I have to say I wondered how long before they would find someway to have Val be more than some lady at ringside. I mean we saw this becoming something on the last Impact and what happened at Genesis it looks like it will happen. I guess they really want Lethal to go all out to be like Savage, but its working for him. I be interested in how this plays out, but looks the Black Machismo gimmick is here to stay. I'm just still surprised how long before they found an angle to use Val in, but she is no Elizabeth.
Jay Lethal and SoCalVal (The New Savage and Elizabeth)
- Thread starter A.J.
- Start date
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I have to say I wondered how long before they would find someway to have Val be more than some lady at ringside. I mean we saw this becoming something on the last Impact and what happened at Genesis it looks like it will happen. I guess they really want Lethal to go all out to be like Savage, but its working for him. I be interested in how this plays out, but looks the Black Machismo gimmick is here to stay. I'm just still surprised how long before they found an angle to use Val in, but she is no Elizabeth.
This is what is wrong with TNA. Instead of dropping the Black Machismo gimmick they're adding another element to it. They should drop the gimmick while Lethal is still over. If it goes stale, Lethal does with it. They've built him up to be a pretty credible champ. Despite the Macho Man mannerisms. He's developed a persoanlity. I'm sure (like A.J.) that he can now use those skills as a non gimmick wrestler.
I think the gimmick is funny and it's a good way to incorporate Val into the show I guess. But, it really is going to limit Jay Lethal. He acts like Savage more and more and now even pretends that he actually is Savage (like during the Angle interrogation). That can only go so far and has to stop at some point.
Who knows maybe he'll get with Val and it'll be the Elizabeth thing and either she "makes him realize he's his own man" or she turns on him and he gives up the gimmick. It has worked to a point though, he is over.
Who knows maybe he'll get with Val and it'll be the Elizabeth thing and either she "makes him realize he's his own man" or she turns on him and he gives up the gimmick. It has worked to a point though, he is over.
K
kenfuu
Guest
i agree with noone, i think either Val has him believe he is his own person, or Sonjay does it....was anyone else waiting for him to cream Lethal in the head with the tambourine? Because i was and probably would have died laughing if someone got creamed with a tambourine.... then team twinkies came out and ruined my fun.
I dont really think they should get Val to do the "elizabeth" angel. I believe that the Black Machismo gimmick was very sucsessful and helped get Lethal over. Before this gimmick nobody really carred about him even though he has talent. I think they should just phase out the gimmick to see if Lethal can maintain being over. In a way I can see Val eventually being the reason y he dumps the gimmick so it may work in lethal's advantage.
TheOneBigWill
[This Space for Rent]
The only problem I forsee with dropping the Macho gimmick from Lethal, is having Lethal go back to no gimmick at all. The fans don't show respect for Lethal as an athlete, they show "respect" for him as a gimmick.
As sad as it is to say, Lethal had all this talent before he put on a tye-dye type outfit, crazy glasses & a hat. The fans never gave Lethal much of any type of reaction, until he started doing the Macho impressions.
I feel bad for when the gimmick runs dry, because Lethal will go back to being nothing. But I think this is wrong, to try & replace Miss Elizabeth, especially with So Cal Val. I'm not saying Val won't be a good "shy" character, but lets just step back & look at the few problems with this situation.
Jay Lethal is a good Randy Savage, but (without making it sound racial) Lethal is black.. therefore.. his version of Miss Elizabeth, should be black too?? Right?!
In my opinion, the reason Val is taking up the role, is because the only current black female wrestlers who could take up the role... would be Jackie, or Jazz.. neither of which have a "shy" bone in their body. None the less, this is where they've failed, before starting.
I'm sure that Val & Lethal will make a nice "couple" for the next two monthes. But here's my final question to ponder.. if they're doing this gimmick, full on.. will Lethal & So Cal Val end up getting "married" on a p.p.v.?!?!?
K
kenfuu
Guest
You don't seem racist at all which is good because I understand that his gimmick is a black Macho Man, and from watching Genesis(if you haven't seen it contact your local ppv providers) that Val played shy REALLY well, and the last girl i was interested in was very shy so from experience Val played the shy girl very well. The only problem is you said...what to do when this gets stale because before he had no gimmick and he didn't get any recognition and now he gets standing ovations and i hope he doesn't become another x-division champion to fade into oblivion coughpeteywilliamscough.
Yeah, I never saw Black Machismo as a long-term gimmick for Lethal. I am glad to see Val worked into the show a bit more, but I'm afraid TNA is taking too many liberties with the Macho Man thing. Doing a few catchphrases and mannerisms is OK, but they really need to make Lethal into his own character. I don't know if Val will really help or hurt, but I think the clock is ticking on the Black Machismo gimmick. Maybe some sort of transition can be made, since Lethal is a fine talent.
BTW, kenfuu makes a good point about Petey. Where the hell is he?
BTW, kenfuu makes a good point about Petey. Where the hell is he?
K
kenfuu
Guest
last we saw of Petey was being put through a table by team twinkies along with shark boy. And just in case i am hoping for lethal to develop his own persona along with DUtt turning heel.
ExtremeIronChef
Hey Yo!
Could they be doing this to set up a possible Randy Savage return?
I'm not really sure how long the Black Machismo gimmick can last. After awhile people will begin to get tired of it and when/if that time comes, what do you do next? Maybe turn him heel and give him a feud with another X Division wrestler or maybe someone like Kaz. Lethal is a good wrestler and it would be a shame to have him drift into obscurity.
I'm not really sure how long the Black Machismo gimmick can last. After awhile people will begin to get tired of it and when/if that time comes, what do you do next? Maybe turn him heel and give him a feud with another X Division wrestler or maybe someone like Kaz. Lethal is a good wrestler and it would be a shame to have him drift into obscurity.
I don't think this is leading to a Macho return (at least I hope not). I think the heel turn would be a good move for Lethal. He could turn on "Miss" Val after 1-2 months, and break away from the Macho mold, hopefully still retaining the Black Machismo name (just b/c I like it). A heel turn is a good way to end the Macho/Val gimmick while keeping Lethal fresh and in the limelight.
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jgja
Guest
I kind of like the idea of doing the Savage-Elizabeth Storyline but I think that it would be cooler if they were to have someone be Hogan. But there are also flaws such as TheOneBigWill mentioned.
I like the Black Machismo character. THe first time I saw it I laughed because he pulled off the Savage character so well. It reminded me of Eugene in WWE when he would use another wrestler's move but taken considerably further.
Even though Val is the most georgeous TNA knockout, I don't like Val as Elizabeth because when Val was on TNA today and they talked about their new women's division, they mentioned Roxxi LeVeaux and Val had alot to say negatively about her and the way Val communicated appeared as if TNA was going to set up a Val - Roxxi feud down the line and bring her into the Women's division. It is as if TNA has no creatie direction for such a beautiful woman and decided at the last minute to do this.
Even though Val is the most georgeous TNA knockout, I don't like Val as Elizabeth because when Val was on TNA today and they talked about their new women's division, they mentioned Roxxi LeVeaux and Val had alot to say negatively about her and the way Val communicated appeared as if TNA was going to set up a Val - Roxxi feud down the line and bring her into the Women's division. It is as if TNA has no creatie direction for such a beautiful woman and decided at the last minute to do this.
ImpactPlayer27
Pre-Show Stalwart
I'm one of the few that has no problem with Black Machismo. I like this gimmick and instead of a parody it kind of pays homage to the original Macho Man gimmick. You want a gimmick that pisses me off, try that stupid Guru gimmick for Sonjay. I want the old Sonjay back. But back to the topic, I got no problem with the gimmick nor do I have a problem with So Cal Val being with Black Machismo because in a way, I see that he's making this gimmick his own or as much as he can anyway. And they're finally doing something with Val so why not. I say go with it
I too like the Machismo gimmick, hearing him make reference to Liz and Hogan on last nights impact was classic. But i do think a heel turn is commin, I like the fact they acknowledge him as trapped in a time machine - perhaps not a permanent angle. I wouldnt be suprised to see a long time feud with Sonjay if this Hogan-Liz stuff keeps poppin up
anyone else thing it could be a dig at WWE for having issues with Macho Man?
anyone else thing it could be a dig at WWE for having issues with Macho Man?
T
tartar13
Guest
jay lethal has a big furture in wrestling and every since get the black machismo gimmick his being getting more attention, So Cal Val is a cold looking freak she is going to make jay just look good. I see no down fall in it so I think its safe to they are the new savage and eliizabeth
Alcohol Wipe
Dark Match Jobber
I for one hate the black machismo gimmick. Its getting very old, and I'm really really really sick of it, I think Jay is much better as Jay Lethal. They can easily stop it now, Jay is way over enough to not have to be Machismo.
i was very into this gimmick but now i feel that its getting a bit dry. TNA seems to be lacking good ideas lately (vince russo is a dick) so it wouldnt surprise me to see So Cal Val become elizabeth so that the black machismo gimmick can go on for a lot longer while TNA tries to find another gimmick for him. a heel turn is the only way to drop this gimmick, there could be a TNA wedding between val and machismo much like the Summer Slam wedding and lethal turns heel during it. but the only problem is that theres not many gimmicks to go for after this one and thats a shame because lethal is incredibly talented.
theblackknight
New Member
I hate this Jay Lethal/SoCalVal connection. She is the worse looking knockout on the roster. They should have brought in a hot diva for Black Machismo. Someone like Kristal Marshall. That would be an interesting setup since the wrestling world already knows who she is.
Macho Man would never try to hook up with a nobody.
"Ohhhhhh noooooo!!!!"
Macho Man would never try to hook up with a nobody.
"Ohhhhhh noooooo!!!!"
SpiralHands
Hardcore Revolutionist
The macho gimmick is pure brilliance but once that gets stale what are they going to do with Lethal? They could turn him heel i geuss or they could make him his own man again either way i would say it be stale by the end of this year and man they need to do something with Sonjay make him feud with Macho Lethal and turn Lethal back to where he was or something.
For some reason I think the angle is going to be the opposite of the Hogan Macho's. I believe that Sonjay Dutt is going to be the heel and The Black Machismo is just going to be an even bigger face. For some reason I don't think the crowd has ever liked Dutt when he did that Mojo stuff, I sure as hell haven't. Anyway, that's my opinion and I'm sticking to it till I see otherwise.
The_Mega_Powers
Dark Match Jobber
Jay lethal has too much talent to be mocking Randy Savage, but Randy Savage has no problem with Lethal doing it. I used to think it was funny at one time but it is getting old real fast. We know what is going to happen already, Dutt is going to turn on Lethal at the next PPV to win the X-Division title. I do think that Val will turn on lethal at that same PPV and Lethal will be gone for a while and come back as his ownself.
Sonjay Dutt won't be winning the X Divison title any time soon. Let's hope they stop the silly promos every week and get back to Lethal wrestling. I have no problem with the Black Machismo thing because he was quite boring otherwise, every talking like Randy Savage is ok, as long as he's still being the X Divison champ every week and proving to everyone why he's the X Divisions new hero.
Father:_Polley
Fun's my Chinese neighbour's name
i don't see sonjay turning on lethal at lockdown. they'll probably let the tension build with jay/dutt over val for a while, sort of turning it into a savage vs hogan rivalry over elizabeth, only with twiglets for wrestlers and a better looking (in my opinion) prize. then it'll start to become about the title, unless williams/steiner win it, then it'l just be for pride
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