventually got, although it was in fact to do with the McMahon limousine storyline.

 

[sdelfin]

I'm old fashioned in my wrestling tastes. I also hate the Canadian Destroyer move, and I am not alone in that. High spots are easy. They may be rough on their bodies, but they're easy. Even huge guys can do moonsaults. Big Show has done top-rope dropkicks. As has been stated, the big stuff will lose impact when done too often, as has happened with various gimmick matches. The problem is the more you pack a match full of high spots, the more the meaningful stuff gets removed. In action films, special effects and explosions mean nothing when the plot is non existent.

The real art of wrestling is in understanding what the crowd needs, and how to control them. It's about knowing what to do and what not to do. And the very best can make the most mundane moves exciting. That's why Flair vs. Steamboat is still amazing, because the headlocks and other basic moves were all meaningful. Lesnar vs. Cena was great because it was stiff, gritty, and realistic.

Without the "spot monkeys", Botchamania wouldn't be so funny.

 

[JoeyJoeJoe]

Spots will get you a high profile loss in Money in the Bank matches but that's about it.

For every Rey Misterio, there's a Shelton Benjamin, Evan Bourne, Sin Cara, Brian Kendrick, Paul London and Kofi Kingston.

 

[Tripleb2k1]

I'm anti-Spot Monkeys. the more often you utilize the highspots, the less special they become

 

[Pay Per Ghost]

Well it depends on repertoire of said wrestler. I can't ask a high-flyer to tone it down (unless he is botching moves), coz thats what brung him to the dance. However, I think this is a case of 'don't overuse your cool moves'. I've heard good things about Generico, if he balances his whole package with mic-skills, limited but pretty high spots, his tenure would be more fruitful.

 

[HBK89Bill]

So they literally asked El Generico to stop being El Generico? That is some bullcrap.

When it comes to high spots in general: I think they are useful depending on what kind of match and story it is. With a complete anti high spot mentality, we wouldn't have a great deal of great moments and matches to review and love. Mick Foley wouldn't be the same, Rey Mysterio, etc. I think high spots can add a amazing amount to a match, but they shouldn't be used all the time.

 

[tvcolosi]

I posted this in the comments of the artice, and it got good feedback, so I'll copy it here;

**Soap Box Alert**

Everyone has different tastes, but for me 25 high spots may be entertaining for a bit, but they aren't telling a story. 3-4 high spots placed in the right places makes them mean more. Once again it is a matter of taste but after the Rock/Mankind match at the '99 rumble, Mick took 11 or 12 unprotected chair shots. For me the next time 1 chair shot was use as a finish, it made it hard to believe.

That's why I believe in 10 years or so we are going to look back and say the "PG Era" was actually good for the business. If the opening match has 2 ref bumps, double juicing, 6 moves off the top, 3 moves diving to the floor, and promos before the match that uses 19 swear words, how are the other 6 matches that night going to top that? Makes me think back to Brock/Cena last year. They both bled (probably the hard way but still..) and it really added to the match since blood hadn't been seen in a few years out side a trickle here and there.

Like I said before, this isn't a shot at you or what you like but, at least to me, show is that you cannot focus a niche audience and be the top promotion. Whether its senseless hardcore (ECW, XPW, CZW, IWA-MS) or 3+ hours of just wrestling no stories (early ROH). You have to stories and angles or there's no vested interest in me seeing that heel get his ass kicked, or the baby face finally get his revenge. You have to have it all, great work rate, a little comedy, heated personal issues, or just trying to win a title and be the best. that's just my 2 cents...



I'd love to see constructive dialogue about this, I've noticed the comments section of places like here if WWE/TNA/ROH and others do not do the story exactly as the person wanted, they are stupid and cannot book. Or, "I think TNA booking doesn't make sense sometimes" you are labeled a "WWE Fan boy mark". Or the other way around. I'll probably be crucified for this but I'd like to have intelligent talks with some passionate fans.

 

[vikesfan]

The same people that love seeing the same old topes and 450s by the spot monkeys are the same ones that moan about Orton's RKOs "out of nowhere.' Hypocrtites.Id rather see 1,000 RKOs or stunners than those stupid career shortening flips and spims any day of the week.

It so stupid looking as 10 seconds after the moves is done the guy who did it and the guy who took it are both up fighting 20 seconds later like nothing happened anyway.Watch any X Divison match for proof of that.

 

[Sephyxia]

Exactly what someone said before me. The more you see them the older they get. High spots do not define a match. The chemistry and story telling do. Case in point in my opinion. Taker vs Triple H in HIAC. Everyone bragged this match up but I do not think it was the best match on the card. It has WAY WAY WAY to much stupid stunts going on. Had exactly zero wrestling. Now Chris Jericho vs CM Punk stole the show. That was a great match with BELIEVABLE near falls. Great story in the ring.

 

[scomvp316]

-In some ways wrestlers that take high risks or more bumps is how they stand out or break out from the pack to be noticed
-I am not anti-wwe but aren't his manuevers the reason WWE took a look at him
-I just feel these days most talent with it being too scripted in WWE can never get over without taking risks

 

[Robotman]

So they literally asked El Generico to stop being El Generico? That is some bullcrap.

When it comes to high spots in general: I think they are useful depending on what kind of match and story it is. With a complete anti high spot mentality, we wouldn't have a great deal of great moments and matches to review and love. Mick Foley wouldn't be the same, Rey Mysterio, etc. I think high spots can add a amazing amount to a match, but they shouldn't be used all the time.

While I agree with your point below, have you by chance ever watched an El Generico match? He's not the type of wrestler who does stupid spots for the sake of doing them, he's a smart worker who can work any style that's asked of him. He's done technical based work and storytelling in ROH and DDT (Japan), he's done brawls in ROH and PWG, and he can work the crowd anywhere without having to do a billion flips to get a cheap pop. They didn't ask him to stop being who he is, they asked him to tone down a small tidbit of his repertoire which isn't a big deal considering he's good enough to do without it anyway.

 

[chibet]

at least ONE strong high spot per episode of RAW would do wonders for repeat and new viewership. This doesn't even have to be necessarily a dangerous move, it can be a swerve, twist, nostalgia cash ins, etc.

so.....

IMHO.....no, never. never enough. always push the limits. Do them well and use them to further in ring psych. and you've got a perfect combo. Encourage in-ring innovation above all else. this is what sent me running to watch TNA, especially some of the older tag and x-division matches.

I understand if you keep the intensity high the whole time during a match it becomes an impossible standard, but you can still have alot of great sequences, moves and spectacles varied up and used at least once a show......... it would work. There only has to be that ONE " did you see THAT moment last night on raw " to get people to tune in next week....every week. creating new fans and holding onto the ones they've got. Hell, if the WWE just created their version of the X-division or cruiserweight division.... let THOSE wrestlers use WHATEVER moves they can pull off, as many spots that they agree on with their opponent. Its cool with both wrestlers...let em do it. Let them make names for themselves. lets us have something to talk about and experience innovation in the WWE. Then we would have TRUE hungry up and coming CUTTING EDGE , INNOVATIVE wrestling.

 

[Headman]

When cutting my teeth as a salesmen I really wanted to make an impression by showing off my vast knowledge of the product I was selling. I prided myself on being able to spout off tons of facts and answer every one of my customer's questions with a treasure trove of information. Sometimes it would work but more often than not most of those facts blended together in my customer's head. They couldn't absorb all that information so all they really left with was the last couple things I said and the impression of a long winded "No it all" sales person. If you don't understand something you tend to walk away. Later I learned to tighten things up. Less is more. The goal is not to show off what I know, or in a wrestler's case how many pretty flippity flop moves he can do. The point is to paint a picture of what my product can do for them. To capture their attention and convince them that what I'm selling is important to them. Yes there are a few people out there who love hearing each and every feature of each and every item, but most people don't want to hear that. Most people also want logic and meaning in their wrestling matches. A few highspots are fine to sell the fact that this guy is a risk taker. But if he does it the entire match the moves that should have meaning just get lumped together with the rest of the crap.

 

[Mustang Sally]

They can also be extremely dangerous to both the wrestlers involved and can be major contributing factors to the general wear & tear of the business.

Case in point: Rey Mysterio and Sin Cara.....and look at the result of it; these two guys are all high spots and, not coincidentally, spend gobs of time on the injured list. High spots can be fun, but don't pretend there isn't a price to be paid for them.

I got tired of Sin Cara quickly, despite the hype that surrounded him. He had to be the hardest guy in WWE to wrestle because so much more was required of his opponent, as far as making sure they're in the right spot to receive Sin's flying maneuvers. We still remember poor ol' Chavo Guerrero getting hell from Vince McMahon for being in the wrong place to "catch" Sin Cara after one of his many blind leaps off the ring ropes.

As to high fliers, I'll say that at least Evan Bourne did some actual ring wrestling in addition to his high spots, as opposed to Rey and Sin with their aerial leaps serving as almost their entire repertoire.

On the other hand, I love flying dropkicks delivered by big guys. Randy Orton and Drew McIntyre have terrific ones, which we rarely get to see. But that's the point: high spots from big guys are rare, making them that much more attractive when they are used.

Okay, little guys need their flying spots, fine.....but I'd like to see more mat maneuvers from them, too...... causing them to function as Munchkins from Hell as they scramble in and out of the grasp of their larger opponents. Never mind what the kiddies like; let's keep it as real as possible.

 

[MCMG]

Guys who can do amazing things in the ring should be cherished even championed. What is the point in having someone with talent and restricting them to a certain move-set. They should just let wrestler X and Y do their job and put on an entertaining match. Their trained professionals doing their job - injuries in a job with such physical strain is inevitable. Of course the WWE can move to limit the amount of injuries but not at the sacrifice of a good match. Like I said, this is their job - they have practiced this for years and if should therefore be able high-risk moves.

The only problem is when does it become a negative trait. While someone like Jeff Hardy used "spots" well, someone like Shelton Benjamin and, to an extent, Kofi Kingston have had their careers hampered because of it.

 

[Headman]

Guys who can do amazing things in the ring should be cherished even championed. What is the point in having someone with talent and restricting them to a certain move-set. They should just let wrestler X and Y do their job and put on an entertaining match. Their trained professionals doing their job - injuries in a job with such physical strain is inevitable. Of course the WWE can move to limit the amount of injuries but not at the sacrifice of a good match. Like I said, this is their job - they have practiced this for years and if should therefore be able high-risk moves.

The only problem is when does it become a negative trait. While someone like Jeff Hardy used "spots" well, someone like Shelton Benjamin and, to an extent, Kofi Kingston have had their careers hampered because of it.

Restricting their move set doesn't sacrifice a good match. Letting people perform meaningless spot after spot for the sole purpose of showing off does not make a good match. If fans want to see flippity flops they can A. Go to the circus. Or B. Stick with the indies. There are some people who go to the movies to see explosions but most of us go for the story. Same goes for pro-wrestling.

 

[MCMG]

Restricting their move set doesn't sacrifice a good match. Letting people perform meaningless spot after spot for the sole purpose of showing off does not make a good match. If fans want to see flippity flops they can A. Go to the circus. Or B. Stick with the indies. There are some people who go to the movies to see explosions but most of us go for the story. Same goes for pro-wrestling.

But these moves can make a match better or an event more memorable. I understand it can become ridiculous in the name of showing off but when used right: a "spot" can become an iconic moment or improve the quality of a match.

 

[Headman]

But these moves can make a match better or an event more memorable. I understand it can become ridiculous in the name of showing off but when used right: a "spot" can become an iconic moment or improve the quality of a match.

I don't think anyone is making the case for getting rid of high spots completely. My issue is with guys who have know idea how to work a match so they do high spot after high spot to get a reaction.

 

[chibet]

LOL why are people confusing " flips" or "flying " with a spot. There are different wrestling styles and LUCHA LIBRE is very much based on the use of ropes and jumping off them and using visually impressive moves. Rey is not doing spots, he's wrestling the way they are taught in mexico.