The Convolution of the Authority Angle

[Kidpolean]

Bahahahahaha!!!! You're a funny guy.

The Corporate Storyline still had continuity did it not? The Corporation were complete heels and Austin was the face that opposed them.

However I'll do a bit of a breakdown of the McMahon Helmsley faction angle:

- We find out that HHH got Stephanie McMahon drunk and married her which makes it no longer possible for Test and Stephanie to get married.

- Vince McMahon is livid and infuriated along with Shane Mcmahon himself

- Vince gets decimated by HHH in a no holds barred match and Steph reveals that she's happy to be with HHH shortly after Vince Mcmahon loses the match

- Steph explains to her father why she's with HHH and it's apparently to piss him off because of the stunt he pulled by getting Taker to kidnap her that time all because he wanted the belt off of Austin

- Vince McMahon leaves WWE TV for a while out of disgust towards the new Mcmahon-Helmsley alliance.

- HHH continues his ongoing feuds with The Rock and Mankind

- Gets Mankind fired after a Pink Slip Ladder Match

- Rock starts a revolt by threatening to walk out with all of their wrestlers

- Foley gets reinstated and later becomes Cactus Jack after weeks of HHH poking fun at him while The Rock juggles a feud with Big Show while still feuding with HHH...None of it gets lost in the shuffle either

- Meanwhile Cactus Jack bring in The Radicalz and HHH gives them tryout matches. The Radicalz get cheated out of all their tryout matches and we find out that they turned against Cactus Jack shortly after because HHH gave them jobs to convince them to do so despite the fact that they lost those "tryout matches". So now Trips has a new team of people doing his bidding.

- Cactus Jack loses to HHH once despite The Rock's interference in the match and loses again in the Hell In A Cell with his job on the line


- The Rock wins The Royal Rumble and still continues to juggle his feuds with HHH and Big Show all the way to Wrestlemania 2000.

- Vince McMahon returns to stop Shane McMahon from interfering in the #1 Contendership match with Rock and Big Show.

- Vince later reveals that he's back to take back his company after watching McMahon-Helmsley reign of terror and reveals he'll be in Rock's Corner.

- After a few family scuffles, Vince McMahon promises Linda he'll "end" this family war at Wrestlemania 2000.

- Vince McMahon turns on the Rock and Linda McMahon as his way of "ending" this.

- Big Show leaves the Main event scene by "going Hollywood" and The McMahon family reveals their plans to stack the deck against The Rock at Backlash with Vince/Steph in Trips' corner and Shane as guest referee.

- Linda reveals she's putting Stone Cold Steve Austin in The Rock's corner to even things out a bit.

- Meanwhile HHH also gets embroiled in a feud over Stephanie Mcmahon's honor with Chris Jericho which Jericho takes advantage of by making it a WWF title match...and winning. HHH goes berserk retcons the match and later beats Jericho in a 6 man tag and a couple weeks before Backlash puts Jericho in a lumberjack match with The Rock. Jericho however was juggling this angle AND an IC title feud with Benoit simultaneously

- Rock wins the title with the help of Austin and Linda at Backlash

- HHH challenges Rock to an Iron Man match at Judgement Day for the title to prove once and for all who the best is. HBK later reveals he'll be refereeing that match

- Once HHH wins The Iron Man Match by Screwjob thanks to Taker returning, Taker becomes a part of the opposition

- Now HHH is juggling a feud with The Rock, Taker, Jericho and eventually Kurt Angle

All of this only takes in account of the Main event related stuff..I.E things involving HHH and The Rock in some way.

The McMahon Helmsley Saga was one of the best developed angles of the Attitude Era due to how much Chris Kreski maintains continuity during his time as a head writer with the storyboards AND a continuity chart. The current Authority angle has already devolved into a convoluted mess because Story arcs and Characters arcs get aborted with no explanation of any kind. So again, cling to that rhetoric about how crazy the AE was but atleast those stories maintained continuity and addressed things as they happened.

Did you read over this before you posted it? I had a family member read this and there exact response was WTF thats doesnt make any sense....and they are absolutely right. That storyline was so ridiculous and over the top that it is laughable that that was your choice to prove people wrong. BTW you failed to mention Test...who for some reason just dissappeared and never fought to get Steph back. HHH and Test never even had a feud.

One storyline doesnt prove anything. I can name PG era storylines that were better than AE era storylines and it woulndt mean anything. My point was that the entire AE was just as screwed up as anything we see on the current product.

Edge and Christian are vampires....wait now there regular people....wait now there kinda funny

Kane's body is burnt and he cant talk...wait he can talk but only with a special device...wait NO he can talk normally and his arms aren't burnt at all....wait neither is his face???

HHH tried to end SCSA career by hitting him with a car....Austin got revenge by flipping HHH's car over with him in it....AND NOW THERE best friends and tag team partners????

I can go on and on and on...Austin and Vince joined forces out of nowhere for absolutely NO reason, Linda had a ridiculous amount of power that was never really explained, Vince gives up his title shot at Mania than allows HBK who is in a lower position in VINCE MCMAHONS COMPANY to give that title shot to to Vince's sworn enemy than Austin fights Vince in a cage because Vince wants the main event spot that he gave up back????? WTF

The AE was full of nonsense but people will blindly defend it. I loved the AE because it was random and made no sense, my problem is that people hate on the current product for the same reason.

 

[Sweettre15]

Did you read over this before you posted it? I had a family member read this and there exact response was WTF thats doesnt make any sense....and they are absolutely right. That storyline was so ridiculous and over the top that it is laughable that that was your choice to prove people wrong. BTW you failed to mention Test...who for some reason just dissappeared and never fought to get Steph back. HHH and Test never even had a feud.

One storyline doesnt prove anything. I can name PG era storylines that were better than AE era storylines and it woulndt mean anything. My point was that the entire AE was just as screwed up as anything we see on the current product.

Edge and Christian are vampires....wait now there regular people....wait now there kinda funny


Kane's body is burnt and he cant talk...wait he can talk but only with a special device...wait NO he can talk normally and his arms aren't burnt at all....wait neither is his face???

HHH tried to end SCSA career by hitting him with a car....Austin got revenge by flipping HHH's car over with him in it....AND NOW THERE best friends and tag team partners????

I can go on and on and on...Austin and Vince joined forces out of nowhere for absolutely NO reason, Linda had a ridiculous amount of power that was never really explained, Vince gives up his title shot at Mania than allows HBK who is in a lower position in VINCE MCMAHONS COMPANY to give that title shot to to Vince's sworn enemy than Austin fights Vince in a cage because Vince wants the main event spot that he gave up back????? WTF

The AE was full of nonsense but people will blindly defend it. I loved the AE because it was random and made no sense, my problem is that people hate on the current product for the same reason.[/Quote]

- Edge and Christian were only "Psedo-Vampires" and not ACTUAL vampires within the context of the gimmick. That's why those two were able to abort the gimmick when they turned against Gangrel and Gangrel had the Hardys as "The New Brood". Edge even described them as such in his retirement promo.

- Austin was willing to resort to anything to beat Rock at WM17 and that was even implied when Austin said "I NEED to beat you" etc

- Regarding HHH and Austin's rivalry, which culminated at the Three Stages of Hell, They likely were putting their differences aside to do Vince's bidding.

- Linda Mcmahon was CEO at the time while Vince was "chairman" but with no real mentions of if he was on The Board of Directors at the time.

- In Test's case, I remember him getting a match with HHH and winning by screwjob but HHH retaliating by getting him injured and Test ending up embroiled in a feud with Big Bossman before getting a complete repackaging as a part of a heel tag team. Plus, seeing as how Stephanie was HAPPY to be with HHH, I'm sure Test didnt think it was worth it to pursue the issue any longer.

- The Shawn Michaels thing was actually explained here: http://youtu.be/jJ3cKE-jhHI

One storyline doesnt prove anything. I can name PG era storylines that were better than AE era storylines and it woulndt mean anything. My point was that the entire AE was just as screwed up as anything we see on the current product.

Did the Heels constantly try to play to the crowd one day and be full heels the next day? No

Did the Heel Authority figures constantly emasculate their heel champion? No

Were storylines just aborted every 2 weeks? No

Were Character progressions just flat out dropped during the same storyline? No

Until the story arc/character arcs were concluded, the characters didnt just flip-flop every other episode with their alignment...When "Swerves" happened the swerve became the status quo until booked and said otherwise.

You keep saying AE was a crazy time because of the overbooking in the 98 and 99 time frame but ultimately it worked because the AE ran on an "anything can happen" type atmosphere while the PG Era DOES NOT.

 

[laodaron]

Did the Heels constantly try to play to the crowd one day and be full heels the next day? Yes.

Did the Heel Authority figures constantly emasculate their heel champion? Yes.

Were storylines just aborted every 2 weeks? Yes

Were Character progressions just flat out dropped during the same storyline? (This is a made up thing that doesn't exist)

 

[Sweettre15]

Did the Heels constantly try to play to the crowd one day and be full heels the next day? Yes.

Did the Heel Authority figures constantly emasculate their heel champion? Yes.

Were storylines just aborted every 2 weeks? Yes

Were Character progressions just flat out dropped during the same storyline? (This is a made up thing that doesn't exist)

Wait, Vince wasnt constantly telling Rock how inept he was in the Attitude Era, HHH wasnt getting berated on a weekly basis in the Attitude Era and the time when Mick Foley was treated like crap it actually lead to a face turn.

When Stephanie Mcmahon heel turned to a spoiled ****, she didnt just magically revert to a sweet girl the next day and then return to spoiled ****.

When The Rock turned face after leaving The Corporation, he didnt just act like a face when it was convenient and become a heel on the other days........

So what the hell are you talking about?

 

[Kidpolean]

Did the Heels constantly try to play to the crowd one day and be full heels the next day? No

Did the Heel Authority figures constantly emasculate their heel champion? No

Were storylines just aborted every 2 weeks? No

Were Character progressions just flat out dropped during the same storyline? No

Until the story arc/character arcs were concluded, the characters didnt just flip-flop every other episode with their alignment...When "Swerves" happened the swerve became the status quo until booked and said otherwise.

You keep saying AE was a crazy time and whatever but ultimately it worked because the AE ran on an "anything can happen" type atmosphere while the PG Era DOES NOT.

1.Did the Heels constantly try to play to the crowd one day and be full heels the next day?

Who is flip flopping? HHH and Steph have been heels the entire time. Orton is a heel, DB is a face...when did anybody do a legit (they Wyatt thing wasnt a true heel turn) heel or face turn? HHH doing things to piss off his Champion is not being a face. He is sarcastic the majority of the time.

2. Were storylines just aborted every 2 weeks? umm one word...TEST

3.Were Character progressions just flat out dropped during the same storyline? Once again...TEST

4.Did the Heel Authority figures constantly emasculate their heel champion? Austin heel turn is a pretty good example of this

AE ran on an "anything can happen" type atmosphere while the PG Era DOES NOT....So if the PG era just starts doing random shit every week in every storyline than this storyline would be ok???

 

[Sweettre15]

1.Did the Heels constantly try to play to the crowd one day and be full heels the next day?

Who is flip flopping? HHH and Steph have been heels the entire time. Orton is a heel, DB is a face...when did anybody do a legit (they Wyatt thing wasnt a true heel turn) heel or face turn? HHH doing things to piss off his Champion is not being a face. He is sarcastic the majority of the time.

HHH and Stephanie are flip-flopping. Originally they were trying to stifle dissension and make the locker room fall in line and eventually HHH says the "Gloves are coming off" after Rhodes Bros won the Tag Titles and acts full heel up until he beats the Big Show. Reverts from this whole "No More Mr.Nice Guy" Thing to kiss Cena's ass the whole feud and completely lays off the Tyrannical antics. Him and Steph berate Orton for going "too far" when he attacked Cena's dad again when before they were clamoring for him to find that old Sadistic Orton that feuded against them in 2009. If you want someone to become sadistic again you dont bury them when they do Sadistic acts.

2. Were storylines just aborted every 2 weeks? umm one word...TEST

3.Were Character progressions just flat out dropped during the same storyline? Once again...TEST

4.Did the Heel Authority figures constantly emasculate their heel champion? Austin heel turn is a pretty good example of this

- I already explained what happened to Test prior to his repackagine and even during the Bossman feud the commentators constantly reminded the audience of what happened between him and Stephanie.

- More like Austin got paranoid and emasculated himself. Vince wanted the old Austin back and even tried to get him to hit him. Eventually though, Austin became his old self again and never looked back. With Orton, he becomes "Sadistic" again, then drops that arc so he can harass Brie Bella, that gets dropped, and now he's CONSTANTLY getting berated and made a fool of while he whines, complains, and ocassionally licks their boot but nothing has come of it yet.

AE ran on an "anything can happen" type atmosphere while the PG Era DOES NOT....So if the PG era just starts doing random shit every week in every storyline than this storyline would be ok???

Not necessarily since even when the AE was "Chaotic" the main storylines were still gradually built up, the heels acted like heels the whole time, and the faces were faces until a heel turn of some kind and they STUCK WITH THE DAMN HEEL TURN UNTIL IT WAS OVER. They didnt act face then act heel then act face again and then act heel....Atleast while Mcmahon was filtering Russo they didnt nor did they when Kreski took over Russo's storylines......until Stephanie took over his storylines and he got demoted.

 

[Kidpolean]

1.Did the Heels constantly try to play to the crowd one day and be full heels the next day?

Who is flip flopping? HHH and Steph have been heels the entire time. Orton is a heel, DB is a face...when did anybody do a legit (they Wyatt thing wasnt a true heel turn) heel or face turn? HHH doing things to piss off his Champion is not being a face. He is sarcastic the majority of the time.



- I already explained what happened to Test prior to his repackagine and even during the Bossman feud the commentators constantly reminded the audience of what happened between him and Stephanie.

- More like Austin got paranoid and emasculated himself. Vince wanted the old Austin back and even tried to get him to hit him. Eventually though, Austin became his old self again and never looked back. With Orton, he becomes "Sadistic" again, then drops that arc so he can harass Brie Bella, that gets dropped, and now he's CONSTANTLY getting berated and made a fool of while he whines, complains, and ocassionally licks their boot but nothing has come of it yet.



Not necessarily since even when the AE was "Chaotic" the main storylines were still gradually built up, the heels acted like heels the whole time, and the faces were faces until a heel turn of some kind and they STUCK WITH THE DAMN HEEL TURN UNTIL IT WAS OVER. They didnt act face then act heel then act face again and then act heel....Atleast while Mcmahon was filtering Russo they didnt nor did they when Kreski took over Russo's storylines......until Stephanie took over his storylines and he got demoted.

I see that you are one of those people that will keep saying dumb stuff just to make yourself right even though you are clearly wrong so I am going to withdraw my self from this discussion because it isnt going anywhere.

To justify Test being left off HIS storyline by saying that Test probably just felt like it wasnt worth it, is the equivalent of me sayiing that HHH plays to the crowd when he is a heel sometimes because he is a having a good day....in another words, its total BS.

You are mad at the current product for random heel/face changes in the middle of a storyline BUT you defend the fact that Test was repackaged in the middle of a crucial storyline? Do you see how you dont make any sense.

BTW...DX was famous for doing the heel one week face the next week thing. Heel DX would always play to the crowd. But you're just going to comeback with some nonsense excuse like DX was always supposed to be tweeners or something dumb like that.

Anyone can make excuses for poor booking and pretend that it makes sense and that is all you have done in this thread.

 

[Sweettre15]

I see that you are one of those people that will keep saying dumb stuff just to make yourself right even though you are clearly wrong so I am going to withdraw my self from this discussion because it isnt going anywhere.

To justify Test being left off HIS storyline by saying that Test probably just felt like it wasnt worth it, is the equivalent of me sayiing that HHH plays to the crowd when he is a heel sometimes because he is a having a good day....in another words, its total BS.

You are mad at the current product for random heel/face changes in the middle of a storyline BUT you defend the fact that Test was repackaged in the middle of a crucial storyline? Do you see how you dont make any sense.

BTW...DX was famous for doing the heel one week face the next week thing. Heel DX would always play to the crowd. But you're just going to comeback with some nonsense excuse like DX was always supposed to be tweeners or something dumb like that.

Anyone can make excuses for poor booking and pretend that it makes sense and that is all you have done in this thread.

Test ended up getting a storyline injury and Steph was HAPPY to be with HHH, so what could he have gained in pursuing the issue after he got a victory over HHH on Raw anyway?

DX didnt act face and heel every other day, they played to the crowd because they were in the roles of the "Cool heels" much like the NWO. THAT is why their act hardly ever changed regardless of their alignment.

 

[The Eighties]

Of course the angle is a fucking mess, Triple H and Steph act like assholes but don't openly do anything beyond being smug and insincere, but the biggest problem is they never get their comeuppance, it's always their puppet champion or The Shield taking the hits.

The whole point of heels, the very art of it, is to sell for faces, it's wrestling 101, Triple H and Steph have verbally ran down Bryan, Show, Orton, Dolph and Miz, so far Big Show got in one punch for 3 months of humiliation, Dolph and Miz got nothing and Bryan has gotten in one running knee and a couple of verbal jabs, nothing has happened to Steph at all.

These type of angles work as a give and take, Vince and Shane were masters at it, they'd get one up on the faces and outnumber them, screw them over etc, but they also take whooping's, they'd stooge, they get humiliated, beer bathed, have the contents of a shitter dumped on them, that's what made it entertaining and an actual rivalry, not this Authority nonsense where they just cut smug, quasi-shoot promos and then fuck off up the ramp without receiving any payback.

 

[JoeFromTomsRiver]

The problem is that we see no end in sight. It's hard to even imagine the Authority "meeting their match" or being compromised in some way. Is Triple H losing a match to Bryan at WM really going to be the one bone the "come-uppance". Only if the stipulation to the match is that if Bryan wins, than Stephanie and Triple H are no longer in charge of running RAW and have to go back the office. IF that happens, then I'll say that this build up has been worth it.

But I think its just as likely that if Triple H and Stephanie think its time to end "The Authority", that it involves Vince taking the keys back from the kids on RAW instead of one of the wrestlers being the one who makes them leave.

 

[occ2]

I don't know what the Attitude Era writing has to do with the topic at hand, other than the beer bath being used as an example of a stupid wrestling angle. Yes, there were stupid storylines during the late 90's/early 00's. Does that fact make this particularly stretch of confusing, bad storytelling any worse? No.

The excuses for "poor booking" have been made by the people defending the current product. Drawing your own conclusions about characters written with the depth of a puddle ("they're only concerned with what is 'best for business!'" "HHH is a smarky CEO!") doesn't make it good writing, because none of that is clear. This is evidenced by the fact that there is a discussion about this in the first place. Nobody questioned what the motives of the Mr McMahon character were. Nobody questioned why The Rock hated Mankind. This is pro wrestling, not French cinema. Subtlety isn't often noticed or appreciated, and while wrestling fans do enjoy surprises, they enjoy more the things that they can predict - that they will get the chance to cheer for the guy they like winning.

The oldest plot in storytelling is still the most effective - the underdog overcomes insurmountable odds to triumph over the villain. You can throw betrayals, surprises, twists and turns in to that story, but the ending is always the same, and that's what people want to see. That's why people freaked out after the Royal Rumble, and that's why they're still turning on the Batista push. WWE did not sabotage their own PPV, cut the balls off of the Orton character and invest what is probably a considerable amount of money in to Batista to advance an Authority/Daniel Bryan storyline - they're trying to change the story people THOUGHT they were telling, and that's why fans are resisting the product. There is no deeper thinking evident here - it's wishy washy characters immersed in fly-by-night, seat of your pants writing, and it makes for a bad story.

 

[laodaron]

^^This is emphatically false. Since Summerslam, every single angle has seemingly involved Daniel Bryan. He's getting the Punk treatment from 2011. He's allowed and being booked into everything. The WWE is telling the same story they've been telling for a good portion of the year now, and that's the underdog overcomes insurmountable odds to triumph over the villain...it's just that with the internet and 24 hour information available, the fans aren't getting their payoff fast enough now. I prefer a long draw out emotional victory over a short burst wasted victory. This writing is brilliant, and it has the smarks in an uproar, which really gets me going.

 

[The AntMan]

.He's getting the Punk treatment from 2011. He's allowed and being booked into everything.

The Punk storyline in 2011 became all about Triple H, Kevin Nash, and John Cena. Instead of Triple H turning heel , proving the red hot babyface right, and putting him over Triple H made Punk out to be a whiner and humbled him at Night of Champions. Triple H played the wise old elder who taught the young guy a lesson. He then proceeded to feud with Kevin Nash, who screwed CM Punk out of the title, and Triple H got the moment of triumph instead.

Meanwhile, Punk was feuding with Johnny Ace, who represented the front office. Yet somehow the guy Vince McMahon, loves, John Cena, gets the match with Ace. Taking the tile off Del Rio didn't mean that much because he wasn't the corporate champion or anything. Punk didn't get to win over Triple H, Nash, or Ace and was a midcard WWE champion until his heel turn.

 

[The AntMan]

People try to act like it's guarantee that all this will make sense in the end but it's not. Drawing attention to these red flags are not a bad thing.