Fortune vs ?

[shattered dreams]

The EV2-Fortune story looks to be winding down and I doubt anyone is exactly broken hearted about that development. However, where does fortune go from here? To sell the fortune concept in the current climate they essentially need a new group to feud with. The question is who should it be? It seems a little early to turn on immortal, so maybe a new faction has to be put together. One interesting option could be, if fortune and doug williams finally part ways, the group could take on the british invasion including Wolfe this time. Certainly wouldn't hurt business if that feud reached its climax around the time of the euro tour in January.

 

[It's Damn Real!]

The writing is already on the wall with Pope, Anderson, Morgan and Joe, as well as with Nash and Sting (eventually).

Fortune is aligned (albeit loosely) with Immortal who are feuding directly with Joe (via Jarrett), Anderson & Morgan (via Bischoff and Hardy) and Pope (via Abyss) — may as well go full force if you ask me.

Then again, why do they need to feud with another faction per say? A makeshift group who only assemble as a strength-in-numbers strategy would be perfectly fine — like Beer Money, Inc. v. Motor City Machineguns, etc.

 

[Serious Mozzarella]

How many factions do you need before it looks like you're just throwing random guys together, like it's some WWE tag team? They need to be thinking of creative ways to extend the storyline before it gets excessively stale and boring, without throwing unnecessary shit at it, like yet another stable.

It doesn't help that every stable in TNA are pretty much involved in the same storyline.

 

[goodlay]

How many factions do you need before it looks like you're just throwing random guys together, like it's some WWE tag team? They need to be thinking of creative ways to extend the storyline before it gets excessively stale and boring, without throwing unnecessary shit at it, like yet another stable.

It doesn't help that every stable in TNA are pretty much involved in the same storyline.

I'm with you on this one. This whole stable wars thing is just overkill at this point. With EV2 slowly leaving TNA, hopefully this will end it. I'd rather just see Fortune feud with guys like Pope, Joe, and Anderson.

I think at this point TNA can have a pretty decent storyline with guys like Pope and Anderson (when he returns) knowing that they can't take out Immortal/Fortune by themselves, so they then are forced to work together. You also have another potentially interesting storyline in Anderson chasing the world title after being screwed.

Or it could be something different, I really don't care. I just hope TNA does something to keep this Immortal/Fortune storyline interesting, because right now its appeal is just about gone.

 

[The Holy One]

I agree with those who have said another stable war being a bad idea, but as for what's next for Fortune. I see them trying to cement their take over by going after the titles that isn't controlled by Immortal. Beer Money will probably revamped their fued with the Guns and Kazarian will probably go after X title. I see Williams splitting from the group sometime in the next few weeks and then fued with AJ for the TV title.

 

[wushady]

The writing is already on the wall with Pope, Anderson, Morgan and Joe, as well as with Nash and Sting (eventually).

Fortune is aligned (albeit loosely) with Immortal who are feuding directly with Joe (via Jarrett), Anderson & Morgan (via Bischoff and Hardy) and Pope (via Abyss) — may as well go full force if you ask me.

Then again, why do they need to feud with another faction per say? A makeshift group who only assemble as a strength-in-numbers strategy would be perfectly fine — like Beer Money, Inc. v. Motor City Machineguns, etc.

I don't always agree with you mainly, because you hate WWE so much. I am a bigger fan of WWE, but lately I'm enjoying TNA a lot more now. On topic I don't really think they really need to feud with another faction right now. They are already aligned with Immortal, and loosely involved with their feuds.

A makeshift strength in numbers faction to stand up to Fortune would be fine in my opinion. As long as it doesn't last long. The last thing I want to see is multiple factions like it was in WWF back in the mid to late 90's. The show had been taken over by multiple factions feuding with each others. It was billed as gang warfare, and that's another thing I don't want TNA to rehash.

The more factions they bring in makes the current factions look less dominate in my opinion.

 

[shattered dreams]

Not sure what people have against "stable wars." IMO that is a pretty realistic approach to conflict when one group has formed a coalition that is greater than any individual. The choice in TNAs case is keep all these guys individual or form a group at some point. If they keep them individual then fortune/immortal reigns until there is a divide in their group. If not an alliance of two different subgroups could potentially oppose them.

I'd buy into letting immortal fortune reign for a while as fortune sought to win all the other titles but it doesn't fit to me. Beer Money and MCMG already had their feud and bringing it back up for a cheap beer money win hurts what the two teams accomplished already. Robbie is the X champ right now and seems a poor choice to be booked to fight vs heels.

The thing about what type of group could oppose them is that just picking everybody they are screwing with seems an odd fit: Pope, Anderson, Morgan, Joe, Nash, Sting, RVD and Angle. It is almost all guys that tend to be high on the card and many tend to be loners. Sure there is intrigue in that but it also seems too powerful and lacking in roles for people to grow into.

 

[MB1025]

What they need to do is have people in Fortune feud separately. I think at some point Hogan and or Flair needs to cut a promo and say that to have true power we need all the titles. In WCW it didn't matter if a face or heel had a title the NWO went after it. I think this would be a perfect time for Beer Money and Motor City to start a feud again. This time have other members of Fortune Immortal decide the outcome. Can you imagine MCMG being in the same ring with Hogan or Flair. Just being in a program with them would speak volumes. I would also have Kaz go after the X Division title. To me Abyss and Jarrett don't need titles.

 

[Serious Mozzarella]

Not sure what people have against "stable wars." IMO that is a pretty realistic approach to conflict when one group has formed a coalition that is greater than any individual. The choice in TNAs case is keep all these guys individual or form a group at some point. If they keep them individual then fortune/immortal reigns until there is a divide in their group. If not an alliance of two different subgroups could potentially oppose them.

I don't actually mind the stable wars idea. In fact, I would actually quite enjoy it. But you're suggesting we throw in yet another stable into the mix. The stables we have are fine -- anything else would be severely bordering on overkill. Plus, who else could they use? The people who aren't in a stable are pretty much stabled up as it is, just being called "part of the TNA roster" as opposed to the Immortals and Fortune, who seem to enjoy being referred to as part of their own thing, independent of TNA.

 

[takerfan24]

i think they should stiill be a team but feud as singles or tag team wrestlers, kaz with the robbie e guy who holds the x divison champ and beer money with mcmg and aj with a rising star like jay lethal or maybe amazing red or brian kendrick (i just got those names off the top of my head so dont hate) and it would mean these guys kick ass if they have each others backs or not

Thts just fortune and thts y i didnt say names like pope or joe or morgon

 

[Alastor]

The enemy of my enemy is my friend reason to band together to form a stable gets old really quick. Any stable formed in this manner should occur near the break up of the other stable so it can be the end of the storyline. Like a chink in one's armor, in this case Fortune's armor.

I don't think TNA wants to break Fortune up yet so as of now, I would rather the wrestlers in Fortune have personal feuds with other wrestlers, and occasionally throw together a big tag with Fortune vs the rest so they can be seen together in the ring.

 

[shattered dreams]

I don't actually mind the stable wars idea. In fact, I would actually quite enjoy it. But you're suggesting we throw in yet another stable into the mix.

How can it be stable wars without a new stable? The only stables there are currently are on the same team.

The stables we have are fine -- anything else would be severely bordering on overkill. Plus, who else could they use? The people who aren't in a stable are pretty much stabled up as it is, just being called "part of the TNA roster" as opposed to the Immortals and Fortune, who seem to enjoy being referred to as part of their own thing, independent of TNA.

Actually, a key part of the storyline since BFG is that this underlined part is clearly not true. None of these guys have each others back because no one trusts anyone. Immortal fortune has been highly successful at divide and conquer.

 

[Serious Mozzarella]

How can it be stable wars without a new stable? The only stables there are currently are on the same team.

The fact that there are two stables that are aligned makes no sense. What goal are they working toward? The TNA championship? Immortal already has it. What's Fortune trying to do? Then we have EV2, who I guess are currently in the process of wrapping up, but weren't they just getting started a couple of months ago? They shouldn't have happened in the first place.

You can't just throw stables at a storyline and expect it to float. Sure, if you want to have stable warfare, make the storyline compelling. Don't just throw a bunch of random guys together and call it a stable, simply because you need an equal amount of guys in the ring.

Actually, a key part of the storyline since BFG is that this underlined part is clearly not true. None of these guys have each others back because no one trusts anyone. Immortal fortune has been highly successful at divide and conquer.

My point is the numerous references to Immortal "taking over" TNA. If you have a group of guys coming in, naturally you're going to think it's those guys vs. TNA. The problem with your statement is, if no one trusts each other, what kind of stable are you going to create, and how would it make sense if no one trusts each other?

 

[shattered dreams]

You can't just throw stables at a storyline and expect it to float. Sure, if you want to have stable warfare, make the storyline compelling. Don't just throw a bunch of random guys together and call it a stable, simply because you need an equal amount of guys in the ring.

My point is the numerous references to Immortal "taking over" TNA. If you have a group of guys coming in, naturally you're going to think it's those guys vs. TNA. The problem with your statement is, if no one trusts each other, what kind of stable are you going to create, and how would it make sense if no one trusts each other?

You are the one that said there already was a stable like this, not me. I said this stable does not exist precisely because of the distrust issue. You said this "stable," which essentially would obviously be consisting of random guys thrown together (something you say not to do above), is good enough to have the stable wars you are not opposed to. My contention was that they should form at least one, maybe two, stables that make sense within the storylines to have a real back and forth between groups. You said no more stables were needed. You seem to be contradicting your point a lot.

The idea is that at some point the faces have to realize that going it alone is not going to work vs the supergroup. Some of them eventually find a common thread and are able to trust. That or immortal's plan works and they reign supreme.

The fact that there are two stables that are aligned makes no sense. What goal are they working toward? The TNA championship? Immortal already has it. What's Fortune trying to do?

They have been kayfabe working together for months in the pursuit of power aka running/owning the company. It is not two actual different stables, it is one supergroup.

 

[Serious Mozzarella]

You are the one that said there already was a stable like this, not me. I said this stable does not exist precisely because of the distrust issue. You said this "stable," which essentially would obviously be consisting of random guys thrown together (something you say not to do above), is good enough to have the stable wars you are not opposed to. My contention was that they should form at least one, maybe two, stables that make sense within the storylines to have a real back and forth between groups. You said no more stables were needed. You seem to be contradicting your point a lot.

Can you read?

I don't think a stable is needed because it's natural to think it'd be Immortal vs. the rest of TNA at this point. You said no one trusts each other for them to be teamed up. I then asked how you propose a new stable would work if no one trusts each other? You're the one who suggested an entirely new stable.

I absolutely do not think they need to create yet another stable (a defined group of people with a name and a goal). I think it would make more sense if the rest of TNA united against Immortal. Which is not a defined group of people with a name, unless you want to refer to an entire company of wrestlers a stable. No one contradicted anything.

The idea is that at some point the faces have to realize that going it alone is not going to work vs the supergroup. Some of them eventually find a common thread and are able to trust. That or immortal's plan works and they reign supreme.

That's exactly what I think would make the most sense. You're the one arguing against the point. The only problem I can see with this is that if a stable is created, there will be no reason for the stable to exist beyond dealing with Immortal and Fortune. They would have to find a reason for the stable to break up that's not as boring as, "Well, we're finished here. Let's get back to work, guys."

 

[shattered dreams]

The only thing I am arguing against is you saying that some loose alliance of literally everyone else in TNA for the awe inspiring reason of by default isn't overkill while picking one or two groups of 4ish wrestlers with a common goal or thread is for some reason. Makes zero sense to me. Right now this storyline has nothing to do with what is going on in the X, Tag or KOs divisions and I think that is a good thing. Why arbitrarily involve everyone?

That's exactly what I think would make the most sense. You're the one arguing against the point.

You have a strange way of showing it because "that" is the formation of another subgroup. How am I arguing against this idea in any possible way? This whole back and forth started because you said no more stables in response to me saying there might be a need for some.

The only problem I can see with this is that if a stable is created, there will be no reason for the stable to exist beyond dealing with Immortal and Fortune. They would have to find a reason for the stable to break up that's not as boring as, "Well, we're finished here. Let's get back to work, guys."

Once the common thread is gone then people tend to get jealous about titles etc. You go from there. This also assumes the face group actually wins before they breakup which is no given.

 

[Hulk Hogan's Brother]

I think that Anderson will be Hardy's prime foe. Fourtune will be the ones to keep the rest of the midcard babyfaces at bay. Guys like Pope, Morgan and RVD will feud with fourtune. I think that at a much later date this is what will cause resentment between the Immortals and Fourtune because Fourtune will point out that they are the ones doing the hard work while Immortal is just resting on their ie Fortune's laurels.

This is what will lead to a split.

 

[Zeven_Zion]

I really really really want to see The Guns thrown into the mix, mainly to feud with Beer Money again. It will help The Guns a whole lot because it's the main storyline of TNA they're a part of, plus we'll see some SWEET matches. Here's how I'd want to see feuds between faces and heels. It's pretty much the same thing TNA's doing with a couple exceptions.

AJ Styles and Kurt Angle -- Whenever these two get in the ring and bust their ass like we know they do, we witness classics.

The Pope and Abyss -- Not too fond of their matches, but it's nice for entertainment purposes. It fits Pope's gimmick to fight an evil monstah.

The Guns and Beer Money -- Need I say more?

- The following is a spoiler, don't click on it unless you read the spoilers please -

Spoiler

Doug Williams and Kazarian - I really liked their little match at iMPACT. Doug is so underrated. I can see these two tearing it down.

Anderson and Hardy - Main match of the feud. I expect these two to deliver on the mic [ Anderson mostly ], and in the ring.

Joe and Double J -- JJ impresses me more and more with each passing week. Joe is Joe - he's awesome. These two together? I likey.

Morgan and Flair, just 'cause there's nothing left for him -- Couldn't give two shits about that. It makes sense, storyline wise, Morgan being his former insurance thingy, but still, I don't think that these two can deliver in the ring. I'm more worried about Morgan than Flair. Flair will do his thing, I don't think Morgan can keep up with a 60 years old who apparently forgot that he's 60 and thinks he's 30 again.

 

[Vintage]

This is how it seems this angle is going to me. Fortune ends up feuding with Immortal.

Fortune aligns with Immortal to gain an advantage over EV2. It's also smart business until the competition is eliminated. After EV2 is eliminated from the picture over the next few weeks we get to final resolution where Fortune shows their hand with all of them in the feast or fired match. Flair tells Bischoff that Fortune only wants to protect the World Title where the real goal is to hold all the titles at once. While all of this is going down, Immortal is feuding with everyone else. Fortune ends up gaining the tagand x title shots with AJ having the briefcase with the world title shot. Bischoff goes ballistic, flair cuts an epic promo on him and Hogan and our feud is on.

I'd personally also like to see The Anti Christ and Matthew do a 2 man power trip with Matthew getting the x-title and the Hardys with the tag straps for Immortal.

It won't happen, but it's better than Frontline 2.0 It could work.. but Immortal needs more members which is probably why they were put with Fortune to begin with. Abyss, Jarrett and Hardy can't carry the load alone.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

I think Fortune is already pretty stale due in large part to the long and unnecessarily dragged out feud with EV2.0. At this particular time, I think a feud with Immortal would just be extremely lackluster. A big reason is that Immortal is comprised, as far as the in-ring stuff goes, of Jeff Hardy & Abyss. The idea of Hardy & Abyss standing alone in matches against Fortune is a very hard pill to swallow. The other route would be to have Hardy & Abyss hold their own and that would only make Fortune look like a bunch of scrubs. If a Fortune/Immortal feud happens at some point, Immortal has to recruit more members.

As of right now, however, the better bet would be for Fortune to be against the likes of Angle, Joe, Matt Morgan, Anderson & maybe even toss in the Guns as opposition for Beer Money. It sounds more interesting than another TNA faction war in my opinion.

 

[EthanMcPowersII]

How about making an "Avengers" stable?

The Avengers are a group of heroes who really have nothing in common, except fot fighting evil, and are already so big that they thrully do not need each other, but they still team up. Avengers members generally join and leave the group as is fit to their storyline. The only person who is really a set Avenger is Captain America.

I think this would work in TNA, have one main guy, the face of the company, who is the main opposition (I'm thinking either Morgan or Angel, maybe even Anderson or Pope) but then, have the faces come and go as is needed for their storyline, they don't really need each other to become big, they just share a common storyline, and then they can leave when they don't have any use for the group.

They can also do a 'Magnificent Seven' stable. My thought is this, Doug Williams leaves Fourtune, and he realizes that the faces need to form one group, so he recruits six wrestlers. The Magnificent Seven also did not trust each other at first, but they learned to get along.

 

[EthanMcPowersII]

They can also do a 'Magnificent Seven' stable. My thought is this, Doug Williams leaves Fourtune, and he realizes that the faces need to form one group, so he recruits six wrestlers. The Magnificent Seven also did not trust each other at first, but they learned to get along.

My reason for Doug Williams forming the group instead of one of the bigger groups is because in the 'Magnificent Seven' storyline, or even in the original 'Samurai Seven' it was a minor character that went to the main hero for help, and thus the group was started.

 

[radec]

the stable wars are killing this and EV2 never wins and i dont see the joy in that. EV2 should die and fortune should turn on immortal. Jeff hardy dosent compone crap as champion and barly has a storyline.

 

[Zeven_Zion]

the stable wars are killing this and EV2 never wins and i dont see the joy in that. EV2 should die and fortune should turn on immortal. Jeff hardy dosent compone crap as champion and barly has a storyline.

Okay, genius. I constantly hear "Fortune should turn on Immortal". Sometimes I wonder if you people have brains. What happens if Fourtune turns on Immortal? You've got Beer Money, Kaz and AJ against Abyss, Hardy and Double J. First problem is that it's 4 on 3. Second problem is -- who the hell are all the faces going to feud with? What about RVD, Anderson, Angle, Joe, Pope, Morgan? Are they going to fight against eachother? Fourtune turning on Immortal at this point in TNA would be the dumbest fucking move ever. That trashes the last 10 months. The "they" storyline was carefully calculated to pitch the current faces against the current heels. Fourtune turning on Immortal would fuck that up the ass. Is Angle just going to forget about Double J's actions? Is Anderson going to forgive Hardy and Immortal for screwing him? Is RVD all of a sudden fine with the current events? Matt Morgan wants no revenge? Pope got scared away by Janice? Or you want the faces to join Fourtune? What happens then? A huge face stable against a small heel stable. That makes absolutely no sense. Faces should NEVER look superior to the heels. Their job is to overcome the odds.

So go ahead, explain just how in the hell is Fourtune turning on Immortal going to work.