Shawn Michaels is known by millions of wrestling fans as Mr WrestleMania but after yet another loss this brings his WM record to a pretty poor 6 wins and 11 losses at the biggest stage of them all. 2 of those wins are against marty jannety and el matador tito santaner so no giant feat there really tho these feuds helped build HBK into what hed become. Now nobody can doubt that he has always put on one hell of a show and that all his matches were entertainng but what im asking is did HBK lose too many times at WM. I mean The Rock had an epic match with Hogan that the fans longed for years as they did with HBK v Hogan yet in the end Michaels lost to hogan where as the rock picked up the win. He lost to razor in the ladder match and the clean tap out losses to angle and cena were great matches but again ended with hbk losing. He clearly has no problem losing to put people over in great matches and HBK is my favourite wrestler of all time. I liked him in the rockers but ever since i saw his heel promo for the '92 rumble ive thought of him as the greatest but what im asking is do you think he put too many people over at WM? I wouldnt even be saying this if his win-loss record was near 50-50 but for 6 wins in 17 it just amazes me.
Did Shawn Michaels lose too many times at Wrestlemania?
- Thread starter db82
- Start date
I don't think Shawn lost too many, at least not in the manner that it hurt his credibility in any way.
He is Mr. Wrestlemania not because of his wins or his loses, but because he goes out there and wrestles matches that everybody remembers, he's a part of what makes Wrestlemania such a huge thing, because people are looking forward to a Shawn Michaels match, and because when you think of Wrestlemania in the past two decades time, you think of Shawn Michaels.
But you do have a point, there's some times where I wouldn't mind seeing Shawn Michaels win a match, but there's also matches where simply because of the awesomeness of the match, and the pure "shocker" that it is, I don't mind the outcome, no matter what it is.
Now I did mind the outcome in his last two Wrestlemania appearances, 26 and 25, but that was because not only was his career on the line this time, but he could also be the one guy to end the streak, actually the one guy with the credibility to end it.
But in the end, not really no, Shawn didn't loose too many Wrestlemania matches, cause he didn't need to win the most of them.
He is Mr. Wrestlemania not because of his wins or his loses, but because he goes out there and wrestles matches that everybody remembers, he's a part of what makes Wrestlemania such a huge thing, because people are looking forward to a Shawn Michaels match, and because when you think of Wrestlemania in the past two decades time, you think of Shawn Michaels.
But you do have a point, there's some times where I wouldn't mind seeing Shawn Michaels win a match, but there's also matches where simply because of the awesomeness of the match, and the pure "shocker" that it is, I don't mind the outcome, no matter what it is.
Now I did mind the outcome in his last two Wrestlemania appearances, 26 and 25, but that was because not only was his career on the line this time, but he could also be the one guy to end the streak, actually the one guy with the credibility to end it.
But in the end, not really no, Shawn didn't loose too many Wrestlemania matches, cause he didn't need to win the most of them.
I dont mean it in regards to him having the name Mr Wrestlemania i just mean do u think that even tho he always put on a great show do u think that the ratio of wins to losses is way too in the balance of defeat? I know most of these losses in the later stage of his career will probably his idea as he had a lot of creative swing in his late career its just that other top stars like the Rock, Hogan, Austin, Cena, Edge would never end up with such a poor record of losses at Wrestlemania.
If you ask me, a big part of it, is because guys like Cena, Edge etc. needs victories to seem legit, John Cena's gimmick and such wouldn't work very well if he lost 60% of his Wrestlemania matches, yet kept going around saying "Never back down never quit"
On the other hand, Shawn Michaels doesn't need to be put out there as the constant winner, because he puts over people while looking god damn strong in the match himself, in matches against guys like, as I mentioned, Undertaker, I mean at this years Wrestlemania, it took what, 2 chokeslams, 1 last ride, and 3 tombstones to kill his career? I say that proves that Shawn never needed to have a winning streak, or a positive winning percentage if you ask me.
#hamler
That's all folks.
shawn michaels could lose every match in his career and it'd still be ok, he'd still be mr wrestlemania, you know why? because every match you put him in, he makes the other wrestler look ten times better than they really are. think about it, kurt angle, already great enough but shawn michaels made the match worth watching. Vs, cena, we all know cena can't wrestle and that match was the highlight of WM23 because of shawn michaels. you could probably put shawn in a match against Kelly Kelly and it'll still be the best match on the card. undertaker resembles this too, maybe that's why it was the best match ever, or at least in my opinion... it doesn't matter the win lose record, remember john cena was undefeated at mania for like 4 or 5 years, doesn't mean they were great matches...michaels=great always...
The_Evil_Empire
Dark Match Winner
Last night we witnessed another phenominal match that will go down in history as one of the greatest of all time. Last year we experienced the same caliber match-up from the same people. Tonight we will see the good-bye ceremony of one of the greatest performers, wrestlers, and entertainers of all time. The fact that we're even having this conversation is proof that he did NOT lose too many times at Mania.
1) Would last night have been any bigger of a deal if he had beaten somebody huge like Hogan, Rock, or Austin at Wrestlemania? Would anything have really changed? Probably... The Rock and Austin may have had their characters diminished. That's all that would have changed.
2) Would you rather him be a Triple H, who wins no matter what, and doesn't seem to put anybody over? HBK has learned, and it's taken a long time for him to, that the best thing to do is put somebody else over.
Now, I would have preferred for HBK to win his last match, but you never know what's going to happen. He's probably going to be done. He probably won't pull a Ric Flair and return 18 times, but you never know. The Heartbreak Kid ended Ric Flair's career, and he finally ended his own career. The boyhood dream has been realized, all the other kid's have gone inside, and the sun is slowly setting on the horizon. It's time for HBK to put down the baseball bat and head inside for dinner. Thank you Shawn Michaels.
1) Would last night have been any bigger of a deal if he had beaten somebody huge like Hogan, Rock, or Austin at Wrestlemania? Would anything have really changed? Probably... The Rock and Austin may have had their characters diminished. That's all that would have changed.
2) Would you rather him be a Triple H, who wins no matter what, and doesn't seem to put anybody over? HBK has learned, and it's taken a long time for him to, that the best thing to do is put somebody else over.
Now, I would have preferred for HBK to win his last match, but you never know what's going to happen. He's probably going to be done. He probably won't pull a Ric Flair and return 18 times, but you never know. The Heartbreak Kid ended Ric Flair's career, and he finally ended his own career. The boyhood dream has been realized, all the other kid's have gone inside, and the sun is slowly setting on the horizon. It's time for HBK to put down the baseball bat and head inside for dinner. Thank you Shawn Michaels.
I didnt know that you needed to win in order to steal the show, because thats what this thread implies. It doesnt matter how the finish of the match was booked. All that matters is what you did with the time slot you were given, and every minute HBK has spent at Wrestlemania was spent stealing the show and topping anything else on the card. He puts his opponent over whether he wins or loses because it makes the product look better. Thats what matters in the end.
CJ The Pirate
Schwing
The answer is simple. No, the losses aren't damaging to his legacy. He has the nickname 'Mr. Wrestlemania' because he deserves it. People who have given him that nickname have taken those losses into consideration.
A great match doesn't just elevate the winner. The loser was part of it too. Shawn has never been a muscular heavyweight. He's not the powerhouse. He isn't the guy that dominates. That's what has made him so successful. He takes a beatng but he has the resiliance to take it, suck it up and bring the fight to his opponents. Shawn is believable.
Thats not just some fanboy speak. Shawn does that himself. He does more far beyond the Superkick and the flying elbows and the nip ups. He constantly tells the story and he is one of the best at it. He always has been.
He knows exactly when to get the crowd pumping. He knows how long to wait to get the perfect amount of anticipation mixed with doubt before he nips up. He takes hits and makes you think it's over and then he kicks out later than anyone else in the business. The man makes wrestling exciting and he will be missed.
It doesn't matter that he's lost more than he's won. Most of those matches he lost will appear in most wrestling fans Top Matches. Vs Ramon. Vs Hart. Vs Austin. Vs Triple H and Benoit. Vs Angle. Vs Cena. Vs Undertaker... Both times. Pick any of them. They're great matches. Watch them if you haven't. Try to disagree with me. Would Shawn have benefit any more had he won them? No. In fact, I wish he'd lost to Jericho rather than winning. That would have made Jericho even bigger.
In my top 10 matches I'd say three of those matches feature. The Triple Threat. The Iron Man and the Undertaker I. The others could quite easily be 11, 12, 13, 14 and 15. If he could do it all again? He should do nothing different.
A great match doesn't just elevate the winner. The loser was part of it too. Shawn has never been a muscular heavyweight. He's not the powerhouse. He isn't the guy that dominates. That's what has made him so successful. He takes a beatng but he has the resiliance to take it, suck it up and bring the fight to his opponents. Shawn is believable.
Thats not just some fanboy speak. Shawn does that himself. He does more far beyond the Superkick and the flying elbows and the nip ups. He constantly tells the story and he is one of the best at it. He always has been.
He knows exactly when to get the crowd pumping. He knows how long to wait to get the perfect amount of anticipation mixed with doubt before he nips up. He takes hits and makes you think it's over and then he kicks out later than anyone else in the business. The man makes wrestling exciting and he will be missed.
It doesn't matter that he's lost more than he's won. Most of those matches he lost will appear in most wrestling fans Top Matches. Vs Ramon. Vs Hart. Vs Austin. Vs Triple H and Benoit. Vs Angle. Vs Cena. Vs Undertaker... Both times. Pick any of them. They're great matches. Watch them if you haven't. Try to disagree with me. Would Shawn have benefit any more had he won them? No. In fact, I wish he'd lost to Jericho rather than winning. That would have made Jericho even bigger.
In my top 10 matches I'd say three of those matches feature. The Triple Threat. The Iron Man and the Undertaker I. The others could quite easily be 11, 12, 13, 14 and 15. If he could do it all again? He should do nothing different.
If the WWE was NOT scripted, then I would agree that Shawn Michaels' win-loss record at Wrestlemania is disappointing; however, we all know that the matches have predetermined winners and losers. That being said, Shawn Michaels is "Mr. Wrestlemania" because he is the best at doing the one thing that is not scripted...PERFORMING.
Shawn Michaels is "Mr. Wrestlemania" and deservedly so. He has had numerous matches at Wrestlemania that have become "instant classics." Simply put, he elevates himself, as well as his opponents, to another level. Even at the age of 44 and with knee and back problems, Shawn Michaels puts everything on the line and has continued to deliver for over 25 years.
In the end, when you think of Wrestlemania, you think of Shawn Michaels.
Shawn Michaels is "Mr. Wrestlemania" and deservedly so. He has had numerous matches at Wrestlemania that have become "instant classics." Simply put, he elevates himself, as well as his opponents, to another level. Even at the age of 44 and with knee and back problems, Shawn Michaels puts everything on the line and has continued to deliver for over 25 years.
In the end, when you think of Wrestlemania, you think of Shawn Michaels.
TripleH2010
Dark Match Jobber
I agree with you on that, shawn michaels is simply one of the best performers in the history of the wwe at Wrestlemania, win-or lose shawn puts on the best match of the night, proof of which he has won numerous match of the year awards
HBK-aholic
Shawn Michaels ❤
I'd be willing to bet most regular/casual fans have no idea about his win/loss record, because it's not important. Most of Shawn's best Wrestlemania matches are matches that he lost, against the likes of The Undertaker and Kurt Angle. Shawn Michaels is known as 'Mr. Wrestlemania' because of the WAY he wins, or loses. Shawn is a fantastic wrestler; absolutely phenomenal when it comes to the biggest stage of them all. I've never seen a bad WM from him, and I give a majority 4 and even 5* ratings - something no one else can, or will match for a long time.
^ This
I must admit I completely agree with you on this Becca, and I must also admit it saddens me, because I've always loved Shawn's matches, and knowing there most likely won't be one at Wrestlemania 27 (saying most likely because of the numerous guys that screams for a definite return by Summerslam or before Wrestlemania 27, this way I haven't blocked a potential return, although I must admit I remain among the people that wants Shawn to stay retired from in-ring competition so that he won't have to ruin the legacy of the send off he got)
Although I must admit I'm crossing my fingers that we will eventually see one that can do it properly, counting on a guy like Morrison to perhaps.. perhaps being able to pull off just partly the quality of a Shawn Michaels match.
There is only one thing you have to consider when judging Shawn Michaels and Wrestlemania.
Was the Wrestlemania match Shawn was in better, for his having been in it?
If the answer to that question is yes, then that really is all you need to say.
If the answer to that question is no, you are obviously an anti-Shawn hater out of touch with reality, and nobody is going to listen to you anyway.
In all seriousness, Shawn Michael's Wrestlemania legacy isn't about wins or losses, its about the match itself. I maintain that there are multiple Wrestlemania "main events". The two title matches, the Undertaker match, and the Shawn Michaels match. Doesn't matter if Shawn is wrestling for a title or not, his Wrestlemania match, against any opponent, is usually one of the best matches of the night. That is his Wrestlemania legacy, consistent high quality matches that are always a major highlight of the PPV. Its not the wins, its the PERFORMANCE! Shawn is exactly like Ricky Steamboat in that regard.
Was the Wrestlemania match Shawn was in better, for his having been in it?
If the answer to that question is yes, then that really is all you need to say.
If the answer to that question is no, you are obviously an anti-Shawn hater out of touch with reality, and nobody is going to listen to you anyway.
In all seriousness, Shawn Michael's Wrestlemania legacy isn't about wins or losses, its about the match itself. I maintain that there are multiple Wrestlemania "main events". The two title matches, the Undertaker match, and the Shawn Michaels match. Doesn't matter if Shawn is wrestling for a title or not, his Wrestlemania match, against any opponent, is usually one of the best matches of the night. That is his Wrestlemania legacy, consistent high quality matches that are always a major highlight of the PPV. Its not the wins, its the PERFORMANCE! Shawn is exactly like Ricky Steamboat in that regard.