IYO, is 6 weeks truly enough to build a legendary retirement angle for HHH?

[The Ace of Knaves]

Words in the spoiler sites have it we will see Streak vs Career again this year, featuring Triple H vs Undertaker with the possibility of Shawn Michaels as the special referee.

Assuming this rumor is true, then that means WWE only have six weeks to build the whole retirement angle while at the same time using Shawn Michaels (both his retirement and Taker/HBK angle) to add to it.

It's no secret that HHH is a major player backstage, so it won't surprise us if he (or Stephanie) wants his retirement and last match to be remembered on the same iconic lines like Hulk Hogan & Stone Cold at Wrestlemania 19 or Shawn Michaels at Wrestlemania 26, not like JBL at Wrestlemania 25.

The thing is, even by involving Shawn Michaels, is 6 weeks really enough to make HHH's retirement as legendary as those three I mentioned above?

Hogan & Vince has gigantic history dating back to the creation of Wrestlemania itself, so their history and build-up was more than proper.

Austin & Rock...well, do I even need to explain?

Taker & HBK last year had one year build up from Wrestlemania 25 (clever move) and it has been teased since HBK was involved in multi-tag match at Smackdown! with Undertaker to the Slammys, The Royal Rumble, The Elimination Chamber, and the rest is history. Not to mention their history dates back to the 1990's which I don't need to explain.

That brings us back to Taker & HHH. If WWE go with this angle, not only they have merely 6 weeks, Taker & HHH also don't have much history to begin with. A match at Wrestlemania 17 and a short feud in 2002, that's it. It's not comparable to Hogan/Vince, Austin/Rock, or Taker/HBK at all. And also consider although Shawn Michaels may play a role in this angle, this isn't about him but about Taker & HHH.

It's about HHH's career not HBK's although WWE seem to not realize going with HBK as special ref, while intriguing, will only cheapen both HHH/Taker & HBK's retirement, because he's about to be inducted to HOF but is forced to participate in yet another storyline with no apparent conclusion seeing how he doesn't wrestle anymore which might lead to the speculation of yet another return or one more match that won't happen which will only anger the fans. I mean if he makes HHH loses, what will HHH say? "It's okay, I just lost my career thanks to your fairness. That's all. No hard feelings, mate"? It just shows to all of us WWE is having a hard time letting go of Taker/HBK for an unknown reason despite having The Rock and Justin Bieber to guarantee buyrates. It's as if HHH's career isn't big enough to be the one at the stake...

Of course there's a possibility WWE will hype this match even more insane than what they did to Orton/HHH at WM 25 (which was an epic fail), but I think insane hype still doesn't make up for the lack of history between Taker/HHH after all.

Regardless, back to my question. As always, I'd love to learn more about all u guys' opinions regarding this matter.

No bashing please. And sorry if nearly all my threads is about HHH, I can't help it.

 

[Big Nick Dudley]

This feud isn't that complicated. It's really not even personal. "You retired HBK, now I'm going to end your streak." The reason I say it's not overly personal is because the feud between Taker and HBK wasn't all that personal. HBK went out of his way to make sure Taker accepted the match, but the way the Mania match ended showed how much respect each man had for the other.

Same deal with HHH and The Undertaker. Both are babyfaces, as were HBK and The Undertaker. A match of this magnitude rests on the stipulation, not so much the feud leading up to it.

I'm not saying this match is even going to happen, but if it starts on 2/21, they have plenty of time. Hell, it could start 4 weeks before the PPV, and still have enough time.

 

[mooseman]

Absolutely not. To me this is clear indication that Vince is concerned about the buy rate and/or the writing has gotten lazy. There is no logical reason for this to be a match at Mania. Why because Taker retired HBK? Terrible. Not only that but a match of this magnitude can't be full considering its been 3 months since we saw Taker and like 10 that we saw HHH. Then you add on the "storyline" reason why they were both gone and you're gonna tell me that neither man wants any form of retribution? HHH should only have 1 match at Mania this year and thats Sheamus. Sheamus took him out for 10 months and "The Cerebral Assassin" is ok with that? As far as The Undertaker I see 3 good possible matches at Mania:

1) Casket Match vs Kane. Yes I know the feud has been done to death however the last chapter was a complete anihilation by Kane. Have this match at Mania with taker winning and then setting the Casket on fire. 2 paths to go for Kane either retire or take some time off and come back once again wearing the mask for his last run

2) Wade Barrett. He is the guy that caused Taker to be Buried Alive and not win the title from Kane. Realistically a great way to cement Barrett as a top guy.

3) Chris Jericho. Y2J constantly says in interviews he has nothing left to do in wrestling. However to my knowledge have Taker and Jericho ever feuded? I don't think so. Perfect way to build it is to have Y2J use the nothing left to prove except ending the streak routine. You can even use HBK in this feud real easy. One of Jericho's best heel runs was against HBK and how he wanted to do everything HBK did, only better. Well here you go do what HBK couldn't do with 2 attempts...END THE STREAK! You can HBK make random appearances warning Jericho of the bumpy, painful path that is THE STREAK.

 

[Second_City_Antichrist]

I've heard talk of it being Triple H vs. Taker at WrestleMania this year, now assuming the whole 2/21/11 thing IS indeed Taker, I wouldn't mind seeing Hunter go out this way, attempting to avenge his best friend.

Now I've got to reply to mooseman's reply, 1. Yeah, the Kane/Taker rivalry I think has run its course, at least to me it has. 2. Wade Barrett, honestly, he doesn't have enough traction to take on The Streak in my opinion, I mean, he's been in a few main events for the WWE Championship and took over RAW for over six months, but he doesn't have the track record executives are looking for to challenge The Streak. Finally, yeah, Jericho has never been in a feud with Taker, which honestly, I wanted to see sometime within the last few years and he does say he's like HBK, only better, which I think would be a good alternative to HHH/Taker, but can six weeks be enough to put Jericho/Taker together IF it did happen and them never being opponents in their careers, ever?

 

[The Ace of Knaves]

Finally, yeah, Jericho has never been in a feud with Taker, which honestly, I wanted to see sometime within the last few years and he does say he's like HBK, only better, which I think would be a good alternative to HHH/Taker, but can six weeks be enough to put Jericho/Taker together IF it did happen and them never being opponents in their careers, ever?

Let's see....

1. Ric Flair has never been The Undertaker opponent before Wrestlemania X-8, but their underrated Wrestlemania classic was built only in 5 weeks.

2. Randy Orton has never been The Undertaker opponent before Wrestlemania 21, but the match that catapulted both Orton's career and The Streak's credibility was built only in 4 weeks.

Still thinking six weeks, meaning 6 RAW & 6 Smackdown!, wouldn't be enough to build Undertaker vs Chris Jericho?

 

[JGlass]

I'm still not even slightly sold on a Triple H retirement angle. Dirt sheets are notoriously unreliable, and it's a known fact that professional wrestlers and their creative teams change their minds at an alarming rate. However, I will suspend my disbelief for the sake of the thread.

If Triple H is going to retire, six weeks is not enough to build up a legendary retirement angle. In fact, I would say it won't even be as good as HBK's retirement angle, which while very good, was not legendary. Then again, I think many or even most would argue that Triple H is not as deserving of a legendary retirement angle as Shawn Michaels is.

That said, it can still be very good. Imagine if Taker returned on Monday only to have Triple H come out and ruin is comeback. You take the two biggest legends in the WWE today and throw them in a volatile situation like that and the feud will already start with a bang. And as Ace of Knaves said, they have 6 RAWs and 6 Smackdowns to build the feud up as Triple H is a RAW superstar and Taker is a Smackdown guy. That's plenty of time to get a great feud going, especially between two guys as huge as they are.

 

[Hulk Hogan's Brother]

I'm not sold on the retirement angle either. Triple H lost his last feud and he is coming back only to lose another feud? And remember this is HHH we are talking about. I do not think that he would want to be remembered as the guy who lost his last two feuds.

But to the question at hand I do not think that 6 weeks is enough time to build an epic rivalry between the two. The only story that they have is Triple H saying that you ended my friend's career so I am going after yours. Now I know that HHH is HBK's best friend but do you think that it makes any sense to risk your career over something that cannot be undone? It's not like HBK would come back from his retirement if HHH won. This angle sounds a bit too over the top to me.

Six weeks is good enough to build that story alone but not enough to build a legendary retirement angle for HHH because the story itself is not good enough to be a retirement angle for a great wrestler like HHH.

I think that even if this match happens at WrestleMania, it will be not contain the retirement clause.

 

[Dark Horse]

I voted NO. It's not enough time to build the retirement of Triple H. At this point like others, I am beginning to think that he isn't coming back for WM anyways. This could be a clever swerve for Chris Jericho to return and face Taker at WM. That would be betting IMHO. Jericho could kick start a feud with Taker no problem, and I would trust that Undertaker is safer in the ring with him than just about anyone besides Triple H. You can still have HBK as the Special Guest Referee just to make it all the more interesting as well.

Triple H still has to deal with Sheamus, and he deserves a better send off than just laying down for Undertaker's Streak. I can't believe Shawn did in twice, and I wouldn't pay to see Triple H do it once. Not like that, not to someone older than him, in worse shape. It's going to have to be a younger guy. I personally wouldn't mind seeing Triple H put over John Morrison as the next HBK in this next year, and finishing next year if he is going to soon, against maybe Alberto Del Rio, or Jack Swagger. It has to be someone with some real in-ring tools that has some serious mileage left on them.

 

[nightmare]

definately not. its hard to build any sort of great storyline in a mere few weeks. (its happened b4, but has also failed alot of times) hunter\taker - career\streak is a temporary solution to the problem. it would technically be dragging out the storyline for the 3rd year & is having fans groan already by mentioning it. 'revenge for retiring my friend'- cmon. that would end 2 ways. HHH wins & shits on shawns matches with taker, or taker wins- with shawns help, because he cant stand to see hhh do what he couldnt. this wouldnt end well.

if people were quickly bored with kane\taker (a long standing storyline), then this would do more harm than good. a few weeks to build a send-off match for one of the greatest champs in wwe history? i would be terribly disappointed.

 

[rge2010]

Not just a case of Undertaker ending "his friends" career. Didnt HBK eliminate Triple H from the Royal Rumble because he was obsessed with facing Taker at Mania? Wasn't Triple H put out of action for 10 months at HBK's retirement night? Theres plenty to go on.

I cant see him coming back for a 6w week run and ending his career though. If he does "retire" it will be Kayfabe.

 

[trendkiller]

If the rumors are true, then I absolutely think that they can build the angle with only four or five weeks worth of TV time.

Both HHH and The Undertaker are so well known and over, all they'd have to do to build a Mania-worthy angle is to be in the ring together and stare each other down after Hunter talks about 'Taker retiring HBK and wanting revenge. That'd be it, then they'd upset one another's matches for three weeks and we'd be all set for Mania.

It's not like we're talking Primo vs Husky Harris here...

 

[TheKev]

I think a retierment angle is a huge slap in the face to the fans. It basicaly says to me HHH cant compete at a high standard anymore and wants one last pig pay-day. It strikes me as HHH trying to get the limelight for his retierment. Its basically Im back, oh Im gone again.

Why not just have HHH state he wants the match to announce his return after a lengthy absence. He is doing something big something nobody has ever done, not even his best friend. Then after he loses he can be the GM for a few months until he officially retires

 

[Mustang Sally]

There is no logical reason for this to be a match at Mania. Why because Taker retired HBK?

It will be interesting to see how this plays out, because it's true; there's no good reason for Triple H to be mad at Undertaker for retiring HBK. After all, 'Taker isn't the one who wanted that final match; HBK did. Remember 'Taker saying to Shawn: "You wanted my attention. You've got it."

Yes, Triple H is mad at 'Taker for some reason and the only possibility that comes to mind is getting revenge for his DX buddy. But I think it would be great if there were some other reason for this confrontation. We'll soon see.

Still, I just can't believe Triple H is in this thing just to retire after WM. He has business with Sheamus, for sure. Also, I can see an exciting program with Randy Orton; perhaps involving two 'tweeners going against each other, which is something I can't recall seeing before. So, if WM is a retirement match, some technicality will emerge that allows him to keep going.

Triple H has a few more years as an active wrestler. Even after he does retire to the front office, I believe we'll see him in the ring on occasion. So, I think the original question as to whether six weeks is enough time to build a retirement angle is moot, 'cause he ain't retiring.

 

[Dave]

No, it really isn't and therein lies my biggest aversion to this match.

The problem is that 6 weeks is not enough to do a lot of things, one of those is building enough interest in a retirement match. Shawn Michaels and Ric Flair both had months to build for their inevitable retirement parties and that is what made it so special. Shawn Michaels was basically feuding with The Undertaker since before the Royal Rumble last year and Flair's undefeated angle leading to his last match at WrestleMania was a long tale too. Neither of these were completed in 6 weeks and that is why this ought to be one of the least cared about matches on the WrestleMania card. For me, that is no way for one of the absolute best to go out.

I mean, I could be wrong. The WWE could throw everything they have at this feud and really take it all the way. However, I just can't see it getting the same sort of reaction that Ric Flair and Shawn Michaels got at their respective retirement matches. Everyone already knows that Triple H is not going to beat The Undertaker at WrestleMania. They know that if Shawn Michaels couldn't do it with two attempts, Triple H is not going to do it with a second, spanning ten years apart. For me, it is just not enough time to build this as being the last time we will see Triple H in a WWE ring in a wrestling capacity.

That being said, no one said anything about it being a retirement match last night. In fact, he seemed to accept the match without anything being put on the line. It is my hope that they leave the stipulation out and just have it be about vengeance for Michaels defeat. I pray for that nightly.

 

[itssoeasy123]

Well, if Triple H wants it this way, why not?

It's possible Wrestlemania 27 may be Triple H's last match. He's got a family, a job he really likes (Senior Advisor) and his own office in Stanford. He seems to like his new job and many superstar's seemingly do like him booking as well.

Maybe this is the way Triple H wants to go out? Maybe he want's to be a creative advisor more than a wrestler at his age, health, and because of his new family.

Even if he retires, we'll still see him. He's not leaving from WWE, he's just done wrestling.

6 week's doesn't seem long, but maybe it was a last minute thing? Maybe Undertaker was supposed to challenge Barret. Remember the report on numerous websites saying that Undertaker wanted to help out Barret, give a rub to Barret? But HHH probably said he wanted to stop wrestling and "retire" at Wresltemania trying to avenge his friend? That's probably why this seem's rushed.

Anyway, don't be worried, WM 27 won't be the last time we see Triple H on screen.

 

[The Ace of Knaves]

Shawn Michaels and Ric Flair both had months to build for their inevitable retirement parties and that is what made it so special. Shawn Michaels was basically feuding with The Undertaker since before the Royal Rumble last year and Flair's undefeated angle leading to his last match at WrestleMania was a long tale too.

My apologies, but what Ric Flair's retirement? Didn't he wrestle in TNA after that? Mind explaining to me how you call that a retirement?

However, I just can't see it getting the same sort of reaction that Ric Flair and Shawn Michaels got at their respective retirement matches.

I doubt Steph and Vince wouldn't do anything big to hype HHH's last match seeing how he's their family.

And again, I beg for an explanation about Ric Flair's retirement. What retirement? Didn't he wrestle in TNA after that? Mind explaining to me how you call that a retirement?

Everyone already knows that Triple H is not going to beat The Undertaker at WrestleMania. They know that if Shawn Michaels couldn't do it with two attempts, Triple H is not going to do it with a second, spanning ten years apart. For me, it is just not enough time to build this as being the last time we will see Triple H in a WWE ring in a wrestling capacity.

As I said above, there's no guarantee Steph and Vince wouldn't do anything huge for this.

Then again, maybe the low expectations from IWC would allow Taker & HHH to perform better.

That being said, no one said anything about it being a retirement match last night. In fact, he seemed to accept the match without anything being put on the line. It is my hope that they leave the stipulation out and just have it be about vengeance for Michaels defeat. I pray for that nightly.

Begging to differ here, mate. I hope IT IS indeed a retirement match. Going 19-0 but only defeating 17 men is beyond ridiculous, not to mention out of those 17 names only 12 of them are credible names seeing how Gonzales, Bundy, A-Train, Boss Man, and Henry got added only because Vince had a hard on seeing them.

And this is precisely why Streak vs Career is needed, because the credibility of retiring Triple H will make up for the lack of men and new credibility Undertaker could gain by defeating someone new (who is credible of course like CM Punk or Jericho. I'm not talking about overrated rookies like Sheamus or Ted DiBiase Jr here).

Doing Taker vs HHH AGAIN but not putting HHH's career will be as pointless as the abomination of a rematch which was Undertaker vs Kane at Wrestlemania 20. Comparing that match to their legendary match at Wrestlemania 14 is an insult. And defeating Kane again by that time who was a glorified jobbed instead of a monster didn't add any new credibility for The Streak. That match really should have gone to someone else like Lesnar, Goldberg, Rock, Jericho, or even Vince himself.

There, I made my point.

Cannot wait to see your reply, mate.

 

[The Mark of Zur-En-Arrh]

Why's everyone so hung up on the 'HHH has no reason to do this?' idea? Of course he does. TO END THE FUCKIN STREAK! The one thing he's never done in his whole career. What better way to truly cement himself as the King of Kings than to end The Phenom's legendary undefeated record?

Isn't that why HBK wanted to do it in the first place? And wasn't HBK/Taker at WM25 only built up in 6 weeks. He beat Kozlov for the opportunity the Raw after EC did he not?

And they could even use this to turn The Game heel if they wanted to. I'm not saying they should, but i do think HHH is a far more effective heel than he is a face. Why not come out and say 'For years i had to play second fiddle to HBK, and even though I've had an awesome run in his absence, i still can't shake the feeling that people view me as being beneath him. Well now's the time to prove that I am The Game, that I am THAT damn good, that I am The King of Kings, and that I AM MR WRESTLEMANIA, by doing what Shawn couldn't do in two separate attempts. End the Undertaker's undefeated streak!', and then it goes on from there.

And then Taker says 'Fine Hunter, you want another shot at me at WM27? You want to prove you were always better than Shawn Michaels? Then i'll give you what you desire most, but you get the same deal he got. Win and you end my streak and get to brag forever more, lose and i end your career and own your soul forever, because 'The King of Kings' will officially be DEAD!'

Just by saying he wants to surpass HBK would be enough to turn some fans against him (not all, but some) and he can use some shady tactics to hurt Taker before the show on the build up, proving also why he's the Cerebral Assassin.

They can even go over their WM17 match as well. Taker can bring up the fact that he and HHH had a full blown war at Mania 17, and HHH even resorted to smashing Taker in the head with a sledgehammer, and STILL lost. HBK didn't cheat like that and he pushed Taker to the edge far more in either of his attempts than HHH did in 2001.

But fuck man, even if neither of them appeared on TV again between now and Mania, i'd still buy it just to see that match. It'll probably be the best match on the card even if it doesn't meet our expectations/hype, and hell i'd rather see Taker/HHH in the ME of WM with zero build than Cena/Miz or Del Rio/Edge with a month and a half of build up each.