Was Chris Sabin's Title Reign a Mistake?

[ヒュー　G.　レックション]

A good little match with Manik. That's about the only thing I really enjoyed about Chris Sabin's world title reign. I think Sabin is a great talent. But looking back should he really have won the world title?

When Sabin beat the fake Suicide, Aries, I was pretty hyped because Aries had put over Sabin as a real contender. Bully also did his part in making Sabin look legit. But when it came to Destination X's main event, it consisted of Sabin getting his ass kicked for 20 minutes but then hitting Ray with a hammer and so getting the win. It did shock me, and I was happy for Sabin. I didn't like how one sided the match was, but hey Sabin can prove himself in the rematch. Which didn't really happen there either...

Overall I would've rather had Sabin lose at Destination X so he could be the first failed Option C, which would've set up some kind of redemption storyline since he gambled the X Division title and lost it all in the process. You could've had him in the exact position he's in now, arguing with Velvet etc.

Hell, I probably would've been even happier with Aries facing Bully at Destination X as I loved that Suicide reveal. And since Aries had beaten Bully before it adds the history of their (brilliant) feud they had. Bully could've then finally got his revenge.

So what do you think? In hindsight, should Bully have just kept his title? Or did you like Chris Sabin's reign and agree with TNA's booking?

 

[Slash-LN]

From my own personal story when I found out that Sabin had won the title I was going to start watching TNA again. I was pretty excited about it and it's what I needed to watch the product again. And that's not a slight on TNA at all. I had taken a break from wrestling in general. I don't know how long he had the title but a couple days after I found out he was champ he lost the title back to Bully Ray so I decided not to watch until the couple of matches I watched last night.
From what I've seen posted online and reading what you wrote his title run was probably pointless. If what I have seen is right it was less about TNA having faith in him as champion and more about thanking him for staying in the company when Alex Shelley left. I think they could have given Sabin the title somewhere down the line when he could have had a longer run with it.

 

[Vintage]

I really thought this would have been the year that the X champ lost the match at Destination X but Sabins return after a 2 year hiatus changed plans.

It was very clear he was always going to be a transitional champion and it lasted just long enough to elevate him and have Bully get some heat back.

That title did what it could for him which was elevate him to heavyweight. He is already somewhat over with the fans and while the rub was nice he really doesn't need the prop. Sabin needs Velvet as his valet and a double heel turn.

 

[Aquaman6686]

Sabin is a good talent, but he's not World Champion material. Personally I'm against the "Destination X Clause", I feel it's a cheap way to do a title switch to someone who doesn't necessarily deserve it. I have a feeling this method will be used numerous times over the years to give smaller wrestlers a World title reign.

As for Sabin, I think he needs to go back to the tag team division and stay there. Nothing against him, but that's where he shines the brightest and that's where he belongs.

 

[George Steele's Barber]

The title reign had more to do with the breaking down of Aces and Eights and the building up of Tito and Rampage. I think using Sabin may have been a small rub and polite gestur e to his fanbase but it had little to do with Sabin. It's hard to call it something as significant as a mistake but I guess you could argue that it did little for Sabin and maybe even hurt the BFG series and winner (but not by much).

 

[tru_overdose]

absolutely.

as if bubba ray dudley wasnt bad enough, they give it to a guy that might not even make the WWE roster, in a time where they NEED to try to be competitive. just downright baffling.

they have entirely too much talent to be putting the title on the heath slater of the company. IMO, that single decision puts into perspective the current state of the company, a company close to death. its just one of those things that cannot be undone.

 

[Papa Pillman]

I really thought this would have been the year that the X champ lost the match at Destination X but Sabins return after a 2 year hiatus changed plans.

It was very clear he was always going to be a transitional champion and it lasted just long enough to elevate him and have Bully get some heat back.

That title did what it could for him which was elevate him to heavyweight. He is already somewhat over with the fans and while the rub was nice he really doesn't need the prop. Sabin needs Velvet as his valet and a double heel turn.

I'm not sure about the heel turn part, but I agree with pretty much the rest of this.

I say Sabin winning was a good development on a few fronts:

First, Sabin's win was needed to further the legitimacy of "Option-C". Now in the future we can't just assume that the current champ will retain, if Sabin can beat Bully, any X-Champ could pull it off.

Second, Sabin is an "original" who has had about as much title success as anyone in the company's history. The World Title was his last great accomplishment and it legitimizes him as a guy who can bounce around all of the divisions including the main event scene without seeming out of place.

Third, it is a reward to Sabin for his loyalty to the company and his hard work to recover from two torn ACL's.

Fourth, Bully's title reign needed something to "break it up". The A&8s situation was getting monotonous and, with the long gap between Slammiversary and BFG, things could have gotten even worse. The mini-feud with Sabin gave Ray a diversion and the chance to regain some heat while having some solid contests against an established and over feel-good-story babyface. And it allowed the shows a vehicle to focus on besides just the BFG series.

The title change may have been transitionary, and doesn't seem to have really gone anywhere, but that doesn't make it a bad move necessarily. The "Hardcore Justice" and "Destination-X" specials drew pretty solid ratings for Impact in comparison to many of the other summer episodes as well. So it also can be said that the title change helped, if only slightly, to drum up a little extra interest during the summer lag period. Also, before we can close the book on just how good or bad a move it was, we should probably see where they go with Sabin's character from here.

 

[klunderbunker]

No but it's going to be a footnote.

Sabin's reign is already forgotten on Impact as he's only been seen in a throwaway match against Knux since losing the title plus I think a quick promo. He held the title for a month, lost it in his first defense, and now we move on to AJ vs. Bully at Bound For Glory. Sabin's title reign wasn't a bad idea, but it doesn't really do anything and Sabin doesn't seem to have been elevated long term at all.

Not a bad idea, but nothing significant either.

 

[Mitch Henessey]

Sabin winning the title just felt like TNA giving the fans a "moment" for the PPV quality show (and it was a PPV quality show). Sabin winning the title was a nice payoff for the fans and people watching at home, but you had to know he was going to lose the title to Bully in the first rematch.

Sabin is not "The Guy" material, and I don't think he'll ever reach that level. Going into your flagship pay per view, you need someone, who embodies that persona of being a top guy as world champion, and Bully is the ideal candidate right now.

Plus, TNA treated Sabin like an afterthought during his run. He took a backseat to AJ's storyline and the Aces & Eights VS Main Event Mafia war. On top of that, TNA presented their world champion as a little puppy, who was lucky enough to follow the MEM around, and get a pat on the top of his head from Sting every now and then.

I wouldn't call Sabin's win a mistake, but his title run was forgettable at best, and I can't picture any scenario where TNA works him back into the WHC in the near future.

 

[R.K.O]

Why was it a mistake? It gave Sabin, someone who fought to come back from injury a nice little title reign. In storyline it gave the MEM an advantage over Aces and when Bully won it back it gave him even more heat. My only problem was Sabin using the hammer to win the title cheaply but I don't see a problem otherwise.

 

[Megadeth]

I think its way to early to tell, and it will depend on what they do with Sabin next. Now that they have started bringing up the fact he and Velvet are an item, and the way he snapped after the Knux match last week, I think they still have plans for him, maybe even possibly a heel turn not to far off. So until we see were all this leads, I don't think you can say for sure it was or wasnt a mistake.

 

[Zeven_Zion]

It wasn't a mistake, but it was forgettable.

Look, Sabin got a charity reign. You know, he's one of those guys that gets a short run with a belt just to warm our hearts before the heel gets it back to reap the heat. That's about it. No people in TNA thought this would amount to anything more than what it was. Neither did we.

It added a little layer to Sabin's character. He put a chink in Bully's armor and it showed how weak he is WITHOUT Aces and Eights, foreshadowing what could happen if the Aces and Eights are eliminated. Also, it showed what would happen if they weren't -- regardless of what you do to him, he'll keep coming back for that belt and cheating to get it.

Nice little moment, didn't last long, rewarded Sabin for his hard work over the years and it might open the door for him to do it again at a later stage.

The only way this reign would've truly lasted and worked is if Alex Shelley returned and challenged him for it, launching a feud between the two. This would then give Shelley the chance to hold it as well and I have zero doubts he'll do better than Sabin and might even exceed our expectations. Then Bully Ray can go on to feud with Hogan or something, get that Hogan match (that is totally happening, cough cough cough cough) going and everything.

But, it was alright for what it was. Better things await us. Good for Sabin and good for his fans.

 

[Salvador238]

Of course it was a mistake. It served no purpose whatsoever. Bully's reign is in the same place now as it would be had Sabin lost in the first place. Sabin is just spinning his wheels and can barely make the card at this point. Pointless.

 

[UFOcalling]

The real problem with Sabin's reign wasn't that he won the title, it's how he was booked to look so weak against Bully (and subsequently, Knux). Sabin looked strong upon his initial return, winning the XD title and beating Aries...but both of his matches against Bully were an absolute joke. I wonder if Bully had anything to do with that, or if it was all creative (or if Hogan pulled another power play, like he did with Roode at BFG 2011).

Even though it seemed that Hogan had completely BURIED Roode in 2011 by having him lose the title match at BFG 2011 (and Hogan even admitted to this, if I'm not mistaken), there were bigger plans in the works for Roode. Whether Hogan's actual involvement in that decision (to have Roode lose to Angle) was kayfabe or not, it most likely turned out for the best. Obviously no one can comment on Roode as a face WHChamp, so that's the only reason I use the qualifier "most likely". I'm sure Hogan likes to take all the credit for Roode's success as a heel champ in 2011/2012, but who really knows.

I think maybe they're doing something similar with Sabin, which I don't necessarily agree with (at least not yet). Sabin had his little temper tantrum with Velvet backstage on iMPACT recently, so he might go out for a match and do something like Roode did (winning the title from Storm with a beer bottle). It won't be a title match, but you get the idea. Although they already tried to show that Sabin has a "mean streak" with him using the A&8 rubber hammer, it hasn't gotten him any heel heat...obviously because the bikers are always introducing it. If a heel turn is in the works for Sabin, it could make him look like a legitimate heavyweight contender. I'm not saying that it definitely will, but up until now he's been booked as a WCW Cruiserweight...and he hasn't had that "moment" that made people believe he can get to the top and stay there. Cheating in his matches might just get him over that hump.

It's really too bad Sabin doesn't have someone like Jericho to work with, and show him the ropes. I believe a feud between Jericho and Sabin would do amazing things for Sabin's career (and I'm not just talking about a victory over Jericho, either). To work with a guy who's been there before (Cruiserweight making a seamless transition to Heavyweight) would really benefit him. Sabin working as a heel against AJ or Aries could help too, but it wouldn't be on the same level. You could only imagine the feud Sabin would have had with Benoit...that would have been amazing too.

Using "Option C" got Sabin too much, too fast...that's the only real bad thing about "Option C", and to a lesser extent the BFG series. Sabin should have had a slower build to the main event, but that's the reason Option C exists. It's now TNA's Money in the Bank briefcase, and it elevates a guy quickly. The MitB failed in the WWE more than a couple of times, too. A guy like Jack Swagger or Kennedy didn't belong as champ, but at least they took a risk. A calculated risk that didn't pay off. Then you look at a guy like Edge, or CM Punk (or Austin Aries) and see when it works.

I hope Sabin gets another opportunity to prove himself as a "real" main eventer, face or heel...but it seems to me that "good guy" Sabin is just too much of a whining pussy to actually make anyone believe in him (sans his die-hard fans). Now a cheating "smart" bad guy might work. At least he got his foot in the door, and I really want to see him succeed. I didn't vote in the poll, though...I still think that his title reign is too early to call a "mistake", or not. I'd like to see where the story goes next, with his relationship with Velvet and his temper tantrum before I decide. I don't think iMPACT is done with the Sabin title story yet.

 

[Alex]

As others have said, it wasn't so much a mistake more how they handled it.

I get that Sabin wasn't going to hold it for long. I get it was more a reward for staying loyal to the company and returning from arguably two career threatening injuries. But they made him look like a bitch.

I get that having Bully not lose clean was going to be a factor, but they could have done it in a way that made Sabin look like a threat, some good back and forth action would have been great. Sure have Ray attack Sabin's knees and heck having Sabin use the hammer wasn't a bad idea. But Sabin getting next to no offence in before using the hammer just makes him look weak.

I get some title reigns are more rewards than anything, but if you're going for a big 'never won it before' scenario the wrestler in question should look like a threat and win (somewhat cleanly) RVD's WWE title win over Cena at One Night Stand wasn't clean, but RVD still looked like a threat and that's what they should've done with Sabin.

Sabin is a good talent. He's good in the ring and ok on the mic, but it's going to take something to get him to bounce back from this and give him some legitimacy.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

Was it really a bad idea? Well, since it seemed to have no real purpose, I'd have to say yes. Seriously, what did it really accomplish? The MEM was in full swing by this time, so giving Sabin a title didn't give them any sort of measurable advantage that I saw since he wasn't even part of the group. It's not as if a huge number of fans were overly enthused about the return of MEM to begin with, whatever enthusiasm was there fizzled out to a large degree with the inclusion of a past his prime MMA fighter who never wrestled a match in his life and Kurt Angle going to rehab.

Aside from merely having Sabin carry the title for a month, during which he wasn't booked to come across as or look like a big deal, I simply don't see any real purpose for it. Sabin ultimately came off looking like he was Sting's "little buddy" who won the title as the result of a fluke instigated by TNA's love of the overbooked main event title match formula. However, MAYBE, if Sabin hadn't disappeared from the title scene altogether after dropping it back to Bully, it could be seen as part of a larger plan designed to ultimately make Sabin a bigger star. However, given that it all went down right in the middle of the BFG Series, Sabin not being booked in ways to make him come across as a star, the need to have big stars in the BFG main event and his first match since dropping the strap is against a low level thug like Knux; it seems pretty apparent that the goal wasn't to elevate Sabin.

 

[ABMorales787]

How the hell was it a bad idea? Pushing Crimson the first time when he was so green was a bad idea. Having Chris Sabin give us a one month breather while giving him something to brag about for staying loyal to TNA for 2 years while being shelfed was certainly not a bad move. It lets talent know that they can be rewarded for their hard work and loyalty, it gave the ratings a little bump and gave us a feel good moment. It did more in it's short length than Alberto Del Rio's World Championship runs have done.

 

[Limitless]

I wouldn't call Sabin's win a mistake, but his title run was forgettable at best, and I can't picture any scenario where TNA works him back into the WHC in the near future.

This pretty much sums it up for me, I mean Sabin just doesn't have "IT" in terms as being the TOP guy for TNA. This reminds me of when mysterio won the world title. It was a feel good moment (which I was against) that served it's purpose. I mean Mysterio is a Legend in his own right but it is really hard to take guys like mysterio and sabin seriously.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

How the hell was it a bad idea? Pushing Crimson the first time when he was so green was a bad idea. Having Chris Sabin give us a one month breather while giving him something to brag about for staying loyal to TNA for 2 years while being shelfed was certainly not a bad move. It lets talent know that they can be rewarded for their hard work and loyalty, it gave the ratings a little bump and gave us a feel good moment. It did more in it's short length than Alberto Del Rio's World Championship runs have done.

Awwww c'mon man, you're MUCH better than this. You're using the loyalty & hard work argument? It's probably the single weakest argument used in defense of reigns that are both short & weak. I'm a fan of Sabin, don't get me wrong, but, realistically, what does being loyal have to do with justification for being World Champion? In that case, where's Christopher Daniels' run? Doesn't James Storm deserve better than his brief 8 day run as champion due to his loyalty? How about Eric Young, whose spent most of the past half decade or so being TNA's version of Santino Marella? Speaking of Santino Marella, he's done EVERY goofy thing WWE has asked of him without complaint or criticism and done his absolute best while doing it, including cross dressing to pose as his "identical twin" sister Santina. If Santino up and won the WWE Championship in the near future then, like damn near everyone else on these forums & throughout the internet wrestling world, I think you'd probably be all over WWE with criticism, rightly so I might add. Would it deliver a "feel good moment"? Sure it would, but so what? You'd still be left with a comedy mid-carder as the top champ in the company.

As for Alberto Del Rio, I agree that his time as champion has been overall pretty damn lackluster. Maybe WWE officials like the guy but, personally, I don't see why that should be the deciding factor when it's obvious that he's not nearly over enough to be in the spot he's in, let alone to be in it for the fourth time. However, let's not go nuts here. For at least a couple of his runs, Del Rio has been booked to come off as a pretty solid heel champion in his various feuds & matches, as well as a credible threat. Del Rio shouldn't be in the spot he's in right now and his current run should be his last, in my opinion, but a "feel good moment" from Sabin amounts to nothing more than a footnote to a footnote.