The Past is Now

[Just Zay'n]

OK don't get me wrong, these guys have been amazing performers in the past, legends even. But this emphasis on keeping wrestlers from the late-Attitude/early-Ruthless Aggression eras in the main event/big match scene, all the way into 2015, is kind of getting out of hand.

As great as Jericho is, his inclusion in the six man tag match was basically a novelty, as opposed to continuing the storyline or showcasing somebody new. Since he only appears rarely, and since he has absolutely nothing to do with the feud, the match seemed less important and subsequently I lost interest.

And not to mention Kane - who's ready for two consecutive Rollins v. Kane main events?! Again, Kane has been great in the past and has contributed an unbelievable amount, but there are soooo many newer, super-talented superstars who never get their time.

I'm not completely shitting on WWE, at least that's not what's intended, but this mentality of clinging onto the past is going to harm things in the long run. The point - how can we see good, memorable title reigns at the top from newer guys such as Reigns, Ambrose, Wyatt (and Harper for that matter), Cesaro, Owens, Barrett, Ziggler, Rusev, Ryback, Zayn, Balor, Joe, Neville, Crews, Corbin, Itami, Breeze (and there's probably more!) ...when we're going to be seeing Kane for the next few months? And who knows, maybe we'll have Cena again after!

It's really time for all these guys to stop being the future, and start being the present.

Edit: Apologies for the very Madden-esque thread title... let's hope I don't sound like the man himself

 

[Navi]

I hear what you're saying, but in Kane's defense, this has been a long running feud with Rollins. It had to come to a head at some point and now it looks like they are ready to go with it. After their feud is finished which Rollins will probably win, that will probably be the last we see of Kane in the ring.

Jericho was needed tonight for the Wyatt's to win and for Reigns and Ambrose not to take the pin. He's been around for years, and it doesn't affect him as much as it would the other two. Miz spoiled it last week when he mentioned HIAC where this feud may and hopefully be over. I'm sure they will pull someone else out of the bag for that one. Might be a new call up in Samoa Joe an this gives them a good reason to get him. Joe is big, experienced and would be a good foil for Wyatt and the gang.

I personally would have liked Cesaro to be the third guy instead of Jericho. His name was never mentioned and he's as strong as a horse. Not as big as Strowman but might be able to match him in strength better than Jericho did. Also don't forget we're in the run up to the Rumble and Mania, so the part timers will come in fast and furiously now. They have to sell 100k seats next year at Cowboy Stadium, and the newer guys won't be able to do it.

 

[Garak]

Memorable title reigns from all these guys? Forget it. They're lucky this isn't the Sammartino, Backlund, or Hogan era. The faces would be afterthoughts and the heels would be fed to the champ, particularly in Hogan's case.

Yes, we'll see Kane for the next few months, and Cena, too. You need steady hands to lend credibility to main events. Do you realize how long guys like Brett and Shawn and even Hogan put in before their first title runs? Do you forget how many greats never got to touch the belt? Back then, being a real main eventer meant jobbing to Hogan in a couple well spaced out feuds. Now, you list 18 names and want to see them in memorable title reigns?

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Kane won't take his ball and go home, only to resurface in MMA. He won't insist on a part time schedule. He won't freak out and insist he go over everyone else. He won't have pictures of his junk floating around online. And, he isn't one strike away from his third strike in the Wellness Policy. He can also get into the ring without injuring himself.

 

[Aquaman6686]

The past is now? I don't think so. WWE isn't bringing back past wrestlers to do anything important, they're bringing them back to be jobbers, and it's disgusting. WWE's logic these days is that all veteran talents are incompetent weaklings who can't win a match, and all rookies are invincible gods who can't be defeated. Chris Jericho comes back and jobs to Braun Strowman after virtually no offense, and loses to a freaking BEAR HUG. I can't wait for WrestleMania 32, when Stone Cold Steve Austin makes a one night return to job to Big E on the Kickoff Show. The youth movement is what's killing WWE.

 

[Heartbreak_Kid_707]

Am I the only one around who was excited to see Kane back, and in his mask, and to exact some revenge on Rollins. Rollins "the future" is still the main event. In the OP you mentioned a list of names that should be main eventing. Look at your list
**Reigns, Ambrose...involved in a major 6 man tag story line
**Itami..been injured and not back 100%
**Zane...been injured not back 100%
**Owens, as he's said a million times he's not a new face
**Ziegler, nowhere near a new face. Was a spirit squad member during the attitude era. Plus been given numerous main event pushes
*Crews, Breeze, Joe, Balor, Corbin..their still needed to push NXT and make it watchable.

Now I woulda liked to seen Cesaro there. But the main roster isn't a mess..

 

[JamJam]

I hear what you're saying, but in Kane's defense, this has been a long running feud with Rollins. It had to come to a head at some point and now it looks like they are ready to go with it. After their feud is finished which Rollins will probably win, that will probably be the last we see of Kane in the ring.

Jericho was needed tonight for the Wyatt's to win and for Reigns and Ambrose not to take the pin. He's been around for years, and it doesn't affect him as much as it would the other two. Miz spoiled it last week when he mentioned HIAC where this feud may and hopefully be over. I'm sure they will pull someone else out of the bag for that one. Might be a new call up in Samoa Joe an this gives them a good reason to get him. Joe is big, experienced and would be a good foil for Wyatt and the gang.

I personally would have liked Cesaro to be the third guy instead of Jericho. His name was never mentioned and he's as strong as a horse. Not as big as Strowman but might be able to match him in strength better than Jericho did. Also don't forget we're in the run up to the Rumble and Mania, so the part timers will come in fast and furiously now. They have to sell 100k seats next year at Cowboy Stadium, and the newer guys won't be able to do it.

Basically this. I won't say much about the Kane stuff because DL said it perfectly already. The best thing about this is that it all makes sense. It would've been so lame if something else happened and just seemed completely random and illogical.

I liked Jericho teaming with Reigns/Ambrose here. Both guys can't really afford to get pinned so letting Jericho take the pin is fine here. Also because it looks like we're getting Jericho/Ambrose, I hope. That'd be a great feud. As for Roman, maybe The Usos are good to go now so they can help him fend of The Wyatt Family. I think it'd be a good story. Family vs. Family. Hopefully Bray wins the feud for once. After that, who knows what Reigns will do. Maybe turn heel or something.

You mentioned some NXT guys and well, it's way too early for them to come up to the roster especially with NXT needing the star power right now. Sure, a debut on the main roster doesn't necessarily mean that they'll be leaving NXT but that is what's going to happen eventually. For now, WWE made the correct moves. Let's see if they keep it up.

 

[Just Zay'n]

You mentioned some NXT guys and well, it's way too early for them to come up to the roster especially with NXT needing the star power right now. Sure, a debut on the main roster doesn't necessarily mean that they'll be leaving NXT but that is what's going to happen eventually. For now, WWE made the correct moves. Let's see if they keep it up.

I guess what my point is, is that superstars who should be main eventing now aren't, and are not even close to main eventing due to veterans getting that spot. So by the time the likes of Cesaro, Owens, Barrett etc. get their hands on the title, those NXT guys would have been called up, and maybe lost in the shuffle. To reiterate, I'll use someone like Itami as an example. He would be an absolutely badass champ, despite his size and ring style he could be booked as an upper-card guy. Theoretically. Possibly. I'm not saying that it should/definitely will happen. But the thing is, assuming he gets a shot, he won't get it before someone like Cesaro gets his time, or Owens, Barrett etc. And those three seem like a damn long way from getting a WWEWHC title shot, if they even do get one.

The fact is, those guys are on Raw, they are phenomenal athletes... but they're not being used as they should. They should all have had title runs by now.

 

[The Samoan Heritage]

**Ziegler, nowhere near a new face. Was a spirit squad member during the attitude era....

WOW!!!!!!!!!!!! (You must be new to wrestling/wwe?) You're not alone though about Kane's return. I am excited about the return of masked Kane I just hope he loses his "ring rust". Before he became corporate Kane he was able to put on some good matches with just about anyone but now Kane's matches have become slow and painful to watch IMO.

I don't see anything wrong with using the past to help build the future. Kane and Rollins have been having heat for months now and its finally come to a boil. There's no strong main event face at the moment besides Sting and Cena so having Rollins go over Kane is the best choice.
Chris Jericho return/addition did two things. Added a credible name to Stroman's path of destruction and it planted seeds for a(n) (awesome) Jericho vs Ambrose feud eventually down the line.
Sting....I have no idea? Rollins should've beaten Sting but then again if Rollins just had a hard fought battle with Cena and even got "attacked" afterwards he should NOT have been able to defeat Sting. It just ruins it for me. Wwe spends all this time making Sting seem like a big deal only to just lose to a weaken beaten down champion. Its kind of like Taker he spent his career creating this mystique around him and it was throwed away just to make Lesnar look strong. Everything about Sting has just about been taken away from him.
The Dudley's addition to the tag scene has given New Day some good material to work with because The Ascension, Los Matadores, and PTP sure wasn't given them anything.

Also as someone mentioned you're rushing thing. These new superstars shouldn't just be thrust into the main event scene(heck most won't even make it). That's what went wrong with guys like Swagger, Ziggler, Khali, etc in the first place. They were pushed into the main event, given the world title and just didn't succeed. Take it one step out a time and it would be better. Wwe has build Rollins(they already have Sheamus) now they just need to slowly start to build up others. They can either take the short route by trying to bring of their upper mid carders In Owens, Reigns, Wyatt, or Ambrose to the main event. Or they can go the longer route and try to build up one of the mid carders like Harper, Rusev, Cesaro, etc. (which will take a little more work to do) to main event level.

 

[Heartbreak_Kid_707]

WOW!!!!!!!!!!!! (You must be new to wrestling/wwe?) You're not alone though about Kane's return. I am excited about the return of masked Kane I just hope he loses his "ring rust". Before he became corporate Kane he was able to put on some good matches with just about anyone but now Kane's matches have become slow and painful to watch IMO.

I don't see anything wrong with using the past to help build the future. Kane and Rollins have been having heat for months now and its finally come to a boil. There's no strong main event face at the moment besides Sting and Cena so having Rollins go over Kane is the best choice.
Chris Jericho return/addition did two things. Added a credible name to Stroman's path of destruction and it planted seeds for a(n) (awesome) Jericho vs Ambrose feud eventually down the line.
Sting....I have no idea? Rollins should've beaten Sting but then again if Rollins just had a hard fought battle with Cena and even got "attacked" afterwards he should NOT have been able to defeat Sting. It just ruins it for me. Wwe spends all this time making Sting seem like a big deal only to just lose to a weaken beaten down champion. Its kind of like Taker he spent his career creating this mystique around him and it was throwed away just to make Lesnar look strong. Everything about Sting has just about been taken away from him.
The Dudley's addition to the tag scene has given New Day some good material to work with because The Ascension, Los Matadores, and PTP sure wasn't given them anything.

Also as someone mentioned you're rushing thing. These new superstars shouldn't just be thrust into the main event scene(heck most won't even make it). That's what went wrong with guys like Swagger, Ziggler, Khali, etc in the first place. They were pushed into the main event, given the world title and just didn't succeed. Take it one step out a time and it would be better. Wwe has build Rollins(they already have Sheamus) now they just need to slowly start to build up others. They can either take the short route by trying to bring of their upper mid carders In Owens, Reigns, Wyatt, or Ambrose to the main event. Or they can go the longer route and try to build up one of the mid carders like Harper, Rusev, Cesaro, etc. (which will take a little more work to do) to main event level.

I don't get it? Why must I be new to wrestling because of my Ziggler comment? I've been watching all of wrestling since I was a kid and I'm 36 now.

Everything I said about Ziggler is true. He was a member of the spirit squad during the attitude era. And been given more than plenty of main event chances. Do your homework.

Every word I replied was the truth about your whole post. You don't have an argument to back it up. So I ask, are you new to wrestling yourself?

 

[FreezeIzGAWD]

Okay maybe I am missing something here but isn't Seth Rollins the champ right now?

About 2 years ago people were begging for it to happen and well it is right now. I think Owens is being used PERFECTLY. I know a bunch of you Nerds have been watching him since No better Heard Backyard Wrestling Association but you have to understand that most fans had NEVER saw him before NXT. So in one year he has won the NXT title, cleanly beaten Cena and won the IC belt from Ryback. You don't consider that a decent push?

Oh and actually Rollins and Reigns would be in the Main Events had all you Nerds not shit on Reigns for nothing. He doesn't deserve it. He needs more time. LOL. Okay well now you have the vets in the main event and its we need NEW BLOOD. GEEEEEZ US!!!!

By the way unless I have miscounted this is Stings FIRST main event and he lost. Matter of fact Sting is a whooping 1-2 since arriving in the WWE and tonight he was cleanly pinned by a guy who had already wrestled. Yeah he is getting PUSHED HARD!!!!

As far as the NXT stars you want pushed. Hey how about letting them get to the big stage first at least. You do realize the Ascension we're can't miss while in NXT. That doesn't always transfer to the big stage.

Oh and Ziggler is TAPPED out. Not everyone is WWE heavyweight material. He is a perfect example. IC and U.S. champ maybe but as of right now I think he should NEVER wear gold again. He should just keep having great matches and mid card feuds because that is where he SHOULD be.

 

[FreezeIzGAWD]

Oh and it did make sense to bring Jericho back because he was feuding with Bray before he left. Oh and Kane is going to just keep getting washed by Rollins. Why would you want an up and comer to have that keep happening to them. Kane can lose EVER match from here on and it won't erase his legacy but for a prospect it might mean a career kilker

 

[The Samoan Heritage]

I don't get it? Why must I be new to wrestling because of my Ziggler comment? I've been watching all of wrestling since I was a kid and I'm 36 now.

Everything I said about Ziggler is true. He was a member of the spirit squad during the attitude era. And been given more than plenty of main event chances. Do your homework.

Every word I replied was the truth about your whole post. You don't have an argument to back it up.

I agree with your first post but that Ziggler comment just stuck out. The spirit squad was no where close to being in the attitude era. The attitude era ended in 2002. The Spirit Squad debuted in 2006-7. Me asking are you new to wrestling wasn't really a dis it was just a question.

 

[Heartbreak_Kid_707]

Ah cool..just a misunderstanding...the spirit squad I wasn't even sure of the year. Lol

Truce..

 

[Jack-Hammer]

Not really seeing how.

Kane, though older, is in phenomenal shape, can still go in the ring and will ultimately be used to put Rollins over. Plus, as has been pointed out, Kane and Rollins have had animosity towards one another for months, so going after Rollins makes perfect sense.

The Dudley Boyz bring a level of star power and nostalgia to the tag team picture that hasn't been there. They didn't win the tag titles last night, they probably will at some point just so they can have a 10th run, but they were used in a way that guarantees their feud with New Day continues.

Jericho has been used for the past several years to put over younger talent and last night was no exception. There's a strong possibility that he'll feud with Kevin Owens over the IC title, he's set to face him at the MSG special on the WWE Network if I'm not mistaken, and he'll put Owens over as well. Again, using Jericho in this situation was perfectly logical considering that he had a long feud with Bray Wyatt last year; something the commentators pointed out just after Jericho was introduced as the mystery partner.

Last night, we saw Sting lose clean to Seth Rollins. Sting was the flag bearer of WCW, a legend who's in great shape and had a great showing against someone half his age.

If older stars have still got the goods and can be used to elevate younger talent, I'm all for it. It doesn't look to me at all like WWE is trying to use stars in their 40s and 50s to carry the company.

 

[That N Word]

I don't get it? Why must I be new to wrestling because of my Ziggler comment? I've been watching all of wrestling since I was a kid and I'm 36 now.Everything I said about Ziggler is true. He was a member of the spirit squad during the attitude era. And been given more than plenty of main event chances. Do your homework. Every word I replied was the truth about your whole post. You don't have an argument to back it up. So I ask, are you new to wrestling yourself?

Actually what you said was about Ziggler false. Ziggler debuted in The Brand Split Era/late Ruthless Aggression Era. And i'm pretty sure you know that and aren't that and are just hoping others slide past the comment.As for the topic itself it is the future, but you can't go to the future without the past. Let's not forget these are all legends where talking about in Cena,Kane,Jericho,Taker,Orton,Lesnar,Rock,Triple H,Mark Henry,and Big Show. They earned the right to chose whether they want to work or not. Besides they are not doing any harm, their there to help. Only harmful thing was Cena winning last night. Don't get me wrong he has been putting stars over with the "Cena rub" all year. But last night he shouldn't have won because it made both Rollins and Sting look weak last night.


However, if Rollins would have lost to Sting as well and then Kane came out and attacked him it wouldn't have been much of a problem for me. It would of told a story that being cocky only get's you so far. Had he won both and Sheamus cashed in would of told a great story as well. But having Cena win,Sting lose,and no cash in but a Kane assault didn't tell much of a story. With the fact that Kane stopped Sheamus cash in, it could be he wants the title for his self though.I think that after WrestleMania 33 the legends will take a almost complete backseat or only be part-timers. Hell I see Cena walking into WrestleMania 33. By WrestleMania 33 the only part-timers will be Cena,Orton,Triple H,Lesnar,and maybe Rock and Jericho. I think Kane,Show,Taker,Sting,and Henry will be retired. Rock may only be an ambassador at that point.


And I think Roman Reigns will be the face of the WWE with Seth Rollins,Samoa Joe/Sami Zayn,Apolo Crews and Finn Balor as the supporting cast of top babyfaces. and Dean Ambrose will be the #1 top heel (when Cena isn’t around) and Kevin Owens,Barin Corbin, Bray Wyatt,and Sheamus will be the supporting cast.I think Ziggler will either get a CM Punk 2011 type push eventually or leave WWE and become a bigger star outside of WWE for it. Daniel Bryan will get back in the ring but unfortunately will have to retire. I also believe Cody Rhodes will manage to take his Stardust gimmick to the main event. I think Neville will become the next RVD/Jeff Hardy guy where he is a mid-card guy, in a couple of tag teams and eventually wins the “big one.” I also predict that at some point down the line AJ Styles will either sign with WWE or just go in the WWE Hall of Fame (Yes,you read that right.) Also Jay Lethal will probably sign with WWE. In about 10 years from now, I think WWE may go back to TV-14. That last right is extremely unrealistic but just a bold prediction.These are just a bold prediction from me.

 

[Garak]

They should all have had title runs by now.

Why? As I pointed out already, you listed more guys than there are titles times the number of months in any feasible time frame during the length of their current careers.

Additionally, very many of these will never get anything beyond a mid card title, or nothing at all. Look at the mention of Wade. Personally, I think he's something special. But, between injuries, timing, and some bad writing, things haven't worked out for him. Not everyone can be the next John Cena or Hulk Hogan.

The big belt should be reserved for some very special people and not handed around left and right. We don't exactly need 11 year title reigns anymore, but we don't need a new champion ever second PPV, either. I don't like Rollins character much, but he is adding to the prestige of the title by simply holding it for a lengthy period of time. Brock elevated it in a fantastic fashion.

For those of you who weren't around for Hogan's big run, you didn't get to see him wrestle on TV for a very extended period of time, until Saturday Night's Main Event came out. He might wrestle a jobber once in a blue moon on Saturday mornings, but usually you saw him in a taped promo, and that was it. If you wanted to see the belt, you went to a house show if you lived in the territory and were willing to travel.

 

[Wrestlingaholic]

I mentioned this on a Bray Wyatt thread the other day: there is little benefit, long term, to having all these people you mention pushed to the top immediately. You think fans are bored of Orton v Cena matches now? They at least started on different brands so spent the first few years of their main roster careers apart. Fans would get bored very quickly of seeing the same combination of matches headline cards.

Letting the majority grow naturally is what's best for business. And whilst the mid-card grows in stature, by all means the top liners should be able to have watchable feuds and matches against veterans, a good way of keeping their fires burning.

Finally we all know the chase is the key in wrestling. Seth Rollins, I hope, keeps the title into Wrestlemania. Every challenger he has faced, he has manager to overcome, one way or another. So, as long as WWE book the Royal Rumble right (and I still believe Daniel Bryan will win that match), the crowd should be firmly behind whoever the challenger is at Wrestlemania, as they will want to see Rollins get his comeuppance. And the way he's winning his matches now does no harm to the 'youth movement' long term because it isn't them that he is beating.

WWE gets a lot wrong (even some of their booking last night was implausible), but certain things they are getting right and in my opinion this is one of them.

 

[whoopin' ass]

Totally agree with you. I have no problem with wwe bringing back these older stars but you can't do that at the expense of your new talent which is what wwe is doing. We have complained for years now that wwe can't build stars anymore. We are not seeing the end result of that as wwe is trying to build but can't get most over so they end up pulling in guys like Jericho, Lesnar, Rock, etc to fill the voids. In the end, it is a simple case of money - they could take a lot of top guys like Cena and Orton off tv for a while and let the younger guys shine but that is going to mean a loss of money. But they do it anyways - how many house shows to the top older guys actually do? Your younger talent are the work horses, the older guys are on the road for a bit, then off for a bit, usually only hitting bigger centers and not the smaller places. Use that mentality on tv and build the names.

With the older guys, make them special attractions. You don't have to abandon them but you can't throw them into your main angles or build big angles around them. I mean, look at Sting vs HHH - didn't exactly get the response wwe was expecting. But had it been a special attraction - one time only, 2 guys who have never faced off in the ring for pride and honor - it would have worked a lot better. That is the kind of thing they need to do. You can throw them into other matches like a mystery partner in a tag match but on Raw for fun and not as a big angle on your ppv. But as long as fans keep popping when they return, wwe is going to keep doing the same thing.

 

[Mustang Sally]

It's really time for all these guys to stop being the future, and start being the present.

It's a reasonable sentiment, yet when you consider the enormous amount of original programming WWE chooses to air, I would think there's room for the old & new.......and lots of other stuff.

'Future' guys like Reigns, Rollins, Ambrose, Ziggler, Rusev & Ryback are on our screens all the time; I don't see them being shorted by the occasional appearance of an old-timer. Performers who have grown old before our eyes but never left the active roster like Big Show, Kane and Mark Henry serve a definite purpose..... appearing fearsome and winning an occasional match in order to spend the rest of the time as enhancement talent for the 'future' guys.

Of course, John Cena is a story in himself; many folks would be thrilled to see him lose every match he's in while boosting the careers of younger wrestlers.....these fans don't seem to realize that Cena would lose his value as a stepping stone for other performers if he continually loses.....and, like it or not, he's a cash cow that WWE would be foolish to shove to the bottom.

Meanwhile, there's the old stand-by argument: most prime-time TV shows air 22 new episodes a year, with the rest of the time taken up by reruns and hiatus. WWE has no such 'down time'..... they're up 52 weeks a year with Raw, Smackdown, house shows, pay-per-views and other original shows on the WWE Network. True, they could choose to air less programming, but since they don't, they have to give us variety......and a constant dose of the 'future' guys & gals just isn't enough.

So, if an occasional old-time favorite like Chris Jericho shows up unannounced to engage in a match that essentially means nothing, but gives us a chance to enjoy a guy we rarely get to see, I think it's all good.

 

[MartialHorror]

I personally suspect that 'Rollins Vs Kane' will only last one PPV.

But then again, wasn't Kane originally going to take on Daniel Bryan at the Money in the Bank PPV before it became clear that Bryan couldn't compete? Eh. I haven't seen this last RAW, but the storyline hasn't sucked so far, but I have to admit that I'd rather see Seth take on someone new. I mean, two of his WHC challengers were also involved in feuds with him last year.

 

[PeaceLove&Y2J]

The WWE can be overly nostalgic at times, I'll admit. However, I don't think that means the WWE is going to suddenly turn to the past all the time. When there's a lack of star power in the company, necessary changes have to be made in order to keep interest of the fans. Thus why we have Kane's return, the Dudleyz return, Y2J's return, and Brock Lesnar being back in our lives since 2012. It's a part of the bigger picture.

And think about what happens when big moments happen for the new guys, like Rollins winning at WrestleMania, or someone beating Cena for the US Title (Rollins and whoever else gets the chip from the big guy once he's ready to move on).