Can you push talent too quickly?

[Bobby B]

It's great looking at the prospects for the future of the company coming through. Sheamus, Barrett, Kingston, The Miz etc to eventually take over the mantle of the main eventers of today.

But I want to know what people think about pushing talent too quickly. Sheamus had been in the company about 5 minutes, and won the title. Barrett's been there an even shorter time, and it looks asif he's going to be pushed to the hills.

I'm not saying it's a bad thing, I think if the talent is there then there's definitely justification in doing it. But I just wonder whether pushing people to the stars before they've had time to establish themselves in the company is a good thing or not?

Sheamus and Barrett are two people who have all the skills to be big players in the company a few years down the line, I not convinced they should be there right now.

 

[Scotty]

Of course you can push talent too quickly. Prime examples of this are Brock Lesnar and the Rock. Both men skyrocketed to the top in a short amount of time and they were both gone before they even showed signs of declining careers. Why did they leave professional wrestling? They reached the top of the mountain before the peak of their careers. I am not saying that it will happen to Sheamus or Wade Barrett, but it happened to two of the men that could have led their business into the future for at least 10 more years and probably more.

 

[Vintage]

I say no but it has to be done in a way that creates an oh shit moment. For example, had Sheamus power bombed Cena through the table instead of Cena leaping back into the table while Sheamus tries to keep his balance he would have looked legit during his first reign and would have replaced Orton as the much needed kryptonite to Cena's Superman.

I want to be clear about something. You absolutely cannot waste that type of push on someone who can't deliver. I am very happy they didn't jump the gun on Kingston. He has no character.. he's a African who was playing a Jamaican who lost his accent, smashes cars but somehow comes out to his old Reggae theme. It doesn't work for Miz either because while he's only awesome when there is a mic in his hand. Sheamus and Barrett are you're generic big man types. If you don't push them fast they don't get noticed and nobody takes them seriously if they are only squashing jobbers.

 

[Fallen Angel 21.3]

Of course you can push talent too quickly. Prime examples of this are Brock Lesnar and the Rock. Both men skyrocketed to the top in a short amount of time and they were both gone before they even showed signs of declining careers. Why did they leave professional wrestling? They reached the top of the mountain before the peak of their careers. I am not saying that it will happen to Sheamus or Wade Barrett, but it happened to two of the men that could have led their business into the future for at least 10 more years and probably more.

Okay i do agree with you on most of your points and Brock Lesnar is the greatest example of how pushing young stars early will bite you in the ass. In fact what about Bobby Lashey who won the ECW world title had a cup of coffee and left for an MMA career. The Rock however isn't a good example, he worked his way up the mountain winning the IC title and he was in the bussiness for over half a decade. Also there are some stars that got pushed and still are big one of them is John Cena,

 

[Scotty]

Okay i do agree with you on most of your points and Brock Lesnar is the greatest example of how pushing young stars early will bite you in the ass. In fact what about Bobby Lashey who won the ECW world title had a cup of coffee and left for an MMA career. The Rock however isn't a good example, he worked his way up the mountain winning the IC title and he was in the bussiness for over half a decade. Also there are some stars that got pushed and still are big one of them is John Cena,

What I meant to imply was that he left while still in his prime. You can argue that he left for bigger and better things in acting and you would be partly right. However an argument could be made that he wouldn't have shunned the WWE like he has. He won the Intercontinental Championship in a mere three months. His first WWF Championship reign came along at about 2 years with the company, which I have no problem with. What I have a problem with is that 1997 to 2003 he had a total of 16 reigns. Fact of the matter is that from basically the time he debut he always had a championship of some sort. Maybe if the WWE hadn't gave him so many reigns in such a short amount of time he might still make appearances or even wrestle matches now and then.

 

[wushady]

Rocky MIavia is the perfect example of being pushed to quickly. He was green and the crowd shit all over him. He took time off slowly built his persona and the rest is history.

We all loved watching Goldberg tear up the competition. I've seen interviews with talent who said how green he was and he injured many wrestlers. Once his streak was over his career kinda of floundered.

There's been many cases where pushing someone to early has had negative results. In some cases it works fine Brock Lesnar had a great run and left on his own. I don't think the company suffered much from him leaving. The put a lot of time and energy behind making him a star, but he put Eddie Guerrero over on the way out.

 

[ForzaItalia]

Yes because look at what happened with Bryan Danielson. They pushed him very far by having him attack Cole because Cole was making negative comments about him. Then they had Bryan beat Miz on Raw, since Miz is one of the most hated heels in WWE. Now they released Bryan for the time being and when he does come back he will be getting a huge ass pop and be a top superstar on Raw. This took about 3 months to Bryan where he is, so yeah that was fast.

 

[Fallen Angel 21.3]

What I meant to imply was that he left while still in his prime. You can argue that he left for bigger and better things in acting and you would be partly right. However an argument could be made that he wouldn't have shunned the WWE like he has. He won the Intercontinental Championship in a mere three months. His first WWF Championship reign came along at about 2 years with the company, which I have no problem with. What I have a problem with is that 1997 to 2003 he had a total of 16 reigns. Fact of the matter is that from basically the time he debut he always had a championship of some sort. Maybe if the WWE hadn't gave him so many reigns in such a short amount of time he might still make appearances or even wrestle matches now and then.

So i am just using John Cena as an example......so John is close to doing what the Rock has done and is doing an acting career too. So assuming that you not a cena hater would you be pissed at Cena if he left like the Rock did. The Rock also gave us some of the very best fueds that I have ever seen, Got a new word put in the dictonary, and was hands down the greatest on the mike. In my oponion The rock left wrestling most likey because he was just bored with it, don't get me wrong, i was pissed when the Rock left and eventully droping the rock in his whole name to become just dwyane johnson, but comeon at least he put in 6 solid years for the company rather then what Brock Lensar did or Bobby Lashey. Also in the Rock would have made a come back most likey this year and wrestled john cena at wrestlemania if it wasn't for Linda McMahon's run for office and putting us in this damn PG era.

 

[Ferbian]

I really think it depends on whether the talent has the potential to get over as quickly as his push is made.

Sheamus was pushed quickly, but he slowly got over as well, we now see his second world championship and it is already looking to be much more entertaining, because he has improved and he improved with the first reign as well, getting over slowly, but steadily.

So I do think you could push talent too quickly, if their reaction from the crowd doesn't follow the same speed, then it won't be a good quick push.

But if someone gets over insanely quickly and is pushed by the same speed, there can't really be anything saying whether it will flunk anyway, or be an immense success.

 

[ABMorales787]

It heavily depends on the person being pushed. Guys like Sheamus, Brock Lesnar and The Giant (Big Show in WCW) are examples of guys that should start out high before going low. Because they are your generic big men on a rampage. At first when they come in they have a sense of invincibility. Beating everybody in there path. Most wrestlers like this are give food for months and are made to look invincible, but when they make it to the main event, the fear of giving them a title over the belief that they are still too green leads to the loss that creates their downward spiral. Their air of invincibily vanishes. This happens very often. Vladamir Kozlov, The Great Khali, Mabel, Kane, Mike Knox, etc. However you have your successes in Sheamus, The Undertaker, Diesel, Brock Lesnar and The Giant. In these cases after the character reaches that level, they develop a character and a more unique personality. I can assure Sheamus would not be seen as such a lovable character to us if he had lost to Cena at TLC.

You then have your cases of wrestlers who present great mic skills. The Rock being the prime example. One simple repackaging and the man took off fast. In this cases, it's best to take your time. Why? What if Mr. Kennedy had become the big guy in WWE like everybody had expected? Or MVP? Kennedy was very injury prone. Imagine a top player who spent more time in the rehab center than in the ring. Or MVP. The guys was gold on the mic, but when he stopped working with the right people, he stopped working well in the ring. Randy Orton. He was too green in 2004. Not everybody was sold with him.

At the end of it, it all depends on the character being sold.

 

[Dave]

I don’t think pushing talent too quickly is such a bad thing. The problem exists when you try to push too much talent too quickly.

You brought up Sheamus. Having won the WWE Championship last year, he has continually feuded with the best that the WWE has to offer. With his humour and his charm, he has managed to get everyone involved in him and he now seems as though he is a legitimate main event talent. The Championship reign has helped him to that and although it was a huge shock to behold, Sheamus really did run with it in the short time that he had it. Upon losing it, he could have been dropped down to the mid-card again and no one would have really thought anything of it. However, the WWE made him feud with Triple H and that has just continued his dominance.

The same is true of Wade Barrett. Upon winning NXT, he will and has been given a major push that will undoubtedly end in him winning the WWE Championship, I feel. Sheamus has been pushed and has now accomplished his goal of being in the main event continually. Wade Barrett is now receiving the same treatment. However, the problem would exist if the WWE were trying to push too many talents towards the main event. Evan Bourne is getting a push but I don’t think it is towards the main event. The Miz could be getting a push but again, although he is feuding with a main event talent, I don’t think he will end up in the main event this soon.

I honestly don’t mind seeing people pushed too quickly. It can be exhilarating and interesting as both Wade Barrett and Sheamus have shown us. However, pushing too many people to the main event at the same time leads to a convoluted main event scene where nothing anyone does will set them apart from the others.

 

[Dr. Stinger A. Zoidberg]

Yes, and we have seen it before with both Brock Lesnar and Bobby Lashley. Both superstars ended up leaving because their mentality was, "I'm a big star now, I can do what I want, where I want." As we all know, they both left the company and are now in MMA and UFC.

As for Sheamus, I think the WWE is pushing him pretty fast, just not too fast. Even though he is a 2 time WWE champion already, he has not always been in the title picture on RAW. He has had small feuds in between his title runs. For not pushing him too quickly, it eliminates the possibility of Sheamus leaving the WWE and going somewhere else because he has the mindset of a "Huge Superstar."

 

["Cool Guy" Jensen]

You can push talent too quickly and we've seen plenty examples of that in the past decade or so. Truth is, no matter who you are, you should not be pushed to the main event or awarded with a World Title reign within your first year in the company. No matter how good or ready you or WWE believe you are, it is always better to get a more gradual push that drags out for a while. If you are willing to take a more gradual push to the top, it shows you have more loyalty to the company.

A true WWE superstar should start with some sort of debut. I prefer a debut of an unknown wrestler being signed to a show (such as Evan Bourne, Sheamus, etc.) or a new superstar debuting after weeks of vignettes (such as Finlay, Kofi Kingston, Carlito, etc.) I have never been a fan of superstars debuting by attacking a superstar... I find it too generic, and all of them have the same purpose: to make an impact. That happened with The Great Khali, Brock Lesnar, and Drew McIntyre last year.

Now, a fast push to the top isn't always a horrible idea, but with the WWE, it just shouldn't happen. It just never works for a long period of time. A quick push can likely lead to their release, a departure, a less-than-memorable WWE career, among other things. A push that comes too quickly will likely have more negative effects than positive.

The names you mention: Sheamus, Wade Barrett, The Miz, and Kofi Kingston. I will breakdown each of their careers and how they push have or will culminate.

1. Sheamus's push was definitely too fast, and with just 3 months on ECW before being moved to Raw, it helped further that thought. Winning the ECW Championship too fast was easier to recover than winning the WWE Championship too fast. However, the fact that losing the title didn't halt his push and he was given credit for "injuring Triple H", and is now a 2-time WWE Champion is great for him.

2. Wade Barrett... his push can't come too fast, which is the entire purpose of NXT. You are given 15 weeks (if you last that long) to get the pros and now the WWE Universe to be more impressed with your work. By the time you win the competition, you have been on TV for over 3 months. WWE obviously believe in him if they paired him up with Chris Jericho. So, his push likely won't come too fast because his NXT angle will only get stronger, and by the time he gets his championship match, he will have gained much more credibility.

3. The Miz was not given much of a push until he had been in the company for 2 years. He lost Tough Enough and then was signed months later. His 2 years on Smackdown from 2005-2007 didn't have much highlights except for his talk show and hosting the "Diva Search". Not until he was drafted to ECW, did he start showing his wrestling ability and a more serious side. Now, he is a 2-time United States and Tag Team Champion.

4. Kofi Kingston had a great time on ECW. His feud with Shelton Benjamin was one of my favorites in all 4 years of ECW. In his first match as a member of the Raw roster, he wins the Intercontinental Championship by defeating Chris Jericho. He then wins the World Tag Team Championship with C.M. Punk. Enters the Money in the Bank match at Wrestlemania 25, later wins the United States Championship, holding on to it for 4 months, after countless title defenses. He then is entered in a feud with Randy Orton, entered the MitB match again, drafted to Smackdown, and is now a 2-time Intercontinental Champion.

So, quick pushes aren't always a bad thing. It's just better to keep it more gradual and take it one step at a time. It will lead to a longer, more decorated career.

 

[Bobby B]

I think from me personally I always like to see guys who have done their time in the company, worked their way up from the bottom to the very top - it's why I like Edge so much. He stared out with Christian, got exposure, took part in arguably the great match in WWF/E history at WM17 - then began building his singles career. And I think we're left with a fantastic wrestler in Rated R Edge.

It's guys like him that perhaps - at times - make me a little bit sad when Sheamus and Barrett shoot straight to the top. I'm not saying they shouldn't be there, I just feel like they should do their time first. I also think it's better long term if you have a solid base that you've built over the years.

 

[Goliath Uterus]

Yes because look at what happened with Bryan Danielson. They pushed him very far by having him attack Cole because Cole was making negative comments about him. Then they had Bryan beat Miz on Raw, since Miz is one of the most hated heels in WWE. Now they released Bryan for the time being and when he does come back he will be getting a huge ass pop and be a top superstar on Raw. This took about 3 months to Bryan where he is, so yeah that was fast.

Seriously? Bryan Danielson? He didn't even get a push, he came in, had a slight fued with Cole, was present for the first night of the Nexus angle, then got released, not saying he wasn't gonna get a push, just that he got released before they could give it to him.

Rocky MIavia is the perfect example of being pushed to quickly. He was green and the crowd shit all over him. He took time off slowly built his persona and the rest is history.

True to an extent, the Rock was always kinda green due to him debuting so soon after his training, but I'd say that it was more managements fault he didnt get over, and he never took time off, he just joined the Nation Of Domination.......... and the rest is history

We all loved watching Goldberg tear up the competition. I've seen interviews with talent who said how green he was and he injured many wrestlers. Once his streak was over his career kinda of floundered.

The wrestlers that say that are jealous of his push, to my knowledge he only seriously injured Bret Hart and himself. It's hard to injure wrestlers in 45 second matches. And I would certainly disagree that his career floundered after his streak ended, Goldberg always got a HUGE pop and was constantly being pushed, in WCW and WWF/E.

There's been many cases where pushing someone to early has had negative results. In some cases it works fine Brock Lesnar had a great run and left on his own. I don't think the company suffered much from him leaving. The put a lot of time and energy behind making him a star, but he put Eddie Guerrero over on the way out.

I'd say the WWE was hurt by Lesnar leaving, while he did put Eddie over a few times on the way out, there were a lot of Brock fans and the company was looking at him to be one the THE guys to lead the company into sucess.

To answer the OP's post, I'd say that it all depends on who the talent that your pushing is. With guys like Big Show, Goldberg, Lesnar, Sheamus, and Barrett, you kinda have to push them from the get go or it really doesn't work, big men are automatically imposing and therfore are a lot easier to get over. But if they were to give say, Randy Orton a huge push from the get go, I wouldnt work, the fans would shit all over him and wouldnt buy it.

 

[The Doctor]

It all depends on the talent's...well, talent. If someone has the ability to get themselves over, with mic skills and ring skills (e.g. Barrett), then why hold them back? If they are good enough to main event, then let them main event!

However, a lot of talent aren't ready to main event just as soon as they debut. The reason wrestlers lounge in the midcard is because they need to improve themselves to be main event worthy. If The Miz had been pushed to the main event near his debut, it would have flopped and flopped hard, because let's face it: he sucked. Now, however, I can totally buy him as a main eventer and future WWE Champion.

Sheamus was booked well and became WWE Champion through it. He then proceeded to get himself over using his mic skills and own talents, as well as being booked strongly.

Drew McIntyre is an example of someone with no talent being pushed too quickly. McIntyre has all the tools to be a main eventer, he just doesn't know how to use them. And it shows. He needs a lot of work before he gets pushed any higher up the card.

If someone has the talent needed to become main event, by all means push them to the moon. If they need improvement, don't. There's no need for people to "pay their dues" if they're good enough for the title already.