Sell me on the NEXUS. (or don't)

[Reddannihilation]

DISCLAIMER: I'm quite aware this is the WWE vs. TNA section, however I do not want this to devolve into "TNA Sux" vs. "WWE Sux". Arguments like that have their place, it isn't here. This thread solely about offering your opinions on the NEXUS angle and evaluating each member of the group.

Note: the reason this is posted in the Vs. section is due to the NEXUS angle constantly being brought up as a reason to watch the WWE over TNA. As such I feel this thread is appropriate for this section. If moderators disagree I am happy for it to be moved to whichever section they prefer.

So with that out of the way, the idea behind this thread is too look at what is supposedly "the best faction/storyline in the WWE today" and evaluate each member and then offer an opinion on why they're worth watching, or alternately not worth watching. As an avid TNA fan I am quite aware that I have a bias towards TNA, that being said I feel that comparisons to TNA are unneccesary, it's not my intention. So with that out of the way, I hereby declare that I look at the NEXUS from a critical stand point, however I still wish to evaluate them in the hopes it will generate constructive discussion between WWE and TNA fans. Without further ado my evaluation of the NEXUS:

Wade Barrett: Wade Barrett has been pegged as the "future star" of the NEXUS. I don't doubt that he'll probably be a main eventer but that doesn't mean he's actually any good. From the few FCW matches and his entire time in the WWE from NXT to RAW I've not seen a single Barrett match I'd call above average. In terms of mobility Barrett's a pretty standard big guy, he's not as slow moving as guys like Khali and Big Show, in all honesty he's a slower Matt Morgan.

Similarly, Barrett is often commended for his mic. skills. I'll give Wade one point, he's a competent public speaker. But there's a huge difference between a confident public speaker and being could at cutting promo's. Every promo I've seen from Barrett has been a monotonous, by the books, heel promo. He's got no emotion, he's pretty much limited to "I'm Wade Barret, I don't like this, I'm gonna do something about it". I've yet see him come anywhere near the level he's claimed to be at. So for me Wade Barrett s little more than a mid-carder at this point. He's certainly got a long way to go before he's main event level. And his current abilities don't suggest that he's worthy of the praise he's been getting.

Michael Tarver: Michael Tarver is someone who hasn't really been able to display much in ring work. He had fuck all matches on NXT before he got given the boot. But I will say this, of the entire NEXUS group he's got the best mic. skill. The fit he threw when he was eliminated from NXT had real emotion to it, he talked about being held back, he said he was better than everyone. The man is a promo machine. As it stands right now I'd say he's the best of the bunch, granted I don't think he's been given nearly enough time to showcase his ring skill (if he has any).

Skip Sheffield: This guys just terrible, he's your standard power guy. A young Batista would be my best comparison. He's a total borefest in the ring and his mic. skills leave much to be desired, if anyone can explain what this guy has that separates him from any other roid-freak I'd love to hear it.

David Otunga: David Otunga is like a worse Barrett, he's on Sheffield's level when it comes to in-ring ability. And he much like Barrett is a confident public speaker but absolutely useless at conveying any level of emotion in his promo's. The upside to Davd Otunga is?

Darren Young: Average in-ring talent. Nothing notable about him and completely lacking in personality.

Heath Slater: See Darren Young.

Justin Gabriel: Justin Gabriel is the absolute worst of the bunch. He has no personality and for the people claiming he's good in the ring, I call bullshit. Justin Gabriel is a poor man's Austin Aries. In fact he's not a poor man's Austin Aries he's a homeless man's Austin Aries. Justin Gabriel is a high flier and he's slow as all hell. The whole purpose of high flying wrestlers is that they can move fast, their finishers are quick. To quote the old phrase "blink and you'll miss it" that's how a high-flier is supposed to be. Instead Justin Gabriel moves around the ring like a marginally quicker Matt Hardy. He takes about half an hour to set up the 450 splash and it's blatantly clear he's not at all confident in his ability to hit the move accurately. Paul London, never stalled for time when he hit the 450, neither did Juventud Guerrera, Austin Aries or AJ Styles. Justin Gabriel is a terrible wrestler and a mannequin on the mic.

So that's my evaluation of the NEXUS. Once again, I'm quite aware I view them negativley and do hold bias against the group. However, I'm willing to hear arguments against what I've said. If you've got a video or something that contradicts what I've said, I'd love to see it and retract my statement.
All in all, I want you to sell me on the Nexus and convince me that they're worth watching. If you opinion is that they aren't, then I'd love to hear what you feel the faults are. So have at it folks.

Note: If this devloves into a "Well NEXUS is better than TNA cos TNA has old guys" then I'm just gonna ask the mods to close it. Stay on topic.

 

[Ferbian]

There's really not much to do to sell a guy like you onto a storyline that, while you obviously have your stand on it being a fan of a different product, you still try to seem open to it. I shall give it a try, but I'm not counting my chances, because I'm certain you have already made a decision.

Wade Barrett: Wade is definitely the future of this faction, he is after all the winner of the very competition that had them all put against each other. Wade does shine through with the overall "It factor" because that's what he has. He is well build, decent in the ring and a good talker. The average person that WWE seems to be die hard sold on, and I don't blame them. He does ooze a bit of interest whenever he's in the ring, at least to me. Wade has managed to turn me from a guy that liked Bryan Danielson and had big expectations to him, and really weren't that much into any of the others, to a guy that is definitely sold on Wade, and mostly Wade. He has grown to become one of my favorite currently active wrestlers.

Wade shines through in a way that if a casual fan tunes in, the size of him, the way he talks and the all over looks of him just makes him seem like a firm main event wrestler already. When I saw him face to face cutting a promo with John Cena one on one, my first thought was "If this was the first time I watched, Wade would look like the most convincing main event wrestler of the two". That is why people are so high on him, because we all see potential in him, and he backs it up.

There's not really that much I can say about the others, because quite frankly the only one that does shine through to me in any interest is Justin Gabriel, and that's because he shows potential in the ring. He has a bit of stage fright, but can you honestly blame the guy? He's still new to these big crowds, they all are, some just handle it better than others.

Overall the faction just brings something new to WWE, they brought a bit of shock value back to a product that many people were locked and shut with iron chains on when it comes to the opinion that things need to change. WWE gave them change, and the crowd are loving it. WWE is pushing for the future, and they're doing it in a big way by not just creating one star that has the potential to be something big, but to get 8 guys at once over with the crowd, and it's working.

I've said it before, The Nexus just shines through as the current top heel of WWE, RAW to say the least. They're thrown right into a feud with the top face of the whole company. The ball has been passed on to them, and they're showing they can run with it.

Sure overall you could say WWE has done little to build them legitimately outside of NXT, but in the end there's really no need to build them legitimately just yet. WWE are slowly progressing it along, by giving them opportunities to shine together, not separately. Because let's face it, there's no sense a faction of guys that have debuted at equal times, to have one guy pushed over the other. At least not just yet.

So overall, the faction has brought a new fresh breath of air to WWE, as well as being an interesting product of young guys that we are definitely gonna be seeing more of in the future. There's not really much more there can be done to sell you on that. At least not from my perspective.

 

[D-Man]

Know what, I really like this thread. It gives me the opportunity to take a TNA fan that doesn't enjoy an aspect of WWE's programming and state my case as to why they should start enjoying it.

In order to best explain why Nexus is the best faction in pro-wrestling today, we need to break it down in terms of what makes up a great faction.

A Great Name
There's not much more to say about this. The group is a combination of former competitors of the first season of NXT. The name, "Nexus", is a perfect derivative-type spin-off of former contestants on the NXT program.

Unexpected Formation
A faction (especially a heel faction) needs to make an impact on its promotion. There is no point to forming a faction for the purpose of feuding with one competitor in a promotion. The obvious reason behind a faction is for superstars to band together for one common purpose or goal. Nexus has explained their stance on this time and time again. But their faction was completely unexpected and struck with perfect timing. They interfered during the highest rated segment on Raw (the main event match) and showed no discrimination as to who or what they attacked. It left the audience intrigued and scratching our heads, counting the minutes until the following week when they were expected to explain themselves. With all of that transpiring, they instantly drew the interest of the audience into their storyline.

Group Direction
It almost doesn't matter who the members of the group consist of. They're a group of men that serve the purpose of causing anarchy in the WWE's flagship television program. Every week, the audience is on the edge of their seats wondering who the Nexus is going to attack next. They've showed no mercy with anyone, including ring announcers, legends, midcard wrestlers, main eventers, broadcast personnel... these guys just want to destroy everything and you don't know which direction they're coming from. All we know is that they were disgruntled about their position on the NXT program and they were out to gain contracts for the entire first-season cast, but now they just want to take over. And since I care about the safety of my favorite program, this storyline is making me want to watch each week. I'm sure you'd do the same if Impact was threatened by a strong group of mysterious competitors that were showing up at all points of the broadcast and destroying everything in their paths.

Intimidation Factor
This group has yet to lose the upper hand against anyone on the WWE's roster. They've collectively dominated everyone from John Cena, Randy Orton and Edge to Evan Bourne, Justin Roberts, and Yoshi Tatsu. Until Cena formed his Summerslam team, the WWE's individual competitors just didn't have the numbers to take on a group of seven young and hungry superstars. And even now, Cena can't seem to get his team on the same page. It makes me want to watch to see who can possibly stop these men and if Cena's group is up to the task.

Ability to Perform as a Cohesive Unit
Since Nexus formed, I've only seen one instance where these men didn't travel in a group. That was when Wade Barrett faced Edge last week, and we all know that it didn't take long for the rest of the group to get involved. These men completely work as a unit and rely on their numbers game to provide total domination. It's brilliant.

Similarities and Common Goals Between Members
As I mentioned earlier, these guys are all former NXT competitors that initially banded together to get contracts for all its members instead of just the winner, Wade Barrett. Even though these men are inexperienced in a WWE ring, when combined as a cohesive unit, they are completely intimidating. They have evolved into a group that knows its strengths and knows it can take over the WWE in a similar way that the nWo attempted in WCW. Each member has their own advantages and disadvantages, but when grouped together, their flaws are hidden. It just makes you understand how powerful these guys really are on the Raw program.

Unpredictability
Do I even need to explain this? The group has been attacking everyone on the show at any time. They even paid an unexpected visit to the season 2 of NXT and dominated their battle royal. These guys have absolutely no boundaries and keep us on our toes.

Impact on Storylines/Good Booking
The Nexus angle has completely turned the Raw broadcast upside down. They interfered in the middle of a main event match on Raw that was going to determine the future of the WWE championship. A perfectly good storyline was in place until this faction walked in, destroyed everything, and completely changed the direction of the television program. Now, about 75% of the broadcast revolves around them. If this isn't brilliant booking, I don't know what is.

Individual Members
I saw that you broke down the individuals and chopped them down to size. Being that you're a TNA fan, I'll spare you the same ridicule of putting all of your roster members under the microscope since I'd be here all day. Instead, I'll counteract your arguments with my opinions.

Wade Barrett: Wade Barrett has been pegged as the "future star" of the NEXUS. I don't doubt that he'll probably be a main eventer but that doesn't mean he's actually any good. From the few FCW matches and his entire time in the WWE from NXT to RAW I've not seen a single Barrett match I'd call above average. In terms of mobility Barrett's a pretty standard big guy, he's not as slow moving as guys like Khali and Big Show, in all honesty he's a slower Matt Morgan.

First of all, up until this past Monday night against Edge, Barrett's matches have only been against rookies or undercarders. What kind of matches do you expect for him to put on with them? No one is saying that just because he's in Nexus that he's the next Shawn Michaels. He is the total package because he's well above average in every element that makes up a superior pro-wrestler.

Similarly, Barrett is often commended for his mic. skills. I'll give Wade one point, he's a competent public speaker. But there's a huge difference between a confident public speaker and being could at cutting promo's. Every promo I've seen from Barrett has been a monotonous, by the books, heel promo. He's got no emotion, he's pretty much limited to "I'm Wade Barret, I don't like this, I'm gonna do something about it". I've yet see him come anywhere near the level he's claimed to be at. So for me Wade Barrett s little more than a mid-carder at this point. He's certainly got a long way to go before he's main event level. And his current abilities don't suggest that he's worthy of the praise he's been getting.

I love when the IWC does this. They say, "That wrestler shows no emotion when they cut promos. Therefore, they're boring and they suck." What an ignorant point of view. Face it... he's a HEEL. He's supposed to be sinister, to the point, and anything but catchy with the audience. He's an ass hole and gives the audience no reason to like him. And considering the fact that you don't like him pretty sums up that he's performing his job to a tee. As for his in-ring skill, I think he did a pretty great job with Edge on Monday. Sure, he slightly botched his finisher with Mark Henry, but that doesn't mean he sucks in the ring. He did a great job of still making the finisher work with Henry. Besides, you try lifting a 450lb man on your shoulders and flipping him onto his back.

Michael Tarver: Michael Tarver is someone who hasn't really been able to display much in ring work. He had fuck all matches on NXT before he got given the boot. But I will say this, of the entire NEXUS group he's got the best mic. skill. The fit he threw when he was eliminated from NXT had real emotion to it, he talked about being held back, he said he was better than everyone. The man is a promo machine. As it stands right now I'd say he's the best of the bunch, granted I don't think he's been given nearly enough time to showcase his ring skill (if he has any).

Ok, so since this guy pulled a temper tantrum once and showed (what you consider to be) emotion, that automatically makes him a great heel? Listen, you're on the right track with it all but I don't think you're fully grasping what makes up a great heel. Its a combination of different elements that, when combined together, make a spark.

That being said, I agree that Tarver has pulled a complete 180 in the way her portrays himself on television. He was voted off NXT because he was terribly forgettable and now he's anything but. The guy is cutting great promos, showing a mean streak, and is moving himself to the forefront of Nexus. But he's no Wade Barrett. Wade has shown his incredible promo skills time and time again both on Raw and when he was in NXT.

Skip Sheffield: This guys just terrible, he's your standard power guy. A young Batista would be my best comparison. He's a total borefest in the ring and his mic. skills leave much to be desired, if anyone can explain what this guy has that separates him from any other roid-freak I'd love to hear it.

Every faction needs muscle. Sheffield is perfect for that role. When he squared off with Mark Henry during the six-man tag last Monday, the crowd popped. That means they see it but you don't.

David Otunga: David Otunga is like a worse Barrett, he's on Sheffield's level when it comes to in-ring ability. And he much like Barrett is a confident public speaker but absolutely useless at conveying any level of emotion in his promo's. The upside to Davd Otunga is?

Yes, Otunga has been poor in the ring. But his look is incredible, he's got mainstream star power, and he's always shown impressive promo skills. Check out his stuff in NXT and you'll see everything you need to see here.

Darren Young: Average in-ring talent. Nothing notable about him and completely lacking in personality.

Heath Slater: See Darren Young.

Agreed on both. However, not every faction is PERFECT. These guys provide the group with more numbers. And as I've explained, their numbers game is their #1 asset.

Justin Gabriel: Justin Gabriel is the absolute worst of the bunch. He has no personality and for the people claiming he's good in the ring, I call bullshit. Justin Gabriel is a poor man's Austin Aries. In fact he's not a poor man's Austin Aries he's a homeless man's Austin Aries. Justin Gabriel is a high flier and he's slow as all hell. The whole purpose of high flying wrestlers is that they can move fast, their finishers are quick. To quote the old phrase "blink and you'll miss it" that's how a high-flier is supposed to be. Instead Justin Gabriel moves around the ring like a marginally quicker Matt Hardy. He takes about half an hour to set up the 450 splash and it's blatantly clear he's not at all confident in his ability to hit the move accurately.

WHOA, WHOA, WHOA...

First of all, Randy Savage was considered a high-flyer. Did he go by the "blink and you'll miss it" moniker that you're explaining? How about Christian? Edge? Ricky Steamboat? Owen Hart? All of these men were considered to high-fliers. Just because YOU want to see something different from them doesn't mean that we should dismiss their persona and moveset.

A high-flyer is a wrestler who uses high-impact, airborne moves as their most effective moveset. And Justin Gabriel was pigeon-holed into that category by the IWC and audience because he has ONE MOVE in his arsenal that defines the characteristic... the 450 Splash. And what makes you think he "takes a half-hour to set it up?" Ever since he turned heel, when he sets up the move, he stares at his victim with a scowl before jumping. That's just him acting like a heel and it works for him. And how does it suck when a two-hundred-something-pound man that's doing a front flip over 15-feet in the air on top of another human being takes longer than three seconds to set it up? Give me a break, man.



So, hopefully you're convinced now.

 

[Reddannihilation]

Firstly I'd like to say that the two responses so far were what I had hoped for; arguments that offer perspective.

That being sai

Know what, I really like this thread. It gives me the opportunity to take a TNA fan that doesn't enjoy an aspect of WWE's programming and state my case as to why they should start enjoying it.

In order to best explain why Nexus is the best faction in pro-wrestling today, we need to break it down in terms of what makes up a great faction.

A Great Name
There's not much more to say about this. The group is a combination of former competitors of the first season of NXT. The name, "Nexus", is a perfect derivative-type spin-off of former contestants on the NXT program.

Unexpected Formation
A faction (especially a heel faction) needs to make an impact on its promotion. There is no point to forming a faction for the purpose of feuding with one competitor in a promotion. The obvious reason behind a faction is for superstars to band together for one common purpose or goal. Nexus has explained their stance on this time and time again. But their faction was completely unexpected and struck with perfect timing. They interfered during the highest rated segment on Raw (the main event match) and showed no discrimination as to who or what they attacked. It left the audience intrigued and scratching our heads, counting the minutes until the following week when they were expected to explain themselves. With all of that transpiring, they instantly drew the interest of the audience into their storyline.

Group Direction
It almost doesn't matter who the members of the group consist of. They're a group of men that serve the purpose of causing anarchy in the WWE's flagship television program. Every week, the audience is on the edge of their seats wondering who the Nexus is going to attack next. They've showed no mercy with anyone, including ring announcers, legends, midcard wrestlers, main eventers, broadcast personnel... these guys just want to destroy everything and you don't know which direction they're coming from. All we know is that they were disgruntled about their position on the NXT program and they were out to gain contracts for the entire first-season cast, but now they just want to take over. And since I care about the safety of my favorite program, this storyline is making me want to watch each week. I'm sure you'd do the same if Impact was threatened by a strong group of mysterious competitors that were showing up at all points of the broadcast and destroying everything in their paths.

Intimidation Factor
This group has yet to lose the upper hand against anyone on the WWE's roster. They've collectively dominated everyone from John Cena, Randy Orton and Edge to Evan Bourne, Justin Roberts, and Yoshi Tatsu. Until Cena former his Summerslam team, the WWE's individual competitors just didn't have the numbers to take on a group of seven young and hungry superstars. And even now, Cena can't seem to get his team on the same page. It makes me want to watch to see who can possibly stop these men and if Cena's group is up to the task.

Ability to Perform as a Cohesive Unit
Since Nexus formed, I've only seen one instance where these men didn't travel in a group. That was when Wade Barrett faced Edge last week, and we all know that it didn't take long for the rest of the group to get involved. These men completely work as a unit and rely on their numbers game to provide total domination. It's brilliant.

Similarities and Common Goals Between Members
As I mentioned earlier, these guys are all former NXT competitors that initially banded together to get contracts for all its members instead of just the winner, Wade Barrett. Even though these men are inexperienced in a WWE ring, when combined as a cohesive unit, they are completely intimidating. They have evolved into a group that knows its strengths and knows it can take over the WWE in a similar way that the nWo attempted in WCW. Each member has their own advantages and disadvantages, but when grouped together, their flaws are hidden. It just makes you understand how powerful these guys really are on the Raw program.

Unpredictability
Do I even need to explain this? The group has been attacking everyone on the show at any time. They even paid an unexpected visit to the season 2 of NXT and dominated their battle royal. These guys have absolutely no boundaries and keep us on our toes.

Impact on Storylines/Good Booking
The Nexus angle has completely turned the Raw broadcast upside down. They interfered in the middle of a main event match on Raw that was going to determine the future of the WWE championship. A perfectly good storyline was in place until this faction walked in, destroyed everything, and completely changed the direction of the television program. Now, about 75% of the broadcast revolves around them. If this isn't brilliant booking, I don't know what is.

Now this I'll give you the booking has been good. They're a well booked faction for the most part. Although personally I felt their formation needed to go further in depth as half of them left NXT on good terms with their pro's and it seemed odd that they'd suddenly got pissed off. My best example being Gabriel who never so much as question Matt Hardy during NXT.

Individual Members
I saw that you broke down the individuals and chopped them down to size. Being that you're a TNA fan, I'll spare you the same ridicule of putting all of your roster members under the microscope since I'd be here all day.

You know if you feel like making that another thread I'd be down for it.

First of all, up until this past Monday night against Edge, Barrett's matches have only been against rookies or undercarders. What kind of matches do you expect for him to put on with them? No one is saying that just because he's in Nexus that he's the next Shawn Michaels. He is the total package because he's well above average in every element that makes up a superior pro-wrestler.

You make a good point, save for his match with Edge and Bryan Danielson he's been exclusively fighting green guys. That being said, the amount of praise he gets for his in-ring abilities seems to be unjustified being that so far no one's seen just how far he can go. Which is why I'll consider him a passable wrestler until I see him go up against someone in a match that doesn't end prematurely. But I'll agree the Edge match was good and obviously I'm not looking at Barrett and expecting Kurt Angle, just to clear that up.

I love when the IWC does this. They say, "That wrestler shows no emotion when they cut promos. Therefore, they're boring and they suck." What an ignorant point of view. Face it... he's a HEEL. He's supposed to be sinister, to the point, and anything but catchy with the audience. He's an ass hole and gives the audience no reason to like him. And considering the fact that you don't like him pretty sums up that he's performing his job to a tee.

The thing is, HHH was a heel for a lot of his career. But I still cared about what he had to say. When he belted HBK in the back with a sledge hammer after Summerslam 02, that made me hate HHH, for his actions. I hate Wade Barrett becase he seems like he's reading a script. E.g. When he came out to confront Edge and Jericho and started on his rant about Jericho taking credit for Nexus' work, it didn't seem like he was pissed off. I'm not asking for him to be on the level of an A-list actor but changing the pitch/tone of his voice or the speed of his delievery would've added more to that promo.

Ok, so since this guy pulled a temper tantrum once and showed (what you consider to be) emotion, that automatically makes him a great heel? Listen, you're on the right track with it all but I don't think you're fully grasping what makes up a great heel. Its a combination of different elements that, when combined together, make a spark

That being said, I agree that Tarver has pulled a complete 180 in the way her portrays himself on television. He was voted off NXT because he was terribly forgettable and now he's anything but. The guy is cutting great promos, showing a mean streak, and is moving himself to the forefront of Nexus. But he's no Wade Barrett. Wade has shown his incredible promo skills time and time again both on Raw and when he was in NXT.

See we sort of agree here. The difference is for me, Tarver seems like the only NXT guy who read his lines and then went the extra mile and figured out how he, the person, would say it. That's what makes him the better speaker to me, he makes me think that this is how he legitimately feels.

Every faction needs muscle. Sheffield is perfect for that role. When he squared off with Mark Henry during the six-man tag last Monday, the crowd popped. That means they see it but you don't.

I can see the need for muscle. But he still isn't remotely interesting. Comparing him to Batista again, as they've both been a power factions muscle, something about Sheffield screams "Snitsky, Knox, Heidenreich". For me Sheffield is the second weakest link after Gabriel. But I'll admit that another big guy fits in with your point about intimidation.

Yes, Otunga has been poor in the ring. But his look is incredible, he's got mainstream star power, and he's always shown impressive promo skills. Check out his stuff in NXT and you'll see everything you need to see here.

I don't really consider a reality tv contestant to be a star. To be honest I had never heard of him, but apparently he's well known in America. Again I still think Otunga has a hard time really making people care about him, when he betrayed Cena on RAW months ago, I thought he might've come up with something better than "made an impact". Otunga for me has good speaking skills, but has yet to find a way to communicate his character through them. The less said about his ring work, the better.

Agreed on both. However, not every faction is PERFECT. These guys provide the group with more numbers. And as I've explained, their numbers game is their #1 asset.

Fair call, the numbers do help.

First of all, Randy Savage was considered a high-flyer. Did he go by the "blink and you'll miss it" moniker that you're explaining?

Savage was a very different type of high-flier. Granted I should've been more clear, Justin Gabriel is a cruiser-weight style high-flier. His moveset is more in line with guys like Jeff Hardy, Evan Bourne, etc. A moveset that relies on speed that he just doesn't seem to have.

Just because YOU want to see something different from them doesn't mean that we should dismiss their persona and moveset. A high-flyer is a wrestler who uses high-impact, airborne moves as their most effective moveset. And Justin Gabriel was pigeon-holed into that category by the IWC and audience because he has ONE MOVE in his arsenal that defines the characteristic... the 450 Splash.

I disagree, he wrestles the same way guys like Jeff Hardy do, drop kicks, enzugiri's, spring board splashes, he's certainly not a power guy, a brawler or a technician. He's pretty much exclusive to that whole style. He's a less risky Jeff Hardy.

And what makes you think he "takes a half-hour to set it up?" Ever since he turned heel, when he sets up the move, he stares at his victim with a scowl before jumping. That's just him acting like a heel and it works for him.

No way, I've seen him as a face, I've seen his FCW matches. Yeah he scowls now, before that he just looked like he was on the verge of crying. To me, he seems unconfident in his abilities.

And how does it suck when a two-hundred-something-pound man that's doing a front flip over 15-feet in the air on top of another human being takes longer than three seconds to set it up? Give me a break, man.

I didn't actually say it sucked, so much as I said many a wrestler who utilize that same style do it better than he does. You can say he's been pigeon-holed as a high-flier, that's your opinion. But I'm hard pressed as to what you call a guy who's moveset is heavily reliant on cruiserweight style moves, unless you'd prefer I'd call him a cruiserweight, in which case he's a poor one, because he's far too slow.

So, hopefully you're convinced now.

You haven't convinced me entirely, although I do agree with your analysis of the group as a whole and looking at Slater and Young as nothing more than peons does make me hate them less. I'm still not sold on Barrett's mic. skill, Sheffield or Gabriel though, not sold on Otunga either, unless he's solely used as a mouthpiece in which case he's passable.

Tell you what this has convinced me to watch RAW for the next month to see if my overrall opinion of the group changes.

 

[D-Man]

The thing is, HHH was a heel for a lot of his career. But I still cared about what he had to say. When he belted HBK in the back with a sledge hammer after Summerslam 02, that made me hate HHH, for his actions. I hate Wade Barrett becase he seems like he's reading a script. E.g. When he came out to confront Edge and Jericho and started on his rant about Jericho taking credit for Nexus' work, it didn't seem like he was pissed off. I'm not asking for him to be on the level of an A-list actor but changing the pitch/tone of his voice or the speed of his delievery would've added more to that promo.

He "didn't seem pissed off"? Aren't you being a little picky? He stayed calm, cool, and collective because he's a devious heel that had the entire situation under control. The rest of the faction panicked a bit but Barrett stayed cool because he's the leader and that's what leaders do in those situations.

I don't really consider a reality tv contestant to be a star. To be honest I had never heard of him, but apparently he's well known in America.

He's not just a reality TV star. He's the husband of one of the most famous singers in the world; Jennifer Hudson. She was a platinum music artist, a finalist on American Idol, and an Oscar-Award winning actress. He's much bigger than you think.

Savage was a very different type of high-flier. Granted I should've been more clear, Justin Gabriel is a cruiser-weight style high-flier. His moveset is more in line with guys like Jeff Hardy, Evan Bourne, etc. A moveset that relies on speed that he just doesn't seem to have.

The guy was the former FCW Heavyweight champion. I think that qualifies him as being a good wrestler. You might not have seen it yet, but let's be honest here; how many chances has he really had to shine as of yet? Give it time... this guy is tremendous in the ring.

I disagree, he wrestles the same way guys like Jeff Hardy do, drop kicks, enzugiri's, spring board splashes, he's certainly not a power guy, a brawler or a technician. He's pretty much exclusive to that whole style. He's a less risky Jeff Hardy.

This is the problem with TNA fans. You're all stuck with a completely different mindset of what a "high-flyer" is and should be. You all see Alex Shelly, Amazing Red, Chris Sabin, Suicide, etc and see their over-the-top flippy-flippy, choreographed hurricanrana's and think that's high-flying. Understand that TNA wrestlers have risen the bar on that type of wrestling but that doesn't mean that anyone with an older style is considered to be shit. It means that they don't need to rise up to that death-defying level that you're all accustomed to.

No way, I've seen him as a face, I've seen his FCW matches. Yeah he scowls now, before that he just looked like he was on the verge of crying. To me, he seems unconfident in his abilities.

He's doing a very dangerous move that can seriously injure someone. Shit, even Evan Bourne freezes for a second before the Shooting Star Press. I think that you're just trying too hard to dislike Gabriel so this is your excuse. Stop "assuming" that he's not confident and just take his skillset for what it is.

I didn't actually say it sucked, so much as I said many a wrestler who utilize that same style do it better than he does.

You didn't say he sucked? Read this again:

Justin Gabriel: Justin Gabriel is the absolute worst of the bunch. He has no personality and for the people claiming he's good in the ring, I call bullshit. Justin Gabriel is a poor man's Austin Aries. In fact he's not a poor man's Austin Aries he's a homeless man's Austin Aries. Justin Gabriel is a high flier and he's slow as all hell. The whole purpose of high flying wrestlers is that they can move fast, their finishers are quick. To quote the old phrase "blink and you'll miss it" that's how a high-flier is supposed to be. Instead Justin Gabriel moves around the ring like a marginally quicker Matt Hardy. He takes about half an hour to set up the 450 splash and it's blatantly clear he's not at all confident in his ability to hit the move accurately. Paul London, never stalled for time when he hit the 450, neither did Juventud Guerrera, Austin Aries or AJ Styles. Justin Gabriel is a terrible wrestler and a mannequin on the mic.

Yeah, I'm WAY off the mark.

You can say he's been pigeon-holed as a high-flier, that's your opinion. But I'm hard pressed as to what you call a guy who's moveset is heavily reliant on cruiserweight style moves, unless you'd prefer I'd call him a cruiserweight, in which case he's a poor one, because he's far too slow.

He's barely a Cruiserweight. He's billed at 215lbs so he barely makes the weight mark. The guy is in the heavyweight class and has a polished moveset. Enziguiri's and dropkicks are normal moves these days. You can't shove him into your version of a category because it's convenience to your argument. That's unfair.

Tell you what this has convinced me to watch RAW for the next month to see if my overrall opinion of the group changes.

Then my work here is done

 

[Tastycles]

The guy was the former FCW Heavyweight champion. I think that qualifies him as being a good wrestler.

...

Anyway, on to my point. I'm by no means a TNA fan, but the absolute drivel that people are speaking about NXT is seriously giving me thoughts like "maybe Jesse Neal isn't being cheered ironically."

The Nexus storyline is original...ish and it was certainly unexpected, but that really doesn't mean its good. There are three people who have shone in the angle - Tarver, Otunga and Barrett. The reason they have done so is because a) they're the only three that are remotely ungeneric and b) they're the only ones who own the microphone. However, the real reason these three are getting focus is because they're the only three who have had any semblance of continuity.

The WWE spent an hour a week for about three months desperate to get these guys over, and just when it was working, they pulled the rug. You don't see Slater and Gabriel doing anything because they are not the characters the crowd are familiar with any more. Sheffield is in a similar boat, but being the only one bigger than me, he has had a bit more of a central role.

The problem is what is probably also its success. There are too many of them. That means a beat down takes forever, a promo takes forever. I like the story as a whole, I think, and I certainly think its brought the best out of the rest of the roster, but whenever NExus are on screen themselves, I switch off. I probably wouldn't remove it from the show, but I can't sell it to you, because I'm not buying it myself.

 

[D-Man]

...

Tasty, Tasty... I love ya to death, but man is this part of your post ignorant. So if your little pictures are to prove your point, are you also saying we should discredit the WWE's version of the World Heavyweight Championship since this man held it?

Anyway, onto the subject at hand...

The Nexus storyline is original...ish and it was certainly unexpected, but that really doesn't mean its good. There are three people who have shone in the angle - Tarver, Otunga and Barrett. The reason they have done so is because a) they're the only three that are remotely ungeneric and b) they're the only ones who own the microphone. However, the real reason these three are getting focus is because they're the only three who have had any semblance of continuity.

The WWE spent an hour a week for about three months desperate to get these guys over, and just when it was working, they pulled the rug. You don't see Slater and Gabriel doing anything because they are not the characters the crowd are familiar with any more. Sheffield is in a similar boat, but being the only one bigger than me, he has had a bit more of a central role.

The problem is what is probably also its success. There are too many of them. That means a beat down takes forever, a promo takes forever. I like the story as a whole, I think, and I certainly think its brought the best out of the rest of the roster, but whenever NExus are on screen themselves, I switch off. I probably wouldn't remove it from the show, but I can't sell it to you, because I'm not buying it myself.

As for the rest of this, I can agree and disagree. But first, let me state that I don't believe anyone said that Nexus is a great faction because it's full of seven men who ALL cut promos like The Rock, wrestle like Ricky Steamboat, and look like John Morrison. I find it absurd that everyone feels that breaking the members of the faction down, one-by-one, is going to prove anything.

What makes Nexus so successful is exactly what Tasty mentioned... its numbers game. If you take seven pro-wrestling superstars, put them together, book them to dominate everyone, give them a common goal and more than one mouthpiece, you're giving the audience a good amount of entertainment from a successful group of antagonists.

 

[Tastycles]

I'm not saying that someone shit being a champion belittles the title, I don't think it makes a difference. You said that Justin Gabriel was a good wrestler because he won the FCW title, which is a flawed premise, and I was showing that with pictures of people who have won that title, but who aren't good wrestlers.

You are suggesting that I said he isn't a good wrestler because he has won the title, which is wrong.

Back on topic, I think Nexus needed the numbers game to get established, but I think it would both solidify them, and make them look more vicious to have them turn on, and eject, one of their shit members. Heath Slater would be the primary candidate for this sort of thing.

The one thing I will say about the angle is that, for the time being, they've kept it simple. When you start bringing in higher powers etc, is when the whole thing TNAs in your face. The moment that they lose the focus as being guys trying to get heard, this thing will nose dive into the toilet. I suppose I'm Nexus neutral. Angle good, actual group bad.