The Legend Killer vs The Viper

[WWEFreak]

Well i've been looking Randy on Wiki and stuff, and i just noticed that WWE don't use the Legend Killer Anymore. In my opinion, i think that the Legend Killer sounds so much better The Viper.... it seems to mean the legend killer brought on so much more heat than viper... he was taking out former stars that we loved.... now i love randy orton hes one my favorite wrestler but i think the blank stair of doom is shitty compared to his cocky Legend killer taunt

What do you guys think? do you think the viper is better than Legend Killer?

 

[Y 2 Jake]

You can't have a murderer on a PG rated show. But apparently being a venomous snake that kills people is perfectly acceptable.

Overall it doesn't mean anything. It hasn't since Randy Orton failed in ''killing'' the biggest legend of them all. The only difference it'll make is there'll be more t-shirst with snakes on. None of which will be as good as the Austin ones.

 

[**Phenom_Cena_HHH_K.O.W**]

You can't have a murderer on a PG rated show. But apparently being a venomous snake that kills people is perfectly acceptable.

Ya really venomous snakes that kill are perfectly fine but ohhhh no not a killer.

Anyway back to the subject, Legend Killer is better for a very basic reason...Randy Orton is not, nor will he ever be, Stone Cold Steve Austin A.K.A The Texas Rattle Snake...Cause thats what WWE trying to do.They're trying to make Randy Orton the new Texas Rattle Snake but it wont work. Austin was and still is maybe one of the most Popular Superstars ever in the WWE even when he was Heel he got cheered and was forced to be Face...Almost like Triple H.

The Legend Killer Montra that Randy had was good,I dont like hin but dam it was fun to hate him as the legend killer...The stare downs, the cockyness it was awsome now...It just wont work trying to make Orton Stone Cold

 

[Mr. Black]

This is gonna be a long one (Thats what she said). I disagree that WWE is trying to make Orton the next Stone Cold simply because they both have snake in their nicknames...Orton and Stone Cold are completely different characters.

Stone Cold was the anti-hero that everyone could connect with. He did what he wanted when he wanted and took out everyone, good guy or bad, that got in his way. He would not be pushed around or depend on any man other than himself. And he loved to drink beer all the time. How could you not love to cheer for this guy? But the Stone Cold character was and is nothing like Orton, so it would be unfair to diminish the Viper name simply because they are both snakes.

Many have argued that the Legend Killer nickname was better and the Viper is lame. While Legend Killer has a much better ring to it, the Viper is more suitable for Orton at this time cuz Ortons character has changed greatly over the last year.

Legend Killer Orton was the young cocky heel we have seen a million times over. He claimed right from the start he would be the great and started killing legends, he had a cool theme, and he was an asshole. If he wasnt busy giving RKO's to Mae Young and Kamala, he was kicking people in the head and running Undertaker over with Eddie's lowrider.He made it easy for us to hate him. But as time went on, the list of legends went down, he got older, and it's hard to keep up being the young cocky heel with everything to prove after winning the wwe title four times.

The Viper fits Orton to a tee in my opinion. Orton has become the uber heel, but different from Edge and heel-Triple H. He is cold and heartless, but what really brings out the depth in his character is his complete lack of human emotion. Alot of people say he talks like a robot, but I say he acts like a sociopath. His actions are violent and impulsive and he has absolutely no regard for the safety of others. He is impossible to not hate.

 

[tLight]

Ya really venomous snakes that kill are perfectly fine but ohhhh no not a killer.

Anyway back to the subject, Legend Killer is better for a very basic reason...Randy Orton is not, nor will he ever be, Stone Cold Steve Austin A.K.A The Texas Rattle Snake...Cause thats what WWE trying to do.They're trying to make Randy Orton the new Texas Rattle Snake but it wont work. Austin was and still is maybe one of the most Popular Superstars ever in the WWE even when he was Heel he got cheered and was forced to be Face...Almost like Triple H.

The Legend Killer Montra that Randy had was good,I dont like hin but dam it was fun to hate him as the legend killer...The stare downs, the cockyness it was awsome now...It just wont work trying to make Orton Stone Cold

Their trying to make Randy Orton the next Stone Cold Steve Austin? Are we watching the same program? You must be getting some alternate reality broadcast of WWE Programming. If their trying to make anyone into the "next" SCSA, it isn’t Randy Orton, it was John Cena. This is almost as bad as people claiming Batista is the "next" Rock, completely forgetting the fact that he’s isn’t as entertaining in the ring or on the mic, and lacks the key thing the Rock had tons of, charisma, not to mention that Batista doesn’t have a drop of Talent and he’s more like the current Ultimate Warrior.

Back to Legend Killer vs. the Viper. The Legend Killer gimmick was great, but got old quick, due to the fact that watching a new up and comer future star beat the snot out of yester years WWE vets is boring (anyone remember Chris Jericho vs. the Retirement home at WM25? terrible garbage much?) so when it started it was great, but after a year of it, it needed to die.

As for the Viper gimmick, its works fine for Orton, when Triple H isn’t on the program, and Orton can beat down, and attack and physically cripple his opponents (much like a viper snake who is capable of delivering a painful and potentially fatal bite, yeah I wiki'ed that shit)

It’s another tag on his name,

like how Triple H is known as The Game, Cerebral Assassin, the King of Kings, blah blah blah

Or how Sean Michaels is the Heart Break Kid, the Show Stoppa, Mr WrestleMainia
Now when Orton comes out Michael Cole can say "the Legend Killer, The Viper, the Legacy blah blah blah Randy Orton"

I think I’ve made my point

 

[Mr. 619]

Whoever thinks that WWE is trying to make Orton into Stone cold is stupid. They are nothing alike at all.

Anyways, Orton's current Viper character is way better then the legend killer. Think about it. How succesful was Randy as the Legend Killer? He had his thing with evolution, his fued with the Undertaker, rated rko,and 1 shitty world title reign. Not in that order but still. After that he was still the legend killer, and basicly got nowhere.

Then in 2007 he has his fued with RVD when he gave him that nasty DDT that took him out. Then he had a thing with HBK where im pretty sure he was the first guy that Orton punted in the head. Correct me if I'm wrong though. These were the first signs of his new character and more serious attitude. Late in 2007 he won the WWE title twice in one night and went on to have a decent title reign that ended prematurly because of injury. He came back last year and took the sadistic viper character to a new high when he was puntin the macmahons, batista, and triple H and such. He won the royal rumble and was in the biggest fued, even if it flopped. Since returning from injury he held the WWE title 2 more times, and is the current champ.

The point I'm making is that even though the Legend Killer had a World heavyweight title reign under his belt, he was still not a legit main eventer. It was after the Viper started to develop that he became the success that he is today.

 

[matty256]

Just because the RKO looks like the Stunner and Vipors and Rattlesnakes are snakes doesnt mean they are trying to mold Orton into the new SCSA. But anyways I really did enjoy the Legend Killer gimmick he had, but it did get old fast. He is no longer that chracter anymore. Even though i get tired of Cole saying "The Vipor Orton" 2643254912342193 fucking times every Monday night, it really is suitable for Orton at this moment.

 

[RKO18]

Mr. 619: Orton wasnt injured when he lost the title in 2008, they simply gave it to HHH at that time. He got injured in a rematch against HHH. As far as the two characters go, he hasn't really been cocky since Rated RKO split and in my opinion that is when he really began to shine. Edge too. I like the bad ass approach that his character has now. He lets his actions do the talking without seling himself on the mic too much. The problem is he hasnt had any defining wins aside from The Rumble since his return. The more he gets punked out the shittier he will become and Im saying this as a huge fan. He needs to beat HHH clean once and for all at The Bash.

 

[Phoenix]

One reason the Legend Killer name was dropped was because the PG alternative was the Legend Destroyer! No doubt that isn't even slightly catchy for a nickname. But I do agree that many guys have multiple nicknames, Triple H, Michaels, Jericho, Rock, Austin. Most nicknames are based on the current gimmick, the Viper suits Orton best because when is the last time he "killed" a legend? The Viper best describes what he does. Nothing like the Rattlesnake issue that's being brought, looking too much into it!

 

[hinkey1]

Mr. 619: Orton wasnt injured when he lost the title in 2008, they simply gave it to HHH at that time. He got injured in a rematch against HHH. As far as the two characters go, he hasn't really been cocky since Rated RKO split and in my opinion that is when he really began to shine. Edge too. I like the bad ass approach that his character has now. He lets his actions do the talking without seling himself on the mic too much. The problem is he hasnt had any defining wins aside from The Rumble since his return. The more he gets punked out the shittier he will become and Im saying this as a huge fan. He needs to beat HHH clean once and for all at The Bash.

Don't take this too personally, but you are among several wrestling fans on the IWC that need to hear this.

RANDY ORTON IS NEVER GOING TO GET A CLEAN WIN OVER TRIPLE H WHILE ORTON IS A HEEL AND TRIPLE H IS A FACE.

If you look at wrestling history, there are only a handful of times when a heel gets a CLEAN win over a HUGE babyface. For instance:
WM VI WARRIROR beats Hogan
WM XXI Kurt Angle beats HBK
BACKLASH The Great Khali beat The Undertaker
And all the times HHH beat HBK from 2002-2004 don't count b/c it was Triple H lol. I can't think of any other instances, please feel free to correct me. OH and WM XIX Trips vs Booker T doesn't count either because of Ric Flair

It is simply how the wrestling business works. Heels have to cheat to win!!! Thats why people hate them, because they cheat!!!!!! I'm not going to explain the concept of babyfaces vs heels to you, I assume you already know that.

 

[matty256]

Don't take this too personally, but you are among several wrestling fans on the IWC that need to hear this.

RANDY ORTON IS NEVER GOING TO GET A CLEAN WIN OVER TRIPLE H WHILE ORTON IS A HEEL AND TRIPLE H IS A FACE.

If you look at wrestling history, there are only a handful of times when a heel gets a CLEAN win over a HUGE babyface. For instance:
WM VI WARRIROR beats Hogan
WM XXI Kurt Angle beats HBK
BACKLASH The Great Khali beat The Undertaker
And all the times HHH beat HBK from 2002-2004 don't count b/c it was Triple H lol. I can't think of any other instances, please feel free to correct me. OH and WM XIX Trips vs Booker T doesn't count either because of Ric Flair

It is simply how the wrestling business works. Heels have to cheat to win!!! Thats why people hate them, because they cheat!!!!!! I'm not going to explain the concept of babyfaces vs heels to you, I assume you already know that.

Sorry dont mean to put you on the spot, but Warrior and Hogan were both face during their match at Wrestlemania.
The Rock also beat Austin clean at Wrestlemania 19 if you remember correctly using 3 rock bottoms. I think Brock is the heel with the most clean win over faces actually lol RVD Hogan Rock and Taker were all beaten clean by a heel Brock Lesnar

 

[LikeABoss13]

I agree, the Legend Killer Randy Orton is better than the lame crap now known as The Viper Randy Orton. Here is the differences between the 2 sides of Randy Orton.

The Legend Killer Side:
1. Randy Orton was moving up in the business and accomplished more by RKOing legends like Shawn Michaels, Mick Foley, Fabulous Moolah, and more.

2. His match with the Undertaker is what I think ended it all for Randy Orton when he hurt his shoulder. The match was good, but once he had pains in his shoulder and left to repair it, he came back as the Legend Killer and once he defeated the Undertaker, he was done with it and never mentioned it anymore as much as he did before.

The Viper Side:
1. He has a gay-look on his face after doing something to his opponent or attacking someone waiting for them to get up so he could punt them in the skull.

2. He has Cody Rhodes and Ted DiBiase, Jr. attack his opponents and help him out. I mean it is helping him, along with Cody and Ted, become bigger heels everytime, but it is also making Randy Orton look weak.

So in my own if these 2 sides of Randy Orton were put in a match together, I believe that The Legend Killer would beat The Viper.

 

[RH23]

To me, the nickname "The Viper" doesn't sound nearly as epic as "The Legend Killer". I think they changed it because of the transition to PG, or because he doesn't necessarily target Legends anymore, unless you count the McMahons.

 

[Cheech 72]

"The Viper" why don't they just call him Supertwink. That's like when WWE called The Undertaker "Booger Red" and "The American Badass. Awful gimmick. I guess they had to change to Viper because there are no more "legends" in the WWE for Orton to kill anymore.

 

[Biggest Triple H Fan Ever]

I think the name change is part of the evolution of the character of Randy Orton. The legend killer was his nickname when he was a young guy trying to become a star. But now, he is an established star who doesn't need to "kill" legends to become a star. Besides, WWE is trying to portray Orton as a psychopath kind of character. A viper is a much fitting nickname right now.

 

[It's...Baylariat!]

The 'Viper' gimmick they've given Randy Orton makes him look and act like some from of sexual predator. It's stupid how he comes out with a look that resembles someone who got finished with some raping and murdering. It doesn't sell anything. It scares children. And it annoys wrestling fans that know he's capable of better.

The 'Legend Killer' was MUCH, much better than his current gimmick. With the "Legend Killer", he could be witty, smart assed, and could still be as dangerous as he is now. The "Legend Killer" had a 'self entitled' personality. The 'Viper' has a 'I'm mentally challenged and only know two words, title and rape' kind of personality. It's not appealing at all and I wish they would scrap the gimmick all together.

Legend Killer gimmick > Viper gimmick.

 

[RKOking]

I think that Randy Orton should still be the slithering viper but also should go back to being the legend killer, mixing them into one great Cocky maniac heel this would really make him even bigger than he is this psycho Orton that WWE are trying to make him has pushed him really huge but to give back some of the "Legend Killer" would make him the best superstar ever! after all being the legend killer in my eyes is what pushed him through and made the WWE Universe accept him as who he is.

 

[Nev]

The Legend Killer was just used for the WWE to try to make Orton look established and slowly enter the main event scene.

This worked somewhat well, he was still mediocre in his feuds with Taker in 2005, but him in the championship scence briefly in '06 and '07 helped him.

When he won the title in No Mercy he looked like a safe main eventer in my view.

 

[hinkey1]

Sorry dont mean to put you on the spot, but Warrior and Hogan were both face during their match at Wrestlemania.
The Rock also beat Austin clean at Wrestlemania 19 if you remember correctly using 3 rock bottoms. I think Brock is the heel with the most clean win over faces actually lol RVD Hogan Rock and Taker were all beaten clean by a heel Brock Lesnar

No, You sir are incorrect. I wasn't thinking when I wrote the Warrior Hogan, I apologize for that.

BUT. Heyman interfered in Brock's matches against Hogan, Taker, and Rock. And RVD isn't a HUGE babyface, in the minds of WWE management. And the Austin vs. Rock match is another exception, because it was Austin's LAST match.

 

[Doomsday Device]

I miss the Legend Killer days.

Randy was on a mission, obviously to "Kill" all the legends. Kick ass and take names.

He was also in my opinion more athletic and more into it in matches. He was also better on the mic and even dropped some funny promos every now and then.

Now dont get me wrong, The Viper thing is alright. I'll take that instead of nothing. But that "blank stair of doom" like someone mentioned here. I dont know about that. He's like giving less of himself. He's doing less in the ring, literally. That slow walk, less emotion, just stalking his opponent. Now with Dibiase and Rhodes doing the dirty work for him, I dont know.

 

[Southwind]

I miss the Legend Killer days.

Randy was on a mission, obviously to "Kill" all the legends. Kick ass and take names.

He was also in my opinion more athletic and more into it in matches. He was also better on the mic and even dropped some funny promos every now and then.

He still is on a mission to be the WWE Champion at all costs and he actually hurts people (kayfabe) now so isn't he kicking ass and taking names ?

Also the reason he was more athletic in his matches was because the character he was playing out needed that style to compliment him the legend killer gimmick. Was based on brash arrogance while the Viper gimmick is bases on cold cunning ruthlessness to the point of lacking emotions.

See this is a thing I enjoy talking about because most people say Orton is a below average wrestler now but the fact is the Viper gimmick is built for slow boring matches i.e. rest holds and lots of strikes like the stomps he does.

This also applies to his "robotic" promos and ring entrances should a evil emotionless villain that punts helpless opponents as well as RKO'ing and kissing Stephanie Mcmahon really be upbeat and lively in his promos ?

People just don't get that wrestlers like Orton have talent they just can't show it because they have to sell their gimmick. Because Gimmicks are what sells and makes wrestlers it's their identities truth is nobody wants to watch a great match if the competitors gimmick suck sorry but it's true. Randy Orton is and will be great no matter what gimmick he executes.

 

[Sasori]

I think The Legend Killer is much better than the Viper!
When Orton started of he was cocky, smug, arrogant, and smiled, thats much better than, emotionless, boring, and phsycho! Orton was getting over and he had a pretty impresive list of victoms as the Legend Killer! How many legends has he beaten now 20, 25, 23? I don't know but I know he defeated over 20 legends. Anyways when he was the Legend Killer he'd get up all over your face and than spit on it! Now he's a pussy who can't do shit with out Rhodes or Dibiase ( I'm still a huge Orton fan!).

Bottomline Legend Killer > The Viper!

 

[Doomsday Device]

To Southwind

Dont get me wrong I like both styles of Orton.

I have a ton of respect for him.

I remember that promo he did on Carlito back in Unforgiven 2006, I had to rewind that several times because it was so funny.

 

[Kanye South]

But the problem is how many more legends are there for Randy to fuck with. Plus, they've kind of given the gimmick to Chris Jericho if you think about it. Who else can he fight. Jericho already pissed on the legends that can actively compete.

 

[Batistabomb10]

Their trying to make Randy Orton the next Stone Cold Steve Austin? Are we watching the same program? You must be getting some alternate reality broadcast of WWE Programming. If their trying to make anyone into the "next" SCSA, it isn’t Randy Orton, it was John Cena. This is almost as bad as people claiming Batista is the "next" Rock, completely forgetting the fact that he’s isn’t as entertaining in the ring or on the mic, and lacks the key thing the Rock had tons of, charisma, not to mention that Batista doesn’t have a drop of Talent and he’s more like the current Ultimate Warrior.

Back to Legend Killer vs. the Viper. The Legend Killer gimmick was great, but got old quick, due to the fact that watching a new up and comer future star beat the snot out of yester years WWE vets is boring (anyone remember Chris Jericho vs. the Retirement home at WM25? terrible garbage much?) so when it started it was great, but after a year of it, it needed to die.

As for the Viper gimmick, its works fine for Orton, when Triple H isn’t on the program, and Orton can beat down, and attack and physically cripple his opponents (much like a viper snake who is capable of delivering a painful and potentially fatal bite, yeah I wiki'ed that shit)

It’s another tag on his name,

like how Triple H is known as The Game, Cerebral Assassin, the King of Kings, blah blah blah

Or how Sean Michaels is the Heart Break Kid, the Show Stoppa, Mr WrestleMainia
Now when Orton comes out Michael Cole can say "the Legend Killer, The Viper, the Legacy blah blah blah Randy Orton"

I think I’ve made my point

WWE assigns too many nicknames!

As far as the next Stone Cold goes, I don't think WWE is marketing Orton in that direction. I'm more indifferent on the "Viper" gimmick than I'm sure Vince would like me to be.
Furthermore, I don't think the WWE was billing Cena in that direction. I think he was/is being pushed more toward being the replacement for the Rock than Stone Cold. Just my opinion...