Undertaker overrated?

You act like what you say is fact, when in reality your argument is complete bullshit. Anybody could have gotten the Streak from Vince? Yeah and anybody can be given 16 World Titles too. The reason people are given these accolades is because they're amazing at what they do. Do you get what I'm saying, man? Sure, Vince can do ANYTHING that he wants. He can give Santino Marella the friggin WWE Title if he wanted to. There's a reason he doesn't. Name somebody else that has remained over for 20+ years on a full-time schedule? That alone warrants his legendary status, and sure IF the crowds became bored by him The Streak would have ended, but THEY NEVER DID... that's the whole damn point of pro-wrestling, and THAT'S why The Streak has to be considered when discussing Taker's legacy.

I dont know why this had to be spelled out over and over, this is probably the fifth time someone has made this point only to be considered a fanboy. Actually the only counter-argument I've seen from people who think Taker is overrated is "you're a fanboy". Simply put, its idiotic.

I wonder if the same people that think the streak and all the other things that are apparently gifts from Vince and other promoters think that Koko B. Ware is in fact that greatest wwe wrestler of all time
 
I called you a fanboy because you take this shit too personally and were freaking out over an opinion on a wrestler.

You're the one who insulted me first kid.... Again, typical of posters like you on this site.


Didn't I pretty much say this? My whole issue was that people were using the streak as a crutch. Sure, it should be considered, but few people consider why. They just for some reason mark out because in their eyes, the streak makes the Undertaker awesome, when they should actually be focusing on how the Undertaker made the streak awesome.

So, do you believe The Streak SHOULD be considered or not? Because you've flip flopped on that point about three times now... People use The Streak as leverage because it's a once in a lifetime thing that will never be matched again, and you're just assuming that people don't remember how Undertaker "made the Streak awesome". You're not the only one who grew up watching Taker. I think most people know how Taker made the Streak legendary.... Maybe that's why people are so outraged with you? Something to think about...


There are many things that make a wrestler great, but these two seem to be the main attributes that people look for these days. Or at the absolute least, what WWE tries to emphasize. I remember hearing about how great the ladder match with Michaels and Razor Ramon was, but then I saw it and thought it was merely good. I've seen too many improved ladder matches since then. Or look at 'Hogan Vs Andre'. At that time, I probably would've loved it. But now? It has one cool moment and the rest is boring. Wrestling as of 2015 is a different beast than wrestling of the 80's. Hence, I can empathize with people who will find Undertaker to be unimpressive by todays standards. That doesn't make me any less of a fan.

Ok, by "today's standard". That doesn't take away what people like Hogan, or Andre, or Lou Thesz, or Sammartino or Taker did in their day and era. Put somebody like Lou Thesz in his prime in the ring today, and he'd get booed out of the damn building. But he's not overrated just because the game changed. I think the fact that Taker evolved over 5 eras (Golden Age, New Generation, Attitude Era, Ruthless Aggression era, and PG era) proves that if he were able to still go, he would be just as likely to be a main event player in this day and age. Hell, he kind of is.



I'm having difficulty understanding what you're saying. Are you referring to CM Punk Vs Taker? Because CM Punk Vs Cena- the guy who's basically just his look, as you say- is also considered to be one of the greatest. CM Punk was really good at carrying people. And if Cena was just his look, he wouldn;t have carried the company for 10 years.

I'm referring to Taker vs Michaels... I was in the heat of the moment when I made the Cena comment, and I was wrong. He is a good wrestler... but he's not in the same league as Taker IMO, because again, Taker is remembered as one of the greatest in the ring of all time. I doubt Cena will.

I was referring to what he even did in the past. I'm not saying he hasn't been involved in some classics. As I said, wrestling is many things- pacing, psychology, story-telling, in-ring ability, promo skills, charisma, presence, appearance, gimmick, booking. But I personally wouldn;'t be surprised if you havent actually watched one of Takers 90's matches in quite some time and are just using a nostalgia filter.

Ironic, as a matter of fact, I JUST got finished re-watching the year 1997 and am through 5 months of 98. I've recently watched Taker feud with Bret, than Shawn, than Kane, and he is clearly the number 2 face behind Bret and than Austin at this point. His Cell match with Shawn never ceases to amaze me (and I've seen it about 7 times), and I'm still amazed at his presence at this time. Believe me, I've re-watched the 90's so many times I can probably recite what happens in order from 95-99... Don't try me.

Well, it's been fun but I think I'll leave my point at this.
 
You're the one who insulted me first kid.... Again, typical of posters like you on this site.

So, do you believe The Streak SHOULD be considered or not? Because you've flip flopped on that point about three times now... People use The Streak as leverage because it's a once in a lifetime thing that will never be matched again, and you're just assuming that people don't remember how Undertaker "made the Streak awesome". You're not the only one who grew up watching Taker. I think most people know how Taker made the Streak legendary.... Maybe that's why people are so outraged with you? Something to think about...

Who is outraged? You're the only one who seems to be bothered by my claims. I think the emphasis should be more on why the streak has been compelling in regards to debate than just relying on namedropping the streak itself. I made it clear when I started this that if anyone wanted to use the streak as a counterpoint to the op's claim, than the only substance surrounding it is how Undertaker has remained over with the fans for so many years. Instead, it feels like most are praising the booking, which I think is silly.

Ok, by "today's standard". That doesn't take away what people like Hogan, or Andre, or Lou Thesz, or Sammartino or Taker did in their day and era. Put somebody like Lou Thesz in his prime in the ring today, and he'd get booed out of the damn building. But he's not overrated just because the game changed. I think the fact that Taker evolved over 5 eras (Golden Age, New Generation, Attitude Era, Ruthless Aggression era, and PG era) proves that if he were able to still go, he would be just as likely to be a main event player in this day and age. Hell, he kind of is.

No, it doesn't and I also said that I don't personally think he's overrated. I simply believe I can understand why a more modern day viewer would feel that way.

I'm referring to Taker vs Michaels... I was in the heat of the moment when I made the Cena comment, and I was wrong. He is a good wrestler... but he's not in the same league as Taker IMO, because again, Taker is remembered as one of the greatest in the ring of all time. I doubt Cena will.

Ah, yeah that was a great match.


Ironic, as a matter of fact, I JUST got finished re-watching the year 1997 and am through 5 months of 98. I've recently watched Taker feud with Bret, than Shawn, than Kane, and he is clearly the number 2 face behind Bret and than Austin at this point. His Cell match with Shawn never ceases to amaze me (and I've seen it about 7 times), and I'm still amazed at his presence at this time. Believe me, I've re-watched the 90's so many times I can probably recite what happens in order from 95-99... Don't try me.

Well, it's been fun but I think I'll leave my point at this.

haha, well you got me there. I've always liked Undertaker, even in his biker days. The only time Taker bored me was when he was paired with the Big Show during the early 2000's (which is strange as I also like the Big Show) and I attribute that to too much mic time. But I do often find myself wondering what it would be like if Undertaker debuted in 2015. Would he be fast paced enough? Would he flounder in the midcard like Harper or be pushed before he's ready like Reigns? I think part of the reason Taker is so highly regarded is he debuted with the right gimmick at the right time. Whereas I think the more versatile stars could've made it in any era.

Although since you're obviously a Taker fan, I have a random question for you. Have you watched his WcW work? I've always wondered if he played a similar role or not.
 
Although since you're obviously a Taker fan, I have a random question for you. Have you watched his WcW work? I've always wondered if he played a similar role or not.

Glad we could return to cordial conversation. I've watched bits and pieces of Taker as Mean Mark Callous, but I can't say I'm a hundred percent familiar with the role he played. From what I've seen, he's basically a mix between his Deadman gimmick, his ABA gimmick, and Hawk Bradshaw... he was portrayed as kind of gothic, but he embraced his southern side a lot more. He was actually pretty over in WCW for a time, but for some reason they never decided to re-sign him.

I actually dug some of his work. You should check some of it out if your interested.
 
No but Wrestlemania is supposed to be the highlight of the year, THE big event. One does have higher expectations from it. Now I'm not blaming Undertaker or anything as he can only do so much with someone like Giant Gonzalez, but look to my primary point. Anyone could've been given the streak.

Here's the thing I hate about the argument of "Anyone could have been given The Streak!"...

They weren't. The Streak wasn't planned, not initially anyway. It was a freaky coincidence that EVERY YEAR at Wrestlemania, Taker won. Then, around W #10 I think it was, Taker said "Hey, uhhh...I've never lost at Wrestlemania." Things kind of took off from there.

I could never believe most guys being unbeaten at Mania. For Taker, it just kind of fits. He was his generation's Andre the Giant. A spectacle draw. He never needed a title. He could get a program over facing off against just about anybody.
 
I don't see how anyone could claim that Undertaker is in any way overrated.

The guy is an absolute legend in the business, and has proven how good he is countless times over his career. No-one has longevity like 'Taker and no-one has been able to update and reinvent himself to remain relevant, over and a top star in so many different eras.

Undertaker is universally respected by his peers for everything he has achieved, his consistent high-level performances over so many years, that's a fact. What is important to remember is that unlike other wrestlers, who've been made out to be THE GUY in WWE, 'Taker has never been one to dominate the title picture. He's always been one of the lead supporting guys- the workhorses to the absolute top guys like Austin and Rock.

Anyone who understands wrestling knows what a talent Undertaker has been. To take a gimmick, which on paper sounds silly even (and did even back then) and make such a success out of it is phenomenal- it's probably the most successful gimmick of all time. The changes the character have gone through- from a mortician to a satanic persona to the more "real life" biker gimmick and then back to the Deadman show 'Taker was always able to adapt to different eras and changing times.

He's so athletic for a man his size and is undoubtably the most talented big man in wrestling history, and for anyone criticising his mic skills you have to remember that during the character's early (and later years)- he didn't speak that much. During his "Bad Ass" "Ministry" or "Big Evil" persona's. 'Taker was fine on the mic.

I refuse to accept that Undertaker is in any way overrated. He is one of THE BEST of all time.
 

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