Downloading Music

[Syn]

Downloading music is not illegal in canada. RCMP have declared it would cause too much hassle and use up too many resources to try and enforce it. However, only applies to personal use. Cannot share it with others in a public setting, or sell it/give it away.

I download alot of music. Whether its from torrents, random hosting sites that have mp3s, or ripping songs from Myspace

However i also buy alot of music. If i download an album and really like it, or it belongs to one of my favorite bands (Breaking Benjamin, Trapt, Linkin Park for ex) I will buy it on CD. If i only like a few songs, I will download the mp3's off of itunes and pay for them.

Between myself, my gf and her dads collections. We probably have close to 1000 different artists cds (not counting each album for each artist). And ive bought least a hundred singles off itunes

At no time do i feel guilty about downloading an album off a torrent to see if its any good.

 

[itssoeasy123]

I admit to have downloaded a shitload of music either from torrent files or from mp3 files. The reason is becuase I'm not employed and don't really have a healthy income to buy album's of artist I like.

Don't get me wrong I get album's, one time I got ten ablum's. It's only when I have money from my college or form a relevative that I can really purchase an album. And yes, I want to get a job.

But, it's just less hassle and easier to download album's instead of having to drive all the way out to the store to look for an album they might or might not have. That's the other thing, stocking of the album. Sometime's you can go to every CD store you know andn ot find a album you really want. An example would be Sebastian Bach's Angel Down album. I downloaded about 3 song's off of it, and loved the song's. So, instead of downloded the rest, I wanted to buy the ablum, but unfortunatly I never found it in any store I knew. And this was before I started to use Ebay. So, instead of frustrating over it, I downloaded the rest of the album. Some time's an album you really want is not in stock at a store, and it's not your fault you have to download it.

Sure, the quality may sometimes be shitty, or the files may be 12 or 13 megabytes, but if I want one song or a discography, it just seem's easier to download it than to buy all the band's albums, especailly if your low on money or can't find the band's albums.

And no, record sales don't make that much money anymore, if they did I'm pretty sure bands would'nt be putting album's on iTunes for you to download 1 or 2 songs for 99 cent's. Music artist make their money through touring. And don't give me that bullshit "you don't support the band's you like," I downloaded every single Motley Crue song and their own of my favorite band's and I also saw them live. If you love the music, that's enough support.

 

[Hardcore Heathen]

I only Really Download music if the Albums are a Bitch to find. Try and find a Faith no more Album in the UK, And not a Greatest hit one.
Heres a Question. Does anyone actually buy Singles and not Download them? I have never seen a Single in say HMV (Except F'in X Factor)

 

[Gore Illa]

I feel like there is really nothing wrong with it, considering artists don't even really get paid off of albums. Tours, endorsements, features, verses, hooks etc. is usually where the money is made. I read somewhere that artists get like pennies off of an albums total sales when it's all said and done.

But on paper, it's always nice to say "My last album sold x amount of copies" and also Platinum and Gold certifications are nice to have.

So I say download the album, if you plan on buying

 

[TheNewStyle]

I have no problems with downloading music. I feel kinda bad about listening to something I'm provided with for free by someone who obviously cares about me (they have made music for my enjoyment so there you have it) but right now I'm not in the financial situation to pay for any albums. Hell, it was hard enough to buy the 8 albums that I own right now. (one of which is my favorite and cost $15, which I bought anyways cause I love that album!)

However, when I'm healthy from a financial standpoint and live by myself, I promise myself to buy all that albums that I love - even out of print ones. With that said, I will never buy an album before having downloaded and heard it. This is no way something to feel guilty about. Cause really, if you don't care about satisfying me with your album, why should I waste fifteen dollars or pound or whatever on it? Download first, enjoyed it? Then go ahead and buy it!

And to Dagger Dias: you know that you can download the very same album/song again from the 'net? It's not like it's a one time thing and when you lose it, you have no chance of getting it again.

 

[Lilio]

Look at the SMALL percentage if ANY that artists recieve from cd/album sales, its fractions of a dollar, if that. TLC's left eye broke this down. When the artists recieves the royalties from cd sales, they STILL have to PAY BACK the record label, and thats AFTER the label already recieved the vast majority of said royalties. All profit to the industry, barely ANY to the artists

Anyone who find it ''disgusting'' to download music, Do the math. They DON'T GET RICH OFF CD SALES. Nor youtube video hits, they make their money off of touring, merchandise and appearances. THATS how you support your favorite artists, financially

And that is the reason I can download music with a good conscience. I don't really think that it affects anybody worth mentioning notably.

I really don't understand why it's such a "wrong thing to do" when all you're supporting by buying an album is major corporations that couldn't care less about the costumers and only want to milk them for everything they can. Artists aren't making much money at all on selling CD's so it's not THAT horrible of a thing to download albums.

But sure, I also have to admit that I have become lazy with supporting bands. Most usually you download something just because it's the easy thing to do. One click away from gratification, y'know.

There is this one awesome unknown band called Alien Breed. I wanted to download their CD but I couldn't find it anywhere so I bought it instead. That was the main reason for getting it really.

 

[SorgFamily]

Heres a Question. Does anyone actually buy Singles and not Download them? I have never seen a Single in say HMV (Except F'in X Factor)

The last single I bought was "Hate to Say I Told You So" from the Hives. It had 2 other songs on it which were decent. The only reason I buy singles anymore is if it;s on vinyl. Got a record player for Christmas 2 years ago and I buy a shitload of vinyl now. And it's really not worth it in terms of dollars (usually 2 songs for six or seven dollars) but it's nice having something that you know millions (in some cases thousands or even hundreds) of people don't have.

 

[El Rev sXe]

Please, there is a bunch of bullshit here. "It's the law", that's not an argument, people do alot more things that are illegal that really affects society. Downloading music doesn't do anything, when people start to actually steal CDs, you will see a consequence in society. Plus god knows how many idiotic laws are there...

What happened to Metallica since Napster, absolutely NOTHING. People still buy their records, their T shirts, their posters, and most importantly people go to their concerts. Do you know who is actually harmed with this subject. Actually there are two "targets":new artists and the record labels/companys.

I agree that downloading music from a new artist does much harm, since it's very difficult to that artist to stablish himself in the music business.

Onto the record companies, they are the only people who are really being affected by this whole situation with downloading. But I don't give a fuck about them, we are talking about companies who think they own "happy birthday" and if they could they would sue everyone's asses for every time we sing that little song. We are talking about companies that doesn't allowed for some artists to completely do what they want with their art. Fuck the music industry.

Anyway, you guys are fiorgetting the fact that there are bands out there that support downloading, in fact they don't care or use it as an excellent way of publicity. I remember the Foo Fighters last record had a leak, well they didn't give a fuck about it and they put a link where you could download for free the whole record. In fact I did it, I listen to it and a couple of weeks later I bought it.

It's all about the money, because as an artists it doesn't affect my art. It's ambition from the artists and the recor labels.

 

[Slyfox696]

And that is the reason I can download music with a good conscience. I don't really think that it affects anybody worth mentioning notably.

I really don't understand why it's such a "wrong thing to do" when all you're supporting by buying an album is major corporations that couldn't care less about the costumers and only want to milk them for everything they can. Artists aren't making much money at all on selling CD's so it's not THAT horrible of a thing to download albums.

Onto the record companies, they are the only people who are really being affected by this whole situation with downloading. But I don't give a fuck about them

It must be nice to steal money from people and have the ability to rationalize it in your own head as being okay.

You all do realize that "the record companies" *ominous music in the background* are not robotic drones, scurry from place to place, headed up by an evil mastermind with a twisted mustache who sits around all day wondering how he can take over the world, right? Record companies are made up of many people, in all sorts of different forms and fashions. They are not just a bunch of suits in a board room. You have people who do the producing, people who mix, people who deal with advertising or even things such as a cafeteria staff and a janitorial staff. The RIAA is a collection of many different music producers, and they all have varying types of employees.

If the music industry starts losing money, do you think RIAA Board of Directors are going to take the monetary losses? Fuck no, they aren't. They'll be the last people affected. It'll be the small fish that get fired, and replaced with people who will work for less money.

Also, if you think being a music producer is so easy, and not worthy of treating with respect, why don't you do it? Why aren't you in the game, spending the big bucks on bands which probably won't make it, spending money on advertising for the next album that bombs? Why aren't you taking the financial risk?

Finally, how many music artists do you people think there would be if every music artist had to do their own recording? How many quality albums would there be then? The answer would be close to zero. If the artists are "getting screwed" by CD sales, like so many thieving downloaders claim, why do they keep signing with record companies? Of course, that's a rhetorical question, because we all know the answer; they need to.


The problem with thinking like the two posts I quoted is that it is small minded thinking, and nothing more than justification for theft. These record companies DO deserve the money, because they are the ones taking the financial risk, and without them, you wouldn't have access to the music in the first place.




No matter how you want to justify it, what you are doing is theft, it DOES affect the artists, it DOES affect people who need the money, and it DOESN'T affect the corporate suit bigwigs you all use as justification for your illegal behavior. In the end, music piracy is theft, and it is completely wrong. I'd rather people claim they are morally bankrupt and have no soul to justify their downloading than to use the same tired "well, it doesn't hurt the artists" bullshit.

 

[TheNewStyle]

The record companies are run by a bunch of greedy assholes that could care less about you and dictate what the artist should do with their music even if they disagree with their methods. In the end, they are ripping off their artists. I'm buying a CD to give the money to the ARTIST not the record company. If the company is ripped off, too bad for them! Whether they are robotic drones or not, they deserve to suffer for ripping off those who make them rich and until the artist receives more than half of the income from the CD's sales, I refuse to feel bad about downloading music. Another thing I don't give a damn about is "morals" since ripping off people who rip off others is just making things even since they are evil assholes that want your money and don't care if you like their product or not.

 

[wrestlingfan]

Record companies still make tons of money even if just a share of people download music, I still see msot of the Hip-Hop artisits I listen to showing off their bling in music videos so why not?

 

[Slyfox696]

The record companies are run by a bunch of greedy assholes

Really? How many of them have you met?

And as far as "greedy assholes" are concerned...what makes them greedy? This is America, where we try to follow the basic laws of supply and demand. If you don't want to give money to them, don't buy the CD. But not buying the CD doesn't grant you the right to STEAL the music either.

that could care less about you

And you couldn't care less about them. Who gives a fuck?

and dictate what the artist should do with their music even if they disagree with their methods.

Then I suppose that artist shouldn't sign with that company.

All of this is piss bucket justification for theft.

In the end, they are ripping off their artists.

Bullshit. They are not ripping off their artists. It's not like record companies hold a gun to Metallica's head and say, "Either sign with us, produce your music here, or we'll kill you". When Metallica willingly enters into that agreement, it's called a contract. Both sides follow the stipulations of the contract.

At the end of the day, you're just ripping off stupidity.

I'm buying a CD to give the money to the ARTIST not the record company.

No, you clearly are not. It's fine if you don't want to buy the CD because you don't want to give money to the record company. I have no problem with that.

Just don't go stealing from them.

If the company is ripped off, too bad for them!

Let's pretend some day you create a product. Let's say you open your own bakery. Every day, a group of teenagers come in, steal half of your donuts.

Too bad for you, right? Nevermind that's your livelihood that is literally being stolen from you, too bad for you.

Whether they are robotic drones or not, they deserve to suffer for ripping off those who make them rich

This is just stupidity to a degree even I cannot bother with addressing.

and until the artist receives more than half of the income from the CD's sales

That will happen as soon as the artist negotiates it in their contract with the record companies.

You're not a fucking noble person. At all. You're not standing up to anyone, and you're not standing up for anyone. You're just a thief. No more, no less. You're a common criminal, a crook, and someone not worthy of an ounce of respect.

I refuse to feel bad about downloading music.

Right, because it's easy to not have to see the night janitor get fired and go home to a family which will now not have anything to eat, all because you get indignant about something you're completely wrong about.

Good job, asshole. Way to ruin the lives of people who have nothing to do with your erroneous stance for justice.

Another thing I don't give a damn about is "morals"

Clearly. You're a morally bankrupt person, at least in his area. Perhaps some day, someone can break into your home, steal all of your possessions, and then laugh at you. Perhaps you'll understand then.

since ripping off people who rip off others is just making things even since they are evil assholes that want your money and don't care if you like their product or not.

Take an Economics class. Any economics class. Take Economics 101, and see why you made yourself look like an idiot right there.

Record companies still make tons of money even if just a share of people download music

And just think...if no one downloaded the music, they could make less money AND lower the price of CDs.

What's really funny is that all these people who rip off music don't understand those of us who do buy the music are subsidizing your theft. Just another reason to hate illegal downloaders.


For the illegal downloaders, you're not hurting the Board of Directors on the RIAA. You're not. You never will. But you're the reason CD prices are still expensive, and you're the reason the night janitor gets fired, and you're the reason innocent people have to put up with DRM restrictions. Basically, the only evil greedy assholes in this fight are the illegal downloaders.

Illegal downloaders....YOU are the greedy assholes.

 

[Alex]

Slyfox said it best.

Just so some people get it, If the 'greedy' record companies run out of money, your precious bands won't be able to really get their music out to you, and you guys are the ones who keep music prices up.

I sometimes do illegally download, but thats more to check out bands before I decide to give them (and the record companies) my money

 

[wrestlingfan]

However at the same time others you should blame our the Websites, When people see websites like that they're going to be tempted to download and not think of the morals.

 

[Big Sexy]

It's definitely theft but I still do it and I sure as fuck don't lose any sleep at night over it. There are some albums that I would have normally bought but didn't after downloading them and listening to them, however, on the flip side there are just as many albums that I go out and buy that I never would have had I not been able to download and listen to them. For me it all evens out.

I'm not justifying myself illegally downloading for that reason but I know that in the end I only have a certain amount of money to spend on music and whether I could illegally download or not that number wouldn't change. Illegally downloading just gives me more music to listen to, it doesn't affect the amount of money I spend on music.

 

[TheNewStyle]

Really? How many of them have you met?

And as far as "greedy assholes" are concerned...what makes them greedy? This is America, where we try to follow the basic laws of supply and demand. If you don't want to give money to them, don't buy the CD. But not buying the CD doesn't grant you the right to STEAL the music either.

Since I don't live in America, I'm not sure how it is over there but many artists who I listen to have never come out with likable stories about the labels. Most of them suggest that they have no creative freedom on the music they make and that can I not respect.

And you couldn't care less about them. Who gives a fuck?

Exactly, but it starts with them and continues onwards. If you respect me, I respect you in return. That's just how it is.

Then I suppose that artist shouldn't sign with that company.

All of this is piss bucket justification for theft.

Maybe, but some major label situations like that with Lupe Fiasco and his Lasers album doesn't give the labels a good look at all.

Bullshit. They are not ripping off their artists. It's not like record companies hold a gun to Metallica's head and say, "Either sign with us, produce your music here, or we'll kill you". When Metallica willingly enters into that agreement, it's called a contract. Both sides follow the stipulations of the contract.

At the end of the day, you're just ripping off stupidity.

They do sign the contract but sometimes it's out of desperation and there is no better options for them. There's a reason why most of the artists I listen to end up going independent halfway through their career.

No, you clearly are not. It's fine if you don't want to buy the CD because you don't want to give money to the record company. I have no problem with that.

Just don't go stealing from them.

I'm not sure if the 'stealing' really makes a difference. Let's say I don't download, or hear it anywhere and wont buy it. Did they win anything? Not really, just one less person who's heard their product which does not do them any favors.

Let's pretend some day you create a product. Let's say you open your own bakery. Every day, a group of teenagers come in, steal half of your donuts.

Too bad for you, right? Nevermind that's your livelihood that is literally being stolen from you, too bad for you.

If I'm so stupid that I let them steal without doing anything in return, then yeah, too bad for me.

This is just stupidity to a degree even I cannot bother with addressing.

And it needs no addressing, cause it's just one person's feeling on a topic.

That will happen as soon as the artist negotiates it in their contract with the record companies.

You're not a fucking noble person. At all. You're not standing up to anyone, and you're not standing up for anyone. You're just a thief. No more, no less. You're a common criminal, a crook, and someone not worthy of an ounce of respect.

And in the end, I don't give two shits if I'm labeled a "crook" or a "thief".

Right, because it's easy to not have to see the night janitor get fired and go home to a family which will now not have anything to eat, all because you get indignant about something you're completely wrong about.

Good job, asshole. Way to ruin the lives of people who have nothing to do with your erroneous stance for justice.

What are you talking about? How in the hell can me downloading an album ruin anyone's life? They have enough money to be able to make a living that losing $10 wont make them unable to eat.

Clearly. You're a morally bankrupt person, at least in his area. Perhaps some day, someone can break into your home, steal all of your possessions, and then laugh at you. Perhaps you'll understand then.

Yeah, maybe and it doesn't matter. If someone breaks into my house, I'll do all it takes to defend myself. If I fail, I will curse that person out and all but I blame myself most of all.

Take an Economics class. Any economics class. Take Economics 101, and see why you made yourself look like an idiot right there.

Two wrongs don't make it right anyways.


And in addition, I just went and read this article which I believe a lot more over your anti-download rage. It doesn't make record companies look any better and besides that, I don't think I need any new music anyways. I have plenty of timeless classic stuff that I never get tired of to listen to and I think I can count the amount of albums I've liked from this year on one hand. And if I do like more than a few new CDs, I end up listening to it a couple of times before going back to the old stuff I never quit listening to. With that said, despite my pro-download attitude, I still intend on buying all the albums that I never stop listening to. I already have 8 CDs to slowly start my soon to grow collection of the timeless music that I so badly love. Not to mention, one person's views are not gonna change anybody's lives.

 

[Slyfox696]

Since I don't live in America, I'm not sure how it is over there but many artists who I listen to have never come out with likable stories about the labels. Most of them suggest that they have no creative freedom on the music they make and that can I not respect.

And again, who made those artists sign with the labels in the first place?

Exactly, but it starts with them and continues onwards. If you respect me, I respect you in return. That's just how it is.

Then respect the fact these people are producing music for you to listen to, and pay them the money they have earned.

That's a ridiculous statement. Respect them first.

They do sign the contract but sometimes it's out of desperation

Then the artists make their own beds. Whose fault is that? Is that the record labels fault the artists are incapable of being successful without them?

I'm sorry, but your whole argument is stupid.

I'm not sure if the 'stealing' really makes a difference. Let's say I don't download, or hear it anywhere and wont buy it. Did they win anything? Not really, just one less person who's heard their product which does not do them any favors.

Yes, it is still stealing. If I make 12 loaves of bread, and only 6 people are willing to buy, and you steal 3 loaves...you've still stolen from me.

If I'm so stupid that I let them steal without doing anything in return, then yeah, too bad for me.

Now you're just being purposefully indignant, and you know you're wrong.

But they HAVE tried to do things in return, and innocent people are the ones who get punished. Increased CD prices, DRM, etc...they have done things in return, and it affects everyone else.

You're an asshole.

And in the end, I don't give two shits if I'm labeled a "crook" or a "thief".

Then why aren't you labeling yourself as such? Why are you trying to justify it by saying the "greedy assholes" from record labels don't deserve the money, when I've quite clearly proven they do deserve the money?

What are you talking about? How in the hell can me downloading an album ruin anyone's life? They have enough money to be able to make a living that losing $10 wont make them unable to eat.

Did you not read anything I wrote? Go back and try again junior.

Yeah, maybe and it doesn't matter. If someone breaks into my house, I'll do all it takes to defend myself. If I fail, I will curse that person out and all but I blame myself most of all.

And if you're not home? Is it going to be your fault when someone breaks into your home while you're out working hard to provide for your family? Are you just going to be okay with it then? Not going to file a police report, press charges, etc.?

Two wrongs don't make it right anyways.

...which has nothing to do with economics...

And in addition, I just went and read this article which I believe a lot more over your anti-download rage.

That's great...what the fuck does that have to do with anything? What point are you trying to make?

Not to mention, one person's views are not gonna change anybody's lives.

Allow me to post you this profound comment by Martin Niemoller,

"First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out --
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out --
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out --
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me -- and there was no one left to speak for me. "

You never know when one person's views could make all the difference in the world.

 

[TheNewStyle]

I am not going to argue any further with your self-righteous views cause it will never go anywhere but I'll respond to a few points you made.

* Artists might create their own hell by signing the contract, but sometimes they are offered that and I'm pretty sure they are lied to about some stuff they wont know in the deal ahead. Therefore, not all of them want to have it their ways at any cost even if they agreed otherwise beforehand.

* I'm sorry but your self-righteous arguments don't faze me. And in response to one of your previous sentences, I'm not trying to stand up for anyone but myself.

* I am an asshole by nature and a crook, now can we leave this name calling behind cause it doesn't bother me in the slightest.

* I'm not living on my own yet and still go to school, but in my future when I depend on my own, I have no intentions of raising a family since that's not part of my plans. Therefore it makes the whole "providing for your family" thing irrelevant. But no, I'm not gonna ignore viewing it from a single person's perspective now. If I'm out and somebody steals from my apartment (which is my style of living), I'll try to find that person and might likely call the police depending on how serious it was and what was stolen. Hell, now you've mentioned it, you've me paranoid enough to think of putting a sneaky camera by the door which makes it all that harder to steal and escape me.

 

[Slyfox696]

I am not going to argue any further with your self-righteous views cause it will never go anywhere but I'll respond to a few points you made.

* Artists might create their own hell by signing the contract, but sometimes they are offered that and I'm pretty sure they are lied to about some stuff they wont know in the deal ahead. Therefore, not all of them want to have it their ways at any cost even if they agreed otherwise beforehand.

Just no. You can't lie about the terms of the contract. Perhaps the wording is set up to be confusing, but then the artist only has themselves to blame for not having a lawyer look over the contract.

* I'm sorry but your self-righteous arguments don't faze me.

I'm not surprised, usually low class crooks don't think of anyone but themselves.

I am an asshole by nature and a crook, now can we leave this name calling behind cause it doesn't bother me in the slightest.

It's not name-calling when it's true.

I'm not living on my own yet and still go to school, but in my future when I depend on my own, I have no intentions of raising a family since that's not part of my plans. Therefore it makes the whole "providing for your family" thing irrelevant. But no, I'm not gonna ignore viewing it from a single person's perspective now. If I'm out and somebody steals from my apartment (which is my style of living), I'll try to find that person and might likely call the police depending on how serious it was and what was stolen.

Wait, you're going to call the police? That just makes you a greedy asshole. How dare you fight for the right to keep the things you own out of the hands of people who didn't have to earn them! You greedy asshole, you!

 

[TheNewStyle]

Just no. You can't lie about the terms of the contract. Perhaps the wording is set up to be confusing, but then the artist only has themselves to blame for not having a lawyer look over the contract.

Why in the first place would they set it up in a confusing way? So they can rip the artist off!

I'm not surprised, usually low class crooks don't think of anyone but themselves.

Unless I owe that person, why should I? I'm a honest person that will do all it takes to pay someone who has done me a favor back, and if nothing, I don't feel like starting an 'alliance', I usually keep to myself. Totally unrelated to the actual topic but since you mentioned the 'thinking of yourself' thing, I felt it should have been said.

It's not name-calling when it's true.

But what's your purpose when saying these words? To get me to feel inferior, it's that simple.

Wait, you're going to call the police? That just makes you a greedy asshole. How dare you fight for the right to keep the things you own out of the hands of people who didn't have to earn them! You greedy asshole, you!

"Call me greedy but I feel like taking a lot." That's one favorite quote of mine that perfectly explains me here. I don't blame the record labels for trying to get the lion's share from record sales since who doesn't like to get rich? It's just that they are doing it in a way I can't stand since they get paid off somebody else's work. Calling the police for having items stolen from your home is a different story. Also those people DID earn it in a way. They didn't do it legally, but they required clever burglary techniques to make it successful. And speaking of the police thing, since they are always there for use, I use them while I can, which only benefits me! And I only use their help if I can no longer do it on my own. I'll set up a camera outside my door to recognize that person and hunt them down, if that doesn't happen, I'll use the police since they offer their services to me and I don't need to pay them back as it's their job.

 

[Slyfox696]

Why in the first place would they set it up in a confusing way? So they can rip the artist off!

Because it's a legal contract. All big time legal contracts are confusing. For example, have you ever read the End User License Agreement you agree to in order to get on Xbox Live or the Playstation Network? Have you ever read the EULA for your iPod/iPhone? Have you ever read the EULA for Microsoft Windows? I doubt it.

Unless I owe that person, why should I?

...to not be an asshole? To be a productive member of society? To not be a fucking leech?

But what's your purpose when saying these words? To get me to feel inferior, it's that simple.

Which is the EXACT reason you're calling RIAA greedy assholes. You're trying to de-humanize them, so you don't feel bad about something you know is wrong. You do it so they are inferior people in your mind, and you don't feel bad about taking their stuff which doesn't belong to you.

"Call me greedy but I feel like taking a lot." That's one favorite quote of mine that perfectly explains me here. I don't blame the record labels for trying to get the lion's share from record sales since who doesn't like to get rich? It's just that they are doing it in a way I can't stand since they get paid off somebody else's work.

But it's not just "someone else's work", how do you not get that? It's their work too! They have done work to produce the album, to mix it properly, to promote it, to build the websites which help give it exposure. It IS their work, just as much as it is the musicians.

How do you not understand that?

Calling the police for having items stolen from your home is a different story.

Not really.

Also those people DID earn it in a way. They didn't do it legally, but they required clever burglary techniques to make it successful. And speaking of the police thing, since they are always there for use, I use them while I can, which only benefits me! And I only use their help if I can no longer do it on my own. I'll set up a camera outside my door to recognize that person and hunt them down, if that doesn't happen, I'll use the police since they offer their services to me and I don't need to pay them back as it's their job.

There is so much stupidity in this paragraph I don't know where to begin.

First of all, you ARE paying the police, whether you use them or not. It's called tax money. Second of all, if you feel the burglars earned your items, why are you trying to get them back? Finally, why call the police, if you don't have a problem with greedy assholes having their stuff stolen?

Finally, how exactly are the RIAA greedy assholes, for doing the EXACT same thing that you are going to do if you get your stuff stolen? Do you not understand how silly you are making yourself look?

 

[Johnny Scumm]

Damn, Sly really IS kicking ass.

However, I have to say, apart from once, when I was meant to do an Album Review, I've never downloaded ANY Music.

I buy LOTS of CD's, or MP3's through iTunes.

 

[Lilio]

But it's not just "someone else's work", how do you not get that? It's their work too! They have done work to produce the album, to mix it properly, to promote it, to build the websites which help give it exposure. It IS their work, just as much as it is the musicians.

You know what? Im just gonna take your arguments for why you should spend a shitload of money on CDs and support major corporations to be BS.

Because seriously. If Trent Reznor of Nine Inch Nails - One of the most popular industrial bands ever - Who himself is an artist and has way more experience in dealing with records companies, MAKING and SELLING music, then what you ever will have - Completely shits on major corporations that screw over both the fans and the artists, I really don't think your opinion holds any more firm ground.

http://www.afterdawn.com/news/article.cfm/2007/05/14/trent_reznor_speaks_out_about_music_piracy

As the climate grows more and more desperate for record labels, their answer to their mostly self-inflicted wounds seems to be to screw the consumer over even more. A couple of examples that quickly come to mind:

* The ABSURD retail pricing of Year Zero in Australia. Shame on you, UMG. Year Zero is selling for $34.99 Australian dollars ($29.10 US). No wonder people steal music. Avril Lavigne's record in the same store was $21.99 ($18.21 US).
By the way, when I asked a label rep about this his response was: "It's because we know you have a real core audience that will pay whatever it costs when you put something out - you know, true fans. It's the pop stuff we have to discount to get people to buy."
So... I guess as a reward for being a "true fan" you get ripped off.

Being a law-abiding citizen as you seem to be promoting doesn't really get you anywhere but screwed over. Because the laws are anything but perfect, and a lot of them are created to make sure that the greedy people without a conscience get it better then anyone else.

You gotta wonder if they are paying you to say shit like that.

 

[TheNewStyle]

Because it's a legal contract. All big time legal contracts are confusing. For example, have you ever read the End User License Agreement you agree to in order to get on Xbox Live or the Playstation Network? Have you ever read the EULA for your iPod/iPhone? Have you ever read the EULA for Microsoft Windows? I doubt it.

No, but you can bet that what is inside it. The same old shit about doing illegal stuff like bootlegging, hacking, "foul" language and the usual things that gets you in trouble. I don't know if such a thing exists in record contract signings.

...to not be an asshole? To be a productive member of society? To not be a fucking leech?

I'm not doing the society any harm as it is and I'm living very comfortable so why make a change? Oh and if you consider downloading a few albums "harm" then I assure you, those I have enjoyed am I going to buy in the future when I live off my own cash.

Which is the EXACT reason you're calling RIAA greedy assholes. You're trying to de-humanize them, so you don't feel bad about something you know is wrong. You do it so they are inferior people in your mind, and you don't feel bad about taking their stuff which doesn't belong to you.

I don't consider ANY human being superior or inferior to another. I treat everyone equally and unless they do something that makes me lose respect, it remains that way.

But it's not just "someone else's work", how do you not get that? It's their work too! They have done work to produce the album, to mix it properly, to promote it, to build the websites which help give it exposure. It IS their work, just as much as it is the musicians.

How do you not understand that?

They do most of the promotion and pressing, but in the end, it's the artists work that counts for buyers. They wanna hear the vocals, the production in the background and all of that. They do deserve some of the cash from the record sales but I believe the majority belongs to the artist since the buyer pays for the artist's name being associated with it, not because of the label it comes from. And besides, with internet in this day and age, artists can promote their music themselves anyways.

There is so much stupidity in this paragraph I don't know where to begin.

First of all, you ARE paying the police, whether you use them or not. It's called tax money. Second of all, if you feel the burglars earned your items, why are you trying to get them back? Finally, why call the police, if you don't have a problem with greedy assholes having their stuff stolen?

Finally, how exactly are the RIAA greedy assholes, for doing the EXACT same thing that you are going to do if you get your stuff stolen? Do you not understand how silly you are making yourself look?

Tax money is a whole another thing and that's something that must happen so the country doesn't go broke and everyone is employed. The same cash that I pay for tax money later comes back to me from my job. And I'm trying to get the items back because they belonged to me. I have no problems with the labels trying to make it right as well, I was just calling them out for slaving their artists as many of my favorite artists have claimed. So it kind of undoes a lot of what was being argued here.

 

[El Rev sXe]

It must be nice to steal money from people and have the ability to rationalize it in your own head as being okay.

Yeah totally, I forgot the fact that right now I'm swimming in money. I haven't steal anything from anyone. I insist, there are out there things that are more important that does affect society as a whole.

You all do realize that "the record companies" *ominous music in the background* are not robotic drones, scurry from place to place, headed up by an evil mastermind with a twisted mustache who sits around all day wondering how he can take over the world, right? Record companies are made up of many people, in all sorts of different forms and fashions. They are not just a bunch of suits in a board room. You have people who do the producing, people who mix, people who deal with advertising or even things such as a cafeteria staff and a janitorial staff. The RIAA is a collection of many different music producers, and they all have varying types of employees.

Yes I do realize that.

If the music industry starts losing money, do you think RIAA Board of Directors are going to take the monetary losses? Fuck no, they aren't. They'll be the last people affected. It'll be the small fish that get fired, and replaced with people who will work for less money.

Exactly, that's why downloading music doesn't hurt at all. You insist that I'm doing something "illegal" yet no one gets hurt, people still buy the T shirts, but the posters and most improtantly, people are going to the concerts. No one is unemployed, no is actually suffering from the downloads. Sly prove me, besides the fact that I am "stealing", how does anyone in the whole music business is affected. Like I said before it does affect new artists, but personally I buy their CD, when they are people like Metallica how downloading is affecting them? Because they can't buy a golden swimming pool?

FYI these record companies technically "own" happy birthday and each and every single time we sing that stupid song they are in their "right" to sue us. My point is that record companies aren't trying to take over the world, but they are trying to private every single piece of art and IMO art is and should be treated like public domain.

Also, if you think being a music producer is so easy, and not worthy of treating with respect, why don't you do it? Why aren't you in the game, spending the big bucks on bands which probably won't make it, spending money on advertising for the next album that bombs? Why aren't you taking the financial risk?

First of all you I respect ALOT producers because I know first hand that it isn't only to play some music. Who I don't respect is the big record labels that try to limit the artist and their art.

Being a producer doesn't go directly to the topic of downloading music. As far I'm concern, the only people who complains about this are artists and record companies cause you know a producer does the record and he is paid for that. Not for how many times his song is played or anything like, he is payed to produce the record and nothing else.

Do you realize that there are independent producers that are taking a bigger chances with new artists? And yes Sly I do now about these things because I consider myself a musician, I play four instruments and since the beggining of the year I've been learning how to produce records.

Finally, how many music artists do you people think there would be if every music artist had to do their own recording? How many quality albums would there be then? The answer would be close to zero. If the artists are "getting screwed" by CD sales, like so many thieving downloaders claim, why do they keep signing with record companies? Of course, that's a rhetorical question, because we all know the answer; they need to.

I'm not sure if someone has said that, but I'm sure that I didn't. Like I said before there are independent artists and labels, but this hans't nothing to do with downloading music. I think you are one of those exaggerate people that say that downloads are "killing" the music industry wich is completely bullshit.

The problem with thinking like the two posts I quoted is that it is small minded thinking, and nothing more than justification for theft. These record companies DO deserve the money, because they are the ones taking the financial risk, and without them, you wouldn't have access to the music in the first place.

Please, you are clearly the small minded one since you forget the fact that there is artists who are in favor of downloading music. It's convenient how you quoted one line of my post forgetting the example I gave of the Foo Fighters.

On the other hand, you are forgetting something really important. You are only having a one sided point of view, to be specific a "first world country" thinking. For you it's easy go to the store and buy a record for what 10,11,12 dollars? Have you EVER considered how it is on "third world countries"? It's obvious you didn't. When people live under two dollars per day, do you think that buying a record for 10 dollars is an option? Just consider consider the currency exchange rate. That's why I hate the big record companies,music is so beatiful that anyone anywhere should be able to buy some great records. But these people don't even consider that maybe in other countries people can't afford those records with the same fucking price that has in the States. Unfortunately piracy has become the answer to this subject.

No matter how you want to justify it, what you are doing is theft, it DOES affect the artists, it DOES affect people who need the money, and it DOESN'T affect the corporate suit bigwigs you all use as justification for your illegal behavior. In the end, music piracy is theft, and it is completely wrong. I'd rather people claim they are morally bankrupt and have no soul to justify their downloading than to use the same tired "well, it doesn't hurt the artists" bullshit.

Again when there are artists that ARE IN FAVOR it must mean something right? I said it tons of time in the thread and I will say it again, people continue to buy the shirts, the posters, all the products, and most importantly people are still going to the shows. No one is unemployed, none of the record companies has been shot down because of downloading.