Wrestlers have to eventually retire after reaching a certain age.There are many ways to leave to wrestling,out of those ways ,the main ways are firing a wrestler,or the wrestler eventually retiring like Ric Flair and Shawn Michaels did.Fire,for example like chris jerciho did in 2005 (but he came back),Mick Foley did (but he too came back).I think firing is a good way because u have a good way to retire because wrestlers can eventually come back and retain their legacy unlike Rick flaire who is destroyin legacy every time he appears.This is my first thread in the wrestling section ,so be easy on me,and moderaters feel free to delete this thread if u dont like it.
Fire or Retire:which Is The Better Way To Leave Wrestling?
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AntiChristDeicide
Championship Contender
Hummm don't want to bash you, but do you realize that the firing a wrestler /diva when he/she returns is only for storyline purposes? Even retiring a wrestlers/diva is used for storyline purposes. The only ways those things can be legit is if he/she legitly pisses off the boss to the point that there is no way that keeping the wrestler/diva is possible. Or if the wrestler/diva is injured to the point that taking a bump would kill that person ( see Edge).
If theres a chance your going to come back, like when Jericho and left, and just want a break then firing. However if like say HBK that's it and your leaving for good then retiring. Firing means you go out but it looks like it's against your will. It leaves unfinished buisness. Retiring suggests you're gone for good and it was your last hurrah.
Rampage Bentley
Saving WZ one post at a time.
That's not an ignorant statement at all, in fact the existing ignorance is turning a blind eye to Ric Flair's destruction of his legacy. No one is "so big" that they can't tarnish it. Look at Hulk Hogan, he's got a much bigger legacy than Ric Flair and he's pretty much killed his.
Ric isn't even a shadow of his former self, in his own admission, he hasn't done anything great since his feud with Steamboat, which was over twenty years ago. Flair is Favreing himself...
Now onto the main topic, I think people don't get what the OP is trying to say, it took me a bit, but what he's asking is, is it better to announce you're retiring and do the whole big send off thing, or to use your retirement in a firing angle.
Do you even know what a "ruined legacy" looks like? Try O.J. Simpson. Try Chris Benoit. Try Richard Nixon. A legacy is only ruined when something negative that you've done becomes the most famous thing about you. Nobody is going to look back on Hogan or Flair historically and say they weren't the iconic figures of wrestling because they hang around too long.
Just look at Mike Tyson; for all the crazy he's displayed people still focus on his dominant boxing in the 80s. Look at Bill Clinton or the late Michael Jackson; people still focus on their positives first and bring up other issues as a footnote. And the futher we move along in history, the more those footnotes fade.
You people need to stop talking absolutes and display a little reason sometimes.
AntiChristDeicide
Championship Contender
Now onto the main topic, I think people don't get what the OP is trying to say, it took me a bit, but what he's asking is, is it better to announce you're retiring and do the whole big send off thing, or to use your retirement in a firing angle.
Yurnewhero, well i kinda answered his question . I said that unless the wrestler/diva has a serious legit injury ( a la Edge) and/or pisses off the boss to the point that its impossible to keep the wrestler/diva on the roster those are always used for storyline purposes.
Yurnewhero, well i kinda answered his question . I said that unless the wrestler/diva has a serious legit injury ( a la Edge) and/or pisses off the boss to the point that its impossible to keep the wrestler/diva on the roster those are always used for storyline purposes.
Long Island Iced D
Dedicated Zack Ryder Nut-hugger
I would say the best way would just to do what the Rock did at Backlash 2003 I believe after he lot to Goldberg. He off camera told the fans he would be taking time off and left the door open for him to come back. But if the wrestler/superstar knows they are done and have made their decision I think its nice to have that retirement match and the whole farewell speech and ceremony thing. Honestly, it depends on the superstar and the situation.
Rampage Bentley
Saving WZ one post at a time.
There's definitely different levels of a ruined legacy, and your right, Ric Flair and Hulk Hogan do not fit in the same levels as OJ Simpson and Chris Benoit.
But I gave the example of Bret Favre in comparison to Flair, both stayed past their prime, and both need to learn to stop flashing their penis. Hogan and Flair haven't comitted atrocities, but their names don't carry the same weight they use to.
jholcomb22
Pre-Show Stalwart
Because the firings we are talking about are kayfabe, I prefer them to retiring. If a wrestler retires, it's bittersweet if they return. Main example here is Ric Flair. It's great that he still wants to be in the wrestling industry, but he made his "last match" with Shawn Michaels completely meaningless in hindsight.
If a wrestler gets fired, and then comes back, it's usually unexpected, and a welcome surprise.
Some of the best "retirements" though are the ones that have no build up, the wrestler just gets so mad, they quit out of the blue like JBL and Batista. Those are classic.
If a wrestler gets fired, and then comes back, it's usually unexpected, and a welcome surprise.
Some of the best "retirements" though are the ones that have no build up, the wrestler just gets so mad, they quit out of the blue like JBL and Batista. Those are classic.
I think if you get Fired it does leave more unrest with your wrestling fans and an uneasy feeling, retiring you give them the last harrah and thank you all for your support. As far as Ric Flair's legacy he has ruined it not to you and I who are in our 20's and up, anyone under that age sees and old man who makes wrestling lose its credibility and believability, when he took that fall of the ladder few years back and came back to finish the match he made me believe the epic match with Shawn Micheals made him my hero for the first time ever, to me he was always a heel I despised and hated which is a gret thing he was like the Joker to Batman. Now I cant tell those great stories to my little brother or growing wrestling fans because they turn on the TV and watch a sloppy old man and thats the image theyll remember and stories they will tell. Steamboat did the opposite put on a legendary performance that kids will dream they got to see him in his prime.
Well it use to and in theory you are 100% correct
but how many people in the past have officially "retired" or losing a retirement match only to keep going a month later.
HBK has retired twice
Ric Flair has retired more times then he's been world champ
Terry Funk has been retiring for the past 20yrs lol
Hulk Hogan technically retired at his HOF induction, one more match has turned into dozens
Some people just can't give up and others may have intention to but can't do anything else
1 - Retiring officially is going out on your own terms - which is best for the person
2 - Being fired (in storyline) is good for the everyone as it leaves things open to continue a storyline and caters to the fans of both sides of the equation
3 - Being fired legit is bad for either side depending on who's fault it was.
4 - Retiring/Being forced to retire in storyline is just dumb, very few people wouldn't realise it's bullshit. ie John Cena getting the sack by a party that's not even in charge of the company DER!!!!
ultraviolence
Occasional Pre-Show
I disagree, Ric Flair got one of the biggest and best send offs I have ever seen, The Undertaker came out and did his one knee bow thing to honor him, he does that for now one. Ric should have retired and gotten into something else.
MachoMadness8894
Dark Match Jobber
Well, being wrestling, being fired isn't like being fired from a day time job. I really like what Jericho does because he doesn't become one of those burnt up guys who leaves for 8 years at a time! He leaves and lets the fans see him for who Chris Irving really is! So we respect his character(Heel or face) more.
Now, I also like when guys like Undertaker leave for months at a time without a word. That's how I would want to leave wrestling. but it didn't work so well for The Rock because he gets ridiculous heat for "forgetting about his first family"
To answer the question, retiring is still much more of a humble, drop the character, thing to do!
Now, I also like when guys like Undertaker leave for months at a time without a word. That's how I would want to leave wrestling. but it didn't work so well for The Rock because he gets ridiculous heat for "forgetting about his first family"
To answer the question, retiring is still much more of a humble, drop the character, thing to do!
SyndicateSaint
Occasional Pre-Show
I think that if it's a heel, sure. Use a firing angle. Jericho had a good explanation on his DVD. But, if you are a face and you meant something to wrestling *excuse me...* "entertainment", then a retirement angle would be good. When I was a kid and had aspirations of being a wrestler, I wanted to to an Inoki Retirement tour kind of thing, and give my gimmick to a new wrestler. I'd want to unmask in a ring, and then announce a new person to take up my mask. It would be epic....
But anyway, I figure if someone is legit done with wrestling, then Face: retirement. Heel: firing. Besides, in the end it's all about the fans, so if the fans dig the guy/girl, why not let them go out with a bang?
But anyway, I figure if someone is legit done with wrestling, then Face: retirement. Heel: firing. Besides, in the end it's all about the fans, so if the fans dig the guy/girl, why not let them go out with a bang?
Maddog Lionheart
Best Sig In The World......
I would rather see a Superstar retire in my opinion. It's a very good way to leave the buisness and when you randomly come back for like just a show or something, it always, will be a great time for the fans. (HBK giving Del Rio Sweet Chin Music)
The Dragon Saga
Whale in a Teardrop
Obviously retire. But the thing is, nobody ever truly retires without a legacy. Ric Flair never actually retired from wrestling, he retired from WWE. It was different. Shawn Michaels has retired, to preserve his legacy. Bret Hart was retired by injury, and he has a great legacy. Some guys, not really. Does Ultimate Warrior have a fantastic legacy? Not so much.
If you get fired, or released, its the way it goes. Your time is done, you may be needed once again. I mean, Mick Foley is going to be released in early September. Is that it for him? Doubt it. If he retired would he have a legacy? Yeah, a pretty good one.
It all depends on the situation.
If you get fired, or released, its the way it goes. Your time is done, you may be needed once again. I mean, Mick Foley is going to be released in early September. Is that it for him? Doubt it. If he retired would he have a legacy? Yeah, a pretty good one.
It all depends on the situation.
xoxo French Kiss xoxo
Pourquoi?
Are you talking Fired
-as in Future Endeavors - it doesn't mean the end of your WWE Career, but it sure does stop your progress within the company, and opens you up to go to TNA for free money
-or Fired as in Dolph Ziggler and Vicki are fired from Smackdown only to be hired on Raw? The story line firing thats used to move talent around, or to advance a story line, Jericho getting fired by the GM so he could take a break from wrestling after losing to Cena 3 times in a row
Retirements work for those wrestlers who want to retire. Flair should of took his WWE retirement like HBK and gone completely away from wrestling. JBL left because he felt he was a top draw, when he was never anything bigger than a middle carder. Batista was the same way, he wanted more money and felt that going the "I'm a complete pussy like the Rock" route was his best option.
-as in Future Endeavors - it doesn't mean the end of your WWE Career, but it sure does stop your progress within the company, and opens you up to go to TNA for free money
-or Fired as in Dolph Ziggler and Vicki are fired from Smackdown only to be hired on Raw? The story line firing thats used to move talent around, or to advance a story line, Jericho getting fired by the GM so he could take a break from wrestling after losing to Cena 3 times in a row
Retirements work for those wrestlers who want to retire. Flair should of took his WWE retirement like HBK and gone completely away from wrestling. JBL left because he felt he was a top draw, when he was never anything bigger than a middle carder. Batista was the same way, he wanted more money and felt that going the "I'm a complete pussy like the Rock" route was his best option.
What is all this horseshit about Hulk Hogan and Ric Flair destroying their legacies???
Only the smarks are going to be talking about how the two didn't go out at the top of their career and worked longer than they 'should have' in ten years. I'm sure Ric Flair cares a whole hell of a lot more about what people on the internet think about him than he cares about paying off divorce lawyers and ex-wives. I'm sure that what people think of him on the message boards keeps Hogan awake more than the thought of paying for his son's stupidities and buying his daughter an entertainment career.
People don't remember Hemmingway for going babbling and insane right before he shot himself. They remember him for The Sun Also Rises, A Farewell to Arms and For Whom The Bell Tolls. You want to talk about destroying a legacy? Working a few years 'too long', in some people's eyes, is nothing. Let's talk Benoit. Let's talk OJ. Let's talk Barry Bonds.
It doesn't matter how you go out, unless it's by killing your wife and son. It matters what you did during the years people remember you best.
Only the smarks are going to be talking about how the two didn't go out at the top of their career and worked longer than they 'should have' in ten years. I'm sure Ric Flair cares a whole hell of a lot more about what people on the internet think about him than he cares about paying off divorce lawyers and ex-wives. I'm sure that what people think of him on the message boards keeps Hogan awake more than the thought of paying for his son's stupidities and buying his daughter an entertainment career.
People don't remember Hemmingway for going babbling and insane right before he shot himself. They remember him for The Sun Also Rises, A Farewell to Arms and For Whom The Bell Tolls. You want to talk about destroying a legacy? Working a few years 'too long', in some people's eyes, is nothing. Let's talk Benoit. Let's talk OJ. Let's talk Barry Bonds.
It doesn't matter how you go out, unless it's by killing your wife and son. It matters what you did during the years people remember you best.
Word. Hogan and Flair have had legal bills coming out the wazoo since their respective divorces. As for tarnishing legacies, not enough people watch TNA for it to matter in the grand scheme of things. Hulk Hogan will always be remembered for his greatest achievements, Suburban Commando and Thunder in Paradise, while to me Ric Flair will always be that guy who wooooo'd around a really fake looking mental institution for months on end on Monday Nitro.
EDIT -
Thank *fuck* I managed to avoid mentioning Mister Nanny...
Calderownz
Brilliant Idiot
In a story line sense, I prefer the firing aspect of it.
The reason I prefer this is because it leaves the door open for a return without having to make the wrestler look like he's flip-flopping. It also makes for better television than just the one week of a wrestler saying goodbye and then walking off to a sappy video montage.
However, at certain times, it makes sense. Edge made sense, for obvious reasons.
The reason I prefer this is because it leaves the door open for a return without having to make the wrestler look like he's flip-flopping. It also makes for better television than just the one week of a wrestler saying goodbye and then walking off to a sappy video montage.
However, at certain times, it makes sense. Edge made sense, for obvious reasons.
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