Were is the drunk skank line?

[Mighty NorCal]

What point do you consider someone being "taken advantage of" as far as having been drinking that night? Incoherency? Visibly shit-canned? 4 drinks?


Bear in mind, the person who is intoxicated is the one INITIATING the physicality, not the sober person.

Back in like 07 and 08, I had friends who went to UD. I used to go up to their house parties all the time. Now, there was this girl who was a mutual friend, who was always at said parties, who would try to get me to sleep with her every time she saw me.....but she was also always visibly drunk. Not incoherent, but clearly trashed. I, of course, am sober as a saint, since I don't drink.

I could never do it, because I just didn't feel comfortable doing that with her drunk(allow me to clarify that it was far from a lack of attraction...she was pretty fucking hot)....At the same time, not only she did she iniate it, but it was literally EVERY TIME I WOULD SEE HER. So I think its evident that there is pre-meditation....

So would that situation been "taking advantage" of her, or not? Does her pre-meditation and clear intent cancel out the obvious amount of inebriation?


On a larger scale, what do you consider a person's responsibility level for their own actions while drinking lies?

(Not to mention, there is another thread about double standards to be found here somewere.....since it became a running joke between all my female friends up there to have us somehow end up in the same room at every party, and they always thought it was just HILARIOUS to saddle me with the responsibility of getting her home safely from all these parties, knowing I would be, in a literal sense, sexually assaulted when doing so. Go ahead and switch the gender roles, and the above story becomes utterly horrifying. But because I am a large male, it was the funniest running joke ever for about a year)

 

[Alex]

I mean I'm terrible with judging how bad drunk people are. So unless they can barely speak or falling over I'd think they're ok.

It's kind of hard. I mean if a drunk girl initiates something but she's still coherent then I think that kind of qualifies for a pass. Alcohol does kind of make anyone a bit frisky so if the woman is coherent then it should be ok. Now if a guy initiates it onto a girl who clearly can't stand then that's a problem. I remember seeing a guy pretty much pushing a drunk girl who could barely stand into a taxi to go wherever and I just thought that was creepy as hell.

I mean I understand if you're out you've had a few drinks you get a bit horny and you wanna get some action but you should make sure the other party is receptive and you're not forcing yourself on them. Even if you've had a few yourself and are bit tipsy trying to get on the trashed girl is still just wrong.

 

[Mustang Sally]

So would that situation been "taking advantage" of her, or not? Does her pre-meditation and clear intent cancel out the obvious amount of inebriation?

No, it wouldn't "cancel out" anything, but even while there's a line that shouldn't be crossed, it's almost impossible to define once the law gets involved; it's one that often gets decided in a court of law if the girl charges rape.

When the guy knows the girl is too drunk to exercise good judgment (the same applies when genders are reversed) it's nice to presume he'll know enough to not comply with what she's asking for if she's too inebriated..... but most of us aren't saints, are we? Sure, when the guy is cold sober, as you were, it makes it easier for him to make a good decision, yet in most cases, the guy's been drinking too, no? And if the damn case does go to court, how can anyone legitimately define what the guy "should have known" when he could see that the girl was of age, asking for what she's now accusing him of having given her (according to your example) .....and drunk? What does he do, give her a breathalyzer test?

Yes, while you seem to be discussing the morality of the guy taking advantage of an inebriated girl, I'm taking it to where she later accuses him of sexually assaulting her, telling the jury: "I was so drunk I didn't know what I was doing" and the jurors deciding to hold him responsible for having sex with a girl who was incapacitated because he should have known better. What about her?

As a woman of small size who knows she'd better have her wits about her when going out, I still have a real problem with a verdict like that. Personally, I'd rather protect myself by controlling my alcoholic intake and not getting to the point where I'm taking some guy to court for doing what I was asking him to do in the first place.....and now having him criminally prosecuted for not knowing I was in no condition to decide for myself.

Maybe he did take advantage.....but maybe I could have avoided the situation in the first place by taking care of myself.

 

[Mighty NorCal]

Yes, while you seem to be discussing the morality of the guy taking advantage of an inebriated girl, I'm taking it to where she later accuses him of sexually assaulting her, telling the jury: "I was so drunk I didn't know what I was doing" and the jurors deciding to hold him responsible for having sex with a girl who was incapacitated because he should have known better. What about her?

As a woman of small size who knows she'd better have her wits about her when going out, I still have a real problem with a verdict like that. Personally, I'd rather protect myself by controlling my alcoholic intake and not getting to the point where I'm taking some guy to court for doing what I was asking him to do in the first place.....and now having him criminally prosecuted for not knowing I was in no condition to decide for myself.

Maybe he did take advantage.....but maybe I could have avoided the situation in the first place by taking care of myself.

My main thing about this too, that I find mitigating, is the fact that this was NUMEROUS SEPERATE TIMES, like, once every two or three weeks. It would happen, I would get her home and tucker in and escape somehow, and then we rinse and repeat three weeks later.

How could a jury convict someone (or why should someone feel bad) when this is every few weeks this same thing is playing out...Like, presumeabley, she KNOWS, while getting dressed "im gonna party tonight, and im finally gonna get him to do it" like, this pursuit became part of the party experience itself for the individuals involved?


The second portion of the quote, I have always maintained as a feminist way to look at things....Why are girls simply not held to the same standard of accountability for their actions or alchohol intake, and the scenarios they find themselves in? I was once involved in a threesome that all the sudden was about to become a fivesome, when I thought to myself "You know, I don't think she would permit this were she of sober mind?" So I physically carried her away (as in, over my shoulder) from the encounter.....Thing is, WE (the males) we are all shithouse drunk as hell too, as one would imagine needing to be thinking that having a sexual encounter involving one girl and three other dudes was a good idea(occurred about 3 months before I quit drinking). However, one could assume in all likelihood, WE would have gotten the blame in the situation had I not changed my mind and things had gotten nasty after everyone sobered up. No I wonder I stopped drinking, eh lol.

However, it seems as though asking for any culpability on the female portion of a situation which goes sour and involves alchohol is a very slippery slope most times.

 

[Stone Cold Tea]

Whichever way you look at it it is wrong for a sober person to be sleeping with a drunk person as that persons decision making ability is impaired. Now say if you'd had few drinks and was feeling merry but the other person is steaming drunk then i don't really see the issue. At the end of the day when some people go out drinking one of there goals is to get laid.

Myself, I don't find girls absolutely shitfaced attractive in the slightest. I feel that once they reach that stage most tend to act like annoying idiots when i like girls that have there sense about them. Don't get me wrong i have no issue with girls getting drunk, its just in my experience when i've come across a shitfaced girl, shes stumbling allover with her eyelashes hanging off and make up everywhere and that my friends is not the one for me.