The Biggest Heel in MMA

[Turd Ferguson]

The funny thing about MMA is that it really is in a lot of ways like pro wrestling. Fighters have personalities. Fights between guys with huge grudges against each other sell. People want to see the bad guy lose. Look no further than Michael Bisping. When he fights, I know I want to see the guy lose. He's an asshole. It's why people love the Henderson knockout so much. The KO itself is awesome, but it's also what went into it, which was constant trash talking on TUF from Bisping to Henderson. There was a lot of emotion behind it, and the heel certainly got his comeuppance.

The question I want to pose in this thread is who you guys think the biggest heel in MMA is. The difference between this thread and fighters that you hate is quite simple. There may be fighters who are assholes that people like. This thread is to talk about who you think is the fighter most fans love to hate. Who antagonizes the world of MMA the most from your point of view?

For me, I'm going to go with Anderson Silva. After giving fans exciting fights against the likes of Dan Henderson, Rich Franklin, and Chris Leben, he decides to put on lackluster fights against Patrick Cote, Thales Leites, and Demian Maia. Fans pay a lot of money ($45-55) to see him fight and he doesn't deliver. It's the reason why Chael Sonnen's done a lot of trash talking. He's trying to sell the fight.

Silva doesn't seem to have any real regard for the fans. He gives condescending answers when the fans give him criticism for his bad fights. He knows people pay to see him fight, and he doesn't care if he puts on a terrible performance and an overall waste of time. He hides behind his manager/translator, Ed Soares, when it's very clear that he understands English and how to speak English.

He doesn't have any respect for Dana White. On the UFC 117 Conference Call, when he was asked about Dana saying he'd cut him if he gave another performance like he gave Maia, Silva said that Dana "can say whatever he wants to say".

He doesn't have any respect for his opponents. Look no further than the Demian Maia fight, when he danced around for three rounds, and rather than engage and fight, he went ahead and punched him in the kneecap, to keep himself entertained and amused. He taunted him throughout the fight between his body language and the crap he talked about him. Back when he fought Forrest Griffin, after he rocked him, sending Forrest to the mat, Silva taunted him by offering to help him back up. He doesn't seem to be taking Chael Sonnen seriously at all, when Sonnen represents a very serious threat to him.

He's even taken a huge crap on the media, who still tries to build him up as a nice classy fighter despite all of his antics. During the conference call, after being asked questions designed for a thought-provoking answer, he just answered with a "No." quite a few times.

I think that right now, between his blatant disrespect for the sport, the fans, the media, and even the President of the company, Silva is the biggest heel in MMA. He's an asshole, but he's polarizing. People might be at the point with him now where they'll pay to see his fights for a couple of reasons... to see him put on a show where he's the best striker in MMA, or to see him lose.

 

[IrishCanadian25]

Brilliant thread.

I am not sure why, but several of the fighters Guy lists as "heels" or who are traditionally known as such are guys I like. I actually like Bisping. I am also a huge fan of Josh Koscheck, and will be rooting for him against GSP, not because I don't like GSP, but because I would love to see Koscheck's new blood with the belt that has belonged to GSP for so long.

One guy who comes to mind is Roy Nelson. His first main stream exposure (his fight with Arlovski, though in hindsight would have been big, wasn't at the time) was beaing the guy who beat Kimbo Slice by laying his fat gut on Kimbo and slowly striking him out. He's everything I hate in an athlete - boring, slow, and fat. It's ok to be one of those three things - in wrestling I think Lance Storm (boring at times), old school Undertaker (really slow) and Vader (fat). But never all three. "Big Country" is just such a cock in my book.

More recent was the advent of Jamie Yager. He was a douche on the show - a blowhard and a coward, everything MMA fans HATE. You can be a blowhard and have the guts to back it up, like Chris Leben is finally turning out to be, but Yager is what everyone hates. I don't think he'll be around long enough to be significant, though, so he barely counts.

I despise The Diaz Brothers with a passion. Everytime I watch them fight, they make me think of themain character from the film "Kids." I just wanted to shoot him - and with the Diaz brothers, I am always rooting for a broken jaw so they have to have their jaws wired shut. Is that wrong? (JMT is coming for me...)

Finally, Brock Lesnar. He's a great heel, because 1) he's legit, and 2) he's not supposed to be legit. He's a former pro wrestler, and came in to "real fighting" and has dominated. He's got a mouth on him (less than he used to, but still) and still has a lot of that WWE showmanship in him. He's not a modest guy despite his upbringing. He's a monster. He's the champ. He's the perfect heel.

It's a shame we haven't seen a guy like Tito Ortiz come long. Brash, cocky, arrogant, loves to start shit, but always backed it up. Then, just when you couldn't be more sick of him, along comes the conquering hero (Chuck Liddel) to bash his face in. It was poetry, and it was justice. Ortiz was THE heel in MMA...not sure who will take his place.

 

[Dressler]

Well IC pretty much knocked it on the nose for me with most of who he picked. I think Josh Koscheck is a pretty big Heel in MMA, at least I know he is the #1 Most Hated Fighter In Montreal (See UFC 113). I hated him before the fight, but after the fight I hated him with a passion. I can't wait to see GSP knock his ass out and show why Koscheck is nothing.

Another guy, and this is the guy I could see taking Tito's place, is Brock Lesnar. Like IC pointed out, hes not suppose to be good, he was a WWE Wrestler and now hes the UFC Heavyweight Champ? Like come on, but that's what so fun to watch, fans want to see him get knocked out so they can say "Hey that's right get out of the UFC and back to fake fighting". But hes that good.

If Jamie Yager could of stayed around then I'd say him but I doubt the UFC will be calling his name.

Then theres a combination of Rashad Evans/Rampage Jackson. If you're a Evans fan, you wont hate anyone more then Jackson. If you're a Jackson fan then guess who you're gonna hate? Rashad Evans. Its hard to tell who's the Heel and who's the "Face". Its more of a Heel/Heel type thing, if you like one guy, then you hate the other, and vice versa. To bad there match flunked, in my opinion. But add them to the list.

 

[IrishCanadian25]

Thanks for the post (and the rep) Dressler! Good call. Oh, but "Koscheck is nothing!?" He's not getting a title shot and co-hosting TUF for no reason, you know...

Anyway, here are the issues with Evans and Jackson. First, I think Jackson's work in the A-Team has softened his image a bit. When he was a bad boy back in the day, ok. But he showed a humorous - hell, downright soft side on TUF. Evans is cocky, but again, he backs it up. Plus, having been the underdog TUF winner, I have trouble believeing Rampage will ever be a full on heel.

You want heel heat? Go get me Junie Browning and his fucking brother, provided either of them are not currently 1) in jail, or 2) dead.

 

[INDYjon22]

Well, if we are going with TUF alums such as Browning and Koscheck then I must ponder as to why War Machine John Koppenhaven hasn't been mentioned yet. The dude is a fucking nut and the fans know it. He has all the potential in the world but because of all the stupid things he pulls the fans are against him, big time.

However, as far as the UFC goes, the biggest heel is either Brock Lesnar or Josh Koscheck, no doubt about it. The Sherdog fanboys hate Lesnar because of his wrestling background, but that is overlooked by the fact that the wrestling fans support him greatly. Kos on the other hand just rubs people the wrong way. They don't like his cockyness and like to nit pick things he does. Personally, I like the guy, but the MMA community as a whole does not.

Junie Browning fucking sucks and needs to get locked up for a very long time. If I see him on my television I will change the channel immediately because of how much I hate seeing that piece of trash.

 

[jmt225]

I despise The Diaz Brothers with a passion. Everytime I watch them fight, they make me think of themain character from the film "Kids." I just wanted to shoot him - and with the Diaz brothers, I am always rooting for a broken jaw so they have to have their jaws wired shut. Is that wrong? (JMT is coming for me...)

Lol... no, no. I completely understand why fans hate the Diaz Bros (though I wouldn't compare either of them to that douchebag in Kids).

Anyways, my answer is undoubtedly Josh Koscheck.

First of all, let me say that to be considered one of the biggest heels in MMA, you have to be a great fighter. I mean, if you suck... then why should I really hate you? I know you're not going to be around for long because you keep losing fights, so why should I put some emotional investment into you? I'm just going to sit back and enjoy watching you get your face smashed in once more.

With that said, Josh Koscheck is a great fucking fighter. His wrestling is top notch, his striking has grown light years since his run on the 1st Ultimate Fighter, and he has one of the most powerful overhand rights in the Welterweight Division. He's a very tough man to defeat.

However, Koscheck is a douchebag. Plain and simple. I don't see how anyone could watch the Ultimate Fighter and walk away liking him. He was such an arrogant prick on the show; plus he was a lay 'n pray guy at the time. He literally had zero redeeming qualities.

Once the show was over, he remained his douchey self, reaching the peak in the rematch against Diego Sanchez. The 2nd Diego fight was dreadfully boring. Neither would engage, and nobody landed any good shots or takedowns. Diego was coming off a terrible staff infection the week before, but decided to fight anyway, which explains why he wasn't aggressive as he usually is.

Anyways, a boring fight you can forgive, but when you win that fight by a worthless decision and then proceed to act like you just won the fucking Super Bowl... that shows what type of person you are.

There was one point though where I thought Kos was actually growing up, not just as a fighter but as a person. When he lost the fight to Thiago Alves after taking that on a 3 weeks notice and then fought at the Tribute to the Troops show just a little over a month later, he was very professional about the whole thing, well spoken at both events, and he looked to have gotten some stand-up and improved his all-round game. I was really starting to like the guy a tad bit.

Then the build-up to the Trigg fight happened, and while Kos reminded me of his usual douchey self, since the trash talk was aimed at someone I couldn't stand, I could look past it. However, when he did the same thing to Anthony Johnson, a guy I deeply respect as both a fighter and person, I was back to, "Okay, fuck this guy. I can't wait to see him get his ass kicked." Then of course in the Johnson and Daley fights Kos would overdo on the illegal blows, like Matt Hughes used to do, showing himself to be even more of a punk.

So, yeah.. I think that about covers it. Kos just has a personality that gets under my skin, and his actions only make it worse. And the thing is... he can't help it. That's who he is. It's not an act; it's Josh Koscheck, which is why he is a true heel in my mind, unlike others who just act the way they act (ala Chael Sonnen) to draw in the crowds.

 

[Rude Rick]

Kos is the current master of heelism, but the GOAT heel was Tito. Even after the Coleman v Couture bore, he showed he still had those bastard tactics in him.

 

[ITurnGirlsGay]

Well, if we are going with TUF alums such as Browning and Koscheck then I must ponder as to why War Machine John Koppenhaven hasn't been mentioned yet. The dude is a fucking nut and the fans know it. He has all the potential in the world but because of all the stupid things he pulls the fans are against him, big time.

Fuckin' A, Indy. You'll be getting repped for this. I was reading this thread and thinking, "HOW HAS EVERYONE MISSED FUCKING WAR MACHINE!?!?" Then you came along with the voice of reason.

He's the anti-christ of MMA. I mean, seriously, he's been arrested how many times now for his outrageous and outlandish behavior. He straight up assaulted multiple individuals at his GF's birthday party. He was arrested another time and had to have a spit bag put over his head. He's the only other MMA I know of who's serving a nice term.

Of course, I'd like to throw a name out there that people have left off. Lee Murray. He is currently serving a 10 prison term for his role in a 53 Million Pound armed bank robbery. I'd say that's pretty heelish.


In the UFC, James Toney. He hasn't even fought yet and he's already talking shit about every fighter at the HW division. Honestly, if this were wrestling, Toney would be the character that would turn Lesnar face.

 

[Via Armbar]

I'm actually going to start by diagreeing with Guy. I have a huge amount of hate for Anderson Silva, let that be known first. You listed plenty of reasons in your post and all of them are true. I don't think that in the history of the sport has there been somebody that does so little when they have so much to give. He truly is one of, if not the, best fighter in the world today, possibly ever. Yet, rather than being humble or respectful he mocks not only his oponents but seemingly the fans as well. He hides behind this respectful foreigner gimmick he has given himself but slowly people are seeing past it. The reason I don't consider him the greatest heel in the sport is because he is still a favorite among newer fans. They see his highlight reels on youtube and hear of his unreal technique in the cage. Soon they realize what a lot of other people know: he's a fake clown. Stillm he's a very attractive fighter to fans who are new to the sport.

A couple of months ago I would have said Brock Lesnar without even hesitating. Even in Tito's glory days was he as hated and polarizing as Lesnar was. People legitimately thought that Lesnar was going to be the downfall of the sport. Even after dominate displays against Mir(2), Couture and Herring people still had reasons to write him off. Now, there shouldn't be any surprises here. He seems to be a humble and down to Earth guy until things get a little heated. He says what he thinks and does what he wants. Sometimes those things can rub people the wrong way. The thing that I never understood was how people only talked about him trash talking to Mir after the second fight when it was Mir who did most of the talking. He was respectful to Couture because Randy showed him the same respect. Now we see today and believe it or not, Lesnar has made somewhat of a face turn. In mma. Yes, it is possible apparently. He had the comeback story of the year and showed true heart when many thought he would cower. My oh my, how things can change.

If I'm going to pick a current heel, it would have to be Koscheck. From faking multiple injuries to ignorant trash talk, there are are very few likeable things about the man. He has so much to work with and endless potential and uet he relies on underhanded tactics to worm his way into favorable positions in fights. I need not remind anyone of both the Daley and Rumble fights. I honestly have the feelings that after GSP puts him in his place, he is going to start slipping down the ladder. Hopefully he'll end up on unaired prelims so people don't have to watch him fake another ''illegal knee''.

 

[ITurnGirlsGay]

If I'm going to pick a current heel, it would have to be Koscheck. From faking multiple injuries to ignorant trash talk, there are are very few likeable things about the man. He has so much to work with and endless potential and uet he relies on underhanded tactics to worm his way into favorable positions in fights. I need not remind anyone of both the Daley and Rumble fights. I honestly have the feelings that after GSP puts him in his place, he is going to start slipping down the ladder. Hopefully he'll end up on unaired prelims so people don't have to watch him fake another ''illegal knee''.

I hate Koscheck more than any human being on the planet, but I'm tired of this "knee-gate" bullshit. Who are you to say that knee didn't connect? Provide me with irrefutable proof that Daley's knee didn't land.

Also, even if it was, as most people call it, a "glancing blow," those can be some of the worst blows. They tend to have sharper angles, they tend to connect at more critical points, and they are just overall the blows that leave you wincing in pain.

You cannot say, just like Dana couldn't say, just like NO video that you could possibly look up, that Koscheck faked that injury. If you can find me a video that CLEARLY shows that Koscheck faked that injury, I'll prop you 500 times. If you can't, then you're just speculating. Personally, I think it's disrespectful to accuse any fighter of cheating unless you have CLEAR proof. That's my stand.

 

[Turd Ferguson]

I'm actually going to start by diagreeing with Guy. I have a huge amount of hate for Anderson Silva, let that be known first. You listed plenty of reasons in your post and all of them are true. I don't think that in the history of the sport has there been somebody that does so little when they have so much to give. He truly is one of, if not the, best fighter in the world today, possibly ever. Yet, rather than being humble or respectful he mocks not only his oponents but seemingly the fans as well. He hides behind this respectful foreigner gimmick he has given himself but slowly people are seeing past it. The reason I don't consider him the greatest heel in the sport is because he is still a favorite among newer fans. They see his highlight reels on youtube and hear of his unreal technique in the cage. Soon they realize what a lot of other people know: he's a fake clown. Stillm he's a very attractive fighter to fans who are new to the sport.

With all due respect man... Sure, he's an attractive fighter to newcomers, as long as you don't show them his fights against Patrick Cote, Thales Leites, and Demian Maia. I mean, I'm sure they'll hear about his unreal technique, and see his highlight reels on Youtube. I'm sure they'll also hear about how when he's on his game, he's without a doubt the closest thing we'll have to a Muhammad Ali in MMA.

At the same time though, they'll hear about how he's been lazy and unmotivated. The UFC 117 promo that's been airing on TV, with Sonnen doing nothing but smack-talk, the first half is littered with clips from the Demian Maia fight and how he wouldn't engage. They even have a line from the commentary where Goldie says something like "Why won't Anderson Silva finish it?"

And if anything, where they soon realize he's a fraud... how does that not make him even more heelish?

 

[Via Armbar]

With all due respect man... Sure, he's an attractive fighter to newcomers, as long as you don't show them his fights against Patrick Cote, Thales Leites, and Demian Maia. I mean, I'm sure they'll hear about his unreal technique, and see his highlight reels on Youtube. I'm sure they'll also hear about how when he's on his game, he's without a doubt the closest thing we'll have to a Muhammad Ali in MMA.

What I'm saying is, those probably aren't the first fights they're going to see. I guess it depends on how they get into the sport, but Silva is usually one of the first names new fans get acquainted with. I have a friend who is just starting to get into the sport and his favorite fighter is Silva, because of he's just ''so damn good''. I try to tell him he really is that damn good, but at the same time he's incredibly disrespectful and fake behind the scenes. He hasn't really been around for the backlash of the Cote, Leites and Maia fights. I completely believe though that he'll learn to hate him as I do.

At the same time though, they'll hear about how he's been lazy and unmotivated. The UFC 117 promo that's been airing on TV, with Sonnen doing nothing but smack-talk, the first half is littered with clips from the Demian Maia fight and how he wouldn't engage. They even have a line from the commentary where Goldie says something like "Why won't Anderson Silva finish it?"

They'll hear plenty of things. Until they have paid for the fight and seen his bullshit, they won't truly understand how much of a douche he is. I'm saying it takes time to hate Silva. Nobody hated him after his first shitty performance. Some even forgave the Leites performance after he destroyed Griffin. Not until the Maia fight did many people stand up and call bullshit. Even I, who has disliked Silva for a long time, thought that he had somewhat redeemed himself by showing that he could finish a former champion easily. And in another weight class no less. Then the Maia fight happened. I'm saying that the hate for him isn't immediate like it is with other fighters.

And if anything, where they soon realize he's a fraud... how does that not make him even more heelish?

I'm not saying he won't ever be the biggest heel in the sport. The Sonnen fight will be a big clue as to where things will go with him. Plenty of people are tired of his shit, and he's one or two stupid moves and some really bad press away from the top heel spot. I just don't think he has it yet.

 

[Tha Wolfpac]

Hey Yo!

I really, really hate Charles "Krazy Horse" Bennett, I heard he showed up for TUF tryouts recently and that reminded me of him.

He used to think it was all about him and that he was the shit. To some he was funny, but to me downright disrespectful he was an animal of a human being he make ****** faces at the camera while the ref was talking, he would fucking climb the cage mid fight and try to fucking drop kick his opponnent. Man this guy got done for selling drugs so to me that screams heel. I dont know i just dont like him.

 

[PowerUp5000]

Brilliant thread.

One guy who comes to mind is Roy Nelson. His first main stream exposure (his fight with Arlovski, though in hindsight would have been big, wasn't at the time) was beaing the guy who beat Kimbo Slice by laying his fat gut on Kimbo and slowly striking him out. He's everything I hate in an athlete - boring, slow, and fat. It's ok to be one of those three things - in wrestling I think Lance Storm (boring at times), old school Undertaker (really slow) and Vader (fat). But never all three. "Big Country" is just such a cock in my book.


It's a shame we haven't seen a guy like Tito Ortiz come long. Brash, cocky, arrogant, loves to start shit, but always backed it up. Then, just when you couldn't be more sick of him, along comes the conquering hero (Chuck Liddel) to bash his face in. It was poetry, and it was justice. Ortiz was THE heel in MMA...not sure who will take his place.

These two are my picks and I think IC hit the nail on the head. I'm an old school MMA fan and have watched it since it's inception. I can safely say that nobody made waves like Tito Ortiz when he came along and I agree that it is a shame that another Tito Ortiz hasn't come along. A lot of the guys who talk a lot of shit can't back it up or can only back it up against the right guy. Tito didn't give a shit who you were, he was going to back it up and until Chuck came along he always did. He was definitely the guy you loved to hate more so than anyone else I can recall in the history of MMA. There have been guys like Dan Severn and Tank Abbott who had kind of a heel demeanor, but they were adored by fans. People genuinely hated Ortiz and many still do years after his hey-day which I think is a testament to how much he really fills this role.

Roy "Big County" Nelson. God I hate this guy, LOL! For some reason I can never get away from thinking "Big Country Omelet Smothered in Gravy" when I hear his name or see his face. I did think it was pretty clever when he came out to Weird Al Yankovic's "Fat", but all he was doing was being honest so -10 points there for pointing out the obvious in an A-ttempt at CON-tempt. This guy somehow Forest Gump'ed his way through inexplicably beating people who probably should have beat him. He isn't exactly skilled in any arena, and stated he doesn't particularly have an appealing personality, and his fatness is kind of a slap in the face to the guys who are in shape and work hard to be in shape. Sure, he CAN take a punch, but so could Rocky Balboa and he ended up with brain damage. That was a movie and in real life in the battle of Will vs Skill, Skill generally wins. Not so with this guy. He smothers his opponent with his life raft of a gut like that Big Country Omelet Smothered in Gravy, forcing his opponent into submission which is bogus and makes his opponents look bad, himself look worse, and the sport look like a joke.

 

[ITurnGirlsGay]

Roy "Big County" Nelson. God I hate this guy, LOL! For some reason I can never get away from thinking "Big Country Omelet Smothered in Gravy" when I hear his name or see his face. I did think it was pretty clever when he came out to Weird Al Yankovic's "Fat", but all he was doing was being honest so -10 points there for pointing out the obvious in an A-ttempt at CON-tempt. This guy somehow Forest Gump'ed his way through inexplicably beating people who probably should have beat him. He isn't exactly skilled in any arena, and stated he doesn't particularly have an appealing personality, and his fatness is kind of a slap in the face to the guys who are in shape and work hard to be in shape. Sure, he CAN take a punch, but so could Rocky Balboa and he ended up with brain damage. That was a movie and in real life in the battle of Will vs Skill, Skill generally wins. Not so with this guy. He smothers his opponent with his life raft of a gut like that Big Country Omelet Smothered in Gravy, forcing his opponent into submission which is bogus and makes his opponents look bad, himself look worse, and the sport look like a joke.

I'm really uncertain how a Brazilian Jiu Jitsu black belt forcing his opponents into submission is bullshit. That's sort of what they train to do? Andrei Arlovski has an incredible ground game, he's an International Master of Sports in Sambo. This is the second highest rank you can achieve in Sambo. He's ranked as high as Fedor in Sambo. Essentially, the only rank higher than this is the BJJ equivalent of a Red Belt. Usually only one or two living human beings will hold the rank of Distinguished Master of Sports in Sambo.

That being said, Roy Nelson had Arlovski in a crucifix and was working for a kimura when they were, ******edly, stood up. Do you know how hard it is to gain top position on someone with the submission pedigree of Arlovski regardless of how fat someone is? Here let me explain, Arlovski has NEVER been submitted. That's how good he is. Even the mighty Fedor has been submitted. That stand-up never should have happened and Nelson was GOING to get that Kimura if not some other submission.

Also, Nelson submitted Frank Mir in a grappling match, and Mir is one of the best defensive BJJ practitioners there is.

I get that you want to hate Big Country, but saying that he is unskilled and that him forcing people into submissions is bullshit and bogus is the dumbest thing I've ever seen posted on this thread. It borderlines spamming. You've provided no evidence that he has no skill and really just mocked the guy because he's a bigger dude. Guess what, he can fucking fight. Renzo Gracie doesn't just hand out BJJ Black Belts like they are candy and he awarded one to Roy Nelson. You should learn a thing or two about submission grappling before you dismiss Nelson's submission and ground game as "will" over "skill." It's clear to me that you've never trained diligently in any form of submission grappling if you plan to stick to that statement.