Tyrone Willingham is fired...where is all the Black Power now?

[Slyfox696]

I never said his bad season wasn't because of that, I'm just saying that Willingham's bad seasons were because of the same reason.

And, I suppose, his bad seasons at Washington were the same?

As I've said numerous times, Willingham wasn't fired for his record, he was fired for his lack of recruiting and the overall downward direction of the program. Which is what separates Weiss from Willingham.

Based on your definition of succesful, Willingham was succesful at Stanford, and weiss has been succesful at Notre Dame, but I don't think either did that great.

Willingham went to BCS games at Stanford? He brought in Top 10 recruiting classes every year?

No, I don't think so.

From the beginning my main point has been that if Willingham deserved to get fired then so does Weiss, because their tenures have been almost identical.

But they HAVEN'T been? When will you quit being so damn lazy and read a fucking thread? Willingham didn't recruit for shit, was known as a lazy recruiter, and the overall direction of the program was headed on a downward slope. Which is why he got fired.

If Willingham had been bringing in Top 10 classes every year, hit the recruiting trail hard every year, and was showing some kind of progression in the program, he never would have been fired. But he didn't. And he got canned.

Willingham's best season came with other coaches recruits. Weiss's 2 good seasons came with other coaches recruits.

And next year, it will be all Weiss's recruits, with his first recruiting class being seniors.

And let's see how they do.

Willingham had 2 bad seasons with young players. Weiss had 2 bad seasons with young players.

No he didn't. He had one bad season, and one average season. You're a moron if you think going to a bowl game, a year after a 3-9 year is a bad season.

The only difference is the rank of the recruiting classes, but projected rankings most of the time aren't right, and if you look at how well the players each coach recruited have done, it's fairly equal. Weiss's projected rankings were better, but his players haven't done that much better then Willingham's did.

Because his players haven't reached the same level that Willingham's did. You're basing Willingham's recruits off their junior and senior years, but Weiss's recruits haven't had their junior or senior years yet.

So you're comparing apples to oranges. Which is why you give Weiss another year.

Willingham was never given the opportunity to to be the head coach with his recruits as juniors and seniors, so why does Weiss get that oppurtunity? because his recruit classes are projected higher?

Because Willingham sucked as a coach?

I mean, you are completely dismissing how terrible Washington has been...you know, so bad they fired Willingham? He didn't even finish his fourth year at Washington. Willingham sucks as a coach. Why keep a guy who sucks.

If his classes were really that good then why are they 6-6 this season.

No senior leadership, and underclassmen at skill positions.

Teams like USC are able to win with young teams because guys like Pete Carrol are great coaches.

No one is denying that Pete Carrol is a good coach.

But, now that you mention it, where is this youth you are talking about? 18 of their 24 starters are upperclassmen (including 7 on the defense). That's not young. Last year 22 of their 24 starters were upperclassmen. That's not young either.

U of M was able to have 13 staright winning season under Lloyd Carr because he was a great coach.

A great coach? Yeah, that's why he got fired, and that's why Rich Rodriguez walked into a situation with ZERO talent.

Lloyd Carr sucked. The best thing that happened to the Michigan/Notre Dame game was that Lloyd Carr was still coaching. As long as he was coach, we always had a shot, even though we usually played with inferior talent.

5-7 seasons and 6-6 seasons are not tolerated at Notre Dame becuase they expect to win at a high level every year. And that is why Willingham was fired. 3-9 and 6-6 seasons aren't tolerated either but Weiss still has his job.

Because the program is showing improvement in every year but one. Why are you too dense to understand this concept?

Weiss might be a better recruiter then Willingham, but Willingham did a better job coaching what he had then Weiss did.

LOL

This is a joke right? Anyone who scouted Notre Dame at all when Willingham was there knew what play Willingham was running before he did. I can remember my father sitting in front of the TV and calling about 75% of the time the right play that Notre Dame was running, before they even lined up. Kids never showed improvement under Willingham, he was entirely predictable, and outside of those first 8 games of his career, his record was 13-16. Once coaches had some film on what he was doing at Notre Dame, he couldn't do anything.

When you look at the overall picture of what both coaches have done neither did a good enough job to deserve being the head coach, but Willingham got fired, and Weiss is still there.

The only people who think that this is a white/black issue are racists.

Willingham got fired for running a terrible program, with no recruiting and a football team that kept getting worse. Weiss is still there because of two BCS bids, great recruiting, and improvement in quality every year but one.

Only a fool can't see the difference. Don't be a fool.

 

[Big Sexy]

Willingham went to BCS games at Stanford?

Actually he went to the Rose Bowl in 1999.

No he didn't. He had one bad season, and one average season. You're a moron if you think going to a bowl game, a year after a 3-9 year is a bad season.

Then I guess Willingham never really had a bad season. 5-7 was jut slighlty below average, and 6-6 was average.

A great coach? Yeah, that's why he got fired, and that's why Rich Rodriguez walked into a situation with ZERO talent.

He didn't get fired, he retired. And Michigan actually has a lot of great young talent, they just don't have shit at the quarterback position because there good young qb transferred when Rodriguez was named head coach. And you really shouldn't get into an argument about Lloyd Carr not being a great coach because that is an argument you have no chance at winning.

Because the program is showing improvement in every year but one. Why are you too dense to understand this concept?

Wow that sounds familiar, maybe its because Notre Dame showed improvement every year except one when Willingham was the coach.

Because Willingham sucked as a coach?

I realize Willingham sucks, but Weiss sucks to.

 

[Slyfox696]

Actually he went to the Rose Bowl in 1999.

Only because the Pac 10 sucked that year. But, fair enough.

Then I guess Willingham never really had a bad season. 5-7 was jut slighlty below average, and 6-6 was average.

And was only going to get worse.

He didn't get fired, he retired.

Yeah, ok. I guess if you want to get technical about it.

And you really shouldn't get into an argument about Lloyd Carr not being a great coach because that is an argument you have no chance at winning.

Allow me to rephrase.

Football completely passed Lloyd Carr by. His Michigan teams underachieved each of the last several years he was there (with the exception of 2006, where they probably overachieved), which is why he "retired". The longer Lloyd Carr would have been at Michigan, the larger the dropoff in quality would have been.

Wow that sounds familiar, maybe its because Notre Dame showed improvement every year except one when Willingham was the coach.

No they didn't. Which is why he got fired.

I realize Willingham sucks, but Weiss sucks to.

And yet, he'll be going to his third game bowl game in four years. And he's bringing in Top recruiting classes every year.

Wait until next year. Barring unforseen circumstances, if Notre Dame can't perform next year, then Weiss will deserve to be on the hot seat. But right now, it's ludicrous to even suggest something like that.

 

[Big Sexy]

Wait until next year. Barring unforseen circumstances, if Notre Dame can't perform next year, then Weiss will deserve to be on the hot seat. But right now, it's ludicrous to even suggest something like that.

I will wait until next year, but Notre Dame needs at least 8 wins to prove to me that Weiss deserves to be the head coach there.

 

[Big Sexy]

Once again I will wait until next year, but that is only if Weiss makes it to next year.

I think it's now safe to say with no hint of reservation: The Notre Dame-Charlie Weis marriage is officially doomed. College football's $40 million man got a reprieve for his 3-9 debacle last year because, according to his apologists, it was Tyrone Willingham's fault. While there were growing grumblings following recent Irish losses to Pittsburgh and Boston College, most reasonable observers believed a 7-5 season would assure Weis' return next season, and AD Jack Swarbrick quickly put out a statement echoing such. But that was before Notre Dame lost to Syracuse. That's right, folks: Syracuse. Saturday in snowy South Bend, Weis' band of former five-star recruits blew a 23-10 lead and lost to lame-duck coach Greg Robinson's 2-8 Orange. Notre Dame has suffered a lot of bad losses under Weis. This was one was unquestionably his worst yet -- and, most likely, his death knell in South Bend. Once again, Weis has been exposed as an incompetent college coach, incapable of developing young talent.

SI.com

Wow that last sentence seems a lot like something I said earlier.

 

[The Bearded One]

College Football- Sylvester Croom, Turner Gill

You mean the guy who had to resine (sp?) earlier today? Croom had one decent season, but other than that was garbage.

But skin color should not matter who gets the job and who doesn't. At the end of the day Willingham was a bad coach. He would have gotten fired if he was white, asian, hispanic, whatever. I hate how everything is based off of race. Take the Rooney Rule in the NFL for example. For those of you who do not what the Rooney Rule is, it states that an NFL team must interview at least one minority while searching for a head coach. That just seems completely absurd to me. If the team knows who they're going to hire, and which direction they want to go, it just seems like a gigantic waste of time to interview somebody who most likely won't get the job.

 

[Mighty NorCal]

The rooney rule in itself is racist as fuck. umm treating someone differently becuase of their race?? sounds racist. a team only has so much time and resources to interveiw prospects, they have to waste time interveiwing someone they have no intention on hiring, while a white coach who may have had a chance doesnt get to interveiw?? racist. Teams, and schools, should be left to their own devices on who to hire and not hire. And all the people lashing out about racism are idiots. maybe the black guys who got fired just cant coach worth shit. Oh yes, I forgot in this country we arent allowed to say anything negative about black people. please excuse my gross, blatant bigotry.