Stop the negativity

[Radical Canadian Goose]

This has probably been done before. I'm sorry if it has. We as the IWC feel the need to dump on every hot angle or story that WWE has going on. We get excited about something then quickly go meh, that's not what I wanted. As a society in whole, we are extremely sensitive, about anything. Oh John Cena said "ass" on tv, let's argue that and get 467 retweets and 1065 Facebook likes.

Examples, from what I have seen recently:

Shane McMahon's return - If you didn't jump out of your seat when the music hit, or chant along with the fans while he was getting ready to speak, then I guess I'm in the minority. The Raw LD on these forums was blazing with excitement. Then they announced that he would be facing Undertaker at WrestleMania. That turned to disgust, and disappointment. I was originally disappointed with the announcement, but I didn't post about the match until 20 hours after the fact, after my high wore off (upon seeing Shane'o Mac on Tv). The critics were out in droves, Shane is 46, Taker is 50. The same critics wanted Taker to face Sting. Don't bring age into it. Let's see how it turns out.

The Social Outcasts - They are a bunch of jobbers. Nothing they do is going to intrigue me. These are comments from posts in these forums. Let's see what they do. They are relevant during Mania season, let's see if it translates to anything important. After all, a lot of posters around here have love for Heath Slater, Curtis Axel and Adam Rose. We thought negative about the New Day as well, and look at them now.

Roman Reigns vs HHH - Well, plain and simple, this feud has been brewing for a year and a bit. Waaaaaahhhh, they are building a new Cena. Yep, that sucks, building a new superstar who could be just like Cena. Cross over appeal, ability to draw a crowd, let's hope that Roman can do it.

Those are 3 recent examples. Let's try to be positive. Come on everyone try to Bolieve in the product. Sorry I had to

 

[FromGlasgow]

I agree I thought this for a while, There appears to be a breed of very sensitive new fans who can never be pleased and b****es about everything.
Getting all offended and upset over comments a hall of famer has made or because someone released a porn movie or inducting a pimp character to the hall of fame or because someone is bleeding in a match just to name a few
Its pro Wrestling its not meant to be taken so seriously.
When they try to make it all politically correct it will take all the fun out of it.

 

[achromat666]

I personally don't feel the need to dump on everything. I personally have no faith in how the WWE books, and how they handle a lot of the talent.

There are certainly positives and negatives to be had but to address your examples first:

--I rather liked Shane's return. I think that the WM match is ridiculous, but being a McMahon there will no doubt be shenanigans. Which is actually kind of my problem with this idea. Nothing to do with Shane, but with Taker. Simply speaking, are we to simply just casually accept the special nature of Taker matches at WM as merely passe? The building of an opponent, the actual choosing of one and the building of the match? If he literally put Shane up against anyone else, I could probably deal with it, but at present this booking is just silly and doesn't seem to help anyone. It just furthers a storyline.

--The Social Outcasts are fine, I don't see them doing anything with the group as every other Slater led group has generally gone nowhere. I like the performers, but they're not going anywhere with the gimmick as is. And I suspect that's just where the WWE want them. Which is sort of a shame for them.

--Roman Reigns vs HHH. I could care less if they were trying to build a new Cena, it's more that Reigns can't handle the crowd. When Cena started getting the boos he addressed it. He dealt with it and went on with his thing. Reigns lacks an essential connection with the crowd and is doing seemingly nothing to remedy it. He's still very stiff on the mic, he's still getting booed routinely and he's overall still not over.

Cena got himself over, as did HHH, Austin and all the other guys that managed to become big main eventers. Reigns needs to find that before he can be said to be the new anything. There a difference between being chosen to be the man and getting over as the man. Roman hasn't done it yet, and that isn't the IWC's fault. That's on the WWE.

Now as for positives...

I like that Ambrose will get a chance to get himself over a WM in a really big singles match for him with Lesnar. It should be a lot of fun to watch.

I really enjoyed the match Owens and Ziggler had, and think they can build around that for solidifying a IC belt division, if they chose to.

I like the Styles/ Jericho thing but I'm curious as to how long it can last. The alliance will no doubt not last for long, but they're good enough workers to make it interesting at least.

I like Charlotte as a heel champ but hope we see another long term program with someone soon. Sasha seems the logical choice, or possibly a triple threat with Becky involved. That would be great.

Very much looking forward to the NXT Dallas show.

See, more positives than negatives.

 

[DirtyJosé]

This has probably been done before. I'm sorry if it has. We as the IWC feel the need to dump on every hot angle or story that WWE has going on. We get excited about something then quickly go meh, that's not what I wanted. As a society in whole, we are extremely sensitive, about anything. Oh John Cena said "ass" on tv, let's argue that and get 467 retweets and 1065 Facebook likes.

As an opening, you are all over the fucking place. You also presume to speak for an entire community, and THAT always goes down well. I get the sentiment you are attempting to express, but it just doesn't take hold. You are expecting coherence and continuity in the expressed opinions of hundreds of thousands of fans (if not more).

Shane McMahon's return - If you didn't jump out of your seat when the music hit, or chant along with the fans while he was getting ready to speak, then I guess I'm in the minority. The Raw LD on these forums was blazing with excitement. Then they announced that he would be facing Undertaker at WrestleMania. That turned to disgust, and disappointment. I was originally disappointed with the announcement, but I didn't post about the match until 20 hours after the fact, after my high wore off (upon seeing Shane'o Mac on Tv). The critics were out in droves, Shane is 46, Taker is 50. The same critics wanted Taker to face Sting. Don't bring age into it. Let's see how it turns out.

Bolded part is you doing the same thing again. I have criticized the Shane/Taker match already and I don't recall ever having asked for Taker/Sting. There goes that theory!

So beyond that, what are you complaining about here? That some people aren't as excited as you are, or at all?

The Social Outcasts - They are a bunch of jobbers. Nothing they do is going to intrigue me. These are comments from posts in these forums. Let's see what they do. They are relevant during Mania season, let's see if it translates to anything important. After all, a lot of posters around here have love for Heath Slater, Curtis Axel and Adam Rose. We thought negative about the New Day as well, and look at them now.

You come back to "let's see what they do", but the problem is that they are on TV often enough that we have indeed already seen what they do. I can understand the point about The New Day, but fan reaction is a part of how The New Day evolved to where they are now.

For someone who cried in the opening about us "in whole" being too sensitive, you sure do care an awful lot about what other people think and say about something you like.

Roman Reigns vs HHH - Well, plain and simple, this feud has been brewing for a year and a bit. Waaaaaahhhh, they are building a new Cena. Yep, that sucks, building a new superstar who could be just like Cena. Cross over appeal, ability to draw a crowd, let's hope that Roman can do it.

What cross over appeal? What do you mean by that? And ability to draw a crowd? Yes, that must be why they pulled in more McMahon Family drama to generate hype for a WM that even people involved in the company are worried is going to flop.

Now, I'm not saying you are wrong for liking Roman. But as much as you are entitled to your opinion, everyone else is to theirs. Which reminds me, what was your point beyond "waaah, some people don't agree with me"?

Those are 3 recent examples. Let's try to be positive. Come on everyone try to Bolieve in the product. Sorry I had to

I get that you are passionate and excited by the product, and that is great. Seriously. Don't let a crusty fuck like me or anyone else take that from you. By the same token, this is an internet forum for the purpose of discussing wrestling and a great manner of things related to it. This is going to include criticism, as it well should.

Again, I'm amused that you and fellow poster FromGlasgow seem to think you are above the sensitivity you claim is a problem when you both openly engage in crying about words people said on the internet about a staged athletic entertainment program. If either of you were as steely as you believed, you wouldn't be here raising a stink.

 

[Sean Valjean]

While a good number of fans are overly negative and can never be pleased no matter what, the WWE has also given plenty of reasons for people to be unsatisfied. They've screwed up so many things in recent years and, more frustratingly, continue to make those same mistakes that it becomes hard to believe in them after a while.

Specific examples include Roman Reigns' disastrous push, the nonsensical booking of the Wyatt Family, The Authority in general, Zack Ryder's burial, the mishandling of some NXT call-ups (Emma, Ascension, Breeze), and the 2014/2015 Royal Rumbles. Broader issues include the constant 50/50 booking, start and stop pushes, and using the same handful of tired methods to tell stories – champions pinned to set up title matches, seeing PPV opponents face each other constantly before their big showdown, or feuds that drag way too long or conclude abruptly.

While WWE objectively does many things right, they do just as much, if not more, things wrong. And years of so many fuck ups has created a very jaded fanbase. We simply don't trust them anymore to not totally blow it. They're essentially guilty until proven innocent. It's truly unfortunate, but they've really brought much of that onto themselves.

On the flip side, this negativity hardly exists with NXT because that promotion is run using the exact opposite philosophies of the main roster. They get things right on a far more consistent basis and because of that, fans can actually trust and have faith in that product. That in turn creates a far more positive vibe. So it is possible to to make haters into believers, as long as the company knows how to please it's fans. WWE at times feels like it's intentionally booking against the fans for no other reason than "We're right, you're wrong"

 

[Radical Canadian Goose]

As an opening, you are all over the fucking place. You also presume to speak for an entire community, and THAT always goes down well. I get the sentiment you are attempting to express, but it just doesn't take hold. You are expecting coherence and continuity in the expressed opinions of hundreds of thousands of fans (if not more).

I was looking for a discussion, I realize we all have opinions. You were quick to negative rep me, I was quick to negative rep you as a repercussion. My point as a sensitive society (myself included)

Bolded part is you doing the same thing again. I have criticized the Shane/Taker match already and I don't recall ever having asked for Taker/Sting. There goes that theory!
Ok, I should have said most critics, not all. Don't try to tell me that most of the community didn't want Sting/Taker.


So beyond that, what are you complaining about here? That some people aren't as excited as you are, or at all?



You come back to "let's see what they do", but the problem is that they are on TV often enough that we have indeed already seen what they do. I can understand the point about The New Day, but fan reaction is a part of how The New Day evolved to where they are now. Hey We agree. Thank you


For someone who cried in the opening about us "in whole" being too sensitive, you sure do care an awful lot about what other people think and say about something you like. Making a point, bud.



What cross over appeal? What do you mean by that? And ability to draw a crowd? Yes, that must be why they pulled in more McMahon Family drama to generate hype for a WM that even people involved in the company are worried is going to flop. Cena is recognizable across the board, these days. He gets worldwide attention. They pulled in more McMahon's because of the lack of Cena

Now, I'm not saying you are wrong for liking Roman. But as much as you are entitled to your opinion, everyone else is to theirs. Which reminds me, what was your point beyond "waaah, some people don't agree with me"?

My point was if Roman is Cena 2.0, let's show the support we did 10 years ago when we thought Cena was the real deal

I get that you are passionate and excited by the product, and that is great. Seriously. Don't let a crusty fuck like me or anyone else take that from you. By the same token, this is an internet forum for the purpose of discussing wrestling and a great manner of things related to it. This is going to include criticism, as it well should.

Again, I'm amused that you and fellow poster FromGlasgow seem to think you are above the sensitivity you claim is a problem when you both openly engage in crying about words people said on the internet about a staged athletic entertainment program. If either of you were as steely as you believed, you wouldn't be here raising a stink.

And that makes you what is wrong with wrestling these days. Appreciate the product and accept that it will never be what we grew up with.

 

[ajdb]

Oh dear, where to begin with this. Well first, "IWC" does not exist anymore. Nearly everyone has an iPhone with internet so everybody has the ability to read dirtsheets. Case in point, people thought nobody would know AJ Styles because he's an "internet darling" and the building exploded when he debuted.

All 3 cases can be explained...reality hits.
Shane McMahon-I was SUPER pumped to see him after the way Vince & Steph have portrayed their relationship with him. (Like a red-headed step-child). Then hearing he's facing the Undertaker popped me again. Then you remember, it's 2016, and that makes us all sad. The reality is that Undertaker is 50, and Shane is 46 and has been in a ring for 7 years. The reality is this is one of main matches at the biggest show of all-time. The reality is that it's another main story revolving around the McMahons which nobody wants after seeing it a million times.
Social Outcasts-People love these guys and they are angry that talented people are thrown into this group. It obvious to anyone with eyes they are only together for the purpose of being jobbers. Each person is very talented and people don't want to watch their talent go to waste in a jobber stable
Roman in general-Roman has not been booked like a champion. People do not want another John Cena because let's been honest the last decade of him at the top has been less than good. Roman is not relatable because he's been handed everything. Most WWE fans cannot relate to that. Roman does not draw crowds. The biggest wrestling show of all-time is being headlined by a guy that 6 weeks out got cheered when he laid bloody and battered by the evil authority figure. It won't get better either with Triple H producing what's more than likely going to be a better show on Friday night, and you know most if not all the people at that show will be at WrestleMania.

 

[BaconBits]

I don't think the IWC is any more or less negative than the Internet fanbase for anything else, really. Go read GTA forums sometime. You'll see what I mean.

 

[Navi]

As long as you give people a platform or soapbox to climb up on they will. I'll do it right now.

For the examples you gave:

I loved the fact that Shane came back. Finally here is one person that can tell Stephanie exactly where to go, how to get there and what to do when she arrives. He's her brother, and can say things to her no one else can. Regarding the match with the Undertaker, I can't see Shane even getting into the ring. He'll like a vintage McMahon find someone else to fight the battle for him, and we'll get one crackerjack of a fight. Hopefully Cena.

The Social Outcasts are the best thing to come along in a long time. They should have started doing this stuff with other roster members a long time ago. Some of the talent is just being wasted sitting in the back. It gives us fresh feuds, and personally I think they're great.

Roman Reigns, well here comes the negative part. I like the guy, always been a Shield mark, but his push is a failure. When someone like Steve Austin says "he's not ready yet" I tend to believe him. After the Rumble last year and the cash in at Mania, Reigns should have been put on the back burner, let the fans come to him organically like they did Ambrose. But they didn't do that and like I've said before some are just tired of seeing him. He's not an underdog no matter how hard they try to portray him as one. Give him his own gimmick, not an old Shield one and let him run with it.

 

[Azane]

I'm actually really psyched for everything going on in WWE and NXT except Roman Reigns right now.

Social Outcasts are interesting, I'm not a fan, but I can appreciate them.

HERE COMES THE MONEY! was the most excited pop I've given since I saw Jericho Pop up on the titantron in 1999

AJ, Austin Aries, KO, the next couple years look to be good.

The "Diva's Revolution" is over now, and we have just solid women wrestlers, with nxt ready to supply us with a whole new cast in the near future.

I will continue crapping over Roman Reigns though, until he can give a promo without spacing out or laughing at his own joke, and his gimmick evolves past "ROMANS SLEEPING!" into a superman punch/spear "OUT OF NOWHERE" - Michael Cole.

I'm even starting to really enjoy the entire WWE Network concept, at first I was really worried about how it would play out, and originally picked it up just to watch PPVs cheap, now I'm finding myself spending ~6 hours a week watching random things on it, and it's really brought my appreciation of the classics up.

 

[dsotm5150]

Go to any forum on the internet youre going to find complaints. Kind of the point of a forum is to voice your opinions. a lot of them are negative but you cant please everybody. Believe me the product could magically transform back to what it was in 98 - 99 and youd still find people complaining about it. Just how it goes.

 

[ilapierre]

As an opening, you are all over the fucking place. You also presume to speak for an entire community, and THAT always goes down well. I get the sentiment you are attempting to express, but it just doesn't take hold. You are expecting coherence and continuity in the expressed opinions of hundreds of thousands of fans (if not more).



Bolded part is you doing the same thing again. I have criticized the Shane/Taker match already and I don't recall ever having asked for Taker/Sting. There goes that theory!

So beyond that, what are you complaining about here? That some people aren't as excited as you are, or at all?



You come back to "let's see what they do", but the problem is that they are on TV often enough that we have indeed already seen what they do. I can understand the point about The New Day, but fan reaction is a part of how The New Day evolved to where they are now.

For someone who cried in the opening about us "in whole" being too sensitive, you sure do care an awful lot about what other people think and say about something you like.



What cross over appeal? What do you mean by that? And ability to draw a crowd? Yes, that must be why they pulled in more McMahon Family drama to generate hype for a WM that even people involved in the company are worried is going to flop.

Now, I'm not saying you are wrong for liking Roman. But as much as you are entitled to your opinion, everyone else is to theirs. Which reminds me, what was your point beyond "waaah, some people don't agree with me"?



I get that you are passionate and excited by the product, and that is great. Seriously. Don't let a crusty fuck like me or anyone else take that from you. By the same token, this is an internet forum for the purpose of discussing wrestling and a great manner of things related to it. This is going to include criticism, as it well should.

Again, I'm amused that you and fellow poster FromGlasgow seem to think you are above the sensitivity you claim is a problem when you both openly engage in crying about words people said on the internet about a staged athletic entertainment program. If either of you were as steely as you believed, you wouldn't be here raising a stink.

It's SquirrelBaby's thing to speak for the whole community when it comes to what he believes. He spoke for us all on the 11 Greatest WWE Legends thread when he claimed Randy Savage wasn't top 11. Then he changed his mind and had the never to claim we all don't think Bret should be there.

There's nothing wrong with people complaining or voicing their frustration. It's what real fans who love the product do when their intelligence is being insulted (mine has been insulted almost indefinitely since 2002-2003). I actually got to the point where I stopped caring and now I only post here about 20 times a year. And I watch even less WWE. It's hard to want to be a fan of a PG product when at least once an evening you have to sit through just another 'this is awesome' chant..Today's younger RAW audiences wouldn't know one thing about awesome.

 

[timothy26]

I'm at a point where I'm probably more passionate about wrestling than I ever have been. This will be the 20th year of me watching wrestling on a weekly basis. As a fan I'm excited about WM, I'm interested to see what happens with Shane vs Undertaker and I think the Lesnar vs Ambrose match should be great too. I'm not sold on Reigns but I still want to see what he can do.

I think this is a very interesting time personally, NXT is a good product and will be strengthened by Nakamura and Austin Aries. AJ Styles and Kevin "Steen" are both in WWE. Who would have thought this 3 or so years ago? It's a great time to be a fan

 

[DirtyJosé]

It took a lot to fix this because Squirrelbaby apparently does not know how to quote.

I was looking for a discussion, I realize we all have opinions. You were quick to negative rep me, I was quick to negative rep you as a repercussion. My point as a sensitive society (myself included)

Please speak for yourself. If you get sensitive about red rep, that's on you. Most normal people don't care enough to bring it up publicly.

Ok, I should have said most critics, not all. Don't try to tell me that most of the community didn't want Sting/Taker.

The funny thing about a community like this is not everyone is speaking all at once. This is why when people try to make sweeping generalizations about what the IWC thinks, they look like a moron. The people who weren't abuzz about it probably didn't do much posting about it.

Hey We agree. Thank you

You might want to read that one again.

Making a point, bud.

The only point you are making is that you are a hypocrite.

What cross over appeal? What do you mean by that?

You still haven't answered this. I love when people say things they don't actually understand.

Cena is recognizable across the board, these days. He gets worldwide attention. They pulled in more McMahon's because of the lack of Cena

What? You mean the guy you said can draw a crowd isn't enough to draw a crowd for Wrestlemania? Lol.

My point was if Roman is Cena 2.0, let's show the support we did 10 years ago when we thought Cena was the real deal

Roman is Cena 2.0, but apparently he needs help (again!) in getting people excited about Wrestlemania, which is only already the biggest WWE event of the year. Yeah.

You just saying he is the next Cena doesn't make it so. By extension, you being a fan of both does not mean that every fan of Cena's is also a fan of Roman.

And being the "next Cena" isn't about just being the top guy; it's about leading the promotion in every aspect the same way Cena has. What you and apparently the WWE haven't learned is that you can't just point at the next guy and say he's the next Cena and then magically have the numbers appear overnight. You have to earn it. Despite his reception now, Cena fucking earned it. People bought the shirts, and bought the shows, and kept watching. Roman won't be the next Cena until he earns those things, not the other way around.

And that makes you what is wrong with wrestling these days. Appreciate the product and accept that it will never be what we grew up with.

My criticisms of wrestling have little or nothing to do with what I thought of wrestling growing up. Truth be told, I like the product better now than I did twenty years ago (there goes another dumb theory of yours, oops!). I can be honest and critical about something I appreciate. That's what well-rounded and thoughtful people do. Only a child or a simpleton requires blind devotion to enjoy anything.

EDIT:

It's what real fans who love the product do when. . .

Get out of here with that fuckshit. If you are a real person and you like watching wrestling, then you are a real fan. No one group owns the product or gets to decide who is an authentic fan or not. Wrestling is far too multi-faceted to be able to break down the people who watch it so simply. If you are really bothered that much by a chant, you are just as sensitive as this guy.

 

[Cats Pajamas]

I hear you about being positive and all that, but… there’s really no excuse for Roman Reigns. I hear a lot of people say they “want to like Reigns” and I guess I’m in that category. I have nothing against him personally or anything, I mean, Joe seems like a nice enough guy…

Right? I mean, come on.

Reigns, however, is just not good. That is to say, he’s not ready yet (check out that optimism). He’s supposed to be a silent badass, I guess? But I think he ought to upgrade to mute badass. (Shhhh... Reigns, no more talking...) Every time they give him a microphone he becomes more and more like Lennie Small from Of Mice and Men.

Spoiler

“I remember about the rabbits, Dean…”

Call it stage fright, bad acting, or inexperience… whatever it is, he looks awkward and sounds funny. What’s worse is that when you surround him with genuine main-event level talent, he brings the whole show down because he simply doesn’t belong there. It’s nothing to do with his designation as Cena 2.0; it has everything to do with him stinking up the place. Pee-yew!

That said, pulling the plug on Reigns at Fastlane would have been a bad idea. You can’t build something for two years just to switch plans a month before. At this stage, you gotta dance with the one who brung ya. Give this whole ugly saga a proper ending, which it deserves. Just please don’t plan next year’s Mania around Reigns.

Tl;dr: Yes, be positive. Roman Reigns sucks though

 

[Mighty NorCal]

Cross over appeal, ability to draw a crowd, let's hope that Roman can do it.

Those are 3 recent examples. Let's try to be positive. Come on everyone try to Bolieve in the product. Sorry I had to

He actually quite clearly has just the opposite of cross-over appeal.




Wrestling Forums are a generally negative place. This draw upon many factors. Its is up to ones own self to separate negativity with valid observations with people who are unrealistic and will never be satisfied.


In the end, anyone who gives their hard earned money to WWE has the right to complain if they don't like something.

 

[whoopin' ass]

Being positive and ignoring the negative is called denial. Yeah, i like it when Rock or Austin appear on Raw but at the same time i know they are just there to sell a crappy storyline that isn't going to work out well. Think back to last year and the Rumble - did your excitement about seeing the Rock appear exceed your disappointment that Regins won the Rumble and was going on to Mania? That's the problem with wwe - there are good things you can find but for every good thing you find there are 3 bad things that make you go "wtf?" and make you want to stop watching the product. That's why there is negativity. You can't say the product is great just because you find a few things you like - the majority of the product sucks so it gets talked about in a negative way because what else can you say about a crappy show?