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Leafy vs. Chris

Leafy

Getting Noticed By Management
I wish Chris a good debate. Me and him are debating who is better Current ECW Christian or TNA Christian. I am choosing ECW Christian.

The current Christian has made an impact in ECW. On his first night back he beat the dominant champion of Jack Swagger. Swagger was making ECW his stomping ground until Christian came in and showed him how good he is. He then competed in the MITB and later winning the ECW title which showed us how this is the better version of Captain Charisma.

Yes, he lost it to Dreamer but it was in a hardcore triple threat with Swagger also. It would be a feat if he won this. He then won it back in July and still hold the sliver title today, February. He is the longest WWE-ECW champion ever. He's beaten great opponents such as Regal, Benjamin, Jackson, and again Swagger. He's been in extreme matches and ladder matches meeting the extreme title's history.

I'll put up points against his TNA career after being explained by Chris. Good Luck.
 
I also wish Leafy good luck, and I appreciate you accepting a challenge from a more or less unknown poster.

I am arguing for the Christian Cage in TNA against the current Christian of ECW. Though I am a huge fan of both I feel that the Christian of TNA was superior.

Looking back over Christian’s time in TNA I think it is easy to see how much he accomplished there in a short space of time. He was a member of the company for about three years, from late 2005 until late 2008. In this time Christian accomplished everything that could be expected of him, he had runs at the top as both a face and a heel, and was a two time NWA champion. The face that he had a run at the top of the company is for me something that separates his time between the two companies, as it is lamented by many of his fans that Christian has never been given a chance to wrestle at the top tier of the WWE. Christian was known mostly as a tag team wrestler from his tenure in WWE, while he had a singles run for several years before his departure he was never given the opportunities that many said he deserved, and it has been widely publicized that Vince McMahon is not a fan of his and has never thought him deserving of a run at the top.

He has had notable achievements during his run in ECW, but this seems tainted when it is considered how much of a second rate show this is regarded as by many. Christian is a big fish in a small pond in ECW, he is a veteran who should be doing more and I think it is a waste of his considerable talent not to give him a chance at one of the larger shows while he is at this stage in his career. The opponents that he has beaten in ECW pale when compared to those who he faced in TNA. I do not think it can be considered a step up for Christian when he was working main event matches against competitors such as Kurt Angle, AJ Styles, Samoa Joe, Abyss and Sting. While I have enjoyed his run as the ECW champion, being the longest reigning champion in WWE does not mean as much as it should when we consider how much better Christian is capable of, and how he was offered and made the most of much better opportunities during his stay in TNA.
 
Looking back over Christian’s time in TNA I think it is easy to see how much he accomplished there in a short space of time. He was a member of the company for about three years, from late 2005 until late 2008. In this time Christian accomplished everything that could be expected of him, he had runs at the top as both a face and a heel, and was a two time NWA champion.

No matter how impressive of Christian's short time in TNA it is smashed by his ECW run. He's been there for there for about a year and he's held the title twice, the longest run of any WWE-ECW title reign. This shows how he has surpassed the previous reigns such as RVD, Big Show, and CM Punk. He held the title longer than any of these great wrestlers in a diverse number of matches.

The face that he had a run at the top of the company is for me something that separates his time between the two companies, as it is lamented by many of his fans that Christian has never been given a chance to wrestle at the top tier of the WWE. Christian was known mostly as a tag team wrestler from his tenure in WWE, while he had a singles run for several years before his departure he was never given the opportunities that many said he deserved, and it has been widely publicized that Vince McMahon is not a fan of his and has never thought him deserving of a run at the top.

It doesn't matter if he was a tag team wrestler in his previous run. We're talking about his ECW run where he held the top title on one of the three brands twice in one year. Obviously Vince has some faith in him if he would give him such a long reign, almost defining the history of WWE-ECW now. When we look back on it Christian will be the last great thing that happened on the "extreme" brand.

He has had notable achievements during his run in ECW, but this seems tainted when it is considered how much of a second rate show this is regarded as by many. Christian is a big fish in a small pond in ECW, he is a veteran who should be doing more and I think it is a waste of his considerable talent not to give him a chance at one of the larger shows while he is at this stage in his career.

I think no matter how people see the third brand as the "lesser" brand they can't deny the amount of talent and matches they put on. Even if the roster is mainly rookies, it doesn't mean ECW is not full of talent. There has been a variety of veterans and great rookies that have tested Christian and made him a better wrestler.

The opponents that he has beaten in ECW pale when compared to those who he faced in TNA. I do not think it can be considered a step up for Christian when he was working main event matches against competitors such as Kurt Angle, AJ Styles, Samoa Joe

Those three wrestlers are the best TNA offers, I can't deny the talent there but for everytime he beat them he lost as well.

He beat Tommy Dreamer, a hardcore icon and veteran.
He beat a man nearing 60. That's good.
While I have enjoyed his run as the ECW champion, being the longest reigning champion in WWE does not mean as much as it should when we consider how much better Christian is capable of, and how he was offered and made the most of much better opportunities during his stay in TNA.

I think Christians TNA run has been condensed into his ECW run. He is the main focus of an entire brand and he did it in one year. That's impressive.
 
No matter how impressive of Christian's short time in TNA it is smashed by his ECW run. He's been there for there for about a year and he's held the title twice, the longest run of any WWE-ECW title reign. This shows how he has surpassed the previous reigns such as RVD, Big Show, and CM Punk. He held the title longer than any of these great wrestlers in a diverse number of matches.

While this is an impressive achievement in some respects, there is no doubt that TNA garners more of an interest from wrestling fans and would more widely considered a bigger league to be a champion of. While Christian surpassed the reigns of other superstars such as CM Punk and RVD, this was mostly because they were being changed to different brands, so Christians long reign does nothing but highlight the fact that he has not been trusted to attempt bigger things. And when you compare the fact that the ECW roster comprises about 20 superstars compared to TNA’s roster of about 65 it is hard to see how being on top of such a small roster as that of ECW can compare to Christian’s time atop TNA.

It doesn't matter if he was a tag team wrestler in his previous run. We're talking about his ECW run where he held the top title on one of the three brands twice in one year. Obviously Vince has some faith in him if he would give him such a long reign, almost defining the history of WWE-ECW now. When we look back on it Christian will be the last great thing that happened on the "extreme" brand.

I do not feel that Christian’s two ECW runs demonstrate a show of faith from Vince, I think they demonstrate a lack of alternatives. Once Christian returned and was drafted to ECW people assumed that it was tryout, to make sure that he still had what it takes to survive in WWE. Christian has stayed in ECW because he is not being given a better opportunity. He would no doubt have been moved to Smackdown at the culmination of the Jeff Hardy attacker story, but this was changed to give Matt Hardy a push ahead of Christian. I fail to see how this constitutes a push, and I think it shows a change of mind, and a decision not to move Christian into the bigger leagues. Yes Christian will be the last great thing to happen on ECW, but that is only because they opted to let him go down with the sinking ship, one that he should have been rescued from quite a while ago.

I think no matter how people see the third brand as the "lesser" brand they can't deny the amount of talent and matches they put on. Even if the roster is mainly rookies, it doesn't mean ECW is not full of talent. There has been a variety of veterans and great rookies that have tested Christian and made him a better wrestler.

The quality of the stars and matches on ECW just make it more frustrating that it is overlooked to such an extent. ECW has a very capable roster, but I do not think it is correct to state that Christian learned much from his matches here, I think his role was more of a teacher than a student. Christian may have learned something from his matches with William Regal, but at this stage in his career he should be accomplishing long term goals, and I do not think that facing opponents such as Zack Ryder, Jackson, and even Swagger or Benjamin is what Christian thought he would be doing when he returned from TNA. The calibre of opponents he is offered in ECW really cannot compare to that in TNA, since here he demonstrated that he is capable of working at the top of a company if given the chance.

Those three wrestlers are the best TNA offers, I can't deny the talent there but for everytime he beat them he lost as well.

The point is that he was given the opportunity to face them, with a feud and an even chance at getting the win. At his time in ECW he has been superior to almost all of his opponents in terms of experience and achievements, and the TNA bouts he engaged in helped him develop much more than anything he has encountered in ECW.

He beat Tommy Dreamer, a hardcore icon and veteran.

I don’t mean to disrespect Tommy Dreamer but winning matches is not what he is best known for. There was very little doubt that Christian would ultimately come out on top of Dreamer, similar to Christians matches with Abyss. I think these are about on par, a chance to gain Christian more exposure and build him up to better opponents.

He beat a man nearing 60. That's good.

Actually Sting was nearing 50 when they faced off. There was no denying that Sting was one of the biggest names in TNA at that time, and beating a figure with the stature of Sting is a huge achievement to have on your record. This was a major push for Christian, one that overshadows any semblance of a push that he has received in ECW.


I think Christians TNA run has been condensed into his ECW run. He is the main focus of an entire brand and he did it in one year. That's impressive.

This gets back to the big fish in a small pond argument, ECW is a fraction of what TNA is, the lack of faith that WWE has in the brand is evident since the brand is being shut down. His run in ECW is impressive, but only because of him making the most of an opportunity below what he should have been offered.
You talk about diversity of matches, but Christian only competed in a few hardcore matches in his time with ECW, a brand that is supposed to be focused around hardcore wrestling, at least to some extent. In TNA Christian was given opportunities in a huge selection of matches, including ladder matches, street fights, cage matches and King of the Mountain matches. This is impressive when we consider that TNA is a company that is not exclusively focused around hardcore matches. Also when we consider that Christian headlined some of TNA’s biggest PPV’s against a variety of opponents, his TNA run far outshines anything he has done in ECW. As much as it can be argued that ECW contains huge amounts of talent, the ECW championship is overlooked on a regular basis for PPV’s, and this is a title that shows its holder as the champion of an entire brand. Christian was given chances in TNA and ran with these, silencing many of his critics and giving vindication to his long time fans. He has done nothing to this extent in ECW, and after accomplishing all that he can on this brand it is clear that his time in TNA was superior.
 

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