School Shootings

[PlayTheGame]

They seem to happen just about every year, and they seem to happen just about in any state. Chardon High School in Ohio just suffered a devastating shooting earlier this week, claiming the lives of 3 young teenagers and injuring others. It's unbelievable these happen every year in such a high frequency. The only positive of the Chardon High Shooting was that the body count was relatively low compared to some of the more notorious school shootings. The Columbine Massacre and the Virginia Tech Shooting both come to mind.

With these kinds of incidents happening on an annual basis with no sign of stopping, what can be done? I'm not sure, but I wish something would happen on a national basis. Some sort of law should be passed to help prevent these atrocities and make kids feel safe about going to school. I say metal detectors should be installed at the main entrances at every school to prevent kids from bringing in knives or guns. Would it be a hassle to pass through them for the kids on a daily basis? No doubt, but at least they would be safe from the 1% of wackjobs out there. Since 9/11, flying is a HUGE hassle. Worse than it has to be or should be. Again, the 1% of wackjob *****es out there had to committ murder, so years later, we have to deal with the bullshit hassle that now comes with airline transportation. But at least we're safe. I say similar measures should be installed at schools. More of a hassle, yes, but it will reduce these atrocities from happening. Unfortunately, I don't see a practical solution for college campuses, as there are usually many different buildings on a college campus. But at least those at the elementary, middle, and high school level could attempt to implement this plan.

Now, I'm sure school shootings would still occur even if metal detectors were at every school, but hopefully it would reduce these incidents from happening at least. It certainly would make a potential shooter think twice before committing murders, and maybe even deter them. When you know a camera is at a traffic light, you're much more inclined to make sure you don't run it. When there's no camera, you may get away with speeding through because there's no accountability. When you apply that to this situation, if a nutjob kid knows that he'll have to go through a metal detector at school, it may deter the bastard from attempting to committ murder. *****es like TJ Lang, the Columbine bastards, and Tech bastard need to be stopped before they can even start their killing sprees. Maybe metal detectors can help, or maybe something else can, but here's the main point: something must be done.

 

[Trill Co$by]

You know, most of the time, the school shootings that occur are done because of them snapping after being overly bullied. After a while, no matter who you are, when you get it into your head that you're done being a victim and ready to become the victim, there's nothing you should theoretically be blamed for.

I mean yes, the school shootings and all of these murders and stuff are tragic... but when it comes down to it, in the "offender's" mindset, what they're doing is justified. I mean let's take the recent Ohio shooting for a minute.

Who's to say that the kid who shot up the place wasn't picked on by the entire school? Who's to say that the kid just had enough of being chased into a classroom for help, only for the teacher to shut the door and let the bullies continue? People are always quick to judge a murderer for killing people instead of looking at the facts. If someone's been treated like shit through their entire life, they're going to retaliate eventually. Everybody has a level of tolerance that once exceeded they go to drastic measures.

Just saying, things in life are NEVER black and white and never will be... but looking into the grey areas and fixing them from within could help improve the black and white ratio.

 

[PlayTheGame]

I think you'd have quite a different take on it if it were your child, brother, sister, or best friend that were killed. Would you then say too that the murderer who CHOSE to shoot up a place, no matter how bullied they were, was still the "victim" of the scenario. I think that's a bullshit defense.

Let's go one further to say that the terrorists of 9/11 just got a little carried away with their religion, right? I mean, so what they killed 3,000 people, robbing countless Americans of parents, family members, and friends, and crippling families in the process. They were just misinformed of their religion, right? Let's not blame them, right? They were just victims of their society too, right?

I'm not attacking you personally at all, this topic just gets me a little fired up. You just have to realize that your point is opening up a slippery slope.

You could argue that any serial killer, too, was damaged in their upbringing. It's quite sad, no doubt, but when a person snaps and makes the decision to take other lives, that's where you draw the line of feeling sorry for them. Up until then, they were the victim, but after their crimes, all they're doing is creating more victims because they're too much of an insecure bastard to do anything functional or proactive about the situation that they are in. If you have the mental capacity to make the choice to kill, then you're held responsible, and you are forever labeled a murderer. Monsters are monsters. It is what it is.

 

[Harthan]

Well, I suppose I might as well comment on this. I went to Chardon High School. I'm acquainted with a couple of the victims including one of the kids that died. The whole town's basically been flipped upside down by this, and it's been a hell of a week.

Anyway. Let me comment on a few things.

*****es like TJ Lang,

Let me tell you about TJ Lane. I'm good friends with a girl who knew him pretty well. TJ's father was charged with murder, kidnapping, and various other felonies. His mother's been basically absent from his life. His only real "role model", his brother, got him into hard drugs and was later arrested. This is a kid who had nobody but his grandparents who did all they could for him, but it wasn't enough, because of all the other shit in his life. He was bounced around between social workers and psychologists and schools for "problem students", and nobody ever stopped to try to figure the kid out. The minute he started down the wrong path, everyone gave up on him. It's easy to write TJ Lane off as a "pussy", or a monster, or whatever. Everyone wants to. But TJ Lane never had a chance. You can be filled with righteous anger about TJ if you want to, but I know better. I know he was a victim in this too. You can't reduce a situation like this to good vs evil. This is a complicated, fucked up mess that's hard to look in the eye, but you have to. And I know that TJ wasn't evil. He was a poor, fucked up kid who never had a chance.

Moving on.

Metal detectors aren't the answer. They're an easy way to make it look like something's being changed, but I know my community and I know that metal detectors won't help. Let's start with the simple, mechanical fact that they're not particularly effective. The perpetrators of 9/11 walked through metal detectors. With metal detectors today, there are still things that get through, plots that are stopped on the planes, or at the terminals, or what have you. Keep in mind that this gets past airport security and the TSA. Metal detectors at Chardon High would be manned by a local cop, if they were manned at all. What I'm saying is that a determined person could get a weapon through metal detectors at Chardon High School. Furthermore, there are many entry and exit points at Chardon. It simply isn't feasible to place metal detectors at every entrance to the building and furthermore, they're going to be detrimental.

Chardon needs to return to psychological normalcy. That's the most important thing. There are 1100 kids at this school who just had the most unimaginably fucked up thing that could possibly happen to them occur in their school. Metal detectors are going to be a constant, every day bleeding wound. I'm fine with increased security measures. Screen visitors to the building more rigorously. Continue to conduct drills. Fine and good. But an everyday reminder of the trauma? No, that's a bad idea. Chardon is not an inner city school. It doesn't need to be transformed into a prison because of one incident. It needs to heal, and metal detectors won't allow that. What needs to be done is for the community and the society to step up and recognize shit like this. I guarantee you that many people, somewhere along the way, could have helped TJ. Someone had the power to get him into a better home. Someone had the power to get his brother's influence off of him. Someone could have helped him, but they didn't, for whatever reason. But someone could have stopped this, somewhere. And every school shooting that's ever going to take place is starting right now. Right now, there are kids in quiet suburbs with no crime where this can't happen, but in ten years, or in five years, or next year, or next week, or tomorrow, it will. And I'm telling you that the kids that are going to do it can be helped out.

Let me give you an example of what I'm talking about. A kid they interviewed yesterday knew TJ, right? They were friends who drifted apart and he knew full well that TJ was becoming a loner, retreating into himself, and he did nothing. TJ posted weird, cryptic shit on his Facebook and Twitter. People saw this, and they did nothing. And this goes beyond TJ. The Columbine kids had blogs of their anger and hatred of society. And, you guessed it, nothing happened.

I'm saying that the solution is empathy. You see shit like this on the Internet and in the physical world, do something about it. Help people out. You see a kid going down that road, don't just let it happen. That's how you stop school shootings. No security measure is ever going to be as effective as just empathizing with your fellow human beings, seeing the warning signs, and helping troubled kids out.

 

[Sparky]

Harthan is right.

Metal detectors will not help in one bit. It's just going to be a constant reminder about the hell that happened.

The only way to help is for everyone that pretends to care to actually stop and give a shit. Every time something like this happens, EVERYONE that comments, says the person who did it was a loner, stayed by themselves ect. most of the people who do it are bullied. I'm not talking about the occasional name calling, they get treated like shit constantly. Most of the time it don't just happen at school. The only way to avoid things like this is to stop the bullying and pay attention to people around them. Talking to somebody you notice trying to pull away from others or at least telling somebody who could help will help alot for the person and help prevent stuff like this happens.

 

[PlayTheGame]

Well, I suppose I might as well comment on this. I went to Chardon High School. I'm acquainted with a couple of the victims including one of the kids that died. The whole town's basically been flipped upside down by this, and it's been a hell of a week.

Anyway. Let me comment on a few things.



Let me tell you about TJ Lane. I'm good friends with a girl who knew him pretty well. TJ's father was charged with murder, kidnapping, and various other felonies. His mother's been basically absent from his life. His only real "role model", his brother, got him into hard drugs and was later arrested. This is a kid who had nobody but his grandparents who did all they could for him, but it wasn't enough, because of all the other shit in his life. He was bounced around between social workers and psychologists and schools for "problem students", and nobody ever stopped to try to figure the kid out. The minute he started down the wrong path, everyone gave up on him. It's easy to write TJ Lane off as a "pussy", or a monster, or whatever. Everyone wants to. But TJ Lane never had a chance. You can be filled with righteous anger about TJ if you want to, but I know better. I know he was a victim in this too. You can't reduce a situation like this to good vs evil. This is a complicated, fucked up mess that's hard to look in the eye, but you have to. And I know that TJ wasn't evil. He was a poor, fucked up kid who never had a chance.

Moving on.

Metal detectors aren't the answer. They're an easy way to make it look like something's being changed, but I know my community and I know that metal detectors won't help. Let's start with the simple, mechanical fact that they're not particularly effective. The perpetrators of 9/11 walked through metal detectors. With metal detectors today, there are still things that get through, plots that are stopped on the planes, or at the terminals, or what have you. Keep in mind that this gets past airport security and the TSA. Metal detectors at Chardon High would be manned by a local cop, if they were manned at all. What I'm saying is that a determined person could get a weapon through metal detectors at Chardon High School. Furthermore, there are many entry and exit points at Chardon. It simply isn't feasible to place metal detectors at every entrance to the building and furthermore, they're going to be detrimental.

Chardon needs to return to psychological normalcy. That's the most important thing. There are 1100 kids at this school who just had the most unimaginably fucked up thing that could possibly happen to them occur in their school. Metal detectors are going to be a constant, every day bleeding wound. I'm fine with increased security measures. Screen visitors to the building more rigorously. Continue to conduct drills. Fine and good. But an everyday reminder of the trauma? No, that's a bad idea. Chardon is not an inner city school. It doesn't need to be transformed into a prison because of one incident. It needs to heal, and metal detectors won't allow that. What needs to be done is for the community and the society to step up and recognize shit like this. I guarantee you that many people, somewhere along the way, could have helped TJ. Someone had the power to get him into a better home. Someone had the power to get his brother's influence off of him. Someone could have helped him, but they didn't, for whatever reason. But someone could have stopped this, somewhere. And every school shooting that's ever going to take place is starting right now. Right now, there are kids in quiet suburbs with no crime where this can't happen, but in ten years, or in five years, or next year, or next week, or tomorrow, it will. And I'm telling you that the kids that are going to do it can be helped out.

Let me give you an example of what I'm talking about. A kid they interviewed yesterday knew TJ, right? They were friends who drifted apart and he knew full well that TJ was becoming a loner, retreating into himself, and he did nothing. TJ posted weird, cryptic shit on his Facebook and Twitter. People saw this, and they did nothing. And this goes beyond TJ. The Columbine kids had blogs of their anger and hatred of society. And, you guessed it, nothing happened.

I'm saying that the solution is empathy. You see shit like this on the Internet and in the physical world, do something about it. Help people out. You see a kid going down that road, don't just let it happen. That's how you stop school shootings. No security measure is ever going to be as effective as just empathizing with your fellow human beings, seeing the warning signs, and helping troubled kids out.

I agree that psychological help and support can help/divert some of these situations. But not everyone produces signs, in fact, there's quite a few incidents where the quiet kid snaps, and no one knew there was anything wrong with him. I still think metal detectors could help. The 9/11 terrorists got through the metal detectors because back then, you were allowed to have some of the things they used as weapons on a plane, such as nail clippers. Now you can't, and plus, metal detector/screening technology has come a long way, probably due to 9/11. Even if it were implemented and wasn't very effective, it'd still be a sign of change in the right direction, and could act as a deterant at least. I think some sort of security measure should be implemented, because these incidents keep happening too frequently. Psychological help and support should be given to those with outward signs, but for those with no signs, maybe this could help. Hell, even if it only stopped 1 kid ever from killing 5, I'd call it a huge success.

You obviously know more about Lane than I do, but I have done some research on him and have learned some of his background information. He's had a terrible life, but that doesn't excuse him from his actions or de-villify him. He still had a choice, and he chose to go on a killing spree. Plenty of people have the life he had and, due to their internal fortitude, overcome it and become great people. I personally know certain people in similar situations that had little no help from others, and came out for the better from their shitty life situations. I'm not just dismissing Lane as a monster without trying to understand him. I feel pity for him, I do. I pity that he lived such a misguided life that led him to killing innocent kids, it's unfortunate and sad to say the least. But his actions turned him into something far worse than anything he came from. Evil begets evil. He "retaliated", and became far worse than anything that ever happened to him in his life. If he came from an evil upbringing, he sure as hell spread it. What he did was pure evil to all of those poor households that will now have a vacant bed each from now on. I feel for all of those poor families. I feel for Lane, but he became a monster. It wasn't his fault that he had a horrible life, but it was his fault that he brought a gun to school and shot 3 innocent people in the head.

 

[Trill Co$by]

I think you'd have quite a different take on it if it were your child, brother, sister, or best friend that were killed. Would you then say too that the murderer who CHOSE to shoot up a place, no matter how bullied they were, was still the "victim" of the scenario. I think that's a bullshit defense.

It's not a bullshit defense, it's a logical one. I've been on both sides of the bully spectrum in high school. I've caused and lived a lot of evil pains that go through the course of bullying. At first hand experience, I know that it's easy to get to a point where you don't care about consequences as long as the bullying you go through stops.

If my son were ever gunned down because he was bullying another kid, that would be his fault. Yes, I would feel bad about it, but not at the child who shot him. I'd feel bad because I had failed as a parent to stop my son from becoming a bully. I wouldn't fault the other kid for shooting my son if my son were bullying him. It sounds barbaric, but it's honesty. I love my son, more than I do anything in this world. I've taught my son the value of being kind to others, I've given him direct examples of what being bullied feels like and he knows not to do it. And don't give me that "he's younger now and it won't matter when he's older" because studies have proven that children learn more at younger ages.

Well, I suppose I might as well comment on this. I went to Chardon High School. I'm acquainted with a couple of the victims including one of the kids that died. The whole town's basically been flipped upside down by this, and it's been a hell of a week.

Anyway. Let me comment on a few things.



Let me tell you about TJ Lane. I'm good friends with a girl who knew him pretty well. TJ's father was charged with murder, kidnapping, and various other felonies. His mother's been basically absent from his life. His only real "role model", his brother, got him into hard drugs and was later arrested. This is a kid who had nobody but his grandparents who did all they could for him, but it wasn't enough, because of all the other shit in his life. He was bounced around between social workers and psychologists and schools for "problem students", and nobody ever stopped to try to figure the kid out. The minute he started down the wrong path, everyone gave up on him. It's easy to write TJ Lane off as a "pussy", or a monster, or whatever. Everyone wants to. But TJ Lane never had a chance. You can be filled with righteous anger about TJ if you want to, but I know better. I know he was a victim in this too. You can't reduce a situation like this to good vs evil. This is a complicated, fucked up mess that's hard to look in the eye, but you have to. And I know that TJ wasn't evil. He was a poor, fucked up kid who never had a chance.

Case and point. The poor kid isn't a monster, by any means. Anybody who's gone through that amount of trouble in their lives is going to eventually snap. Without any help or any guidance, he did what his mind told him was the best solution. It's terrible that other kids died, I'm not saying it's not... but it's equally as terrible once you stop and think about everything that lead up to that moment.

 

[Davi323]

He's had a terrible life, but that doesn't excuse him from his actions or de-villify him. He still had a choice, and he chose to go on a killing spree. Plenty of people have the life he had and, due to their internal fortitude, overcome it and become great people.

It wasn't his fault that he had a horrible life, but it was his fault that he brought a gun to school and shot 3 innocent people in the head.

These two quotes summarize everything I believe in about accepting personal responsibility for your own actions. Nobody forced him to obtain a gun. Nobody forced him to load ammo into it. Nobody forced him to pack it into his backpack. Nobody forced him to take it to school.

I get that there were all kinds of shitty things that went on his life. But, I cannot, will not believe that there is ever anything that can justify bringing a firearm to school and opening fire on your classmates. Up until the point he pulled the trigger, he still had the choice to step back from the edge, to put the gun away, to make the right decision. Nobody forced him to pull the trigger multiple times. That decision will always be on him and nobody else. All of that stuff that happened in his life that made him miserable didn't kill those students. TJ Lane pulling the trigger on his gun did. He ALWAYS had the choice whether to pull the trigger or not. Nobody else, just him. He pulled the trigger, not his dad, not his mom, not his grandparents, not his teachers, just him. I don't care how miserable you think you are, it's never excusable to murder three innocent people because of it.

 

[Trill Co$by]

These two quotes summarize everything I believe in about accepting personal responsibility for your own actions. Nobody forced him to obtain a gun. Nobody forced him to load ammo into it. Nobody forced him to pack it into his backpack. Nobody forced him to take it to school.

I get that there were all kinds of shitty things that went on his life. But, I cannot, will not believe that there is ever anything that can justify bringing a firearm to school and opening fire on your classmates. Up until the point he pulled the trigger, he still had the choice to step back from the edge, to put the gun away, to make the right decision. Nobody forced him to pull the trigger multiple times. That decision will always be on him and nobody else. All of that stuff that happened in his life that made him miserable didn't kill those students. TJ Lane pulling the trigger on his gun did. He ALWAYS had the choice whether to pull the trigger or not. Nobody else, just him. He pulled the trigger, not his dad, not his mom, not his grandparents, not his teachers, just him. I don't care how miserable you think you are, it's never excusable to murder three innocent people because of it.

Okay let's use this logic here...

Nobody forced the family to put him into a shitty lifestyle, nobody forced the other kids to target him and bully him, nobody forced them to make his life hell to the point where the only justifiable action in his mind was to put a permanent stop to it. By YOUR logic, the bullies who got shot basically deserved it because nobody FORCED them to bully TJ Lane. Nobody FORCED them to be in the way of his bullets.

 

[Davi323]

Okay let's use this logic here...

Nobody forced the family to put him into a shitty lifestyle, nobody forced the other kids to target him and bully him, nobody forced them to make his life hell to the point where the only justifiable action in his mind was to put a permanent stop to it. By YOUR logic, the bullies who got shot basically deserved it because nobody FORCED them to bully TJ Lane. Nobody FORCED them to be in the way of his bullets.

Uh, no. Did you seriously just say that nobody forced them to be in the way of his bullets? Seriously? Do you have any idea how ridiculous you are?

Further, I haven't read that those were the students that bullied him. I have read that he was mad that one of the victims, Russell King went on a date with his ex girlfriend. Not that he bullied TJ, but that he DARED to go out with a girl Lane was still sweet on. How dare he? Is dating someone another guy used to date considered bullying now?

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505263_162-57389221/tj-lane-knew-some-shooting-victims-well/

Further, the prosecutor doesn't even think the victims were chosen deliberately, they were random. IE, if he was being bullied, it wasn't by those particular students. Hell, according to the Prosecutor, Lane even admitted that he chose them randomly. Kinda takes the wind out of your argument there, doesn't it?

http://abcnews.go.com/US/ohio-school-shooter-chose-victims-randomly-prosecutor/story?id=15807146#.T1DjY5ukcbI

If you are going to claim that the victims bullied TJ Lane, fine. Show me the news articles. Show me the witnesses who state that. You claim that the victims were chosen deliberately because they personally bullied TJ Lane. Show me the evidence to support that claim.

 

[PlayTheGame]

Davi pretty much summed that up, he shot numerous people, one being a girl. He was on a rampage. I'm sure, for the most part, it was random. Maybe he shot King on purpose, but other than that, he was just shooting. But even if he did shoot someone who was bullying him, ever hear of two wrongs don't make a right? It's simple morality. Lane acted on his own accord. He is responsible for his actions. If he's going to take the lives of 3 innocent kids, injure numerous others, and leave unhealable scars on that whole community, how can you not place the blame on him? It's ludicrous to try to de-villify him. Lane's family (or lackthereof) and upbringing were evils in his life, sure. But then he became an evil far worse.

Look at it this way. What if one of the survivors hypothetically went on a shooting spree of their own because they snapped due to the psychological damage that Lane's shooting incurred on them. According to your logic, we wouldn't blame this shooter either, and we certainly aren't blaming Lane... so that means this shooting was also the fault of Lane's parents, right? But that's the path of logic that you are opening up with your argument. Soon we're going to be de-villifying all criminals. Or, we can just call it what it is, and call the criminals what they are: monsters.

Like I said earlier, pretty much EVERY criminal has had a messed up life. So, again, by your logic, no murderer with a messed up life should be to blame for their crimes, no matter how heinous. Which is obviously not the truth, nor is it justice. If you're going to defend Lane for his bad upbringing, you will also have to defend Jeffrey Dahmer, Ted Bundy, and Aileen Wournos for their shitty upbringings as well.

 

[Davi323]

Lets play devil's advocate for a second, just for fun. Okay, you win. Lane is just a victim in all of this.

What should the authorities do with him? Should they let him go, since obviously he can't be held responsible for his actions? Would you want a guy that went on a shooting rampage and killed 3 people running loose in your neighborhood? If you had children that went to his school, would you want your son or daughter anywhere near him? If he is just a victim, and should be blameless, you would have no problems with your daughter dating a guy you know murdered 3 people and attempted to murder more, right? What possible harm could come from it? He was just a poor victim, afterall.

Further, should everyone who is locked up in prison that had any kind of hardships in their life be set free? Are the streets going to be safer because we are now labeling them as victims rather than criminals? When they continue to rape and murder, rob and assault people, should we simply look the other way? Recommend a psychologist for them, rather than call the cops?

OR, will you acknowledge that no matter shit they had happen in their lives previously, they are still responsible for the crimes they committed, and deserve to be in prison where they can't harm innocent people anymore?

 

[LSN80]

It's not a bullshit defense, it's a logical one. I've been on both sides of the bully spectrum in high school. I've caused and lived a lot of evil pains that go through the course of bullying. At first hand experience, I know that it's easy to get to a point where you don't care about consequences as long as the bullying you go through stops.

Is it easy to get to the point where one can snap? Sure. A well-timed insult here, some snide remarks here, and a few well-placed shots that hit below the belt there could make it easy for one to snap. But just because it's easy to get to the place where you don't care about the consequences excuses you from them.

Much of this is irrelevant, because what he did, he did calmly. He didn't suddenly snap, he chose people at random. My sympathies that you experienced bullying in high school yourself, but to react with the same actions or worse makes you worse. You know what it feels like to suffer, yet you choose to put other people through sufferring.

I won't claim to know T.J. Lane. I won't claim to know the life he lived or what he went through. From what Ive read and what Harthan said, he had it rough. But living with pain in your own life isn't an excuse or a cop-out for causing worse pain for others. I feel for Lane if he was suffering from some mental disease or disorder, but unless he's a narcissicist, he still has that little voice that told him what was right and what was wrong.

If my son were ever gunned down because he was bullying another kid, that would be his fault. Yes, I would feel bad about it, but not at the child who shot him. I'd feel bad because I had failed as a parent to stop my son from becoming a bully. I wouldn't fault the other kid for shooting my son if my son were bullying him. It sounds barbaric, but it's honesty.

So you would stand up in court and ask for the freedom of the person who shot and killed your own son, because of words that came out of his mouth? What you're suggesting is an "eye for an eye" mentality, one where people can act as they please based on how others treat them.

I can understand you blaming yourself as a parent if your son bullied another child, but to not fault the other child? To not want to see him held responsible for his actions? Place the shoe on the other foot here. Are you going to teach your son that it's pk to go on a shooting spree at his school if he's bullied? In essence, that's exactly what you're suggesting if you don't believe someone should be held responsible for their actions because they were bullied.

I love my son, more than I do anything in this world. I've taught my son the value of being kind to others, I've given him direct examples of what being bullied feels like and he knows not to do it. And don't give me that "he's younger now and it won't matter when he's older" because studies have proven that children learn more at younger ages.

Studies show that certain values and beliefs along with a moral balance
are learned best at a young age yes, but it's that through the continuation of teaching those things throughout someone's life that produce the best results. But again, it brings me back to the same problem we had before:

Since you're of the belief that kids who are bullied shouldn't be blamed if they go on shooting sprees, will you provide the gun for your son if he'd bullied too heavily? I hope I'm being completely extreme here, but the mentality you're displaying here is a helluva dangerous one for a parent to have.

Case and point. The poor kid isn't a monster, by any means. Anybody who's gone through that amount of trouble in their lives is going to eventually snap.

This doesn't really qualify as snapping. Snapping would be an in the moment reaction. This would be classified more as a psychotic break from reality. Honestly, that's what it sounds like happened, but it doesn't make what he did excusable.

Without any help or any guidance, he did what his mind told him was the best solution. It's terrible that other kids died, I'm not saying it's not... but it's equally as terrible once you stop and think about everything that lead up to that moment.

It's worse that other kids died. Because for him, at least there's a chance for him to get better. As for those kids? not so much. How could you think in any way that those events are equally terrible? The kid has a chance to recover emotionally, but the three bodies lying in a morgue do not.

It's not even remotely comparable.

 

[jrichardson25]

I don't see the point. This whole bully/victim thing is a fact of life. There are times, a lot of times that it goes too far. The father from the movie said it best "All we needed when I was a kid was our fists" (not the exact quote... but not the point). Simply put, these kids are thinking ending someone's life solves the problem but they don't think it through completely. If they get tired of it and the staff isn't noticing or caring (and it has been brought to their attention more than once), they need to be a little physical. I bet getting suspended for popping a bully in the jaw is a lot better than spending life behind bars or their own death over the matter. It is a sad sign of the times. I think kids aren't learning from the past. They're just emulating it...

 

[PlayTheGame]

I don't see the point. This whole bully/victim thing is a fact of life. There are times, a lot of times that it goes too far. The father from the movie said it best "All we needed when I was a kid was our fists" (not the exact quote... but not the point). Simply put, these kids are thinking ending someone's life solves the problem but they don't think it through completely. If they get tired of it and the staff isn't noticing or caring (and it has been brought to their attention more than once), they need to be a little physical. I bet getting suspended for popping a bully in the jaw is a lot better than spending life behind bars or their own death over the matter. It is a sad sign of the times. I think kids aren't learning from the past. They're just emulating it...

I don't think that's the answer either. While I see where your going with it, I still think that if you go down the path of violence, there's the chance that violence begets even more violence. Once it's introduced to the equation, who really knows how far it will go? One students hit another, then the next day the other student brings in a knife, then before you know it, guns are involved. I know in 98% of situations that it doesn't escalate that far, but it is certainly not out of the realm of possibility. Here's an idea: how about instead of resorting to bullying/insults/violence of any kind, kids talk out their problems! Crazy, right? So 21st century! But really, if only Lane and others who commit violent acts had talked their problems out with someone, like a school counselor or the ones they are having problems with, so much distress and pain can be averted. But instead, they resort to barbaric, borderline psychotic acts, ranging from punching somone in the face to acquiring a gun, loading it full of live ammunition, and bringing it to school so they can shoot 3 innocent teenagers in the back of the head. Sad.